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Guy advice - Guys? - Page 2

post #51 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
But we're not talking about high school here, or even a public institution. I don't really see a conflict as far as the individuals are concerned.
Simple ethics say you don't date potential clients or current clients. Of course, I'm a Doctor so things are a bit worse down that road for me.
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post #52 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:38pm
Maybe you'll have to call him sensai during sex. Bizarre.
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post #53 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:38pm
I think all these fine chaps have given some great advice and it seems like just popping in is a great way to go. Lisa, I don't even know you and yet my tummy is getting all squirmy with excitement for ya. Best of luck!!!
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post #54 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:46pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KABONG
Maybe you'll have to call him sensai during sex. Bizarre.
Sempai. He'd always correct the students who accidentally called him Sensei in class - I'd imagine I'd get the same correction during sex.

Okay, so the casual pop-in at the school seems the way to go! Thanks, guys, I feel alot less weird about this!
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post #55 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:47pm
So, Lisa, are you going to go for it?

Do it soon, because I hate waiting.
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post #56 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaNewYork
Sempai.I'd imagine I'd get the same correction during sex.
Yeah, then he'd make you do your kata 20 times. Naked...
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post #57 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:50pm
The most important advice, that has been missed by us all thus far...

Sweep the leg.
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post #58 of 137
9/12/07 at 4:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsotdc
Simple ethics say you don't date potential clients or current clients. Of course, I'm a Doctor so things are a bit worse down that road for me.
Well, a doctor is quite a different situation, given the unsettling potential for abuse of trust in the examining room alone. I can understand in that profession one would want to stay far away from any possible misunderstanding.
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post #59 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe LeFors
So, Lisa, are you going to go for it?

Do it soon, because I hate waiting.
I'd like to. It's going to be a matter of finding time to go there with two jobs, and not chickening out after all this great advice (especially sweeping the leg!). I just looked at his teaching schedule at their website, and on evenings I could go over there are Mon. Weds and Thurs in the evenings, or Friday in the morning. As luck would have it, I have this Friday off, so in the morning is a possibility.
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post #60 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:12pm
Well, I used to be a tennis instructor, and honestly, from what you described I get the feeling that he was just being kind. There's a personality that you take on where you're always smiling, and kind, and to someone who's looking for something more, it can come off as flirtatious. You always have to seem in charge but always do it gently and with a smile because you don't want your students to feel like they're doing things wrong, or they're not worth your time. And with people that you teach longer, you do get a connection with and genuinely care about them, but usually just as an individual and nothing more. Without knowing him or the situation there's no way for any of us to be quite sure about his intentions while he was around you, but I just get the vibe that he was being instructor-ly.
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post #61 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:13pm
Okay, good.

And spare us no details, no matter how lewd, humiliating, or seemingly insignificant.
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post #62 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric C
Well, I used to be a tennis instructor, and honestly, from what you described I get the feeling that he was just being kind. There's a personality that you take on where you're always smiling, and kind, and to someone who's looking for something more, it can come off as flirtatious. You always have to seem in charge but always do it gently and with a smile because you don't want your students to feel like they're doing things wrong, or they're not worth your time. And with people that you teach longer, you do get a connection with and genuinely care about them, but usually just as an individual and nothing more. Without knowing him or the situation there's no way for any of us to be quite sure about his intentions while he was around you, but I just get the vibe that he was being instructor-ly.
Not really necessary to throw a cold shower on the proceedings, is it? Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
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post #63 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric C
Well, I used to be a tennis instructor, and honestly, from what you described I get the feeling that he was just being kind. There's a personality that you take on where you're always smiling, and kind, and to someone who's looking for something more, it can come off as flirtatious.
See also: Every customer service job ever.

If you're an adult, the worst that happens is you get rejected, which - hopefully - you've been a couple times by now. It's not really a big deal to rebuff someone's advances. But you're not shitting where you're eating so there are no repercussions. Show up, ask him out, don't come across as weird until he gets to know you a little better.
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post #64 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaNewYork
Sempai. He'd always correct the students who accidentally called him Sensei in class - I'd imagine I'd get the same correction during sex.
What a life he must lead- I HAVE to entertain the ridiculous notion he calls himself this out of class.

"Hey, what has two thumbs and loves blowjobs? SEM-PAAAI!"
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post #65 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
Not really necessary to throw a cold shower on the proceedings, is it? Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
I wasn't insinuating that she shouldn't do it, just playing Devil's advocate and trying to show the other side of the coin.

And yeah, in customer service jobs you absolutely have to have those qualities, but a teacher/instructor is a bit different.
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post #66 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KABONG
What a life he must lead- I HAVE to entertain the ridiculous notion he calls himself this out of class.

"Hey, what has two thumbs and loves blowjobs? SEM-PAAAI!"
I doubt he uses the term himself.
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post #67 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
I doubt he uses the term himself.
But oh my god he should.
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post #68 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:41pm
Thread Starter 
No, it's okay, really - I mean, Eric has a point too. Like I said, my "guydar" is off alot of the time, especially coming off of a really shitty relationship like I was. I subscribe to "Nothing ventured, nothing gained - especially after you're done licking your wounds for a year." But I do realize, he could have been just being extremely nice because he was my instructor. Or it might have been a little interest. Either way, it's a 50-50 crap shoot; I mean, like I said, I'm interested, and the number of posts you guys have dedicated to helping me was incredibly nice of you, but I'm not overly worried about it. I was just wondering what the guys of the board thought of the situation, and any advice you had.
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post #69 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:46pm
Don't worry about the radar being off. Chances are that he, being in a work environment, wasn't looking at you as a potential date, just as a student. A lot of times guys don't realize the girl right in front of them is potential when they meet in a platonic event. If you're at a singles bar it's obvious that people want to meet someone, but at work/school/classes/etc you're there with another purpose in mind.

EDIT: I'm posting lots here because I just entered the all out dating world for more or less the first time after a long term relationship. I've been finding that helping others talk about how crappy and tough the dating scene can be can help you out too. Most important thing I've learned is whatever I plan on spending on a date, double it. Single is so much cheaper, but oh so lonely.
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post #70 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:50pm
If he ever showed you the fishhook, well it's game on...
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post #71 of 137
9/12/07 at 5:55pm
Quote:
If you're at a singles bar it's obvious that people want to meet someone, but at work/school/classes/etc you're there with another purpose in mind.
I don't know, I would think that in general if you meet someone who's really your type your mind eventually swings 'round to the same purpose. Unless you're a mortician.
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post #72 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaNewYork
No, it's okay, really - I mean, Eric has a point too. Like I said, my "guydar" is off alot of the time, especially coming off of a really shitty relationship like I was. I subscribe to "Nothing ventured, nothing gained - especially after you're done licking your wounds for a year." But I do realize, he could have been just being extremely nice because he was my instructor. Or it might have been a little interest. Either way, it's a 50-50 crap shoot; I mean, like I said, I'm interested, and the number of posts you guys have dedicated to helping me was incredibly nice of you, but I'm not overly worried about it. I was just wondering what the guys of the board thought of the situation, and any advice you had.
OK, here's FrankCobretti's guide to dating:

It's all about percentages.

W = people to whom you're attracted.

X = percentage of people to whom you're attracted who are attracted to you.

Y = percentage of X who are available.

Z = Percentage of those with whom you actually close the deal.

W*Y*X=Z

It does not make sense to define Z as 1. Rather, work the numbers and ping every W you meet. Once you've developed a healthy pool of Zs, you'll be in a position to select a long-term prospect.
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post #73 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:02pm
Flattery/humor one-two punch: If the school has a large-ish window, pop in and say "I was just walking by and saw you from outside, and I was like, 'Is that Sempai BILL?' and I had to come in and challenge you to a kung fu battle. But now that I'm in here, I've lost my nerve and decided I would just go with a 'hello'."

(small talk)

Psychology: Screw the open-ended "get coffee sometime". Try a "Hey, I'm going to a (thing he might be interested in*) on (specific day). Any interest?" You need to establish that you are a fun, engaging party that is going to happen with or without him. It's a good sales tactic and makes you look casual and confident.

*You can get extra psychotic by looking him up on myspace or whatever and pre-picking an event/activity you know he's into.

Good luck!
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post #74 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:08pm
It might get him a little nervous, but I say just go for it. At worst nothing will come of it.
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post #75 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte
See also: Every customer service job ever.
I misread those signals from a waitress once (yeah, yeah). She wasn't actually my waitress the first time I saw her, we just started chatting when I was there waiting to meet some friends. I went back a couple of days later for lunch with some people from work, and just decided to ask if she'd like to grab coffee sometime. Turns out she was married (not sure how in the hell I missed the big ring the first time). Anyway, I got shot down, but I did flatter her and make her day, so it wasn't a total loss. I say go for it.
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post #76 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankCobretti
OK, here's FrankCobretti's guide to dating:

It's all about percentages.

W = people to whom you're attracted.

X = percentage of people to whom you're attracted who are attracted to you.

Y = percentage of X who are available.

Z = Percentage of those with whom you actually close the deal.

W*Y*X=Z

It does not make sense to define Z as 1. Rather, work the numbers and ping every W you meet. Once you've developed a healthy pool of Zs, you'll be in a position to select a long-term prospect.
I'm not sure I've quite got it. If you keep running around "closing the deal" aren't the other Zs you've kept waiting in the pool apt to get jealous?


Quote:
*You can get extra psychotic by looking him up on myspace or whatever and pre-picking an event/activity you know he's into.
No need for Myspace. Hopefully that sort of information was already gleaned from small talk during the earlier lessons. I agree with the suggested event invitation approach though.
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post #77 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:17pm
As soon as dating and sex gets translated into mathematical terms, I'm never getting laid again.
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post #78 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:18pm
I'm a little disappointed, because it sounds like you've ruled out mailing him your ear.
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post #79 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Miller
I'm a little disappointed, because it sounds like you've ruled out mailing him your ear.
Don't be sad. Maybe if he and I hit it off and date, that can be my Christmas present to him.
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post #80 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankCobretti
OK, here's FrankCobretti's guide to dating:

It's all about percentages.

W = people to whom you're attracted.

X = percentage of people to whom you're attracted who are attracted to you.

Y = percentage of X who are available.

Z = Percentage of those with whom you actually close the deal.

W*Y*X=Z

It does not make sense to define Z as 1. Rather, work the numbers and ping every W you meet. Once you've developed a healthy pool of Zs, you'll be in a position to select a long-term prospect.
This sounds like my "Shotgun Approach to Dating". Ask everyone out you would like to go out with and, hell, some you don't. As the pattern spreads you're eventually gonna hit something.

Then again, I only ever dated waitresses in college. They had to talk to me.
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post #81 of 137
9/12/07 at 6:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by scudd
I misread those signals from a waitress once (yeah, yeah). She wasn't actually my waitress the first time I saw her, we just started chatting when I was there waiting to meet some friends. I went back a couple of days later for lunch with some people from work, and just decided to ask if she'd like to grab coffee sometime. Turns out she was married (not sure how in the hell I missed the big ring the first time). Anyway, I got shot down, but I did flatter her and make her day, so it wasn't a total loss. I say go for it.
Did you at least get a free Maple Butter Blondie out of the situation?
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post #82 of 137
9/12/07 at 7:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
You mean something like:
Your breasts, they're like melons. No, no, they're like pillows. Can I fluff your pillows?
Glad you got the reference. Watching ROXANNE on video was actually the first date I had with my wife.
Quote:
I'm not really up on my karate moves, but there must be a more appropriate euphemism.
Watching UFC (MMA) and grappling taught me the "Rear Naked Choke", so there's that...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyG
Sweep the leg.
Well, mercy IS for the weak...
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post #83 of 137
9/12/07 at 7:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DARKMITE8
Glad you got the reference. Watching ROXANNE on video was actually the first date I had with my wife.
That's probably a great date movie, but on video? It takes guts to suggest something so relatively informal on a first date.
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post #84 of 137
9/12/07 at 7:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
That's probably a great date movie, but on video? It takes guts to suggest something so relatively informal on a first date.
We were both waiting on tables at the time at the same restaurant, had chatted, and I'd even given her a ride home a few times already... so it wasn't a cold-sell.

And we were both pretty poor (I was in college).
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post #85 of 137
9/12/07 at 8:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
I'm not sure I've quite got it. If you keep running around "closing the deal" aren't the other Zs you've kept waiting in the pool apt to get jealous?
For the purposes of this exercise, "closing the deal" means getting them to agree to go out with you. What happens after zat, monsieurs et madams, ees magic. And good time management.
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post #86 of 137
9/12/07 at 8:30pm
Ok, I haven't read every post because this thread has rapidly gotten really long.

But, in my female opinion, I think going by right before closing, getting a book or tee shirt or whatever, and then leaving at the same time he does and asking if he wants to grab a cup of coffee and continue the conversation is the way to go. Then you have a full conversation to ask about his life outside the dojo and incidentally find out if he's married/taken, and go from there.
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post #87 of 137
9/12/07 at 8:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DARKMITE8
We were both waiting on tables at the time at the same restaurant, had chatted, and I'd even given her a ride home a few times already... so it wasn't a cold-sell.

And we were both pretty poor (I was in college).
I got you. I figured it was something like that. I guess you can save money on anniversary celebrations by romantically recreating your first date.


Quote:
For the purposes of this exercise, "closing the deal" means getting them to agree to go out with you. What happens after zat, monsieurs et madams, ees magic. And good time management.
Ah, merci Monsieur Le Pew.
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post #88 of 137
9/12/07 at 8:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsotdc
Simple ethics say you don't date potential clients or current clients. Of course, I'm a Doctor so things are a bit worse down that road for me.
Doctor Dave had slept with one of his patients and felt guilty all day long.
No matter how much he tried to forget about it, he couldn't.
The guilt and sense of betrayal was overwhelming.

But every once in a while he'd hear an internal, reassuring voice in
his head that said: Dave, don't cry about it.
You aren't the first medical practitioner to sleep with one of their patients
and you won't be the last.
And you're single. Just let it go."

But invariably another voice in his head would bring him back to
reality, whispering...



Dave.............



Dave.............



Dave.............



"................you're a veterinarian."
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post #89 of 137
9/13/07 at 3:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Wood
I got you. I figured it was something like that. I guess you can save money on anniversary celebrations by romantically recreating your first date.
Yeah, especially because I own it on dvd.

I also like to beat up bullies (who find my schnoz comedic) with a tennis racket, to properly display my manhood. Warms up the oven quite nicely.
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post #90 of 137
9/13/07 at 7:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaNewYork
Don't be sad. Maybe if he and I hit it off and date, that can be my Christmas present to him.
"Oh my god honey, what happened, are you all right?"

"Oh, the bandage, yeah... Open your Christmas present first and I'll tell you about it!"
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post #91 of 137
9/13/07 at 8:11pm
I agree with Death Surge. Have a package from the shopping center in hand and drop by to get recent class schedules for a friend. Strike up a conversation, and if he seems interested, find out if he'd like to get coffee or a drink some time.
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post #92 of 137
9/14/07 at 8:58am
Best of luck if you go for it today, Lisa!


Get back to us in "two and two" and let us know what happened!
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post #93 of 137
9/14/07 at 12:30pm
Thread Starter 
Nope, now it's not going to happen today. I'll aim for this coming week if I can - that's the biggest obstacle, other than my chickening out - my schedule. Two jobs and I'm tired as hell all the time. I probably shouldn't be dating right now!
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post #94 of 137
9/14/07 at 2:49pm
Remember what they say about "all work and no play"...


Regardless, best of luck to you when you do go to see this guy. I hope everything works out the way you want it.

Sassypants.
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post #95 of 137
9/17/07 at 8:44pm
Whatever you do, don't let him know about the Five Points 'sploding palm. That'd tend to make it look like you're being a little pushy.

fingers crossed for you, hot stuff
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post #96 of 137
10/2/07 at 3:49pm
OK, I'm tired of messing around with Dellamorte's bait thread, so let's get back to something more important...

Lisa, what happened with this? Did you bow to your sensei? Don't leave us hanging!!
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post #97 of 137
10/2/07 at 4:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe LeFors
Did you bow to your sensei?
Also, when you reply, please try to work this euphemism in there somewhere.
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post #98 of 137
10/2/07 at 4:29pm
Thread Starter 
Hey, guys, thanks for checking in on me. And I'm embarrassed to admit it after all the good advice I got in this thread, but no, I didn't bow to the Sensei (or Sempai, in his case. Still a big huge blackbelt. Still would fuck you up. But not that high of a rank yet).

I read over the thread a couple days after I posted it, and just decided to let sleeping dogs lie and not follow through with this. I do appreciate the advice, truly, and it'll be taken to heart with the next guy. But I started thinking that even if I do the more normal-seeming "head on over and just happen to bump into him" routine, it just might seem kind of stalkerish in the long run. I mean, it's not like he's the love of my life - he's just the most recent guy I've taken an interest in in a long time. But maybe not enough to go through with something I realized I'm not comfortable with after sleeping on it - you know, my own fault for waiting a full year before going into hot pursuit, but there you go.

My big problem, since getting out of my last relationship, is that my enthusiasm for dating again is still rather short lived. Every so often, I figure, "Okay! Ready to dive back in again! Oh, and look over there - HE'S cute!", which is where I was at when I posted this thread. But then just give me a day or so... suddenly I start realizing how much I really love my independence, and more importantly, how shitty I generally am at relationships, and I back off again with a resounding, "Naaaah..." Look at it like this - when people found out that Woody Allen and Mia Farrow never lived together in all those years of being a couple, most people were scratching their heads. I, on the other hand, thought, "Yeah... that's not a bad idea... have the relationship, and have your space." I swear, I was such a different person years ago. I used to be Boy Crazy. Now not only do I have trouble committing to a relationship, I have trouble committing to a date.

I think I'm in a rut where - I'd like to start dating again, I'd sure as hell like to have sex again, but I don't know how badly I want a boyfriend or a relationship. Now, that's some loaded stuff to admit, especially in front of a bunch of guys on a message board, but there you have it. Don't take that the wrong way - it doesn't mean I just want to slut around or have an endless series of fuck-buddies. It just means, I'm still lukewarm about the whole relationship thing, but I'm slightly more open to casually dating, maybe a little sumpin' sumpin' once in a while, but nothing commitmenty. And how the hell do you put something like that out there on Match.com without sounding like a slut?

Anyway, I'm still mentally debating back and forth, and in a case like that, it's probably better to not make a move just yet.

I really do appreciate all the advice you guys had, please don't think it went to waste or that I don't think you're all awesome.
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post #99 of 137
10/2/07 at 4:39pm
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to LisaNewYork again."

I know exactly what you mean. Since my ex and I broke up a while ago, there's only really been one or two girls that I felt I could have any interest in, but then that desire to follow up on it wanes as the time goes by.

On a weird side note about internet dating, one of my work acquaintances just got married to a woman he met on eHarmony. It seems to work.
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post #100 of 137
10/2/07 at 4:43pm
Hey, all that's fair enough, although you could have at least made up a story about the sensei for our entertainment!

But good luck as you work through your relationship issues. We all have them, and will figure them out eventually (I hope).
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