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"How the GOP will steal the 2008 election"

post #1 of 26
Thread Starter 
That tragic typo. Obviously, the headline should read: "How the GOP will steal the 2008 election." DOH!

Quote:
With the Democrats regaining a mini-swagger in their political strut, Palast lays out the scenario for the Republicans stealing the upcoming presidential election. In fact the longtime swagger of Bush and the smirk of Rove may be grounded in their total confidence in knowing how to steal presidential elections in perpetuity. Palast lays out in detail just how they did it and more importantly, how they plan on doing it again. Can the Democrats stop them is the only question at this point. It’s kind of like facing a football team with a massive offense and your team has a pretty good defense. Can your team stop their offense - in both meanings of the word?

In 2000 it was caging lists. In 2004, it was provisional ballots. In 2008 it will be voter IDs. Palast lays out the case about Florida scrubbing its rolls for ex-felons or anyone who had the same name as a felon or might have known a felon. But there were other scrubbing going on. The overall genius of the National Republican Party is to work with local state officials to eliminate as many ethnic voters, aka Democrats, as possible through a myriad of methods.

For instance, Florida absentee ballots were discarded in record numbers. The ones that came from Republicans actually said so on the outside of the envelope. Nice. Election officials also used methods; such as zip code, race reporting and name recognition to achieve the same goal.

Concerning provisional ballots in 2004, Palast explains how the Republican-controlled Congress, confronted by Jesse Jackson and the Congressional Black Caucus, signed deceptive bipartisan legislation for access to so-called provisional ballots. The one thing carefully omitted was that it wasn’t required by law to actually count those ballots. No accident.

Other methods included leaving the oldest machines in poor neighborhoods and reducing their numbers over all to create 7-hour wait times and thereby crippling the election process. Secretary of State Blackwell did everything he could to reduce the number of ethnic/student/urban voters including challenging the weight of paper used for voter registration forms.

All intentional.

All incrementally effective.

Anti-conspiracy theorists in the media kept demanding a ‘smoking gun’. There is no smoking gun – just thousands of spent rounds of ammunition.

It is not two sided by the way. Republican operatives covered the landscape with various illicit techniques from phone slamming, to hidden party switching petitions that in some cases said they were for marijuana reform on the “cover” sheet.

Regarding black box voting.

Palast insists that while touch screen voting is a real threat, it is really a McGuffin that will not do as much damage as feared. It is the total overall ballot and registration dumping that caused Democrats to lose two elections they actually won with ease.

Now the new boogieman is the voter ID card needed to vote in battleground states. For Democrats, a nightmare in the making. Only 20% of Americans have passports. Not everyone has a driver’s license. And many do not have birth certificates. In many states, the phony threat of voter fraud has permitted legislation for this new method of voter elimination to be ratified. The drama will be played out on Election Day 2008, a little over a year away.

Brilliant.

And that is why they are still smirking.

Check the government’s official numbers in Ohio for the 2004 presidential election:

Spoiled ballots 103,660
Provisional uncounted 33,998
Absentee uncounted 15,519
Ghost & blocked votes 85,950

Total Uncounted 239,127

Bush ‘victory’ margin 118,599

Through careful statistical analysis, Palast demonstrates how inner city Blacks, Latinos, Native Americans, Jews and students were successfully targeted and eliminated by Republican election operatives. All of the above were overwhelmingly Democratic voters.
This is from a Crooks and Liars review of Greg Palast's book Armed Madhouse. I have this book but haven't read it yet, but it looks like it will be on the menu for this weekend.
post #2 of 26
Please provide ONE disenfranchised voter.

If there are as many as this article claims, where are they?

Are they hiding in their closetsGoing on seven years now), Elian Gonzales-style, to avoid the certain death that would be visited upon them should they speak up about their vote not being counted?

If Republicans were stealing elections wouldn't they actually have stolen one that mattered? The Congressional one perhaps? Or perhaps the buffoonish Repubs are just smart enough to take a dive every now and then to ensure the electorate is none the wiser about their machinations?

Please.
post #3 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsotdc
Please provide ONE disenfranchised voter.

If there are as many as this article claims, where are they?

Are they hiding in their closetsGoing on seven years now), Elian Gonzales-style, to avoid the certain death that would be visited upon them should they speak up about their vote not being counted?
There are so many things wrong with your arguement...

How the hell would they know they had been disenfranchised if ballots we simply thrown away? It's not like you get something in the mail a week after the election thanking you for your vote and verifying who you selected.
post #4 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tieman
There are so many things wrong with your arguement...

How the hell would they know they had been disenfranchised if ballots we simply thrown away? It's not like you get something in the mail a week after the election thanking you for your vote and verifying who you selected.
Ahh, but the bigger claim that is usually made is people who were turned away or kept from voting in the first place. I want to hear from someone who was kept from voting.

I'm not sure where these "official" stats came from showing that the government keeps track of ballots that they throw out. I am going to have to look that up. Seems to me if the "official" numbers are there for anyone to get via FOIA, then those buffoonish Repubs are even stupider than the Left claims them to be. They can't even cover up the fact that they are throwing away ballots.

And historically absentee ballots are Republican leaning. Where this bullshit comes from that the envelopes are marked is beyond me. It is complete and utter consipracy theory mumbo jumbo to say that this shit is happening on side of the aisle and not the other.

*EDIT* Spelling mistakes
post #5 of 26
i consider myself a Liberal and I am denying that voter fraud may take place bbbbbuuuuuttttt I do wonder where were all the complaints about voters being disenfranchised and voter fraud taking place when the democrats took the house??

The past two presendential elections there have been all these huge claims of election theft yet once we win something its all roses and no complaints.

I dunno...it just seems a little like sore losing to me.

but we have to get rid of the electoral college thingy....its nonsense.
post #6 of 26
Both parties take elections very seriously and lots of fraud go on during each election. To single out Republicans is kind of myopic. But I don't suppose that's ever stopped you before.
post #7 of 26
post #8 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
11 in O.C. Charged With Voter Registration Fraud
By Christian Berthelsen and Christine Hanley
The Los Angeles Times

Friday 27 October 2006

Dozens of people who thought they were signing up to be Democrats ended up Republican. Those accused in the case are low-level, per-signature workers.

The Orange County district attorney's office has charged 11 people with fraudulent voter registration stemming from a Republican registration drive this year that resulted in dozens of Democrats unwittingly being signed up as Republicans.
From LA Times

Quote:
Just Try Voting Here: 11 of America's Worst Places to Cast a Ballot (or Try)

By Sasha Abramsky
Mother Jones

September/October 2006 Issue

Machines that count backward, slice-and-dice districts, felon baiting, phone jamming, and plenty of dirty tricks.


#1 The New Poll Tax
Atlanta, Georgia

#2 Machine Meltdowns
Beaufort, North Carolina; Fort Worth, Texas; Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (tie)

#3 Line Forms Here
Franklin County, Ohio

#4 Incompetence
Cuyahoga County, Ohio

#5 Foul Play
New Hampshire

#6 Gerrymandering
Travis County, Texas

#7 No Felons Allowed
Mississippi Delta

#8 Voting While Black
Charleston, South Carolina

#9 Suspect Students
Waller County, Texas

#10 Failing to Register
Florida

#11 Politicos in Charge
Ohio
Read the whole article at Mother Jones

Quote:
Ohio GOP Election Officials Ducking Subpoenas as Kerry Enters Stolen Vote Fray
By Bob Fitrakis, Steve Rosenfeld and Harvey Wasserman
The Columbus Free Press

Tuesday 28 December 2004

Columbus - Ohio Republican Secretary of State J. Kenneth Blackwell refused to appear at a deposition on Monday, December 27. The deposition was part of an election challenge lawsuit filed at the Ohio Supreme Court. Meanwhile John Kerry is reported to have filed a federal legal action aimed at preserving crucial recount evidence, which has been under GOP assault throughout the state.

Richard Conglianese, Ohio Assistant Attorney General, is seeking a court order to protect Blackwell from testifying under oath about how the election was run. Blackwell, who administered Ohio's November 2 balloting, served as co-chair of the Bush-Cheney campaign.

...

In Miami County, Blackwell certified a 98.6% turnout in the Concord Southwest precinct, comprised of 520 votes for Bush and 157 for Kerry. This statistically improbable turnout has all but 10 of the 689 registered voters casting their ballots on Election Day. A preliminary canvas by The Free Press of less than half the precinct found 25 registered voters admitting they had not voted, meaning the official tally was almost certainly fraudulent.

The nearby Concord South precinct certified a 94.27% voter turnout, with 468 alleged votes for Bush versus 182 for Kerry. Miami County is included in the election challenge since it somehow reported nearly 19,000 additional votes after 100% of the precincts had reported on Election Day.

In Madison County, where public records requests were filed to obtain voting records, the voting results provided by the Madison County Board of Elections came directly from a private company, Triad Governmental Systems, Inc.

...

In Mahoning County, the Washington Post reported new affidavits documenting electronic "vote hopping" from Kerry to Bush. This means voting machines highlighted the choice for Bush before the voter recorded a choice of his or her own. The legal team has been told by a computer expert that this may mean the machines were pre-set on a Bush vote as a default. The Free Press has obtained dozens such sworn statements of vote hopping.

The legal team is also exploring new evidence that in Coshocton, Ohio, write-in votes wrongly defaulted to Bush when run through the voting machine.

...

These problems add to the established pattern of problems that favored Bush at Kerry's expense.
From here.

Quote:
Diebold May Face Criminal Charges
By Kim Zetter
Wired

Friday 23 April 2004

SACRAMENTO, California - After harshly chastising Diebold Election Systems for what it considered deceptive business practices, a California voting systems panel voted unanimously Thursday to recommend that the secretary of state decertify an electronic touch-screen voting machine manufactured by the company, making it likely that four California counties that recently purchased the machines will have to find other voting solutions for the November presidential election.

The panel also voted to send the findings of its recent Diebold investigation to the state's attorney general for possible criminal and civil charges against the firm for violating state election laws.
From here.

Dan Rather: The Trouble With Touch Screens

Quote:
Directed by GNN's Ian Inaba, American Blackout chronicles the recurring patterns of voter disenfranchisement witnessed from 2000 to 2004. Told through the life of Georgia Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney who took an active role investigating the scrubbing of the Florida voter roles and then found herself in her own election debacle after publicly questioning the Bush Administration about the terrorist attacks of 9-11. American Blackout travels from Florida to Georgia to Ohio examining the contemporary tactics used to control our democratic process and silence political dissent.

Winner -- Special Jury Prize, Sundance Film Festival 2006
Winner -- Best Documentary Feature, Cinequest Film Festival 2006
Winner -- Stand Up Audience Award, Cleveland International Film Festival 2006
Winner -- Special Jury Prize, Independent Film Festival of Boston 2006
Winner -- Audience Award, Columbus Alive Deep Focus Film Festival 2006
Winner -- Best Documentary Feature, Urbanworld Film Festival 2006

"One of the most important docs of the past several years." -Earnest Hardy, LA WEEKLY

"Impossible to Ignore" -Jeanette Catsoulis, NEW YORK TIMES
Trailer for American Blackout - Black Voter Disenfranchisement
Quote:
Was the 2004 Election Stolen?
Republicans prevented more than 350,000 voters in Ohio from casting ballots or having their votes counted -- enough to have put John Kerry in the White House.

ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR.Posted Jun 01, 2006 5:02 PM

Page 1 2 3 4
The complete article, with Web-only citations, follows. Talk and read about it in our National Affairs blog, or see exclusive documents, sources, charts and commentary.

Like many Americans, I spent the evening of the 2004 election watching the returns on television and wondering how the exit polls, which predicted an overwhelming victory for John Kerry, had gotten it so wrong. By midnight, the official tallies showed a decisive lead for George Bush -- and the next day, lacking enough legal evidence to contest the results, Kerry conceded. Republicans derided anyone who expressed doubts about Bush's victory as nut cases in ''tinfoil hats,'' while the national media, with few exceptions, did little to question the validity of the election. The Washington Post immediately dismissed allegations of fraud as ''conspiracy theories,''(1) and The New York Times declared that ''there is no evidence of vote theft or errors on a large scale.''(2)

But despite the media blackout, indications continued to emerge that something deeply troubling had taken place in 2004. Nearly half of the 6 million American voters living abroad(3) never received their ballots -- or received them too late to vote(4) -- after the Pentagon unaccountably shut down a state-of-the-art Web site used to file overseas registrations.(5) A consulting firm called Sproul & Associates, which was hired by the Republican National Committee to register voters in six battleground states,(6) was discovered shredding Democratic registrations.(7) In New Mexico, which was decided by 5,988 votes,(8) malfunctioning machines mysteriously failed to properly register a presidential vote on more than 20,000 ballots.(9) Nationwide, according to the federal commission charged with implementing election reforms, as many as 1 million ballots were spoiled by faulty voting equipment -- roughly one for every 100 cast.(10)

The reports were especially disturbing in Ohio, the critical battleground state that clinched Bush's victory in the electoral college. Officials there purged tens of thousands of eligible voters from the rolls, neglected to process registration cards generated by Democratic voter drives, shortchanged Democratic precincts when they allocated voting machines and illegally derailed a recount that could have given Kerry the presidency. A precinct in an evangelical church in Miami County recorded an impossibly high turnout of ninety-eight percent, while a polling place in inner-city Cleveland recorded an equally impossible turnout of only seven percent. In Warren County, GOP election officials even invented a nonexistent terrorist threat to bar the media from monitoring the official vote count.(11)
Read the rest at Rolling Stone.

Etc.
post #9 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsotdc
Ahh, but the bigger claim that is usually made is people who were turned away or kept from voting in the first place. I want to hear from someone who was kept from voting.
Actually, some Ohio voters had to wait up to 9 hours to vote in 2004, many waited up to 2 hours. A bunch of those, guess what, left because they had to do something else. But let's just say that it was a clerical error that a voting precinct that was right off a state university campus only received 2 voting booths.
post #10 of 26
yt and I rideshare brains.
post #11 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte
Ok, not being american, I had no idea it was THAT bad. Even discounting over half of this as "the democrats do it too!" it really shows that the voting system isnt working at all..... or in other words, that you guys dont live in a democracy
post #12 of 26
Jesus Christ that RS article hurt. I had to stop reading it. Thanks?
post #13 of 26
I'm also stunned at the hard time you guys having running elections. Yeah, I think there's a lot of Republican shenanigans going on right now, but the same system allows for Democrats to pull them off, and there's no doubt they either have done so (I'm thinking 40 years ago) or they will do so. It boggles the mind that Kathryn Harris had any sort of say in the Florida elections. Not because she's crazy and not because she's a Republican, but because she's involved with a political party. No one with a vested interest in the outcome of an election should be allowed anywhere near the electoral process.
post #14 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte
yt and I rideshare brains.
You bring the donuts next time.
post #15 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seabass Inna Bun
I'm also stunned at the hard time you guys having running elections. Yeah, I think there's a lot of Republican shenanigans going on right now, but the same system allows for Democrats to pull them off, and there's no doubt they either have done so (I'm thinking 40 years ago) or they will do so. It boggles the mind that Kathryn Harris had any sort of say in the Florida elections. Not because she's crazy and not because she's a Republican, but because she's involved with a political party. No one with a vested interest in the outcome of an election should be allowed anywhere near the electoral process.
The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he doesn't exist.
post #16 of 26
yt & Andre, I'm glad you're there with the citations. I'm always struggling to remember where I hear about this stuff when I get in an arguement. Thanks!
post #17 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seabass Inna Bun
I'm also stunned at the hard time you guys having running elections. Yeah, I think there's a lot of Republican shenanigans going on right now, but the same system allows for Democrats to pull them off, and there's no doubt they either have done so (I'm thinking 40 years ago) or they will do so. It boggles the mind that Kathryn Harris had any sort of say in the Florida elections. Not because she's crazy and not because she's a Republican, but because she's involved with a political party. No one with a vested interest in the outcome of an election should be allowed anywhere near the electoral process.
It's funny you should mention Harris. After Bush got elected in 2000 my wife (girlfriend at the time) got tickets to one of inauguration parties going on around DC. We couldn't stand the idea of being around all those people but we knew that there may never be another chance to get into a party like that. So, we go and hang around a bit. It was every bit as irritating as we thought it would be so we're trying to figure out whether we should go (after being there only 1 hour) when Kathryn Harris gets up on the microphone and screams out "YES! WE DID IT!" and the whole crowd starts cheering. We were back at my wife's apartment in 30 minutes. I'll never forget seeing that.
post #18 of 26
Aside from actual voting trickery, you also have to take into account that there is institutional disenfranchisement, based on the fact that normally only 50-60 percent of the population is accounted for in elections. Go ahead and talk about it on a personal level, how these people had the right to vote, nobody pointed a gun at them to stay at home, but if this is the situation then the system merits review from the people who are responsible for maintaining a democracy in the US.
post #19 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by donde
It's funny you should mention Harris.
Her insanity reaches across the continent. Diagonally.

Quote:
After Bush got elected in 2000 my wife (girlfriend at the time) got tickets to one of inauguration parties going on around DC. We couldn't stand the idea of being around all those people
Enochlophobic? Or just choosey?

Quote:
but we knew that there may never be another chance to get into a party like that.
Alas, there was. Four years later.

Quote:
So, we go and hang around a bit. It was every bit as irritating as we thought it would be so we're trying to figure out whether we should go (after being there only 1 hour) when Kathryn Harris gets up on the microphone and screams out "YES! WE DID IT!" and the whole crowd starts cheering. We were back at my wife's apartment in 30 minutes. I'll never forget seeing that.
Ah! She confessed!

Maybe having political figures run elections made sense on paper a few hundred years ago, but not anymore. America should live in the now.
post #20 of 26
Seabass: When I think about it, I really believe that the founding fathers had no idea that people would honestly be so dishonorable towards each other in the future. Back then, especially amongst themselves and more often than not, a person's word/oath was solid. To go back on it, after you've made a commitment uphold the public good, would be a source of shame and disgust within the community. Nowadays, people just say it's all part of politics.

stump: I think I've read that the number of voters is actually closer to 40%. Nonetheless, we suck as an educated voting populace in this country.
post #21 of 26
Could be, but I'm more inclined to think they believed a well-informed, politically aware and active population would act as per spec and vote such rapscallions and curs out of office out of a sense of enlightened self-interest.

Optimistic lot, weren't they?
post #22 of 26
Well, to an extent they designed the government with those checks and balances and other limitations because they understood how corruptible people are. It's tough to create a system of government that allows a good President/Senator/etc. to do as much good as possible while simultaneously limiting the abuses of a bad one. I don't think the citizens of 200 years ago are all that much different from what we have to deal with nowadays.
post #23 of 26
I was under the impression that the founding fathers only thought that white landowners should vote? So there was less of an issue of someone who wasn't "one of them" getting elected and who is to say that they wouldn't be in the Republican camp trying to fix elections.
post #24 of 26
scsotdc, your faith that something like this could never happen here is endearing, but oh so misplaced. Honestly, there's been so much written on this that anyone who's still saying "Show me the proof" is willfully ignoring its existence at this point.
post #25 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by nekkerbee
Well, to an extent they designed the government with those checks and balances and other limitations because they understood how corruptible people are. It's tough to create a system of government that allows a good President/Senator/etc. to do as much good as possible while simultaneously limiting the abuses of a bad one. I don't think the citizens of 200 years ago are all that much different from what we have to deal with nowadays.
Maybe. Regardless of why, the US electoral process has the fox guarding the henhouse.
post #26 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg David
scsotdc, your faith that something like this could never happen here is endearing, but oh so misplaced. Honestly, there's been so much written on this that anyone who's still saying "Show me the proof" is willfully ignoring its existence at this point.
Greg, not sure you saw it in the Gay Marriage thread but please call me Scotty for ease of typing.

I have been away this weekend and mean to get back into this thread. I am not saying that nothing like this could ever happen here, or that some level of fuckery did not occur. I just don't think the scale is as big as the original posts article claims nor do I believe the insane assertion that voter fraud is a one sided deal.

I have just as many issues with electronic voting as my leftist brethren. I have probably close to the same amount of issues with the disappearance of registration paperwork that belongs to someone of the opposite party. I see the latter as a low level volunteer problem though.

Where I take issue is when the claim is made of a GOP conspiracy to throw out votes, purge voter rolls and block access to polls. I have yet to hear from a single person that was not allowed to vote if they tried.

When I get some more time I will read what has been posted and see if I can respond.
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