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Are US Troops Being Force-Fed Christianity?

post #1 of 26
10/5/07 at 2:01pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Are US Troops Being Force-Fed Christianity?
By Jane Lampman
The Christian Science Monitor

Thursday 04 October 2007

A watchdog group alleges that improper evangelizing is occurring within the ranks.

At Speicher base in Iraq, US Army Spec. Jeremy Hall got permission from a chaplain in August to post fliers announcing a meeting for atheists and other nonbelievers. When the group gathered, Specialist Hall alleges, his Army major supervisor disrupted the meeting and threatened to retaliate against him, including blocking his reenlistment in the Army.

Months earlier, Hall charges, he had been publicly berated by a staff sergeant for not agreeing to join in a Thanksgiving Day prayer.

On Sept. 17, the soldier and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF) filed suit against Army Maj. Freddy Welborn and US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, charging violations of Hall's constitutional rights, including being forced to submit to a religious test to qualify as a soldier.

The MRFF plans more lawsuits in coming weeks, says Michael "Mikey" Weinstein, who founded the military watchdog group in 2005. The aim is "to show there is a pattern and practice of constitutionally impermissible promotions of religious beliefs within the Department of Defense."

For Mr. Weinstein - a former Air Force judge advocate and assistant counsel in the Reagan White House - more is involved than isolated cases of discrimination. He charges that several incidents in recent years - and more than 5,000 complaints his group has received from active-duty and retired military personnel - point to a growing willingness inside the military to support a particular brand of Christianity and to permit improper evangelizing in the ranks. More than 95 percent of those complaints come from other Christians, he says.

Others agree on the need for the watchdog group, but question the conspiratorial view and some of its tactics. They say dealing with religious issues is a complex matter, and the military is trying to address them appropriately.

At the Defense Department, spokeswoman Cynthia Smith says the DOD doesn't comment on litigation, but "places a high value on the rights of members of the Armed Forces to observe the tenets of their respective religions."
The rest is here.
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post #2 of 26
10/5/07 at 2:05pm
This has been going on for years:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s9F7p3w9jQ
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post #3 of 26
10/5/07 at 3:05pm
I don't know how the U.S. Army rolls, but when I was in the Marine Corps about five years ago we had total religious freedom to practice whatever the hell we wanted. Sometimes the Wiccans would get made fun of, but we were never forced to engage in a decidedly Christian prayer. I pretty much went from church to church depending on what I felt like sitting through every Sunday.

The only time I was every fucked with was back in boot camp when I attended Buddhist ceremonies (oh, the irony!) and we had to take off our boots before we went inside. Sure enough, when we came out there was a Drill Instructor there screaming at us for not having our boots on, knowing full well we had to take them off. Hilarious.

However, as I said, this was five years ago. I have no idea how deep this Fundie movement has entrenched itself into today's military.
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post #4 of 26
10/5/07 at 3:22pm
Same for me. I guess they had services for a bunch of different religions and you were only required to go on the first Sunday. Usually I stayed in the squad bay and did crossword puzzles, except for Thanksgiving, when the choice was church or having to sit through "Behind Enemy Lines 2".
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post #5 of 26
10/5/07 at 3:34pm
My time in the Marine Corps is a while before yours. I don't remember ever feeling much pressure myself, but I have friends that were in battalions where there was a lot of active evangelizing going on. I remember one battalion commander who had daily religious services at the CP--these were a refuge for all the dirtbags who would then hide under the COs wing when they got in trouble for other stuff. Also, some highly placed wild man would occasionally get religion after a long life of misbehaving and decide that he had to save everybody else too. Mandatory bible studies and churchgoing would become the order of the day until somebody further up the food chain would hear about it and cool things down.

I think that things are a lot more intense now (if all the reports in the news are to be believed). The Air Force--particularly the Air Force Academy--seems to be particularly lousy with evangelical Christians. The Air Force is creepy enough to begin with--I don't know if this makes me think any less of them or not. Still, I don't think anybody should have to put up with any more crap than they already have dealt out to them when they're in the military. Evangelizing--whether done by chaplains or resident 13th disciples--should be prohibited.
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post #6 of 26
10/5/07 at 3:34pm
Now THAT'S inappropriate.

Whatever happened to the Full Metal Jacket guy? "Do you love the Virgin Mary?...My God, you've got guts."
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post #7 of 26
10/5/07 at 4:01pm
Quote:
The Air Force is creepy enough to begin with
Eh, how so? If I had known the Corps would throw me in the air wing I probably would've just joined the AF instead. Maid service in the barracks, you know.
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post #8 of 26
10/5/07 at 5:09pm
I guess that my feeling about the Air Force is wholly irrational. Now, if I were to think about it seriously, I'd have to admit that guys in the Air Force have full and meaningful lives, just like me. Still, I remember that we thought that the Air Force was something like a slack version of the Postal Service. One of my buddies used to say that when his brother joined the Air Force, his dad told everyone that he was in jail to avoid embarrassment.
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post #9 of 26
10/5/07 at 5:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nid Hog
One of my buddies used to say that when his brother joined the Air Force, his dad told everyone that he was in jail to avoid embarrassment.
See, I can understand someone doing that if their son's in the Navy, but the Air Force seems a little more respectable than that.
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post #10 of 26
10/5/07 at 6:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Happenin
See, I can understand someone doing that if their son's in the Navy,
HEY! Them's fightin' words, buddy!
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post #11 of 26
10/5/07 at 7:27pm
My dad was in the Navy, my best friend through high school is currently in the Air Force. They both get alot of shit.

My friend went through boot camp...3, 4 years ago? He said there was no evangelizing or religious pressure of any type.

As a side note, if I were to join the military, I think I'd go after his job. He's works on B2 bombers, which means he is stationed at one base for his entire service time - no moving around every two years. On the downside, that base is in Missouri.
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post #12 of 26
10/5/07 at 11:21pm
If I joined, I would what my uncles job, Captian of a warship. Nice work if you can get it.
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post #13 of 26
10/6/07 at 10:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by lordelsey
If I joined, I would what my uncles job, Captian of a warship. Nice work if you can get it.
See? In the Navy they let you warship whatever you want.
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post #14 of 26
10/6/07 at 11:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by horrid
See? In the Navy they let you warship whatever you want.


"BA-DUMP BUMP, ting!"
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post #15 of 26
10/6/07 at 3:38pm
Most of the guys I know who are National Guard or Reservists are pretty much evangelical or at least very conservative Christians. But most of the guys I know who are regular military are religious but not so much of the evangelical rank.

As for the Air Force, I have a bunch of friends who are in it. I mess with most of them. Accept my best friend since he should have been a Marine, but his dad forced him into the Air Force (the whole father/son shit).
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post #16 of 26
10/6/07 at 5:24pm
Why does the Air Force catch so much shit? Wouldn't most people want to try and be a fucking badass fighter pilot?
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post #17 of 26
10/6/07 at 8:53pm
Because only a very small number of people in the air force are fighter pilots and they're all officers anyway.
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post #18 of 26
10/6/07 at 11:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormin
Why does the Air Force catch so much shit? Wouldn't most people want to try and be a fucking badass fighter pilot?
Because there are a third of a million people in the Air Force and two thousand figher jets. You do the math on how many of those guys ever fly a fighter jet.

Plus, the Army has the Rangers and the Navy/Marines have the SEALs. The USAF does not have an equivalent to the SAS as far as I know.
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post #19 of 26
10/6/07 at 11:45pm
Army's got Rangers, Delta, Green Berets. Navy has SEALs (Marines are not part of the Navy and have Force Recon). Air Force has Special Tactics Group.
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post #20 of 26
10/7/07 at 12:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soilent Green
Army's got Rangers, Delta, Green Berets. Navy has SEALs . Air Force has Special Tactics Group. And the Marines have..the Marines.
Fixed.
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post #21 of 26
10/7/07 at 12:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belethedheliel
The USAF does not have an equivalent to the SAS as far as I know.
They're just waiting until they've perfected jet packs, and then they'll get their special troops all right.
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post #22 of 26
10/7/07 at 11:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belethedheliel
The USAF does not have an equivalent to the SAS as far as I know.
The Air Force does boast a small cadre of men who do not hold their pinkies out while sipping their appletinis. That's about the best they can do.
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post #23 of 26
10/9/07 at 3:12pm
Living in Las Vegas, I have to go to Nellis Air Force Base to hit up my local Commissary and PX (they call it BX but fuck them) so I have to deal with a lot of airmen, and they deserve all the shit they get. They are heinous when it comes to behavior and respect for their appearance. I actually got into an argument because one of them insulted my wife (who is a civilian contractor) when they had what amounted to a Blue Light Special and we hit them up to see what they were selling.

Douchebag: Huh, looks like they let just anyone in here nowadays! Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk!

Me: Why are you wearing your cover indoors, asshole?

Douchebag: Uh...I didn't know we couldn't?
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post #24 of 26
10/9/07 at 4:19pm
Ahhh so much hate for the Air Force, but that's ok. All I know is when I deploy I don't have to sleep in mud and get shot at or blown up.

Check out our new digs at al Udeid

Quote:
New housing planned at al Udeid

By Bruce Rolfsen - Staff writer
Posted : Tuesday Aug 28, 2007 22:16:08 EDT

If your idea of a deployment to the Persian Gulf region conjures visions of living in plywood barracks or trailerlike dorms, you may be surprised if your orders send you to al Udeid Air Base in an undisclosed location in SWA.

Airmen at al Udeid are preparing to move into a permanent housing and recreation complex dubbed Millennium Village that has been in the works since 2003.

Millennium Village, built to house about 1,500 people, is slated to be in the “initial operational capability” phase by January, and by the end of 2008, the complex should be in “fully operational capability,” according to Air Force news release.

Once complete, Millennium Village will feature a mall, base exchange, recreation room with two golf simulators, food court, chapel, post office, dining facility, learning resource center, clinic, fire house, fitness center, dorms, a kennel and two search pits, the release said.

In the dorms, airmen will have bedroom suites that share a common kitchen area, much like new dormitories at bases in the U.S. Many of the stores will face an enclosed four-story atrium with a blue tile fountain in the center.

“Our goal is to assist in the transformation from an expeditionary base to an enduring base using a well-thought-out approach assuring Millennium Village is structurally sound and meets Air Force quality-of-life standards,” Lt. Col. Donald Reese, deputy chief of the 379th Expeditionary Mission Support Group, said in the Air Force release.

Al Udeid is the largest air base in the U.S. Central Command area of responsibility. The base’s runway facilities were built by the an undisclosed location in SWAi government in mid-1990s. As the Air Force prepared for the start of Operation Iraqi Freedom, al Udeid became a primary hub for air operations.

Today, the base is home to the 379th Air Expeditionary Wing and the Combined Air Operations Center. Because the base is far from the war zones of Iraq and Afghanistan, some Air Force officials have suggested that as base facilities there improve, assignments to the base be treated as yearlong unaccompanied tours, much like tours to Korea are handled.
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post #25 of 26
10/10/07 at 9:34pm
...and that's why everyone hates the Air Force! The Navy's making me fly through Alaska instead of Hawaii on my way to Japan this month because it saves a few nickels, and the Air Force is laying in fabulous rec centers because it has money to burn.
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post #26 of 26
10/11/07 at 7:18am
Say what?
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