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The tiger attack.

post #1 of 90
12/27/07 at 3:56am
Thread Starter 
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...4SVN.DTL&tsp=1

Quote:
San Francisco police are investigating the possibility that one of the victims in the fatal tiger mauling on Christmas Day climbed over a waist-high gate and then dangled a leg or other body part over the edge of a moat that kept the big cat away from the public, sources close to the investigation said Wednesday.

The minimal evidence found at the scene included a shoe and blood in an area between the gate and the edge of the 25- to 30-foot-wide moat, raising questions about what role, if any, the victims might have had in accidentally helping the animal escape.

....

Police sources said a footprint had been found on a metal fence, suggesting that someone had climbed it to get closer to the big cats.

....

Zoo Director Manuel Mollinedo said it was also likely that the animal was provoked.

"Somebody created a situation that really agitated her and gave her some sort of a method to break out," Mollinedo said. "There is no possible way the cat could have made it out of there in a single leap. I would surmise that there was help.

"A couple of feet dangling over the edge could possibly have done it."

Sources said pinecones and sticks that were found in the moat might have been thrown at the animal. Those items could not have landed in the grotto naturally, they said.

While the jury's still out as to whether or not the tiger's victim's helped her escape, and I'm not a hardcore animal rights activist, the circumstances around this incident make me feel even more guilty about animals trapped in the zoo than I already do. On top of that, I have a feeling that these teens did help the tiger escape, resulting in the attack, and I additionally feel guilty for my gut response of 'You got what you deserved dumbasses.'
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post #2 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:17am
Somebody get the Darwin Awards on the line.
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post #3 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:22am
If they helped, they got what they deserved.

When I read the story I honestly felt sorry for the tiger more than anything. It certainly wasn't the animal's fault. I loved the zoo growing up, still do, but certain animals just don't belong there.
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post #4 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:28am
I'm backing the dead tiger as well. I know I'd be out for blood if I had to work on Christmas.
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post #5 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterRose
While the jury's still out as to whether or not the tiger's victim's helped her escape, and I'm not a hardcore animal rights activist, the circumstances around this incident make me feel even more guilty about animals trapped in the zoo than I already do. On top of that, I have a feeling that these teens did help the tiger escape, resulting in the attack, and I additionally feel guilty for my gut response of 'You got what you deserved dumbasses.'
I'm torn on this as well, for the same reason. A human being was killed. A siberian tiger was killed. They had no choice but to shoot the tiger, but the tiger never did anything to merit life in prison, did it? I Gotta side with the tiger, too.
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post #6 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:41am
Yeah, I mean, couldn't they have tranq'ed the shit out of it?

What would the people have said? I mean, it's not like calling out animal control for not putting down a rabid pitbull or something... it's A SIBERIAN TIGER. A pissed off one, to boot. Who, apparently, was being harassed by the kids.

It's like that Chris Rock joke... "That tiger didn't go crazy... that tiger went tiger!"
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post #7 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:47am
What I love is that some of these attacks took place in a cafeteria...meaning the non-injured parties were treated to being spectators of tiger maulings with their meal or Dinner Theater: Roman Coliseum Style. I wish I were that lucky.
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post #8 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:02am
Why wasn't anyone filming this? If it was some dumbass provoking the tiger then he deserved it, and that makes it OK to want to see a video of this, right? If Cloverfield teaches us anything, it will be that people should always have a camcorder ready.
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post #9 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:06am
Is this the face of a vicious killing machine?

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post #10 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:15am
Is this?


Tigers are pretty and all, but they seem kind of like the jerks of the animal world.
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post #11 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:49am
I dunno man, beavers are pretty big jerks.
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post #12 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuddL
I dunno man, beavers are pretty big jerks.
Nah, beavers are like the construction workers of the animal world. Slow, dumb, and crude, but they perform a needed service.
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post #13 of 90
12/27/07 at 6:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeShaynePI
Nah, beavers are like the construction workers of the animal world. Slow, dumb, and crude, but they perform a needed service.
A needed service for whom? The beavers. They block and divert water supplies without any consideration of others.
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post #14 of 90
12/27/07 at 6:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeShaynePI
Tigers are pretty and all, but they seem kind of like the jerks of the animal world.
Tigers are thugs. Lions give hugs!*


*Other lions must be pissed - that guy's giving them a bad name!
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post #15 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeShaynePI
Is this?


Tigers are pretty and all, but they seem kind of like the jerks of the animal world.
Is that, like, Ted Bundy's baby picture? No matter the species, all viscious killers were once cute and cuddly. Did I just blow your mind or what?
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post #16 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTSMGL
Yeah, I mean, couldn't they have tranq'ed the shit out of it?

What would the people have said? I mean, it's not like calling out animal control for not putting down a rabid pitbull or something... it's A SIBERIAN TIGER. A pissed off one, to boot. Who, apparently, was being harassed by the kids.
Actually, they'd've had to get the zoo vet out to sedate it, and it was currently mauling a person when the police shot it. So I think the police, reasonably, decided to kill the tiger before it killed the person it was currently mauling.

Animal control does not have any medications and certainly does not have the kind of drugs it takes to dart a tiger.

Tigers weigh hundreds of pounds and are incredibly dangerous. If one of the people mauled was responsible for baiting/provoking and releasing the tiger, then I do think he got what he deserved; it was a cruel and incredibly stupid thing to do. However, although all the victims were at the zoo together, if one of them was provoking the tiger and the others were not, they certainly do not deserve the lifelong scars (physical and mental) they shall have if they survive.

Although you may think that zoos are cruel (and captivity certainly has its price), the educational benefits of creating public awareness of ecology, biodiversity and endangered species, and the ability to study and captively breed threatened and endangered species requires some animals to be in captivity. The IUCN Red List currently lists 65 species as "extinct in the wild." If it were not for captive animals, those 65 species would be extinct.
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post #17 of 90
12/27/07 at 8:47am
Never get out of the boat. Absolutely Goddamn right.
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post #18 of 90
12/27/07 at 11:19am
Naive question: Wouldn't the zoos be better served keeping tranquilizer guns at the ready for situations like this? There had to be at least a few moments of lag time before the police rolled in. If zoo staff had quick access to guns, it could save other people/animals from being attacked, and also might save the attacking animal's life.
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post #19 of 90
12/27/07 at 11:21am
If tigers are the jerks, what does that make elephants? This thread is turning very interesting...
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post #20 of 90
12/27/07 at 11:57am
I'd like to point out that tiger's are the only species to have the kick ass moniker: "Man Eating" (not to be confused with the Hall and Oates song, of course). It's not like this is a fluffy bunny that goes postal and chews your head off, dumbass. It's a fucking TIGER! A MAN EATING fucking TIGER!

Oy...
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post #21 of 90
12/27/07 at 12:43pm
Actually, crocodiles and sharks can both be given the "man-eater" label.

Sharks, however, are somewhat less likely to climb out of their enclosure and wander around the zoo cafeteria.

Re the story, if I were a zoo official, I'd be additionally heartbroken at the shooting of the tiger, because now we can't put it back in the cage and start advertising, "Come see the tiger that killed and ate a dude!" You know that'd sell a shitload of tickets. Not least to parents who could amuse themselves by saying to their children at the cage rail, "LOOK OUT THE TIGER'S ESCAPING, aw, stop crying, you pussy."
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post #22 of 90
12/27/07 at 1:30pm
Was the guy who was killed one of the ones doing the taunting? I got the impression he was sitting in the cafe calmly enjoying his drink when HOLY SHIT FUCKING TIGER!!!
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post #23 of 90
12/27/07 at 1:37pm
Hopefully the guy didn't try and reenact that scene from The Simpsons where Homer was taunting that Dolphin with his hot dog.
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post #24 of 90
12/27/07 at 1:52pm
This is a reason I dislike zoos. They seem to provoke completely inappropriate feelings from both sides of the spectrum. On one hand you have assholes trying to show off by teasing beings that could casually snap their spine in half, behind steel fences. On the other hand you have sentimental fools crying about them as if they're kittens starving in the snow.

None of these approaches is proper. Incidents like this are good because they put things a little bit in perspective.
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post #25 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:15pm
The Tyler Zoo had a lion exhibit where you could look through a ground level plexi-glass enclosure at the Tigers. The Tigers would often be right up on the glass watching the two legged meals watch them. Sometimes the Tigers would pounce and hit the glass if a two legged meal had their back to them. This went on for a few years till the Zoo introduced a electrical fence around the viewing enclosure. Now the Tigers just sit and watch, waiting.
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post #26 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by summer smile
Naive question: Wouldn't the zoos be better served keeping tranquilizer guns at the ready for situations like this? There had to be at least a few moments of lag time before the police rolled in. If zoo staff had quick access to guns, it could save other people/animals from being attacked, and also might save the attacking animal's life.
According to one article, zoo staff actually do keep guns on hand for emergency situations such as this and are authorized to shoot escaped animals. Unfortunately, the scene was so chaotic that none of them were able to respond appropriately. Training issue, maybe?
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post #27 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrybeanbag
I'm torn on zoos as well. A lot of them are just grungy places that treat the animals like crap, and then you have places like the San Diego Zoo which is fairly aware of animal rights and the importance of preservation as well as giving the animals a fair bit of space.
San Diego Zoo works to protect the animals' welfare. Please don't confuse that with rights. (Welfare = well being of animal; rights = privledges like freedom, fair trials, and voting)
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post #28 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:51pm
Hey! Animals deserve the full rights of human beings, dammit! Don't make me throw blood on you, you sickening carnivore!
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post #29 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrybeanbag
Oh shit, you mean the Caldwell Zoo in Tyler, TX?

The Christian school I attended used to go on field trips there all the time. Now that I think back, an incident with lions and that crowd would have been somewhat amusing.
Yep. Kinda disappointed in the Zoo because they started to charge admission. It used to be free for several years due to the Caldwell estate funding the Zoo and through revenue by their special breeding programs.
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post #30 of 90
12/27/07 at 2:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Brasky
According to one article, zoo staff actually do keep guns on hand for emergency situations such as this and are authorized to shoot escaped animals. Unfortunately, the scene was so chaotic that none of them were able to respond appropriately. Training issue, maybe?
My girlfriend works at Sea World here in Orlando and they have polar bear drills -- what to do if a polar bear somehow gets out of the Wild Arctic exhibit. Which should be one page long and read "Run like hell."
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post #31 of 90
12/27/07 at 3:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Happenin
Hey! Animals deserve the full rights of human beings, dammit! Don't make me throw blood on you, you sickening carnivore!
If they should, they should pay taxes like everyone else. No one gets a free ride around here.
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post #32 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by summer smile
Naive question: Wouldn't the zoos be better served keeping tranquilizer guns at the ready for situations like this? There had to be at least a few moments of lag time before the police rolled in. If zoo staff had quick access to guns, it could save other people/animals from being attacked, and also might save the attacking animal's life.

In terms of tranquilizer guns, it's not like the same drugs and doses work for all large animals, so they'd have to have one for each animal (as in, the tiger gun, the elephant gun, etc) and people trained to shoot each one.

As far as having firearms, those are obviously more one-size-fits-all. However, it still requires quite a bit of training. Keep in mind that in a public space, you can't just shoot, seeing as if you miss the tiger you could hit a bystander. Also, it is my understanding that the tiger was shot while in the act of mauling a person. Having the wherewithal to shoot the tiger when it's moving and within inches of a living person (without shooting the person)... that's a whole 'nother ballgame.
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post #33 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson
My girlfriend works at Sea World here in Orlando and they have polar bear drills -- what to do if a polar bear somehow gets out of the Wild Arctic exhibit. Which should be one page long and read "Run like hell."
That's step two.

Step one is "throw 'em a cripple."
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post #34 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeShaynePI
Is this?


Tigers are pretty and all, but they seem kind of like the jerks of the animal world.
Like these jerks of the animal world?







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post #35 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cervaise
That's step two.

Step one is "throw 'em a cripple."
"When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon... ...you just have to outrun the halfling."




Also, you know how to hunt polar bears? You and the guide go out in the arctic and sit back to back, and wait for the polar bear to hunt you.
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post #36 of 90
12/27/07 at 4:15pm
Now that you mention it, Tom Cruise is a lot like Hitler. And I'd bet they were both adorable tots, too.
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post #37 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belethedheliel
Although you may think that zoos are cruel (and captivity certainly has its price), the educational benefits of creating public awareness of ecology, biodiversity and endangered species, and the ability to study and captively breed threatened and endangered species requires some animals to be in captivity. The IUCN Red List currently lists 65 species as "extinct in the wild." If it were not for captive animals, those 65 species would be extinct.
I don't buy it. Awareness and education can be done in other ways and note that those 65 species are namely birds, insects and lizards, animals which are easy to raise and breed in captivity.
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post #38 of 90
12/27/07 at 5:20pm
Seems like one person was killed in the proximity of the cage, then two people were killed three hundred feet away in a cafeteria. Some worthless taunters being removed from the gene pool is something we can all get behind (except for the tiger's death), but were the two guys way over in the cafeteria involved? Hmmm.....

Upon doing some research on the web (which I won't bother to cite, cuz' I'm lazy), the last time an article was written on this tiger (Tatiana), the picture depicted her in a cage with the lock hanging open. Ummm....not safe. Of course, the San Francisco Zoo is like every aspect of San Francisco; decaying, poorly managed, staffed largely by incompetent dullards, and incapable of modernization. I remember visiting it on several occasions and being appalled by it. Obviously it was designed in an area when maximizing viewing area was more important than providing a humane and sizable enclosure.
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post #39 of 90
12/27/07 at 6:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlord
Seems like one person was killed in the proximity of the cage, then two people were killed three hundred feet away in a cafeteria. Some worthless taunters being removed from the gene pool is something we can all get behind (except for the tiger's death), but were the two guys way over in the cafeteria involved? Hmmm.....
Those "little Eichmanns" were complacent in their own demise.
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post #40 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson
My girlfriend works at Sea World here in Orlando and they have polar bear drills -- what to do if a polar bear somehow gets out of the Wild Arctic exhibit. Which should be one page long and read "Run like hell."
This makes my role as office fire-drill chief seem a little less important. Oh well, at least I still have my little red hat.
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post #41 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:05pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlord
Seems like one person was killed in the proximity of the cage, then two people were killed three hundred feet away in a cafeteria. Some worthless taunters being removed from the gene pool is something we can all get behind (except for the tiger's death), but were the two guys way over in the cafeteria involved? Hmmm.....

Upon doing some research on the web (which I won't bother to cite, cuz' I'm lazy), the last time an article was written on this tiger (Tatiana), the picture depicted her in a cage with the lock hanging open. Ummm....not safe. Of course, the San Francisco Zoo is like every aspect of San Francisco; decaying, poorly managed, staffed largely by incompetent dullards, and incapable of modernization. I remember visiting it on several occasions and being appalled by it. Obviously it was designed in an area when maximizing viewing area was more important than providing a humane and sizable enclosure.

The article states that the tiger followed a blood trail to find the other victims who had run away slightly scathed from the first attack.
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post #42 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
The injured victims fled, leaving a trail of blood, which police believe the tiger followed for 300 yards up a zoo pathway. As the tiger cornered and attacked one of the brothers, four police officers arrived, distracted the animal and shot it dead.
For clarification....
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post #43 of 90
12/27/07 at 7:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuddL
Those "little Eichmanns" were complacent in their own demise.
Err....."complicit?"

This tiger is my new hero. Also, the racist comments sprouting all over the web in regards to the dead victim are somewhat shocking, even by my web-cynical standards.


Here is the dead victim's myspace page:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...endid=44515158

Apparently he took the time to log in and register his mood as "high" on the day of his tortuous mauling/slaying. Here's a quote from his "about me" section:

Quote:
Hey What's Up!?
My Name is Carlos,
Im portugeese and brazilian.
I'm 16, I love my life , but its gonna get better.
I want to be DJ someday.
I Hang with the family ,
and my true homies play basketball
and go out to the movies and
partyharder then a rock star,
only sumdayz wen i have my days off of work.
I'm just a laid back guy
looking for some cool new friends!
So if anyone wants to talk,
just say wat it doo doo!!
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post #44 of 90
12/27/07 at 9:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlord
Err....."complicit?"
I'll "complicit" you!
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post #45 of 90
12/27/07 at 10:45pm
And the winner is...!



BOOYAH!
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post #46 of 90
12/27/07 at 10:50pm
So it's come out that the wall of the tiger enclosure was not 20 feet high, but only 12 and a half. WTF? Yeah, the kid may have been a dumbass, but 12 feet is not high enough by any stretch for the pen of a tiger that, rearing upright, would reach 6' or more already. That means it only needed to leap up around 6 feet to catch hold of the top of the wall, and if the zoo staff and administrator find it hard to believe that a tiger could make that jump they need to go back to zoo school.
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post #47 of 90
12/27/07 at 11:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Hill
and if the zoo staff and administrator find it hard to believe that a tiger could make that jump they need to go back to zoo school.
Obviously they all had degrees from an online correspondence course. "It was either this or Dental Assistant!"
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post #48 of 90
12/28/07 at 1:27pm
The wonderful thing about Tiggers is that Tiggers will MAUL YOUR FACE!
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post #49 of 90
12/28/07 at 1:33pm
I've got word the SFPD wants to talk to this guy:



In fact Baloo is wanted for questioning in the matter.
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post #50 of 90
12/28/07 at 1:40pm
Don't mess with tigers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7Rqk...eature=related
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