Bill Hicks

Don't say I didn't warn you. But at least you like some British comedy.

Actually, that second option's not too far from truth. A lot of stuff goes into the category of "preaching to the choir". That said, presentation's everything, and he was damn good at presenting this "obvious" stuff in an entertaining way.

Also, not to make the "you saw the wrong special" argument, but his best stuff's on CD. Chances are, someone talking about how great Bill Hicks is is basing it on Arizona Bay or Rant in E Minor.

I always get a kick out of how he dealt with hecklers.

Okay, Patrick, that's it...you and me, behind the school, 3:00.

Seriously, though, you don't dig him, you don't dig him. Personally, I love the guy, but he's one of the few comedians who really speaks to my way of thinking. Plus, as Justin said, he really was good at his presentation.

Still...it couldn't hurt to go and have your funny bone checked.

I wrote a bunch of different things. But, it's just not worth it. I will say this: There's more to it, to anything, than just not liking it. Things are bigger than you just not liking it. Why is it that some things have resonated and remained? I'm not saying you're wrong. But the things that resonate are usually worth looking into a little deeper.

Fuck it. Hicks is one of my favorite artists of all time. He deserves to still be listened to, shared, talked about. Comedians of today look up to his work for a good reason. He hated the right things in the right way. Wish there were more like him.

R.I.P.

R.I.P. Patrick's taste - who, god help me, likes our podcast.

You don't find his "advertisers, go kill yourselves. No, seriously, go kill yourselves. This isn't a joke, go kill yourselves." funny? At all?

Dead to me.

I usually don't resort to this, but Patrick, you are wrong. Your PERSONAL opinion, it's wrong. You shouldn't trust yourself from now on.

This is like old Bruce Wayne, Kevin Spacey, that fail bullshit, all that rolled into one giant internet retort. I just can't comprehend.

Even mentioning Carlos Mencia and Dane Cook in the same breath as Bill Hicks (I know you weren't advocating them) deserves some kind of stern talking to, at the very least.

Now I'm thinking you can't even be trusted to tell us whether or not you like dudes. Everything you think going forward, you have to ask yourself, "Am I sure?"

I'm teasing you. This is one hurty generation gap, though. Can other 20 year old dudes weigh in? Like Albert Popwell, I gots to know.

I've got your back to a degree, Patrick. I don't think Hicks works as well in a one-hour stand-up format. It's too relentless, repetitive and negative. I think he would have been brilliant doing 5-10 minute rants on something like The Daily Show (like what Lewis Black does now), but I find his stand-up pretty exhausting and only moderately amusing.

Bah. Where do you hear this kind of shit anymore? Yeah, it's obvious, but no working comedians are talking about it anymore. White guys drive like this...

I don't know, in one night I've read that Patrick finds John Belushi, Gilda Radner, and Bill Hicks not funny. I could only pray it's an age thing, I know he's an intelligent, seemingly right minded guy.

I know comedy's a weird thing- I've been known to recommend some awfully shitty movies because they made me laugh- but I thought everybody liked Bill Hicks.

To each his own, I suppose. Don't misconstrue this as being judgmental, either. All in good fun, but if I respond to every one of your threads "Yeah, but you don't like Bill Hicks," don't hold it against me.

Sucks for you.

God damn it, Ripoll, you just slammed the door on any chance you had at sleeping with me too.

In all seriousness, I didn't like Hicks the first time I heard him. Granted, it was a shitty bootleg and not one of his best performances, but I swore that I hated it. A few years later, I decided to check out Rant in E Minor and Arizona Bay on a whim, and fell in love. Maybe it was because everything hit at the right time for me and Hicks echoed a lot of the emotions and frustrations I was feeling at politics and society in general.

I'm a huge defender of Hicks now. Give it some time, you might grow to like him.

I'd probably still be willing to sleep with you, but first I need to hear your opinion of peanut butter cups and Salma Hayek's breasts.

Hicks may be losing his bite nowadays because an entire generation of comics has come along that is either heavily influenced by Hicks (David Cross) or is flat out ripping him off (Denis Leary). I discovered Hicks in high school, and it influenced my growth as a human being. Finding him now, I can't imagine he would have the same effect.

I saw one bit where he was busting on a smoker - "how much do you smoke? 4 packs a day? Wow, aren't you a big, tough guy...smokin' 4 packs a day, 'oh yeah, my lungs are black, I don't care whatcha gonna do about it?'

Dude, I go through two LIGHTERS a day."

Good point. You need to look at the context of where Hicks came out of - just as SNL to an extent blew up the entrenched Borscht Belt stylings of the old school comedians, Hicks was an innovator at the time; such an innovator that these days what he came up with is the driving force behind what NUMEROUS comedians do. Think the Beatles - I like 'em well enough, but they don't do anything for me. But back in the day, Revolver must have been absolutely fucking mind-blowing; today, it's just an old record that's part of some unassailable canon.

Gayest and Chavez pretty much nailed it. Patrick, this is one of those cases where you had to be there - when Hicks came around, we were ass-deep in Reagan and Bush I presidencies, coming out of Desert Storm, etc. Stand-up comedy was going through a decent revival (Kinison, Dice, Dangerfield's HBO Specials, etc.). Hicks was one of the few who wasn't angling for a sitcom deal or movie vehicle - all he did was preach the truth, with all the venom and bile he could, at a time of excess superficiality.

It's like your classic SNL take - you had to be there and live through the times they were referencing in order to appreciate it.

The reason Hicks is so close to my heart isn't that he was so funny (he was, imo, and I was only introduced to his stuff a couple of years back) but that everything he said is a sign of just how intensely he cared. There are a lot of great comedians, many who make me laugh a hell of a lot more than he does, but not one who is as much of a humanist.

And if the "Running up to Jackie Onassis with your sniper rifle pendant" bit doesn't make you laugh, well...

What Tim said.

Also, Ripoll is a Republican. That's the only way this thread makes sense. But thanks for sharing, Pat.

I fairly recently got turned on to Hicks by a friend. I may not find him the most gut bustingly hilarious, but watching him perform or listening to him is riveting. I can understand if you don't think he's all that funny, but not insightful? Madness.

I disagree with the "you had to be there" argument. If you watch a Marx Bros. movie you have to watch it knowing that all the jokes have been ripped off hundreds of times since the movies originally came out. The movies are still funny if you ignore all the things that have copied it and view it as if you were in the original audience. I was eight was Hicks was at his peak, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate and enjoy his work.

Okay, guys. I think we need to all calm down, take a deep breath, and LYNCH THE FUCK OUT OF PATRICK. I'll get the rope.

EDIT: Also, what Doinel said. I basically just discovered the guy two years ago. I think I was more taken with the idea of another Southerner who felt misplaced and at odds with most of the stuff that he grew up with - and like Quarant said, he was a hell of a humanist for as much vitriol as he could spit, but damned if his Bush and Iraq stuff didn't hit at the right time too. It's funny how you can basically re-play skits regarding both of those topics today and they still come off as fairly prescient.

It's true, and creepy, that the Bush/Iraq jokes play almost better now than they did at the time. Can you imagine if Hicks had lived to see W? He would have been apoplectic.

I think, in the case of the Marx Bros., it was more slapstick and visual/musical/linguistic comedy (puns, double entendres, improvised lines, etc.). That type of comedy is timeless and has a bit wider, more universal, appeal, as opposed to more topical comedy, which comes across as more cerebral (it's an odd coincidence that we're going through Bush and war with Iraq again - I'd betcha if anyone predicted we'd have a repeat performance after Bush Sr. and Desert Storm, Hicks' would've been foaming at the mouth screaming for a revolution).

Ultimately, everyone has different takes on comedy - I dig most of Patrick's picks, I worship at the altar of Hicks, Lenny Bruce, Mel Brooks, Carl Reiner, Kids in the Hall, Upright Citizens Brigade, classic SNL, and so on. But, I also can't stand comedians like Tom Green, Sasha Baron Cohen, etc. and am indifferent on Dane Cook. Someone wiser than I said it - different strokes...

I think Patrick has begun to drink deeply of the Devin Faraci "I hate everything you guys love" Kool-Aid.

Why won't you let us love you?

True enough; but I think the point was that even with the Marx Bros being masters of the genre, someone just stumbling across, say, Duck Soup might watch and think it's enjoyable enough, but not get what the big deal is, as they've seen that stuff a million times.

And of course, they have; they've seen it a million times because in the time span between the film's initial release and today, thousands of comedians, movies, and tv shows have imitated what the Marx Bros did.

That's why Hicks would have been mind-blowing back in the 80s but fall into the "entertaining and charismatic but I don't get the worship" category that Patrick has slotted him into today.

I'm 21 and I agree with Patrick. Now all I've seen are a handful of four minute clips of Hicks on youtube but from what I've seen, I'm not a fan. I didn't laugh at his marketing people jokes or his stuff about smoking. It wasn't terrible, I guess it was just okay.

And I think early SNL ranks up there as some of the best comedy ever. I love or enjoy Carlin, Pryor, Cosby, Eddie Murphy, Izzard, Oswalt, Hedburg, Steve Martin and Kaufman. So I don't think it's a generational gap.

Maybe I don't really like that more confrontational style of comedy that much. I also hate Sam Kinison.

Well, Kinison doesn't really deserve comparison to those other people on your list anyway. The guy somehow became retroactively brilliant after he died, and people who never would have praised him in life were required to talk about how great he was. I call it The John Candy Effect.

I'm kind of the opposite. I used to like the guy, but in retrospect, his stuff doesn't work for me anymore.

...

Early on Kinison was brilliant. It was toward the end of the decade when he was trying to rival the Diceman as a "rockstar" comic and doing that "Wild Thing" video where he flew off the rails.

Not to be cruel, but it's a bummer he didn't die before doing that sitcom where he was the pint-sized inner voice of Tim Matheson. Anyone remember that? Hope ya don't.

I know I've told this story before on the boards, but I met Bill. He did a show back in the early 90s at my college. No press, no advertising, just a small show in a 1-200 seat "bar with a stage" on campus sponsored by a genius in our campus entertainment group. To this day I remember it like it was yesterday. I went with a group of 3 other drunk as piss guys and 4 girls. The girls were so offended that they got up and left and demanded that we all leave with them. Fuck that, I stayed for the whole show. As the show went on more and more people left, as this was definitely not what a bunch of drunk 18-20 year olds expected. By the time he was done there were maybe two dozen people left from a crowd of 100+.

I went up to Bill after he was done to thank him and just say hi. He was super gracious. He just hung out and we shot the shit for 30 minutes or so. So not only was he damn funny, he was a damn good person too. We miss ya Bill.

Sadly, I do. It was in contention with Goldthwait's work as a sock puppet in that Married...With Children ripoff for Saddest Decline of a Standup Comedian On a Little-Watched Network.

Don't forget Don Rickles and Richard Lewis as a hilariously dysfunctional father and son on "Daddy Dearest." Sundays on FOX!

Gotta say, Sam Kinison's first album is pretty damn brilliant. His "Charles Manson Becomes Obsessed With The Monkees" never gets old.

You do know the reason you find so much of what Bill Hicks says obvious is because Bill Hicks pretty much made these issues become part of the popular consciousness.

It's easy to look at Bill Hicks as not having an angle when his legacy has been in place since you were born, his effect on the popular stand up scene and the fact that what he ranted about are 'obvious topics' is a testament to how much power the guy had.

And posting youtube links of comedians you do like won't make people like you anymore after this.

I also disagree with the "you had to be there" thing. I'm 27, & I started listening to Hicks when I was around 17 or so, once I discovered that some of my favorite bands had dedicated some of their work to him (Tool, Radiohead, Rage). So this was late 90's, Clinton-era, years after his death, & his work connected with me in a major, major way. I actually regard the guy has having a pretty profound effect on my growth as a person, my overall worldview, etc. One of my favorite artists from any medium, for sure.

Whoever mentioned that his best work is found on CD is basically right. I love his filmed performances, but "Arizona Bay" & "E-Minor" are fucking side-splitting & probably his best. Also, it's worth noting that the CD version of "Relentless" is a different performance than that of the filmed version, & the CD version is also better. Just for reference's sake.

By the way: it is really, really worth the effort to track down the bootleg of Hicks confronting the drunk heckler chick who tells him that he sucks. He goes off like a nuclear bomb. It is beautiful.

I'm glad that you dig Stanhope, Patrick. I was beginning to think that I was the only one. None of my friends like him, despite my best efforts. I have a lot of his stuff & I think that he is a fucking riot. Probably my favorite comedian that is working right now.

You've lost the chance to see bra strap.

She could've been your greatest adventure Patrick. Think about it.

Now that I think of it, I started out on the wrong foot when it comes to Hicks. The very first thing I saw of him was a clip of him going crazy on some heckler. I didn't think it was funny at all. Having only that clip to base my opinion on, I thought wow, if this guy handles a heckler like that, he doesn't seem like much of a comic. Any fucking idiot can mock a heckler by screaming, "I can yell at the comedian because I'm a drunk cunt!"

So then I watched a second clip where he goes nuts after he got heckled again, screaming "Hitler had the right idea" and asking for rain "to wash these fucking turds out of my life." I'm always down for a good Hitler joke but I just got the impression that this guy seriously has some fucking problems to snap like that. It's hard to identify with what he says when he displayed what to me seemed like deep-seated bitterness.

So that was my very first impression of him and I know that he wasn't like that all the time but it's a little hard to shake that. Maybe I'm just being a pussy about it.

One of the things he liked to do was try really, really hard to lose the audience - to have the audience turn on him. And then try to turn it around again. Or not. I love everything he put on CD. Rant in E-Minor is a tough listen for me because it's just so filled with bile. But at that point in his life certainly understandable.

If you are in to learning about him, here's a great article that was written about him after the infamous Letterman spot:

http://www.newyorker.com/archive/199...ARDS_000365503

The bit about goldfish leaving Lincoln logs is so fucking inspired.