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Crime Fiction Thread 2.0. - Page 34

post #1651 of 3037
6/29/12 at 7:44pm
Thread Starter 

The Rap Sheet has a great article on the pretty great mafia novel Cut Numbers by Nick Tosches

 

http://therapsheet.blogspot.com/2012/06/book-you-have-to-read-cut-numbers-by.html

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post #1652 of 3037
7/1/12 at 6:40pm
Thread Starter 

Drew liked Savages. Disappointed Uma Thurman's scenes seem to be cut, but at least Stone seems to have a reason for it.

 

http://www.hitfix.com/motion-captured/review-oliver-stone-turns-aaron-johnson-taylor-kitsch-and-blake-lively-into-savages

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post #1653 of 3037
7/2/12 at 6:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

Drew liked Savages. Disappointed Uma Thurman's scenes seem to be cut, but at least Stone seems to have a reason for it.

 

http://www.hitfix.com/motion-captured/review-oliver-stone-turns-aaron-johnson-taylor-kitsch-and-blake-lively-into-savages

 

Can't wait to see this movie, hopefully it will save my summer after the awful taste Prometheus left in my mouth.

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post #1654 of 3037
7/2/12 at 8:16am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecallahan View Post

 

Can't wait to see this movie, hopefully it will save my summer after the awful taste Prometheus left in my mouth.


Winslow also liked it.

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post #1655 of 3037
7/2/12 at 9:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

Drew liked Savages. Disappointed Uma Thurman's scenes seem to be cut, but at least Stone seems to have a reason for it.

 

http://www.hitfix.com/motion-captured/review-oliver-stone-turns-aaron-johnson-taylor-kitsch-and-blake-lively-into-savages

 

Yeah, I thought that was interesting: she may not be the name she once was, but you don't cut Uma Thurman out of your movie unless you've got a mighty strong vision of what it needs to be, and are willing to sacrifice what she might have brought in terms of awareness of the property. Reinforces the idea that Stone has done the right thing.

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post #1656 of 3037
7/2/12 at 9:20am

I've been hearing some mixed things, but I've been wondering how much of that is related to the source material?  It's not exactly the easiest book to read or like.  

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post #1657 of 3037
7/2/12 at 9:24am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeb View Post

 

Yeah, I thought that was interesting: she may not be the name she once was, but you don't cut Uma Thurman out of your movie unless you've got a mighty strong vision of what it needs to be, and are willing to sacrifice what she might have brought in terms of awareness of the property. Reinforces the idea that Stone has done the right thing.


To be honest, what I'm most interested in is Blake Lively(aside from the fact that I'd do absolutely filthy things with her), if O hadn't worked in the book, the book wouldn't have worked and with her narrating the movie, the pressure is even bigger.

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post #1658 of 3037
7/2/12 at 9:27am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediumdave View Post

I've been hearing some mixed things, but I've been wondering how much of that is related to the source material?  It's not exactly the easiest book to read or like.  


Really? Everyone I know that's read it found it really readable with great characters.

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post #1659 of 3037
7/2/12 at 10:25am

I had troubles with it, initially, and I know I'm not the only, from people I've talked to.  There's a very Twitter generation vibe that I found grating for about the first 50 pages.  Also, I don't find any of the characters likable or relateable.  That doesn't matter as I find them INTERESTING, but the first dip into the book left a very bad taste in my mouth.  I kept going because Winslow is awesome and I don't think he's a fuckup, but I had to get to where I could ride the vibe without hating it.

 

I can see how some people would have a hard time getting past that, past the rapid fire descriptions, the post MTV generationness of it, of these assholes and douchebags and fuckups who talk and act like assholes and douchebags and fuckups (PAQU is still an annoying goddamn phrasing to me.  And I just fucking rolled my eyes at the whole why she's called O bit.)  It's a great fucking book, but I was VERY put off by it, initially.

 

And talking to friends who have read it, too (including one dude who hadn't read any Winslow and fucking HATED it until I told him to keep going and never really loved it), I could see that being a barrier and if the movie maintains that, well, there you go.  It's not the first Winslow I'll ever recommend to anyone.

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post #1660 of 3037
7/2/12 at 1:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediumdave View Post

I had troubles with it, initially, and I know I'm not the only, from people I've talked to.  There's a very Twitter generation vibe that I found grating for about the first 50 pages.  Also, I don't find any of the characters likable or relateable.  That doesn't matter as I find them INTERESTING, but the first dip into the book left a very bad taste in my mouth.  I kept going because Winslow is awesome and I don't think he's a fuckup, but I had to get to where I could ride the vibe without hating it.

 

I can see how some people would have a hard time getting past that, past the rapid fire descriptions, the post MTV generationness of it, of these assholes and douchebags and fuckups who talk and act like assholes and douchebags and fuckups (PAQU is still an annoying goddamn phrasing to me.  And I just fucking rolled my eyes at the whole why she's called O bit.)  It's a great fucking book, but I was VERY put off by it, initially.

 

And talking to friends who have read it, too (including one dude who hadn't read any Winslow and fucking HATED it until I told him to keep going and never really loved it), I could see that being a barrier and if the movie maintains that, well, there you go.  It's not the first Winslow I'll ever recommend to anyone.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mediumdave View Post

I had troubles with it, initially, and I know I'm not the only, from people I've talked to.  There's a very Twitter generation vibe that I found grating for about the first 50 pages.  Also, I don't find any of the characters likable or relateable.  That doesn't matter as I find them INTERESTING, but the first dip into the book left a very bad taste in my mouth.  I kept going because Winslow is awesome and I don't think he's a fuckup, but I had to get to where I could ride the vibe without hating it.

 

I can see how some people would have a hard time getting past that, past the rapid fire descriptions, the post MTV generationness of it, of these assholes and douchebags and fuckups who talk and act like assholes and douchebags and fuckups (PAQU is still an annoying goddamn phrasing to me.  And I just fucking rolled my eyes at the whole why she's called O bit.)  It's a great fucking book, but I was VERY put off by it, initially.

 

And talking to friends who have read it, too (including one dude who hadn't read any Winslow and fucking HATED it until I told him to keep going and never really loved it), I could see that being a barrier and if the movie maintains that, well, there you go.  It's not the first Winslow I'll ever recommend to anyone.


I totally get this, but I think I have a different perspective because I grew up and live in San Diego and Laguna and other towns like it are just a skip away(Not counting L.A.) so growing up I knew a lot of Ben's, Chon's, and especially O's. Granted, none of them were pot growers at war with a Mexican cartel....

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post #1661 of 3037
7/2/12 at 1:35pm

Hah, that's probably a good thing!  I don't mind watching or reading about people I dislike or hate or find annoying or terrible or whatever, as long as they're interesting, and Savages totally nailed that.

 

Again, I'd like to make clear, I turned around and really dug the book.  I was just initially turned off.  So, when I heard some mixed reactions (Drew's really got me pumped up, thankfully), my first thought was whether or not it was the source material.

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post #1662 of 3037
7/3/12 at 5:20pm
Thread Starter 

don%2527t+ever+get+old.jpg

 

My favorite cover and title of the year.  Baruch "Buck" Schatz is an 87 year old ex Memphis police detective when he hears that the sadistic Nazi concentration camp guard that tortured him and countless others is still alive and finds out he has a fortune in Nazi Gold. Buck decides to shoot two birds with one stone, kill the guard and get the loot, but word of the gold gets out and unsavory and otherwise crazy people are out for it as well. Not to mention he's saddled with his slacker grandson(And once upon a time, Jason Lee would have been cast as the grandson) Whenever it threatens to get too goofy (Buck swears a lot, it really pushes annoying Betty White territory where everyone thinks she's edgy because she's old and talks about sex. Still, Buck's jabs and insults are often very funny. Picture Ed Asner in UP), it has some really good insights about aging or it has a flashback to Nazi Europe and the camp and the horrors there, or reminding us just how many Nazi monsters escaped justice.

 

A good and original debut, and a great road trip novel that is very funny, the dialogue sings.


Edited by Cameron Hughes - 7/4/12 at 7:34am
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post #1663 of 3037
7/4/12 at 6:35am

Cameron's picks never disappoint.  Now that's it's summer I can finally kick back and read.cool.gif
 

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post #1664 of 3037
7/4/12 at 7:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew McWeeney

Stone reveals himself in the one major choice where the film is different than the book, and in what has to be the most shocking thing Stone could add to his repertoire, he's gone every so slightly gooey.

 

I REALLY hope the change isn't what I think it is.

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post #1665 of 3037
7/4/12 at 7:12am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post

Cameron's picks never disappoint.  Now that's it's summer I can finally kick back and read.cool.gif
 


Aww, I'm blushing.

 

Jesse Kellerman's Potboiler is a really funny read too. Talented family, the Kellerman clan.

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post #1666 of 3037
7/4/12 at 4:02pm
Thread Starter 

I wish I didn't have so many books to read, because I'm feeling like A Power of the Dog re-read. For the 4th time.

 

Of course, what I really want to read is Winslow's 1,000 page original version. And then I want to lock him in a room with all his notes until he does his 1800s San Diego western (One of the stars being Wyatt Earp, who owned a brothel or two here) that he started years ago when he wasn't nearly as famous.

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post #1667 of 3037
7/4/12 at 4:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

I wish I didn't have so many books to read, because I'm feeling like A Power of the Dog re-read. For the 4th time.

 

Of course, what I really want to read is Winslow's 1,000 page original version. And then I want to lock him in a room with all his notes until he does his 1800s San Diego western (One of the stars being Wyatt Earp, who owned a brothel or two here) that he started years ago when he wasn't nearly as famous.

 

You're killing me Smalls.

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post #1668 of 3037
7/4/12 at 8:21pm
Thread Starter 

What's everyone reading? I'm about to start Nick Harkaway's(Son of John Le Carre!) Angelmaker which is sort of a high stakes spy tale laced with gangster noir and the McGuffin is a doomsday device in the shape of a clock, and activating it brings out people like an aging Asian dictator who was the arch-enemy of a very old female spy the protagonist befriends. It feels like both a loving tribute and joking poke against his father. It is very odd, very British, very funny. If you like your stories always vanilla and straight-forward, stay away, the rest of us will be having a blast with this wacky book.
 

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post #1669 of 3037
7/4/12 at 8:42pm

I took a run at Angelmaker a few weeks ago but I only read about 30 pages.  It was very dry and I couldn't go on.  I did pick-up Nefertiti because you recommended it a few weeks back.  I'll be starting that next week.

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post #1670 of 3037
7/4/12 at 8:44pm

1,000 pages?!  I know what I want for my birthday.  Work your magic Cameron!

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post #1671 of 3037
7/5/12 at 3:01am

I've been reading The Green Eagle and Black Ice score books by Richard Stark. Now that Parker has a steady love interest in Claire, it's interesting to see how she is slowly penetrating Parker's emotional armour. The last scene in The Black Ice Score is very telling in terms of how Parker now views Claire, it's something almost close to affection.

 

I've also been reading alot of Elmore Leonard, I'm currently reading The Hunter which is set in Israel which is a very interesting place to set a crime story in. I've been going through his books from his westerns, you can really see where his style emerges from in his crime books, he never really left the western, he just skipped forward 100 years and changed the locale to Detroit. He can write some terrifically interesting female characters though, they really stay with you.

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post #1672 of 3037
7/5/12 at 9:28am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BorisTheCheese View Post

1,000 pages?!  I know what I want for my birthday.  Work your magic Cameron!


I've been trying!

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post #1673 of 3037
7/5/12 at 9:32am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanW View Post

I've been reading The Green Eagle and Black Ice score books by Richard Stark. Now that Parker has a steady love interest in Claire, it's interesting to see how she is slowly penetrating Parker's emotional armour. The last scene in The Black Ice Score is very telling in terms of how Parker now views Claire, it's something almost close to affection.

 

I've also been reading alot of Elmore Leonard, I'm currently reading The Hunter which is set in Israel which is a very interesting place to set a crime story in. I've been going through his books from his westerns, you can really see where his style emerges from in his crime books, he never really left the western, he just skipped forward 100 years and changed the locale to Detroit. He can write some terrifically interesting female characters though, they really stay with you.


Absolutely. Aside from a name and skin color change, Jackie is the same person she was in Rum Punch. Jackie Brown is a great movie, but the strength of the characters was all Leonard.

 

I haven't read the Hunted, I should. His gangster novel The Moonshine War is getting reprinted in August. Haven't read it, really want to.

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post #1674 of 3037
7/5/12 at 9:35am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BorisTheCheese View Post

I took a run at Angelmaker a few weeks ago but I only read about 30 pages.  It was very dry and I couldn't go on.  I did pick-up Nefertiti because you recommended it a few weeks back.  I'll be starting that next week.


Angelmaker beat me once already. Trying really hard this time to make it my bitch.

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post #1675 of 3037
7/5/12 at 9:51am

Not crime fiction per se, but reading Bruce Perry's The Boy Who Was Raised as a Dog.  Accessible and essential for people who want to learn about the science behind damaged people, damaged minds, and what makes some people criminals.  
 

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post #1676 of 3037
7/6/12 at 6:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post


Absolutely. Aside from a name and skin color change, Jackie is the same person she was in Rum Punch. Jackie Brown is a great movie, but the strength of the characters was all Leonard.

 

I haven't read the Hunted, I should. His gangster novel The Moonshine War is getting reprinted in August. Haven't read it, really want to.

 

I've mentioned it before but the difference between the film version and the novel for The Big Bounce just seem miles away. The novel is a somewhat dark, character study while the film just looks like your average caper film, then again, I haven't actually seen the film, I'm just going by the poster but it still looks kinda goofy and lighthearted.

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post #1677 of 3037
7/6/12 at 6:49am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanW View Post

 

I've mentioned it before but the difference between the film version and the novel for The Big Bounce just seem miles away. The novel is a somewhat dark, character study while the film just looks like your average caper film, then again, I haven't actually seen the film, I'm just going by the poster but it still looks kinda goofy and lighthearted.


Well, for one thing, the book is set in Detroit and not sunny Hawaii...That's why I love Jackie Brown. Tarantino is so obviously a student of Leonard (Reservoir Dogs and Pulp Fiction are very Leonard), and he totally respected Rum Punch while putting his own stamp on it. The characters really aren't that different from the book.

 

 

The other novel the character Jack Ryan stars in, Unknown Man #89 is considered one of Leonard's best, and it has one of the best tonal changes ever as it goes from a fun romp trying to find this guy to getting drunk in bars and AA meetings, and it totally works. It's a great novel.

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post #1678 of 3037
7/6/12 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediumdave View Post

I had troubles with it, initially, and I know I'm not the only, from people I've talked to.  There's a very Twitter generation vibe that I found grating for about the first 50 pages.  Also, I don't find any of the characters likable or relateable.  That doesn't matter as I find them INTERESTING, but the first dip into the book left a very bad taste in my mouth.  I kept going because Winslow is awesome and I don't think he's a fuckup, but I had to get to where I could ride the vibe without hating it.

 

I can see how some people would have a hard time getting past that, past the rapid fire descriptions, the post MTV generationness of it, of these assholes and douchebags and fuckups who talk and act like assholes and douchebags and fuckups (PAQU is still an annoying goddamn phrasing to me.  And I just fucking rolled my eyes at the whole why she's called O bit.)  It's a great fucking book, but I was VERY put off by it, initially.

 

And talking to friends who have read it, too (including one dude who hadn't read any Winslow and fucking HATED it until I told him to keep going and never really loved it), I could see that being a barrier and if the movie maintains that, well, there you go.  It's not the first Winslow I'll ever recommend to anyone.

 

My first Winslow was THE POWER OF THE DOG, and at the time I was worried if I jumped too soon into an author's Big Work, and should have led up to it so his other books wouldn't suffer. Followed it up with WINTER OF FRANKIE MACHINE (they still can't get this movie off the ground? The hell?) and then SAVAGES -- and I knew within the first 5 pages of SAVAGES that I probably would've hated it if I hadn't read the previous two, and knew just how goddamn great Winslow is at expressing -- becoming -- the various voices of his characters, in more than just dialogue.

 

Instead, I was chuckling and snorting to myself almost immediately, just letting him yank me along down whatever thread he felt like pursuing in whichever voice he felt like using that paragraph. If I'd started with SAVAGES, I'm sure I would have written off the style as needlessly showy affectation or a crutch for other weaknesses. Thankfully, I was going in already knowing that Don Winslow has no fucking weaknesses.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

What's everyone reading?
 

 

After what seems like a dozen or so sidetracks (see above for three of em), I'm finally cracking John D. MacDonald's ONE MORE SUNDAY, that I'd picked up last February; halfway or so through now. There's a basic mystery to it -- missing investigative reporter! -- but that mostly hangs around the edges of the story, which is more of an ensemble character study surrounding a fictional 80s SuperMegaChurch, with its massive financial, real estate, cable TV, and political interests, all teetering on the edge of decline as its founder/patriarch slips into Alzheimer's and his (cynical, hypocritical) heirs try to keep the empire together. So, although there's sure to be a violent crime uncovered, it's hard to call it a crime novel; although no one still has been better able than MacDonald to make white-collar shenanigans and dealings come off as interesting, exciting, and revealing of character. Not one of his page-turning potboilers, though. And though I'd hesitate to call it soap-opera-y, it does feel like reading a novelization of a lost great HBO drama series.

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post #1679 of 3037
7/7/12 at 12:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

What's everyone reading?
 

 

I decided to work my way through the "Connelly-verse" in story order (including working in the Bosch short stories where they seem appropriate); just about to start Lincoln Lawyer (which I actually haven't read before), and it's been fun, even though that kind of approach will show more of the seams in an author's work than taking them one at a time.

 

Given how I always think of Connelly as consistently entertaining, I'd forgotten how variable some of these can be: I remember now how I found A Darkness More Than Night a real slog (McCaleb's half of the book is pretending we might really believe that Bosch is the killer, and Bosch's half is interminable courtroom scenes that seem as though we need to be convinced that Bosch is right about the guy on trial being guilty), but was delighted at how much Void Moon (the first of his I read orignally) held up, given how much of it is focused on technology that now feels antiquated, or at least over-familiar.

 

I'm also hoping that my initally negative impression of 9 Dragons will soften on a re-read before I move on to the ones I haven't read before.

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post #1680 of 3037
7/7/12 at 2:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeb View Post

 

I decided to work my way through the "Connelly-verse" in story order (including working in the Bosch short stories where they seem appropriate); just about to start Lincoln Lawyer (which I actually haven't read before), and it's been fun, even though that kind of approach will show more of the seams in an author's work than taking them one at a time.

 

Given how I always think of Connelly as consistently entertaining, I'd forgotten how variable some of these can be: I remember now how I found A Darkness More Than Night a real slog (McCaleb's half of the book is pretending we might really believe that Bosch is the killer, and Bosch's half is interminable courtroom scenes that seem as though we need to be convinced that Bosch is right about the guy on trial being guilty), but was delighted at how much Void Moon (the first of his I read orignally) held up, given how much of it is focused on technology that now feels antiquated, or at least over-familiar.

 

I'm also hoping that my initally negative impression of 9 Dragons will soften on a re-read before I move on to the ones I haven't read before.

Connelly is very hit or miss, but fortunately he has more hits and they tend to be good to great.

 


I didn't much like 9 Dragons. Bosch needs to be in L.A.

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post #1681 of 3037
7/7/12 at 11:26pm

I was at Bouchercon what, ten years ago, listening to a panel with Connelly, Dennis Lehane, and that young author who writes contrived crap Robert Crais likes - what the hell is his name - anyhow, the topic was research and the young guy was talking about going on a ride-along with the Sheriff's office in Moorpark.  Talk about thrilling.  Anyhow, he covered every detail of the night, including what the cops took in their coffee.  I think he even pantomimed pumping a shotgun at one point.  By the end of his discourse, even the most uninformed audience member could tell the guy was not exactly a member of the crime beat, and more than a little insecure.  As he was catching his breath, Connelly leaned back, clasped his hands behind his head, and said "By the way, the cops generally refer to Moorpark as Craproom."  Laughter filled the room.  The kid turned red.  
 

Connelly knows the turf; he's a good writer who is given a little more credit for his writing chops than he deserves, at least based on his recent output.  I think we were all happy when, after so many years in the trenches, a guy who deserved it made good.  A guy who knew the game and put in the hours, with some serious journalistic cred.  But he has put some serious clunkers out there.  I agree with Cameron, he is hit and miss, but over the past ten years there have been more misses than hits.

 

The guy has published something like 30 novels in 20 years.  He needs to cut back a bit, drop the Lincoln Lawyer line, and keep writing stuff that lasts.

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post #1682 of 3037
7/8/12 at 2:03pm
Thread Starter 

At just over 300 pages, Chris Morgan Jones's debut The Silent Oligarch is a nasty dense little novel about political intrigue, double-crossings, and the threat of violence. Like the best spy novelists like John Le Carre and Alan Furst, atmosphere and character are more important than pointless violence. What could happen is infinitely more interesting. It concerns a Russian mogul, a crafty lawyer and an investigative journalist trying to un-ravel it all. It covers Russia, London, Kazakhstan, and the Caymans. They're all rendered beautifully. In this world, there are no real heroes or villains and all have an agenda and secrets. A masterpiece.

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post #1683 of 3037
7/8/12 at 7:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post

I was at Bouchercon what, ten years ago, listening to a panel with Connelly, Dennis Lehane, and that young author who writes contrived crap Robert Crais likes - what the hell is his name - anyhow, the topic was research and the young guy was talking about going on a ride-along with the Sheriff's office in Moorpark.  Talk about thrilling.office in the next couple books.

I agree with pretty much all of this, but I think his Lincoln Lawyer novels are very consistently good and interesting, and could even get better if Haller becomes DA in the next couple books.

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post #1684 of 3037
7/8/12 at 9:16pm

I disagree with a lot of people here. I read Savages first and loved it. I find the characters incredibly sympathetic. I don't relate to them but I cared about the three main characters.

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post #1685 of 3037
7/8/12 at 10:24pm

I was sympathetic with the characters from the very beginning of Savages.

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post #1686 of 3037
7/9/12 at 6:21am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfan View Post

I disagree with a lot of people here. I read Savages first and loved it. I find the characters incredibly sympathetic. I don't relate to them but I cared about the three main characters.

 

Same, but I related to them because I've known a lot of California kids like them, especially the O's. Should be seeing the movie today, the thing I'm worried about is if Stone has the heart to tell the story of these three people that truly love each other.


Edited by Cameron Hughes - 7/9/12 at 7:12am
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post #1687 of 3037
7/9/12 at 8:16am

I've got absolutely zero in common with Ben, Chon, and O and loved them right off. I just know that I'm a prickly unforgiving cuss when I discover highly stylized writing if I don't feel the author's earned the right to be experimental. To borrow from the proper McGee, Pollack and Picasso could damn well draw a horse that looked like a horse. Just my own personal bias (and one I find I apply more and more to other media, as well). Winslow had well earned my trust by the time I cracked Savages, so I was primed for the ride.

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post #1688 of 3037
7/11/12 at 4:04am

I don't love Savages but I can't deny that the ending to that book is one of the most romantic, beautiful things I've ever experienced, the ultimate act of love between O, Chon and Ben. I hope Salma nails the role of the female cartel because she's such a fascinatingly tragic character.

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post #1689 of 3037
7/11/12 at 12:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post

The guy has published something like 30 novels in 20 years.  He needs to cut back a bit, drop the Lincoln Lawyer line, and keep writing stuff that lasts.

 

Mostly agree, and it's a shame since after reading the first two Mickey Haller outings (just finished Brass Verdict, moved on to my re-read of 9 Dragons), I think he might be Connelly's best character yet; certainly the best since Bosch himself. His no-nonsense view of the legal system ("I've defended plenty of innocent people," I lied) and his own weaknesses really brings the character to life; the problem is that while Connelly can make crime investigation both realistic and compelling, when he gets to the courtroom, he only manages realistic. And just as he's acknowledged that it was a mistake to toss in Bosch's discovery of his father as a coda to his mother's story, rather than making it a book of its own, I think he missed a huge opportunity to make the twists and turns of Haller's life between Lincoln Lawyer and Brass Verdict into its own story, rather than having it continually inserted as awkward exposition in Brass Verdict.

 

Plus, sometime between those books, Bosch starts using an iPod, and I can't help thinking that was deserving of further exploration!

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post #1690 of 3037
7/11/12 at 12:48pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeb View Post

 

Mostly agree, and it's a shame since after reading the first two Mickey Haller outings (just finished Brass Verdict, moved on to my re-read of 9 Dragons), I think he might be Connelly's best character yet; certainly the best since Bosch himself. His no-nonsense view of the legal system ("I've defended plenty of innocent people," I lied) and his own weaknesses really brings the character to life; the problem is that while Connelly can make crime investigation both realistic and compelling, when he gets to the courtroom, he only manages realistic. And just as he's acknowledged that it was a mistake to toss in Bosch's discovery of his father as a coda to his mother's story, rather than making it a book of its own, I think he missed a huge opportunity to make the twists and turns of Haller's life between Lincoln Lawyer and Brass Verdict into its own story, rather than having it continually inserted as awkward exposition in Brass Verdict.

 

Plus, sometime between those books, Bosch starts using an iPod, and I can't help thinking that was deserving of further exploration!


I would love a Connelly-verse show. It'd cover a lot of society, Bosch representing the police, Haller the court system and reporter Jack McEvoy from The Poet representing the media. Ideally it would be on FX to give it the grit and seriousness it would need.

 

My cast

 

Bosch: Titus Welliver

Haller: Matthew Perry(I know it's a far cry from McConaghey, but Perry can act and potentially also be a smooth talker)

McEvoy: Jay Karnes

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post #1691 of 3037
7/11/12 at 1:09pm
Josh Lucas for Haller. Titus would be great for Bosch. Or maybe Josh Brolin? Apparently THE FIFTH WITNESS is being lined up as the next movie. Haven't read that yet. Is Bosch in it?
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post #1692 of 3037
7/11/12 at 1:24pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluelouboyle View Post

Josh Lucas for Haller. Titus would be great for Bosch. Or maybe Josh Brolin? Apparently THE FIFTH WITNESS is being lined up as the next movie. Haven't read that yet. Is Bosch in it?


I'm thinking Brolin is too young and fit. Don't get me wrong, Bosch is in shape, but more like a retired athlete. If I had a time machine, I'd grab 80's William Petersen. I think Bosch needs that distinguished salt and pepper hair.

 

I think Bosch is in The Fifth Witness, it's been awhile.

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post #1693 of 3037
7/11/12 at 1:32pm
Well Brolin's 44. Ten years older than 80s Peterson. You're right about the hair though. And Brolin might be too short for Bosch.
The bald guy from MURDER ONE could play Irving. CCH Pounder for Kis Rider.
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post #1694 of 3037
7/11/12 at 2:09pm

Based off a few recommendations from the discussion, just finished up a few books I very much enjoyed:

 

Thick As Thieves/Peter Spiegelman - Loved it. Couldn't put it down once I started and it only got better as it went. Someone on here said the crew reminded them of the one from "Heat" and after reading that I knew this would be right up my alley. Could haven spent another couple hundred pages just following them pull off different jobs. I find this kind of material fascinating. especially the exploration of professionalism these types of characters exhibit and how they go about their work. Absolutely absorbing and would appreciate any other similar recommendations.

 

Beat The Reaper/Joshua Bazell - Awesome debut with an absolutely bat-shit insane ending. The cutting back and forth between the past and present caught a very nice rhythm as the book went on as I would almost get pissed because I wanted to keep reading about that particular storyline and it would always cut away. Also, This was one of the first books I can remember where the medical descriptions were anything but boring so kudos to the author for making it completely engaging.  I was cringing (in a good way) throughout, especially during a certain underwater adventure our protagonist experiences late in the story. Great read and it completely had me on the hook when it just went nuts towards the end. Will definitely seek out the followup, "Wild Thing", when I get a chance.

 

Kings of Cool/Don Winslow - Nothing to add that hasn't been mentioned but Winslow can do no wrong. I'm pretty much caught up on everything hes written (save for the Neil Carey stuff and "Satori") and he once again makes it all seem absolutely effortless. Loved spending more time with Ben, Chon, and O and it was nice exploring the histories of all the characters and how they came to be. Glad he didn't try to replicate the pacing/stylings he used for "Savages" as this was a more traditional story in comparison (then again, what isn't compared to "Savages"?). 

 

This thread is great BTW. Look forward to digging in to a lot of other stuff you guys have talked about.

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post #1695 of 3037
7/11/12 at 2:31pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by notpaulavery View Post

Based off a few recommendations from the discussion, just finished up a few books I very much enjoyed:

 

Thick As Thieves/Peter Spiegelman - Loved it. Couldn't put it down once I started and it only got better as it went. Someone on here said the crew reminded them of the one from "Heat" and after reading that I knew this would be right up my alley. Could haven spent another couple hundred pages just following them pull off different jobs. I find this kind of material fascinating. especially the exploration of professionalism these types of characters exhibit and how they go about their work. Absolutely absorbing and would appreciate any other similar recommendations.

 

Beat The Reaper/Joshua Bazell - Awesome debut with an absolutely bat-shit insane ending. The cutting back and forth between the past and present caught a very nice rhythm as the book went on as I would almost get pissed because I wanted to keep reading about that particular storyline and it would always cut away. Also, This was one of the first books I can remember where the medical descriptions were anything but boring so kudos to the author for making it completely engaging.  I was cringing (in a good way) throughout, especially during a certain underwater adventure our protagonist experiences late in the story. Great read and it completely had me on the hook when it just went nuts towards the end. Will definitely seek out the followup, "Wild Thing", when I get a chance.

 

Kings of Cool/Don Winslow - Nothing to add that hasn't been mentioned but Winslow can do no wrong. I'm pretty much caught up on everything hes written (save for the Neil Carey stuff and "Satori") and he once again makes it all seem absolutely effortless. Loved spending more time with Ben, Chon, and O and it was nice exploring the histories of all the characters and how they came to be. Glad he didn't try to replicate the pacing/stylings he used for "Savages" as this was a more traditional story in comparison (then again, what isn't compared to "Savages"?). 

 

This thread is great BTW. Look forward to digging in to a lot of other stuff you guys have talked about.

Wild Thing is even more batshit crazy than Beat The Reaper, I loved it. And like Reaper, I learned a lot of random but fascinating stuff.

 

I compared TaT to Heat and I absolutely stand behind it.  I'd love prequels with the crew.

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post #1696 of 3037
7/11/12 at 2:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post

Wild Thing is even more batshit crazy than Beat The Reaper, I loved it. And like Reaper, I learned a lot of random but fascinating stuff.

 

 

Good to hear. I've had it sitting in my library e-checkout basket for the longest time, but the reviews (and general reaction) were so mixed that I've always hesitated to grab it. Have to give it a shot when my Connelly-fest ends.

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post #1697 of 3037
7/11/12 at 3:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluelouboyle View Post
Apparently THE FIFTH WITNESS is being lined up as the next movie. Haven't read that yet. Is Bosch in it?

 

Wikipedia's handy-dandy Connellyverse chart suggests not. He was in Brass Verdict, and evidently appears in The Reversal, but not the other two Haller books.

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post #1698 of 3037
7/11/12 at 3:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post


I would love a Connelly-verse show. It'd cover a lot of society, Bosch representing the police, Haller the court system and reporter Jack McEvoy from The Poet representing the media. Ideally it would be on FX to give it the grit and seriousness it would need.

 

My cast

 

Bosch: Titus Welliver

Haller: Matthew Perry(I know it's a far cry from McConaghey, but Perry can act and potentially also be a smooth talker)

McEvoy: Jay Karnes

 

I was going to suggest Carla Gugino for Rachel Walling, but only if that also leaves her time to return to Justified. Rene Russo for Eleanor Wish.

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post #1699 of 3037
7/12/12 at 1:44pm

http://www.hitfix.com/motion-captured/the-mcp-don-winslow-guests-on-an-oliver-stone-themed-podcast
 

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post #1700 of 3037
7/12/12 at 2:04pm
Do they only spoil SAVAGES in the Winslow interview? It isn't released here until September...
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