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Crime Fiction Thread 2.0. - Page 5

post #201 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:26am
Thread Starter 
I loved Down By The River Where The Dead Men go

I think his best work is the Clay and Karras quartet, Hell to Pay, Soul Circus and The Night Gardener. But I like all his books. I think Shoedog is criminally underrated.
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post #202 of 3025
6/4/09 at 1:53pm
Since summer is coming up, and since the rage on the boards is to go through a series of something and faux-blog about them, I have decided to read (and in some cases, re-read) the Matthew Scudder novels in chronological order, starting with The Sins of the Fathers and continuing all the way through to All The Flowers are Dying. I debated a lot about which detective I should do this with and almost thought about tackling Travis McGee (also Harry Bosch and Elvis Cole), but there are fewer Scudders and the character's been on my mind lately. I won't hijack this thread, but I'll post updates as I finish the novels.
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post #203 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:01pm
That's funny, Rath. I was just planning on re-reading all of the Andrew Vachss Burke Novels. I figure that I'll finish all of them at about the same time that the current (and LAST) one hits paperback. 'Flood', in particular, should be an interesting re-read: the cast of characters are still in a raw form in this book (the Prof doesn't speak in rhymes, for instance), so it will be interesting to see how they all evolved over the entire run.
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post #204 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Booth View Post
That's funny, Rath. I was just planning on re-reading all of the Andrew Vachss Burke Novels. I figure that I'll finish all of them at about the same time that the current (and LAST) one hits paperback. 'Flood', in particular, should be an interesting re-read: the cast of characters are still in a raw form in this book (the Prof doesn't speak in rhymes, for instance), so it will be interesting to see how they all evolved over the entire run.
I dropped off of these a few pages into Blue Belle. No idea why, because I really liked the first two. I need to fix this.

I'm probably going to drop by and pick up Money Shot from Mystery Bookstore tonight before heading home just due to the praise on this thread - plus the Hard Case books are usually fairly breezy reads.
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post #205 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:14pm
Money Shot is so good. I know I say that everytime somebody mentions they're going to read it, but really, it's so good.
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post #206 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:16pm
'Blue Belle' is one of the best ones in the entire run. The follow-up, 'Hard Candy', is probably my favorite Burke book; it resolves most of the loose threads from the end of 'Blue Belle'. You're going to want to pick up both books at the same time if you can.

I met Vachss at a book signing back in the 1990s (he was signing for 'Sacrifice', the 6th book). He mentioned that 'Blue Belle' had been optioned for film development, but I guess that nothing came to fruition.
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post #207 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:18pm
The Burke novels are one of the many crime series I need to read. I've liked a lot of Vachss' short story work (the comic he wrote about the phone sex line is FUCKED UP.) and his novel where Batman fights international pedophiles is fun.

Also, he has an eyepatch. Who wears an eyepatch these days? That's awesome.
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post #208 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:23pm
He definitely had an aura about him as someone that you wouldn't want to mess with, but he couldn't have been a nicer guy to me.
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post #209 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:26pm
That's the exact same experience I had when I met Ellroy.
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post #210 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Booth View Post
'Blue Belle' is one of the best ones in the entire run. The follow-up, 'Hard Candy', is probably my favorite Burke book; it resolves most of the loose threads from the end of 'Blue Belle'. You're going to want to pick up both books at the same time if you can.
Yeah, I got lucky and picked up a three-fer used from Amazon - it has Strega, Blue Belle, and Hard Candy. No excuses!
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post #211 of 3025
6/4/09 at 2:45pm
I'm a Vachss fanatic; no author has influenced my life so profoundly. That said, the Burke series went on way too long. I think you can split the series in half perfectly: the first nine range from very good to superb, while the last nine are entertaining, but formulaic, albeit with the exception of Mask Market and possibly Pain Management.

For me the series culminates with Footsteps of the Hawk and False Allegations. The former is one of the only two books in the series to place Burke at the center of a threat, while in the latter Vachss includes more insight into child abuse than any of the other novels, which was his intention all along, and it seems that after that he didn't know where else to go. Every subsequent book features a truly fascinating premise, but Vachss struggles wrapping them up, and he never pushes the Burke character in new directions.

Still, if you're interested in the series, make sure to read it in chronological order because not only do the characters age throughout, but Burke's first-person narration spoils the events of the previous books.

Now that the series is over, I'm really looking forward to see what Vachss has in store because the three stand-alone novels he published in between Burke's run were all excellent.
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post #212 of 3025
6/4/09 at 4:24pm
His website has an interesting interview with him, done live a few months back.

I still have the tape of him doing Oprah 15 years ago. Only episode I've ever watched, but it was really good.
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post #213 of 3025
6/4/09 at 4:37pm
I won't disagree with Highway 61's analysis at all. Many of his later books read more like lectures than novels: there's still alot of meat in there to digest, and the topics of discussion sometimes outweigh the forward momentum of the story.

I also agree on the overall quality of his standalone novels. I especially love 'Shella', and I'd love to see a book that follows up with the character of Ghost.
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post #214 of 3025
6/4/09 at 4:41pm
New Michael Connelly out now with a Harry Bosch novel to come out later this year.
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post #215 of 3025
6/6/09 at 4:58am
I stopped reading the Burke series after Hard Candy but I agree, he's an excellent writer.

I got through 'A Firing Offense' in 2 days, It was a good read but I can see why Cameron said it was a rough read, it tends to meander alot, most of the book focuses on Stefanos at his job fucking around with Johnny McGinnes (great character) until the last half where he actually starts doing some detective work.
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post #216 of 3025
6/11/09 at 12:08am
Oh man, Money Shot.

I almost want to read it again. Thanks, Rath.
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post #217 of 3025
6/11/09 at 1:13am
See, it's not that I'm a crazy fanatic for that book, it's that I'm right.
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post #218 of 3025
6/11/09 at 6:45am
Loved Money Shot. Thanks for the rabid love. I might not have given it a shot. Fuck me, I just did that, didn't I?

Read it in two days, which is quick for me because I'm usually quite leisurely when it comes to the books.
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post #219 of 3025
6/14/09 at 10:30pm
Thread Starter 
Watching the movie*Fletch made me appreciate book so much more(And it was already one of my favorite books)

It hits a lot of the same beats, and Chevy Chase was actually a very good casting choice, but it misses so many points of the book. Take Clara for example, in the book they hate each other, her editing ruins a lot of his stories and he thinks she's everything that's wrong with the newspaper business. The movie show's Fletch finding the same leads as in the book, but not the leg-work of Fletch in the book. The thing about Fletch is that he is very good at his job, but also has no time for BS, so everyone in authority hates him for that.

The movie also takes the way Fletch uses fake names and uses it at an absurd and broad level. This stuff isn't a joke for Fletch, but he does have fun with it.


The biggest sin of the movie is excising Bobbi. She's a 15 year old junkie in the novel and Fletch lets everyone think he's banging her(Remember, Fletch works with misconceptions as much as good investigative work).), but he has a very protective relationship with her, almost fatherly, even though he's barely ten years older than her. Her fate is what gives the book weight, and ultimately gives Fletch's work a purpose. Its such a densely plotted book with so much in it at just 200 pages.

Fletch is a great movie if you've never read the book, and it is remarkably faithful, but it misses the point, especially at how they end it.

*I always thought it'd make a better TV show than movie.
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post #220 of 3025
6/21/09 at 1:11pm
I'm just working my way through the Fletch books no Cameron, and you're right. It's jarring to read something that feels so familiar but can then knock you back a bit, either with a sprinkling of foul language or an unexpected moment.

For my mind, 'Fletch Won' (Came out after 'Fletch' but is set before it) would make a great starting point if they ever make a Fletch film. No one quite writes dialog like McDonald can.
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post #221 of 3025
6/21/09 at 1:33pm
This is great information on the Fletch books. I'll make a point of picking up this series in the future.
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post #222 of 3025
6/22/09 at 12:01am
Thread Starter 
http://www.thrillingdetective.com/eyes/fletch.html

A link to the chronological order of the books. The books about Fletch's son aren't so good though.

Fletch and Fletch Won are two of my favorite books ever though.
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post #223 of 3025
6/28/09 at 3:29pm
Grabbed Vanilla Ride and read it in one afternoon yesterday. You weren't bullshitting, Cameron, this is long overdue. A Joe Lansdale Hap & Leonard novel shows how truly great writers are born. It's been a while, and while I loved Sunset and Sawdust and A Fine Dark Line, there are no characters in fiction like Hap and Leonard. He's also got a short story in that zombie anthology I have to check out.

Less worthy, but still entertaining, and in the same genre is McDonald's Fletch series are Warren Murphy's Trace novels.
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post #224 of 3025
7/1/09 at 10:18pm
I got through 'Nick's Trip' by George Pelecanos in just a couple of days, wow, what an improvement over 'A Firing Offense'. I really enjoyed reading this one, Pelecanos has got a better handle on the art of plotting a good story, two seemingly unrelated stories both end up connecting in the end. There's also a nice bittersweet ending about the loss of friendship, you can never recapture the good times once they end because people change.

Pelecanos is getting really good at writing detailed character descriptions, although he tends to lose me when writing about certain places in DC (not his fault, as he writes from a specific point of view)

Up next, 'Down by the river where the dead men go'

Also, you guys should really heck out 'QueenPin' by Megan Abbott, a terrific read.
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post #225 of 3025
7/2/09 at 12:45am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post
Grabbed Vanilla Ride and read it in one afternoon yesterday. You weren't bullshitting, Cameron, this is long overdue. A Joe Lansdale Hap & Leonard novel shows how truly great writers are born. It's been a while, and while I loved Sunset and Sawdust and A Fine Dark Line, there are no characters in fiction like Hap and Leonard. He's also got a short story in that zombie anthology I have to check out.

Less worthy, but still entertaining, and in the same genre is McDonald's Fletch series are Warren Murphy's Trace novels.
Its because he writes about people, freakish as they sometimes are, they're real and he never shies away from the ugly stuff. Its not my favorite, that would be Bad Chili and Mucho Mojo, but I'll take Lansdale anyday over boring writers like Lee Child who I find incredibly boring and juvenile.
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post #226 of 3025
7/2/09 at 1:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post
Grabbed Vanilla Ride and read it in one afternoon yesterday. You weren't bullshitting, Cameron, this is long overdue. A Joe Lansdale Hap & Leonard novel shows how truly great writers are born. It's been a while, and while I loved Sunset and Sawdust and A Fine Dark Line, there are no characters in fiction like Hap and Leonard. He's also got a short story in that zombie anthology I have to check out.

Less worthy, but still entertaining, and in the same genre is McDonald's Fletch series are Warren Murphy's Trace novels.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post
Its because he writes about people, freakish as they sometimes are, they're real and he never shies away from the ugly stuff. Its not my favorite, that would be Bad Chili and Mucho Mojo, but I'll take Lansdale anyday over boring writers like Lee Child who I find incredibly boring and juvenile.
So, so glad to see some Lansdale love here. I've got most of his stuff, but I need to catch up (last I read was Captains Outrageous). He captures East Texas pretty well and I get slightly homesick every time I read one of his books.
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post #227 of 3025
7/2/09 at 3:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron Hughes View Post
Its because he writes about people, freakish as they sometimes are, they're real and he never shies away from the ugly stuff. Its not my favorite, that would be Bad Chili and Mucho Mojo, but I'll take Lansdale anyday over boring writers like Lee Child who I find incredibly boring and juvenile.
Not only that, but as Bruce Campbell says in the Bubba Ho-Tep commentary, Lansdale is a sap. He's Kipling & Flannery O'Connor's love child, the friendship between Hap and Leonard is one for the ages. As much as a I hate to say it, I wouldn't mind Brett getting taken out of the picture.

And has Reacher ever even taken a punch? In like, 8 books or whatever? Child's a nice guy, he promotes the right people, eg Winslow, but I never made it past book 2 in the Reacher series.
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post #228 of 3025
7/2/09 at 3:37am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post
Not only that, but as Bruce Campbell says in the Bubba Ho-Tep commentary, Lansdale is a sap. He's Kipling & Flannery O'Connor's love child, the friendship between Hap and Leonard is one for the ages. As much as a I hate to say it, I wouldn't mind Brett getting taken out of the picture.

And has Reacher ever even taken a punch? In like, 8 books or whatever? Child's a nice guy, he promotes the right people, eg Winslow, but I never made it past book 2 in the Reacher series.
Aw, I like Brett. He's just as good at writing women as men.

They talk like real guys that have known each other for decades. I like when they talk about sex and they'll just as easily chat about Leonard's men. I've said it before, but Lansdale is Garth Ennis without the juvenile humor and homophobia. Or rather, since Lansdale was first, Ennis is Lansdale with loads more juvenile humor and homophobia.


I picked up a random Reacher and stopped when Reacher stopped a bullet because his pecs were just that awesome.

True story: I recently asked Lee Child(in front of an audience) if he had a non-Reacher novel in him, and the audience booed me(Hey, change is a good thing when you write, people!), Child looked at me stunned for a second probably because he had never been asked that and flashed a salesman smile and said "I'm the Jack Reacher guy! So, no". It lowered my opinion of him. In his defense though, he later called Power of the Dog the book of the deacde, which is hard to argue with.
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post #229 of 3025
7/2/09 at 10:11am
Well, that's his comfort zone. But again, to his credit, he does support new authors.
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post #230 of 3025
7/2/09 at 10:18am
Yeah, I was skeptical of Brett in the beginning, but she ended up being a pretty solid character. So Vanilla Ride's worth it, eh?
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post #231 of 3025
7/2/09 at 2:31pm
If only because it's the only Hap & Leonard book to come down the pipe in the last what, 7-8 years? And who knows how long until the next one...
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post #232 of 3025
7/2/09 at 3:51pm
SHIT. I got this one confused with Lansdale's "Leather Maiden". Anyone touched that? I'm getting Vanilla Ride just out of habit, obviously.
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post #233 of 3025
7/2/09 at 4:22pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post
If only because it's the only Hap & Leonard book to come down the pipe in the last what, 7-8 years? And who knows how long until the next one...
Next year. I have this from Lansdale himself.
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post #234 of 3025
7/2/09 at 11:18pm
That's good news.
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post #235 of 3025
7/5/09 at 5:46pm
Thread Starter 
My video interview with Christopher G. Moore, author of the fantastic Vincent Calvino series

http://therapsheet.blogspot.com/2009...f-zen-men.html
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post #236 of 3025
7/5/09 at 10:55pm
According to Collider.com, Jason Statham has been cast as Brant in the adaptation of the Ken Bruen book, Blitz. The start of a franchise based on the series? I hope so, especially with the guy who wrote 'Moon' doing the script.
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post #237 of 3025
7/6/09 at 12:14am
Thread Starter 
Jason Statham? I always saw him as Ray Winstone or Brendan Gleeson. Brant is an older lout of a cop, a monster, not someone young, fit, and handsome.
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post #238 of 3025
7/6/09 at 12:57am
Yeah, I know what you mean. I think Statham can pull it off, though my pick would be Cirian Hinds, or another intense Black Irish actor. Maybe Hinds is about 10 years too old, but in any case, they'll probably dress Statham down and he'll do fine. Better than another Crank.
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post #239 of 3025
7/6/09 at 2:35pm
WHAT could be better than another Crank??

Seriously though, I thought Statham was great in The Bank Job. Hopefully he can pull this off. The books are good, then? Recently I've discovered Michael Connelly - The Poet, Concrete Blonde, Black Echo - and loving them, but keen to find something else.
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post #240 of 3025
7/6/09 at 3:09pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluelouboyle View Post
WHAT could be better than another Crank??

Seriously though, I thought Statham was great in The Bank Job. Hopefully he can pull this off. The books are good, then? Recently I've discovered Michael Connelly - The Poet, Concrete Blonde, Black Echo - and loving them, but keen to find something else.
I'm not a big fan of Bruen's Brant novels, but his Jack Taylor novels are great

and I absolutely love American Skin. He's a great writer.

Try Lawrence Block first though.
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post #241 of 3025
7/6/09 at 4:42pm
Speaking of Connelly, I just ordered The Scarecrow for vacation next week. Another Bosch book is coming out later this year.
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post #242 of 3025
7/6/09 at 5:38pm
Between Lawrence Block and Ken Bruen as authors, would you say one is better than the other and I should start with one series over another? Or should I just take whatever pops out at me first?
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post #243 of 3025
7/6/09 at 10:12pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecallahan View Post
Between Lawrence Block and Ken Bruen as authors, would you say one is better than the other and I should start with one series over another? Or should I just take whatever pops out at me first?
Block did the whole alcoholic P.I. thing way before Bruen and does it better. Start with Eight Million Ways to Die and When the Sacred Ginmill Closes. Bruen acknowledges him as the master.
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post #244 of 3025
7/6/09 at 11:12pm
Block.

EDIT: What Cameron said, basically. That's what I get for not refreshing the thread.
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post #245 of 3025
7/6/09 at 11:15pm
I'd start definitely with the early Scudders. He did a trio of them back around 1976, The Sins of the Fathers, In the Midst of Death, and Time to Murder and Create. They are lean, fast, excellent reads, demonstrating a surplus of existential angst with a minimum of writing. Scudder was truly a drunk then, and his state reflected a degenerating New York City, the New York of Taxi Driver and Serpico.
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post #246 of 3025
7/7/09 at 2:32am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subotai View Post
I'd start definitely with the early Scudders. He did a trio of them back around 1976, The Sins of the Fathers, In the Midst of Death, and Time to Murder and Create. They are lean, fast, excellent reads, demonstrating a surplus of existential angst with a minimum of writing. Scudder was truly a drunk then, and his state reflected a degenerating New York City, the New York of Taxi Driver and Serpico.
I like both periods, but I think his masterpieces came when he was in recovery.
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post #247 of 3025
7/7/09 at 2:33am
Thread Starter 
While I like the Jack Taylor novels, they start to sound the same after awhile. The Gaurds is a modern classic though.
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post #248 of 3025
7/7/09 at 3:46am
Thread Starter 
Wow, Blood's a Rover is mediocre.
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post #249 of 3025
7/7/09 at 11:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Booth View Post
This is great information on the Fletch books. I'll make a point of picking up this series in the future.
Advice: Don't read the series in chronological order. Fletch, Too was a big misstep (a formless, pointless, tedious travelogue in Kenya as Fletch searches for his father) that will make you hesitant to read further after only the second book. Carioca Fletch is a similar bore coming on the heels of Fletch.

Also, try to stick to the books where Fletch actually works as a journalist. The stories where he works under editor Frank Jaffe are the best: Fletch, Fletch and the Widow Bradley and Fletch Won. Also strong: Fletch's Fortune, in which Fletch is blackmailed by the CIA into bugging hotel rooms at a journalist convention.

Anybody here read Mcdonald's Flynn series? The books are a lot of fun. Very much of interest to Fletch fans since Flynn has a lead role in Confess, Fletch, and Flynn is in some ways a sequel to that book.
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post #250 of 3025
7/9/09 at 4:59am
I got through 'Die a Little' by Megan Abbott and it was pretty good, it felt like Douglas Sirk filtered through Raymond Chandler, an interesting mix, it's interesting to see noir written from a female perspective. There was a vague incestuous tone to the relationship between Lora and Bill.
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