College Dropouts - Page 2

Trust me: at 75 buck an hour, the slow-working plumber is not handling shit or digging holes — the GC has labour take care of that. If it's any good (has a pulse), the plumber runs pipe.

Hey, if want a mid-range cubicle job in an "organization", the college mentality and a credential can only benefit you. Finish that degree.

See if you can get a degree brown-nosing with a minor in glad-handing.

Hardly the natural endpoint for college dropouts. There are plenty of skilled trades that require brains and hard work — but don't require college. The fact that these are often not considered valid careers says a lot about class-oriented North Americans who would rather take pay cuts and drive desk than be caught dead with a set of tools; like some poor uneducated immigrant.

These are second only to whining and complaining on the list of required academic skills.

By the time I "dropped-out," I had enough credits for two degrees. I stuck it out for the paper and simultaneously worked on a trade for the last few years.

The experiences are going to be 50/50 either way, finishing college or not. So hearing about experiences won't help as much as recommendations likely. Considering you are interested in going into a particular trade, treat it like any other, teach yourself as much as possible, find somewhere to help you practice your trade, and bust your ass. Basically what would happen with a degree anyways.

What will these films be financed with?

Anyway, it sounds as if what you want would be better served at some sort of specialized institute or program where you'd just learn the gear.

I dropped out of film school (would have graduated in 2006), but the best thing that came out of my experience at NYU were the contacts. If you feel like you know everything or aren't getting what you need, then that's what you're going to get out of film school: contacts. People who you want to work with, or who want to work with you. That's all I got.

I'm actually considering being a college drop-IN. There's nothing stopping anybody turning up to lectures and taking notes on the cheap. I'm surprised there aren't more jobless weirdos doing that.

That's pretty much what I'm doing, I'm learning to be an audio engineer and only taking the relevant courses. I don't have to worry about any math or english bullshit.

Going back to your original request...

I dropped out of college after two years. Got married and went to work for an oil jobber as an accountantant to support my wife. We figured that she'd get into the field she was enthusiastic about (teaching...yeah, I know) and I'd go back and finish at a school where they didn't try to make the music majors into school teachers or church musicians. Of course, that worked out just great.

So I figured I'd learn everything I could outside of school. Ended up with a long and varied collection of jobs, but in the end was able to get pretty locked into the local music scene as both a player and a business/tech guy. Had some GREAT gigs...helped start some very nice studios for people, worked as the distribution arm of a regional indie, owned my own music PR company, wrote a weekly music column for a metro paper, did writing for the city's music rag, all that stuff. And ended up doing my own cds and tours and videos and all that as well.

College will give you the diploma, yes. But actually going out and *doing* the work will get you more opportunities to do it. You want to work with film? Cool. But until you get in a situation where you can, I'd say learn all the basic concepts using DV and video your guts out.

One of the big secrets to success is to be around people that do what you want to do. You want to be rich? Be around rich people. Want to make music? Be around musicians. Want to make movies? Get to know the folks making movies. Back when I was involved in music hard core, my rolodex was legendary. I could get ahold of nearly anyone in the city that had anything to do with music whether it was concert promotions, publicity, marketing, sales, radio broadcast, legal, engineering or sales. I had a lot of success because of that.

I miss the piece of paper, honestly. Miss that I have to go the "end around" route when I want to get a job instead of being able to put down on a resume that I have a degree. In my case I have to sell my experience and ability to learn quickly, and that's only when I can find a situation where the lack of a degree doesn't bar me from the door.

Anyway, that's my take. You want to make movies? Make movies. On whatever scale you can make them. Take any work you can that involves utilizing your skillset and then add to that skillset a little at a time. And invest in your contacts. Take people to lunch when you can. Pick their brains when you can. It'll help your career as much as being good at what you do.

I did that quite a bit during my college career...most professors would love to have an interested person sitting in and asking questions (get permission before you do it.) I always enjoyed it when a student would ask me why I never showed up for tests, "...because I'm not enrolled in this class." The shocked look on their faces was wonderful.

I can see why that would be disheartening. The thing is you've already decided on a career that requires a bit of nuts'n'bolts knowledge (although I'm still not clear on what aspect of filmmaking you intend to focus), and committed to not accepting anything less.

Sounds to me like your best bet would be transferring to a school with a good film program. Yeah, it'll cost more money, but assuming your grades and test scores are high enough to get you admitted, that's what loans are for. Another option is to drop out now, pick up a trade, make some money, then apply to film school down the line when it's more financially feasible. Or you can finish your degree at the current school, get the piece of paper that will at least get you in the door with some small-time video productions outfit. That way you can make some money, improve on some of the skills that may help you in filmmaking down the road; maybe it'll even inspire you to pick up an additional degree in filmmaking at a better school that has the stuff you want.

I'm guessing you're not going to find a job in film without having the technical knowledge you'd pick up or connections you'd make in film school, though. And without a degree or trade experience, don't expect that 50K that seems so odious to you anytime soon. That's not a "fallback" salary for many of us who did very well in school and have the paper to prove it.

I understand where you're coming from, specifically with respect to my current pursuit of teaching certs - Spanish major, Sociology minor. Nobody gives a fuck, really. Debates are stultifying, hollow, half-hearted attempts at discussion, the level of discourse in the film studies class I took was nothing short of depressing, and people just seem to be floating around in a pseudo-academic puddle because they have nothing better to do. I can't wait to get the fuck out of there to a higher-level institution.

Speaking as someone who hires people in the film industry Dean you walk into my studio with that story I'll show you the door. Why? Because the film industry is 80% really shitty work with people who aren't a lot of fun and stupidly long hours. I need to know that whoever I hire has the ability to work through a shit storm of bad attitudes and poor quality productions and not walk on me the moment things get really bad. I need someone who basically works for those 20% moments where you realize that you work in one of the coolest industries in the world and that the other 80% is just the price we pay to do so.

However, if you still want to learn about film making but still don't want to stay in school. Go down to your local IATSE office, take Set Etiquette and Protocol (or whatever your local equivalent is) get a job as a PA and network your way to new positions. A good attitude and hard work will keep you employed and keep you rising through the ranks. Plus you get the bonus of learning how to get cheap gear for your side projects.

Honestly, if you're upset that you're doing stuff that you don't want to do, you should just end life right now.

I dropped out after a year because I panicked about my major and decided to "take some time off". Ended up getting a temp job as a data analyst for $15/hr eventually becoming permanent. It's because of that work experience that I got my current job in the city which pays far more then a college dropout like me should get. Shockingly, the fact that I didn't have a degree never was mentioned during the entire interview process.

Is this the career I really wanna have? Not really, but I'm only 22 so I figure I'll ride this out for a bit. Will I ever go back to school? It's very possible. Hell, every spring I say "in the fall".

*tentatively reaches for the red button*

I'm currently in my third semester of my Sophomore year at film school. I gleaned the fact from enough books, discussions, and director's commentaries that film school is pretty much worthless for making you a filmmaker. I came anyway because the school I attend has a great production focused department. The tuition (and thus the loans) are insane, but it gives me access to an enormous amount of equipment, professors who know their shit, and a large student body of folks who actually do want to make movies. The attitude here is very straightforward and work-based, people don't fuck around. Honestly, it feels more like a studio than a school. So while I'm going to have to learn how to pace a narrative, convey and imply ideas in a shot, and all of the other artistic techniques that a director needs my damn self- I will be able to set up and light 35/DV, and run a respectable set. I'll know how to use everything from a fucking Bolex, to a DVX100, to a Panavision 35mm. Most of all, I'll be exposed to working with an honest to god film crew.

This all sounds like what you are looking for, can you make it to GA?

Sounds to me like you want to quit regardless of what advice you get. So quit.

Just know that life-- real life -- will be a lot easier with a degree.

My degree makes no difference at all in my job. Most of the time they don't even care or ask if I have one. It's that bastard professional designation that's killing me.

Which is why I want too quit and join the Coast Guard.

Quit school and lie on your resume.

Or sell condos. They'll let any asshole do that.

Edit: And if you want to make movies, make a fucking movie. You could be the next Tarantino or Rodriguez. You could also be the next Mark Borchardt...stay in school.

Yes life is made up of doing things you do not want to do. If you have the right drive and ability, you might reach your dream job. But you will end doing a lot of things you really do not want to do until that happens. So either suck it up, or check out now.

Film School taught me that Film Students are douchebags.


HOLLYWOOD, HERE I COME!

You want to study film. Go work on them. Jesus, a large group of the people I work with never went to college or if they did they didn't really study.

But I will echo what Ryan said. Film work means shoveling a lot of shit for those great moments where you realize this is pretty fucking cool. Like me doing tons of paperwork one day only to walk out to where the picture car stage is and stop in my tracks as I look at a real race car we just brought in. Or having the producer take 15 minutes out of his very busy day to just shoot the shit about other films he is working on. Or getting the shit scared out of me by a dummy from KNB I thought was a real person at first.

But guess what? Even people in the movie business have lousy taste in films a lot of time. They don't discuss art films or foreign films a lot. Get over it. The population that does like the truly great or even good films out there is small.

I posted this before, but if you want a job in the film industry you need to hit the pavement and start hitting production offices. Drop your resume off. Be persistent about it too. And be willing to take some small, extremely low paying gigs to start off. If you can, be willing to work for free on some no-budget film going on. Because once you get experience and contacts, and impress people hopefully, you will find people setting you up with jobs or calling you to come work with them.

I could do a lot of other jobs which pay better and have better hours. I do this because its all I want to do.

But no, you don't need college. Just passion and willingness to work in this business.

There's never a straight road into the film business. My advice, if it matters, is stick it out, get the B.A. Bear with my anecdote: I got my B.A. in journalism and broadcasting, and didn't learn shit about what I really wanted to do, which was film post. But that piece of paper opened doors for me to get in on the ground floor of a Post production company, and led to better connections in the business than what I would have had if I didn't have the degree. And I'm still climbing the ladder pretty briskly and have worked at some amazing facilities based on connections gained. I'm in debt, no doubt about that, but I figured I paid for the experience I'm having now.

I know you're not looking for advice, but you kind of opened up a can of worms because we all want you to succeed. But whatever path you choose, I wish you all the best either way.

I think "dropping" is a metaphor for "killing'" and school is a metaphor for "his life". Read between the lines ladies and gentlemen; this is a cry for help.

I'm hungry.

A lot of people didn't go to college. Albert Einstein. Pochahontas!

As yet another one of those pesky film school graduates, I can tell you that college was a great experience for me because, while yes, you can take all that money and just make one movie, at college, you get to learn everything, audio, post, production and especially: equipment. 35mm and HD cameras aren't cheap by the day, but at a halfway decent film school (like Savannah where Renn is at), that makes a hell of a lot of difference as you not only get the piece of paper but a lot of hands on experience with the equipment of the industry. You may not become master at Avid or lighting, but you'll be a jack of all trades, which is highly useful for getting your foot into a PA gig.

The periods of unemployment suck, especially if they go on too long with no one biting.

I can't tell someone what to do with their life - but sticking with college meant me getting work as a lecturer at the very same place I graduated and employment as a cameraman.

Really, that's the best kind of endorsement for sticking around.

I don't have a degree...

I finished when I had a diploma (not a degree) in TV and Radio. Worked in radio a little bit in mostly menial jobs, was (after a few years) asked to help out on a radio station arts show- research, followed by the occasional on-air review and, after a while, the odd interview.

Later still, I sold a radio interview I did with Natasha McElhone to a local magazine (she was promoting Solaris). The mag gave me a part time job as a film critic, which I still have. Now I'm a freelance arts journalists- one of the papers I write for is hugely reputable. I'm such scraping by financially, but am progressing and I love my work. It took a lot of scraping and bullshit phonecalls to get where I am, but I love what I do.

In most fields (that are neither medicine nor law) you don't need a degree to practice it. I never studied print journalism, but have surpassed other freelancers who are better educated. Be prepared to work hard at selling yourself- call, call, and call a few more people.

There's no guarantee that you'll succeed either way, but in my ten years of experience, employers respond more to personality and experience. Work for free, beef up your resumé (pay a recruitment consultant to tell you how to sell yourelf) send it to everyone, then call everyone. (Everyone.) Educate yourself and do solo projects. Repeat process.

Degrees are useful, but overrated.