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Jesus Was a Pedophile

post #1 of 48
Thread Starter 
According to OTVIII, authored by L Ron Hubbard, Jesus was a pedophile.

I'd be interested in hearing from religious types why this has any less validity than any of their own holy texts.

Quote:
OT VIII US District Court, Central District of California Fishman Case No 91-6426 HLH (Tx) HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE Saint Hill Manor. East Grinstead, Sussex
HCO BULLETIN OF 5 MAY 1980
LIMITED DISTRIBUTION ISSUE I
OT VIII Course Students OT OT VIII Auditors OT VIII C/Ses AO Review Auditors
AO C/Ses OT VIII Series I
C O N F I D E N T I A L STUDENT BRIEFING
By the time you read this I will no longer be occupying the body and identity that you have known as Ron. That identity continues to live in the hearts and minds of many as well as in on-Source tech and admin centers around the planet, and will inspire for years to come Scientologists and lovers of truth everywhere.
What follows is a story that has been withheld, for reasons which will soon be obvious, until such time as there were enough OTs that something could be done about it. That time is now. It is not a nice or a pretty story, but I trust that having arrived on the OT VIII Course you are ready to hear it. You have undoubtedly heard pieces of data over the years that hinted at the greater untold reality of my mission here on Earth, but the story was never written, nor spoken, in its entirety due to security problems that have unfortunately always plagued the organization. It is only now that I feel it safe to release the information, although the time is rapidly approaching when I will have no choice in the matter, the hour draws that near.
I am not going to delve too deeply into specifics as people have a tendency to bog themselves down in significance, which would only serve to delay the immediacy of the task at hand. Therefore I will be brief.
Some eighty-odd million years ago Earth time (it actually dates at 78, 395, 042 but dates are a bit superfluous with this material) plans were drawn by a group outside the MEST universe for the eventual takeover of a good portion of this universe. Not a particularly large nor imaginative crew, their exterior perspective, however, gives them considerable advantage over tho time-bound beings of the MEST universe. Borrowing from earlier operations such as Helatrobus, they conceived an ongoing implant, some portions of which have been fairly faithfully rendered in parts of the Bible. This implant, laid in by carefully controlled genetic mutation at Incident Two of OT III and periodically reinforced by controlled historic events since then, makes it effectively impossible for beings on the more heavily affected planets such as Earth to become free. It causes progressive genetic "evolution" that gives the subject population greater and greater susceptibility to the telepathic impingement and direction of the controllers. In its final stage the progression becomes almost geometric, and it is this final stage that we are rapidly approaching.
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Another aspect of this GE-line implant is that the body becomes in effect a sort of theta trap that kicks in heavily on the being should he attempt to expand his horizons beyond that of pure physical universe reality. There can be temporary key-outs which we have all experienced in varying degrees, but until this area is handled it can honestly be said that there is no hope for continued expansion. The good news is that once this is run out. Expansion becomes rather effortless and almost automatic.
No doubt you are familiar with the Revelations section of the Bible where various events are predicted. Also mentioned is a brief period of time in which an arch-enemy of Christ, referred to as the anti-Christ, will reign and his opinions will have sway. All this makes for very fantastic, entertaining reading but there is truth in it. This anti-Christ represents the forces of Lucifer (literally, the "light bearers" or "light bringer"), Lucifer being a mythical representation of the forces of enlightenment, the Galactic Confederacy. My mission could be said to fulfill the Biblical promise represented by this brief anti-Christ period. During this period there is a fleeting opportunity for the whole scenario to be effectively derailed, which would make it impossible for the mass Marcabian landing (Second Coming) to take place. The Second Coming is designed, among other things, to trigger a rapid series of destructive events.
With the exception of the original Buddhism, virtually all religions of any consequence on this planet, mono- and pantheistic alike, have been instruments to speed the progress of this "evolution of consciousness" and bring about the eventual enslavement of mankind. As you know, Siddhartha Gautama never claimed to be anything more than a man. Having caught on to this operation, he postulated his own return as Metteyya, part of which prophecy will have been fulfilled upon the passing of L. Ron Hubbard.
For those of you whose Christian toes I may have stepped on, let me take the opportunity to disabuse you of some lovely myths. For instance, the historic Jesus was not nearly the sainted figure has been made out to be. In addition to being a lover of young boys and men, he was given to uncontrollable bursts of temper and hatred that belied the general message of love, understanding and other typical Marcab PR. You have only to look at the history his teachings inspired to see where it all inevitably leads. It is historic fact and yet man still clings to the ideal, so deep and insidious is the biologic implanting.
post #2 of 48
Thread Starter 
continued

Quote:
It is a good joke that the Galactic Confederacy is associated with the Serpent in the Garden, the beast and other emissaries of the "Prince of Darkness". Yet in certain passages and esoteric interpretations of the Bible (much of which has been taken out and effectively suppressed for centuries) as well as the Cabbalah, the truth reveals itself quite nicely for the clever and the ungullible.
So it really is a race against time and one that we happen to be losing at the moment, as the implant drama inexorably plays itself out in spite of the breakneck pace I've managed to keep up these last thirty-five years.
I had an inkling, but only that, of the insidiousness of this material as far back as 1945. Later, in charcteristic over-optimism, I thought that R6 would be the end of it. But that was followed by NOTs and the Purification Rundown and still the string continued to unwind with the ball at the end of it just out of sight. It makes ons wonder about such things as fate and destiny, such
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was the resolve with which I managed to cling to that string, not often knowing how close I was to falling into the abyss myself, but destiny is merely the rationalization of feeble minds. Things don't just happen, they are caused. And causative beings can undo the plans of madmen and would-be enslavers, no matter how long those plans may have been in the making.
I will soon leave this world only to return and complete my mission with another identity. Although I long to stretch my arms back in repose on some distant star in some distant galaxy, it appears that is one dream that will have to wait. But my return depends on people like you doing these materials thoroughly and completely so that there will be a genetically uncontaminated body for me to pick up and resume where I left off. A body free of religious mania, right/wrong dichotomy and synthetic karma. The job ahead is far too tough to even contemplate doing with your standard -- courtesy of certain other-dimensional players and their Marcab pieces, many of whom are right here in the general populace -- genetically altered body.
Without the biogenetic meddling of those who stand outside time (who cannot yet directly influence our world and must work through others) the dwindling spiral is not nearly as automatic and self-perpetuating as it appears. There are regions even in isolated parts of the Milky Way where poets are free to poet and magicians can paint reality with their magic wands and exteriorize without body kickback. But these areas unfortunately are fewer and fewer.
I will return not as a religious leader but a political one. That happens to be the requisite beingness for the task at hand. I will not be known to most of you, my activities misunderstood by many, yet along with your constant effort in the theta band I will effectively postpone and then halt a series of events designed to make happy slaves of us all.
So there you have it. The secret that I have kept close to my chest all these years. Now you too are part of this secret and I no longer have to shoulder the burden alone or live with the possibility of body death before all the data could be released. And with this briefing I entrust to each of you the responsibility for this material until such time as I am able to return. For we have no help from any other quarter in this matter. The handful of secret societies throughout history that have caught on to this game have long since fallen by the wayside or been taken over and become instruments of the very menace they were set up to combat.
The rundown is long and can be arduous, but it must be done thoroughly if there is to be any effect not only on the body of the pre-OT but the body of his or her progeny as well. There is some danger, but with OT VII thoroughly complete it is not nearly so great as the danger witnessed by assorted unfortunates who happened to stumble into this area in their sleep or in moments of reverie or anaten, experiencing an hitherto mysterious phenomenon known as "spontaneous combustion".
CAUTION: DO NOT BE PTS WHILE TRAVERSING THIS THIRD AND FINAL WALL OF FIRE
But the area is well charted, the rundown many years in secret development, and by the time you read this undoubtedly completed on myself. The wins awaiting you are like none that you have ever experienced, not just for you, but for your children, your children's children and the whole of mankind, if we succeed. And we will. If we had time we should pity the many poor souls, from
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1950 to PT, who chose such an exactly inopportune moment to drop off the road to truth and disconnect from reality, the full burst and glory of OT practically within their grasp. But we haven't the time to "wax philosophic" or ponder might have beens.
The rundown follows. Again I say, do it thoroughly and completely, for it is your ticket to the stars. And beyond!
L. RON HUBBARD FOUNDER
LRH:lrh Copyright (c) 1980 by L. Ron Hubbard ALL RIGHTS RESERVED
[/QUOTE]
post #3 of 48
But don't pedophiles usually try to lure kids with gifts? hmmm. http://www.landoverbaptist.net/PS3.htm
post #4 of 48
I didn't see any Bible quotes. Not that I read it too carefully--Hubbard's prose is uglier than Ayn Rand's. Your bait threads are usually a little better thought out, unless you have a further point to make.

I've noticed noticed you usually act as a shit disturber and then swoop in with logic at the last moment. If you have better than Elron I want to read it. Really.
post #5 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasMN View Post
I didn't see any Bible quotes. Not that I read it too carefully--Hubbard's prose is uglier than Ayn Rand's. Your bait threads are usually a little better thought out, unless you have a further point to make.

I've noticed noticed you usually act as a shit disturber and then swoop in with logic at the last moment. If you have better than Elron I want to read it. Really.
You've missed the point.
post #6 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
I'd be interested in hearing from religious types why this has any less validity than any of their own holy texts.
This was the point.
post #7 of 48
If I remember from previous discussions, the only answer you can expect is: "Because scientology was created by a man so he could make money and the Bible/Koran/etc were created/inspired by God for the good of mankind."
post #8 of 48
To answer Devin's question:

Because it's L. Fucking Ron Fucking Hubbard. The hack wrote "Battlefield Earth." He's referring to Galactic empires and 80-million year old evolutionary something or other. I could never believe this garbage because it was written by L. Fucking Ron Fucking Hubbard.





The Bible, on the other hand, was written by William Shakespeare. WAY BETTER.

I hope this helps.
post #9 of 48
I understood your point. I will just make mine a little clearer. What Elron said has no validity because he took a "holy" figure from a "holy" book, made a claim about that figure and then didn't use any passages from that book to back it up.

Any religious figures validity is only relevant among his followers. The more followers, the more valid. Christians have the numbers on their side therefore their beliefs seem more "official". It is only about personal prejudice--you'll see that when/if Christians start posting.

The title of this thread is just a bait. If it was actually to prove a point about the idiocy of religious faith, you could have taken one of the funnier quotes from Revelations and another quote from Hubbard. The title of this thread was to engage emotions, not reason.
post #10 of 48
Yea it's safe to say there is never gonna be a book of L. Ron added to the Bible. This is why I never try to argue logic with religious people. Christianity, Islam ect are structured in a way that science and logic are not nearly as important as faith. I am all for them believing whatever side of the whole Jesus story they want so long as it ain't infringing on my right to not give a shit what the Bible, the Koran or lame ass L. Ron says.
post #11 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasMN View Post
The more followers, the more valid.
So Jesus takes the square due solely to numbers? To be fair you say later on that the strength in numbers makes it "seem" more official. I'll buy that but I hope you don't mean what you said in the section I quoted.

Kinda following what Sherm said, what Scientology tries to do (from the little I know of it) that makes it less credible (to me) than Christianity or Islam for example is to explain everything in our terms. Using "science" and aliens to explain the soul and to answer "Why are we here" seems too small, not to mention goofy.

Setting aside the history and the numbers and that fact that so many of the major tenets of Christianity feel right to someone raised with Western morals (don't kill, judge and treat others as you'd want to be judged/treated, doing the right thing is its own reward, be tolerant of those who believe differently than you, love one another, etc.), Christianity explains everything without actually explaining it - it acknowledges that not everything can be understood rationally and that you simply must have faith. That's pretty ingenious and pretty powerful. It is at base unassailable from a rational perspective.
post #12 of 48
I meant gives the illusion of validity. Scientology would not have gotten tax exempt status without the numbers. Christianity will always keep it's status for the same reason.

As for Western morals, any group will toss its morals aside to further its own interests. Whether its the Crusades, 9/11 or some Buddhist groups in Japan committing terrorist acts--religion has never been very good at improving human behavior. We only seem civilized now because technology has made us comfortable and allowed us to go beyond our own isolated groups.
post #13 of 48
The difference is all in the reader. Whether you believe this or the bible is based completely on how much you trust the author (and who you think the author is, ultimately).

Objectively, there is no more reason to believe this than the bible. But once emotion gets involved there's no more objectivity. It's really hard to have a discussion like this because either everyone agrees or the disagreements are based on things you can't rationally argue about. It always comes down to "I'm right; you're wrong. And more people believe me than you." (Which ironically wasn't true when Jesus was converting people the same way it isn't true for Hubbard's followers now.)
post #14 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianM View Post
Christianity explains everything without actually explaining it - it acknowledges that not everything can be understood rationally and that you simply must have faith. That's pretty ingenious and pretty powerful. It is at base unassailable from a rational perspective.
That is one of my main problems with religion. Saying "Just Believe" turns your mind off to other possibilities. At a personal level it isn't that bothersome--what ever gets you through your day without killing yourself or anyone else is fine.

Unfortunately, when belief becomes a group activity the group tends to take precedence over the belief. See Scientology's reaction to any websites that question them. Then factor in the War on Christmas, Creationists trying to weaken science, etc. and maybe large groups of people turning off their brains doesn't seem like such a good idea. At that point it goes beyond personal faith and into the realm of controlling others for personal gain.
post #15 of 48
I heard Xenu was into beastiality.
post #16 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianM View Post
The Bible, on the other hand, was written by William Shakespeare. WAY BETTER.

I hope this helps.
post #17 of 48
Sixteen posts and no Lebowski references? Are the chewers growing up or slipping?

I can't read scientology texts, by the way. They give me a headache.
post #18 of 48


Seriously, didn't he say "Let the little children come on me?"

...yeah, I'm going to hell.

EDIT: ...goddammit, mastronikolas...
post #19 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by mastronikolas View Post
I can't read scientology texts, by the way. They give me a headache.
Well, L. Ron said those that weren't trained and brought up through Scientology the right way would suffer and die if they read OT text before they were ready.
post #20 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by billylove View Post
Well, L. Ron said those that weren't trained and brought up through Scientology the right way would suffer and die if they read OT text before they were ready.
What he failed to mention is that all of us suffer and die no matter when/if we read OT.
post #21 of 48
I'm surprised the thread has gone so long without one of these posted:

post #22 of 48
When jesus said,"Suffer the little children to come unto me." That's not what he meant.

George Carlin=Gold.
post #23 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasMN View Post
That is one of my main problems with religion. Saying "Just Believe" turns your mind off to other possibilities. At a personal level it isn't that bothersome--what ever gets you through your day without killing yourself or anyone else is fine.

Unfortunately, when belief becomes a group activity the group tends to take precedence over the belief. See Scientology's reaction to any websites that question them. Then factor in the War on Christmas, Creationists trying to weaken science, etc. and maybe large groups of people turning off their brains doesn't seem like such a good idea. At that point it goes beyond personal faith and into the realm of controlling others for personal gain.
I used to work with a woman who was born-again, a decision that (naturally) followed quite a few years of drug/alcohol abuse. She was quite a holy roller, one of those people who seemed to get genuinely excited by the prospect of armageddon. For her, Christianity was a 12 step program designed to keep her on the wagon ... and she felt the world was a better place if everyone believed what she did.

Anyway, she kept her desk litter with religious fetishes. My favorite was a framed picture that read "Dianne, don't worry, I've got everything under control. — Jesus." The whole thing just seemed juvenile, like teenagers who get their names airbrushed on T-shirts to advertise their love.

If she really believed, would the fetishes be necessary? And why is my confirmation of her beliefs so goddamned important?


Oh, and Dianetics is the greatest satire of organized religion ever. I don't believe anyone actually believes that shit (but that goes for pretty much every religion.) I've always suspected Scientology is just a money laundering scam operating under the pretense of a church.
post #24 of 48
Yeah, it is pretty ridiculous to imagine a person looking at what Devin posted above and thinking 'Hmm, makes sense.'

At least other religions have better writers at the helm, yeesh.
post #25 of 48
I think what Devin's getting at is this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver Wendell Holmes
Most of the things we do, we do for no better reason than that our fathers have done them or our neighbors do them, and the same is true of a larger part than what we suspect of what we think.
So the question for the religious is (or maybe it isn't, but it's what interests me), once you embrace the patently irrational as part of your worldview, how do you go about refuting other people's irrational beliefs, such as Scientology? Is there more than age or social convention that lends your specific beliefs credence in your mind?
post #26 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werewolf Girl View Post
Yeah, it is pretty ridiculous to imagine a person looking at what Devin posted above and thinking 'Hmm, makes sense.'

At least other religions have better writers at the helm, yeesh.
This is why I find Scientology more baffling than any other religion. At least there's SOME ambiguity as to who or what created the Bible. We know a fucking hack sci-fi author and fraud wrote all this Scientology crap so there's not even the tenuous excuse that it MAY be legit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
I think what Devin's getting at is this:



So the question for the religious is (or maybe it isn't, but it's what interests me), once you embrace the patently irrational as part of your worldview, how do you go about refuting other people's irrational beliefs, such as Scientology? Is there more than age or social convention that lends your specific beliefs credence in your mind?
People don't like to be challenged, especially not on something they hold so dear as religion. Religion is all about taking some insane idea for granted as true, so naturally people get uppity when something contradicts it.

Also, it doesn't help that these people think it's rational. That's a pretty big part of it. They 'KNOW' their God is real, so therefore yours is not and how dare you for believing otherwise.

You really can't find a logic in pretty much any of this. You can find the cause and effect, but the rationale is obviously where it all comes apart.

I'm sure you knew all that already.
post #27 of 48
Where the fuck is this Hubbard guy's burning bush or talking snake? Who told him this shit? Is that ever stated in any of his religious texts? I mean Smith and Moses and all these other cats they tell me some naked dude with wings or a magical shrubbery told them where they could find the golden book about magical underpants. Where is L. Ron getting his information?

Even Son of Sam had a talking dog. I'd be a lot more inclined to listen to what this guy had to say if he was endorsed by something that doesn't normally talk or have wings that talks or has wings (or both) telling him what is what.
post #28 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by KillingPickman View Post
Where the fuck is this Hubbard guy's burning bush or talking snake? Who told him this shit? Is that ever stated in any of his religious texts? I mean Smith and Moses and all these other cats they tell me some naked dude with wings or a magical shrubbery told them where they could find the golden book about magical underpants. Where is L. Ron getting his information?

Even Son of Sam had a talking dog. I'd be a lot more inclined to listen to what this guy had to say if he was endorsed by something that doesn't normally talk or have wings that talks or has wings (or both) telling him what is what.
Yeah I never considered that. What's the official story on how he came to get all this wonderful knowledge? And by official, I mean the Scientology version where it's not because he's a shitty science fiction writer.
post #29 of 48
I think we can all agree that L. Ron failed as a human being in every respect.
post #30 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
Yeah I never considered that. What's the official story on how he came to get all this wonderful knowledge?
If you give me $100,000 over the next few years, I'll tell you.
post #31 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by mastronikolas View Post
If you give me $100,000 over the next few years, I'll tell you.
Okay...NO WAIT!

Can we do $50,000? It's all I have.

EDIT: More like all I see myself having over the next few years.
post #32 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
According to OTVIII, authored by L Ron Hubbard, Jesus was a pedophile.

I'd be interested in hearing from religious types why this has any less validity than any of their own holy texts.

Devin

As a lifelong adherent to the Baptist religion, I can tell you my own opinion:

I don't think it has any less validity than any other holy text.

I won't validate it, personally. But that doesn't mean that his message and approach won't speak to someone else that will. And if they do, more power to them. Maybe they'll work their way up in the heirarchy of the organization and make some decent money. Who knows?
post #33 of 48
I'm neutral in this, but the blatantly one sided, anti-religion shit that's going on here is just as irritating and annoying as if someone came out and started preaching outright in favor of their religion. In a way that allowed no leeway for the opposite point of view. Just my two cents.
post #34 of 48
Actually, to correct myself, L. Ron does impress me as an extraordinary con artist, and while I do try to see the world as amoral, he fails so much ethically and morally by controlling others that I need to revise how I gauge humanity; my impression of his is the same way one is fascinated by a serial killer's operations. His actions are reprehensible, yet I can't help but be amazed at his ingenuity in fucking people over. An episode of CSI should be devoted to how L. Ron's evil genius has killed and ruined people.
post #35 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkovsky View Post
I'm neutral in this, but the blatantly one sided, anti-religion shit that's going on here is just as irritating and annoying as if someone came out and started preaching outright in favor of their religion. In a way that allowed no leeway for the opposite point of view. Just my two cents.
True, but at least science and reason are in our corner.

EDIT: Christ. This place is getting to me. That was meant to be a joke, but it reads about as smug and self-satisfied as anything Devin writes. I mean, I do believe that some people are literally raving with their religious beliefs, but there are people who are quite reasonable and rational with it. They clearly feel they experience things that they accredit to a God or other religious being, and since I can't prove it wrong, who the fuck am I to say otherwise? I know many people use the fact that we can't prove them wrong to, say, jam intelligent design into schools, but not everybody who believes in a God or has religion has a self-righteous agenda they beat people over the heads with. Some people just feel some sort of connection with a higher power, or just legitimately believe in one regardless. My thing is if you're not being a cunt about it, who cares?
post #36 of 48
There's something weird about driving and seeing 2 or 3 cars near you with Scientology decals or badges.

But it's also weird seeing LOLCAT speak on a bumper.

What do I know?
post #37 of 48
post #38 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
...but there are people who are quite reasonable and rational with it. They clearly feel they experience things that they accredit to a God or other religious being, and since I can't prove it wrong, who the fuck am I to say otherwise?
It's not your job to "prove it wrong" though. I'm sure there are reasonable and rational people who truly believe they were abducted by aliens too, but that doesn't mean I have to take their stories at face value. I'm not saying you have to be a dick about it, but neither do you need to be a shrinking violet. Never apologize for being reasonable.
post #39 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
True, but at least science and reason are in our corner.
I've researched both "corners", and it's pretty laughable how some of this stuff reads. Have you even given religion the benefit of the doubt, ever? Or given any serious thought into researching the events of the bible, etc? I'm not saying either side is right, but as far as God goes, I'd rather be wrong and go nowhere than be wrong and go to Hell. Brush me off as an idiot, but until you can explain fairly both sides of the argument, I'm unable to find any stability in your words.
post #40 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
It's not your job to "prove it wrong" though.
I don't think I ever implied I felt it was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
I'm sure there are reasonable and rational people who truly believe they were abducted by aliens too, but that doesn't mean I have to take their stories at face value.
That's fine, but you don't have to be a prick about it. That's all I'm saying, really. Not that you are, by the way.

Religion is also different because it is a lot more institutionalized, so it's easier to understand where somebody's belief comes from and why. It's more attractive to marginalize the alien abduction people because it's not anywhere near commonly accepted the way religion is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
I'm not saying you have to be a dick about it, but neither do you need to be a shrinking violet. Never apologize for being reasonable.
You're not being a dick at all. I appreciate what you're saying and even more that you're saying it. If only more people actually attempted to discuss things on this site it would be much better off.

Anyway, I don't think I am rather apologetic for being reasonable in this respect, it's just there are people I've encountered where I feel I'd be unreasonable in debasing their beliefs. One of the smartest, most reasonable people I know believes in God, but I don't ever feel the need to attempt to disassemble that belief out of a respect for him and the fact that I more than likely couldn't prove any of what he believes wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkovsky View Post
I've researched both "corners", and it's pretty laughable how some of this stuff reads. Have you even given religion the benefit of the doubt, ever? Or given any serious thought into researching the events of the bible, etc? I'm not saying either side is right, but as far as God goes, I'd rather be wrong and go nowhere than be wrong and go to Hell. Brush me off as an idiot, but until you can explain fairly both sides of the argument, I'm unable to find any stability in your words.
You obviously didn't read the edit I made, not that I fault you for that. It was a throwaway joke and I realized it would come across the way you took it, so I explained how I really felt about the situation. Check it out, please.
post #41 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkovsky View Post
I've researched both "corners", and it's pretty laughable how some of this stuff reads. Have you even given religion the benefit of the doubt, ever?
Why would you? It's just prejudice to one side.

Quote:
I'm not saying either side is right, but as far as God goes, I'd rather be wrong and go nowhere than be wrong and go to Hell.
I'd rather go to Narnia when I die, but beavers still don't talk.

Quote:
Brush me off as an idiot, but until you can explain fairly both sides of the argument, I'm unable to find any stability in your words.
I was going to, but I suspect that English may not be your first language, which would explain why your post occasionally slips into the incomprehensible.
post #42 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
Why would you? It's just prejudice to one side.
I like how you criticize him for bothering to actually enhance his opinions with research and suggesting others do the same to keep them from becoming like the obnoxious radicals they're against.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
I was going to, but I suspect that English may not be your first language, which would explain why your post occasionally slips into the incomprehensible.
You clearly still think he is. You just don't want to be called prejudiced.

EDIT: I accidentally overlooked Tarkovsky's point about hedging his bets when it comes to religious beliefs. I think THAT is stupid. Religion and faith should not be based in a fear of going to Hell, and sticking to a belief system you don't actually believe in to play the odds will probably take a hell of a lot out of your life. Also, for emphasis I don't think Tarkovsky is stupid, just this particular thing he believes. Sorry, but I can't mince words on that.
post #43 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
I like how you criticize him for bothering to actually enhance his opinions with research and suggesting others do the same to keep them from becoming like the obnoxious radicals they're against.

You clearly still think he is. You just don't want to be called prejudiced.
The guy's not stupid for not being fluent in a language that isn't his own, if that is actually the case. But I think some of his ideas are dumb, and if it isn't, then his presentation is muddled, which isn't wowing me with smarts.

I have nothing against the concept of research. Of course, studying the accuracy of the Bible as a historical document doesn't have much bearing its accuracy as a metaphysical treatise.
post #44 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
The guy's not stupid for not being fluent in a language that isn't his own, if that is actually the case. But I think some of his ideas are dumb, and if it isn't, then his presentation is muddled, which isn't wowing me with smarts.

I have nothing against the concept of research. Of course, studying the accuracy of the Bible as a historical document doesn't have much bearing its accuracy as a metaphysical treatise.
All right, cool. I just thought you came across a bit supercilious, but that's me.
post #45 of 48
Meh, it's Monday and I'm cranky.
post #46 of 48
Getting back to Devin's original question: the only reason to believe ludicrous story A over ludicrous story B is evidence; lacking any evidence, both are equally credible (in that they are equally implausible).
post #47 of 48
I'm just glad my head doesn't explode when I skip ahead chapters in the Bible.
post #48 of 48
English is my fourth language, so does that explain it?

And just because you don't necessarily like the means in which I argue or go about debating doesn't mean there's at least some accuracy there. It's easy to brush someone's points off due to lack of credence than it is to actually consider the opposite point of view.
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