Oh Frank Miller... The All-Star Batman and Robin # 10 Mess

Complete shit. A comment on FARK summed it best when they said this seems like a really weird Cartoon All Stars "Just Say No" comic.

I was lucky enough to get a pair of copies of this at my local store when they opened. I literally happened to be downtown before they opened and was killing time at an internet cafe when I read the article. When I went to pick up my weekly books I grabbed two of these and tossed one up on ebay. One's going for $15 bucks already with two days to go. So insane.

Silver Snail, you bastard?

This comic is so good.

I don't get it, did Miller intend to have the words blacked out? Or was he censored? Seems odd if he intended it.

Also, did this just come out? I've been hearing about this for awhile, but was never clear on if it had already been released or what. I love select comics (anything Moore, some Miller, Preacher, Maus, etc. etc.), but don't follow the medium so closely that I'm up on release dates, etc.

Also, is this serialized? Or is it one big collection? (EDIT: nevermind, answered my own question on the serialized bit)

"THIS HERE ARCADE BELONGS TO THE FUCKING BATGIRL."

Must buy

One Million Comix. I don't think Snail got them, or they obeyed the Diamond order.

Though it only comes out every other century to remind me that it even exists, I have to confess that it's the most fun I've had reading Batman in a long while. It's unapologetically juvenile, masturbatory and mean-spirited, the kind of thing that'd make the good folks at The Comics Journal shit broken knives, but why not? If I can accept this sort of thing in film w/ the abundance of silly, exploitive shit that lines my DVD shelves, I simply can't see justifying a double-standard for comics.

I love this thing so much. If THE SPIRIT is half as good as this book I will die.

Not enough Batman and Robin in the newest issue. Batman's psychotic "EAT GLASS LAWMANHAHAHAHAHA!" ramblings and Robin's violent outbursts are the best thing about the comic. I love how Batman is beating himself up over Robin almost killing Green Lantern.

Where did Batman's training go wrong??

Training included:
-Constantly yelling at Robin
-Leaving Robin alone in a cave to fend for himself after his parents were murdered
-Training him to break bones and shit

I can't stand Jim Lee's art, so it's hard for me to get behind this book.

I wonder how this would have turned out if Bryan Hitch was doing it with Miller, and not Lee. The delays would have been the same, but the end product, art-wise, would have been a lot more fitting to Miller's tone.

I think the clashing of tones is part of the point. I think.

Is Jim Lee to blame for all of the delays?
Completing THE GREATEST MOVIE OF 2008 has probably been taking up a lot of Miller's time.

Just don't get the book's appeal. Yeah, I suppose there's the odd giggle to be had out of Batman acting like Mike Hammer's inbred cousin, but that wears thin pretty fast. And the fact that Miller regards readers of superhero comics as retards is hardly news at this point. But as satire, it's about on the same level with "Jingle Bells, Batman Smells." Oh, look-- Batman's acting like a dick.

I'm not even that big a fan of Batman, but I do find it fascinating the way that DC got themselves into this mess. I mean, the only reason that withdrawing the books caused a stir is that Miller has Batman-- hero of lunch boxes and Underoos worldwide-- and company (including a young girl) cussing like longshoremen; if they had just mis-colored Killer Croc or something, no one would even notice. And instead of just having black blocks in place of the text, they have to place it OVER the actual words, so we can all have the titillating sense that those naughty words are right there, in the ink on the page; we can even sometimes see the top or bottom of a letter here and there, and maybe even figure out what the word is! They just didn't make the boxes black enough this time. On what planet does this seem like a good idea?

Well, DC's evidently been good with letting Miller do his thing, and unless the marketing folks at Time Warner perceive a problem, I guess it'll continue. But more and more, Miller reminds me of J.K. Rowling or Tom Clancy: he's so big that editorial can no provide guideline or supervision, and the work suffers as a result.

This book is for all the fanboys who want every superhero film to be R rated.

I've been wondering that myself, but I can't imagine that the hours of stroking off to dailies of Eva Mendes is cutting into the five minutes it must take Miller to write these scripts. If anything, his scripts read as if he is deep into the throes of a yank session, he might be a multi-tasker like that.

I agree. While I'm a fan of the book, there's no way he takes more than ten minutes to write each issue.

Devin likes it and he's the exact opposite of that description.

Because Frank Miller despises his audience, maybe? That's the underlying hook of the book, isn't it? The old Denny O'Neil quote of "Frank Miller hates superheroes"?

If the book has any appeal, it's that anything can happen - all the rules are out the window, and you can page through without without a certainty of what will happen by the last page. Oddly enough, that's also the appeal of Morrison's All-Star Superman, but the books are night and day.

But then he creates something like The Spirit film, which outside of a PG-13 rating that AS B & R likely couldn't grab if it was adapted, looks like quite the same thing (there's a even a reverb in the dialogue). This is what makes Miller such an interesting figure, more interesting than the material he's been writing recently anyway. I have a difficult time buying into the idea that The Spirit is a multi-million dollar "fuck you" to his audience. As I suggested in another thread, I think Miller is disconnected from his audience, but he's so headstrong (a double-edged sword) that he won't alter his approach despite numerous protests questioning his creative whims.

To put this into perspective, I don't care about George Lucas or Star Wars, but it seems that the complaints amongst the people that do, seem to parrallel the issues w/ Miller.

Jim Lee causes the delays. I was interviewing Miller on the set of 300 and he was really far ahead on the series. I think he may have been on 7 or 8.

I don't understand why they ink those words in the first place if they're going to black them out.

I'm not a Jim Lee hater, but I'd happily trade him in for an artist who can get this magnificent book out regularly.

There's a editor in deep shit and a fired letterer out there today I'm sure

The problem with the book is only that there seems to be no rhyme or reason to the story. It's just whatever Miller feels like jerking off over that day. There literally is no story. It is possibly the most cynical cash grab in comics history. And that is saying a lot.

Nope. DC knew.

No matter how bad it may be, DC is indebt to Frank Miller's The Dark Knight Returns (which influenced the current crop of Batman movies), so I think DC will let him get away with just about anything. TDKR 2 is a perfect example.

They don't really think like that the higher up you get at DC. They know Frank Miller on a title, especially Batman, equals sales. The day Miller stops selling books is the day they stop giving a shit about him.

Devin thinks it's some subversive take on Batman that Miller is brilliantly pulling off.

The reality is that it's a horrible book that's so over the top it comes back around to being entertaining. But it's undeniably awful.

Thats what I had been hoping for as well. I was hoping that Batman's extreme personality was going to be dulled by the inclusion of Robin...that Batman would take a mature father figure and cut back the broken bones. You know, when a young man suddenly finds he's going to be a father his life can change becoming more serious and perhaps a little more tollerable. I figured his actions were being used as a hyperbole to show the contrast of Batmans personality pre- and post-robin. I was fucking wrong.

No, I know that's what it is. I've actually talked to him about. Shockingly, I once again know more than you do, Drew S.

Oh SNAP. Well, Im hanging on just in case it is something Amazing. For the time beings, Im left cratching my head and awaiting the recalled #10 in the mail.

Frank Miller is simply making fun of Batman and Batman fans. It's glorious.

He's making fun of Batman and Batman fans by putting out a horribly written and terribly paced comic book. Joke's on us, I guess.

I don't understand how it's horribly written. Honestly, anybody who didn't clue in to this thing from 'Goddamned Batman' in issue 2 is just missing the boat. It's almost brilliant at times - if it wasn't such an obvious joke.

That's DARK KNIGHT STRIKES AGAIN you're thinking of.

I think All Star is a more successful version of TDKSA.

The large gaps in publishing have helped this book as opposed to hurting it because of the lack of streamlined narrative. Reading these issues back to back, or in the hardcover that came out a few months back completely highlights the lack of substance this comic actually has. There are bits that are interesting, and it's not difficult to see what Miller is going for, but I don't feel like the book deserves praise for it's attempt to be divisive and subversive just for the heck of it without pulling it off.

But it is divisive. Go to any message board and see what they're saying.

And I don't know if this was part of his point, but it's amazing how this book is so hated... and still sells.

Still in 2008 if you have the names Miller and Lee on a book it's going to sell if it was nothing but a cover and blank pages.

Perhaps its just a Hyperbole to demonstrate the true nature of Batman's warped psyche. I mean, how sane can a man be who dresses up like a bat and fights crime. On top of that, Batman is just getting swept up in his own delusions and slowing acid tripping down the bat hole. Here's a man who now names everything he owns with the Bat- prefix; he's almost completely narcisistic. He's wrapped up in the sensation that is himself. And anyone who ripps on him and his view of Bat-reality is quickly admonished...like Robin. On top of that, FM is displaying that he is truly a Caped "Crusader" by referring to his "mission." This Batman is on a no holds barred Holy Crusade against crime, and sanity or rationalism be damned. Oh and Green lantern is a tool. On top of it all, if Freud were reading the comic, I would say Batman is having some sort of severe personal or sexual repression/inadequacy issues. Eveything he owns is over the top, I mean the batmobile is a car, boat, submarine, and jet. Overcompensation much? Not to mention everything he owns in the batcave is usually some oversized novelty of an item usually found small...the playing card, the penny, etc. You ask me, FM's Batman is seriously disturbed and everything in his universe helps paint that tepestry.

Well, at the end of issue number nine a bit of what Bruce/Batman is really thinking shows through when he takes Dick to visit his parents at the graveyard, and again in issue ten where he's having vague regrets about what he's done and how he almost indirectly caused the death of Green Lantern, "A good man". At a little over the midway point in Miller's run it's going to be very interesting to see where it winds up. I wouldn't be surprised if Miller is doing a reverse fake/red-herring type of story where he sets up Batman as being a narcissistic sociopath (which psychologically he clearly is), but revealing ulterior motives for his actions. Or this could be the redemption story that occurred in Batman's life that makes him be more careful and stoic.

Devin's 100% right. I bought the trade, interested in finding out what I'd think of it, and it's so clearly a joke that I can't believe there's a debate on it. It's pretty damn funny at times.

The fact that it's a joke has no relevance to quality, though.

You don't think? I think you judge parody quite differently than an action story. I mean, if you're caught up on the fact that they're in the batmobile for three issues or whatever, I think that's kind of grasping at straws.

I don't recall saying anything about them being in the Batmobile for three issues, so I don't really know what that's supposed to mean. And I judge a comic like All-Star Batman on the individual issues, and the content within, instead of serving up praise for the writer's intent without the follow-through. Just because someone is shooting for a particular idea doesn't mean the execution is any good. When Miller's last issue of ASB ships then I'll judge the endeavor as a whole, but as of this moment, it's just not that good. And to be honest, issue ten has actually been my favorite thus far in the series.

I've never liked the smug, self-satisfied nature of putting out a product that is meant to be a prank on its target audience like this. That said, some groups are just asking for such a thing considering, as someone pointed out above, this book is almost universally reviled but still sells like crazy.