Diablo Cody versus the haters

She didn't call out the massive undercurrent of sexism that lies beneath all the online hate.

The thing is that JUNO is a good movie. A really good movie. I'm sorry that 'you' weren't able to see the film early and had to hear people get excited for it before you caught it, but that doesn't make the movie bad.

And people who complain about the dialogue are kind of why I hate the internet. It's stylized? NO SHIT. It's supposed to be stylized. Cody doesn't think she's writing gritty teen language here.

I didn't much care for Juno(I didn't dislike it, it just didn't grab me the way it did others), but I never cared about Diablo Cody in the least until I read this. It's actually kind of off-putting, and I'm mildly saddened that my first impressions of her are distasteful. She seems very into herself, and really unnecessarily foul. The "toxic silicone toys up my ass for money" thing rings hollow, since, if I recall correctly, didn't she claim to be a stripper for a while as an experiment? Y'know, just kinda for kicks, and maybe writing a book?

Justified. 100%.

Wait, how was this your first impression of her if you know her reasoning for being a stripper?

Well, this was the first thing I actually paid attention to. The stripper thing I just gleaned off the forums back around the time Juno came out. It stuck, yeah, but just as curious trivia.

I dunno - I kinda get the impression that even though Cody has exploded into the mainstream consciousness, she's still a Hollywood Outsider. That blog read like a normal every day person reacting to the shit that's being said about her in a well-written, well-thought-out, but understandably pissed way. A highly confident (rightfully so) normal person, but a normal person nonetheless.

I agree.

In fact, I had the opposite reaction of AlmightyShmun.

I knew very little about Diablo Cody before this (I knew about her being a stripper, saw Juno in the theater, and saw her at the Oscar's, and I'm sure I must have read a few snippets here on CHUD at some point)... but I found that blog post kind of funny and somewhat endearing.

There's a large group of retards, a lot of them sexist, all of them bitter, that feel like there's nothing to what she does. There was that asinine fake Diablo script that floated around and places like Defamer and idiots on message boards thought it was so funny and felt it was exactly like her writing. But none of them could write 99% of that movie and they all seem to ignore that she's the first writer like this to also have a heart the size of a planet. God bless Daniel Waters, but he never had that. The scene with Jennifer Garner at the mall and her arc is a work of total genius and she's a huge talent. You can be a cynical and vocal dick on the internet all you want, but the second you start going overboard and tearing apart someone very talented is when you need to get some perspective and rethink your bullshit.

Her script for the Tara pilot is as good or better than Juno and Toni Collete is going to kill that part.

Here's the kicker:

I bet there's 1,000 asshole articles or posts about Juno and Diablo for every one there is of Little Miss Sunshine and Michael Arndt. You can't hate one and not hate the other, and if you do, where are the legions of idiots calling Arndt a talentless douche? That's where the sexism starts to become horribly transparent.

(Oddly enough, "Hit paydirt with KDIRT" is a Daniel Waters line)

2 facts: There are a lot of haters on the internet. There are also lots of regular people who like to blog/vent on the internet. None of these things are particularly strange to read. And Diablo Cody is a talented writer.

It's amusing, laugh-out-loud funny here and there, and horribly sweet. It's going to be a huge show.

Juno is a really good movie? And The Dark Knight is just a 'good' movie?

...

Devin Faraci = Opinion void.

Devin gives instant freebie points to original works...I know, it's weird, right?

Juno was kind of like Gangs of New York for me in the way that I'd rather have seen a movie about Bateman and Garner than Page and Cera (replace with Neeson and Lewis for the latter).

Any chick that candidly admits to "shoving silicone up her ass for money" deserves props from me.

But the icing on the cake is her hyper articulate response to the anoymous people talking trash. Get over it. She won an Oscar for writing the first film to incorporate zeitgeist internet speak while almost impossibly backing that dialouge up with actual narrative pathos. The "By the way, I listened to the new Sonic Youth album and it sucks!" line stings more than any of Hard Candy's shock value.

From the sounds of it, it sounds like Cody might not become a parody of herself. I'm glad to hear it. We already have one Kevin Williamson. We don't need another one.

They are, but many of the same complaints one can lobby at Juno (a feel of disingenuity, easy script saved by first class performances, morally gray area for a storyline) can be lobbied at LMS. The difference is, with Little Miss Sunshine came out, nobody gave Michael Arndt the pure seething venom that Diablo Cody got for a movie that's not just smarter, but whose moral and overall heart is a lot more relevant and genuine, and arguably, there's an undercurrent to LMS that speaks more to Michael Arndt having some severe pedophilic issues that were very conveniently glossed over when his film was being spoonfed Oscar nominations.

The only reason why comes down to some very, VERY thinly veiled chauvinism: young, female, screenwriter who used to be a stripper got nominated for an Oscar. Yup, must've only got where she is because she's a chick. Fuck those people, and fuck anyone who doesn't believe she's got a right to be sick and tired of her past and gender being a factor behind everything she does.

That rant was justified, righteous, and, get ready for it, well-written. She wins brownie points on several fronts for this.

I like that line. I liked the whole rant with the exception of the "I have an Oscar and you don't!" part.

On one hand, I understand why she did this. The Internet has been strongly dickish towards her. At the same time, I'm wondering why a woman, who's become so successful and rightly claims her success in her rant, is so bothered by losers on the Net? She must know what the Net is like. She's gotta let shit like this roll off her Oscar-winning back. If anything, those people she's aiming this at are gonna go at her harder now.

And Ellen Page is still my least favorite thing about JUNO.

The Diablo Cody thing is no different than the Shia LaBoeuf thing or the whoever's-getting-a-big-push-now thing. Sure, there's sexism out there, but a bigger reason for all this is she has courted this sort of attention by making herself a celebrity and a brand name. She's the most recognizable writer in Hollywood now, with one movie under her belt. She writes editorials, for Entertainment fucking Weekly. Just as many people hated Little Miss Sunshine, because it was cute and people liked it, but no one has any idea who wrote the damn thing. So of course she's gonna get shit from the internet.

This reeks of the Affleck/Damon combo winning for GWH. Both wrote a good (if albeit slightly overrated) movie, and now the backlash begins. Isn't that just the way of the internet though? Eventually the backlash starts.

I'd prefer if artists just silenced critics with their output more than anything.

The difference between Cody and Arndt is that Arndt wasn't getting hailed as the next Tarantino when LMS came out. Either way I wasn't a fan of either film to be honest and pretty much for the same reasons. They were just too cutesy and "indie" in style they both just felt really forced and annoying to me. I'll echo both that Page was my least favorite part of Juno and that I would have much rather seen a film about Bateman/Garner. Garner was the real revelation in the movie to me because I had never seen her be so good in something before, she was the only character in the movie I actually cared about by the end.

She has every right to be mad but she also has to realize that it comes with the territory. We live in a world where everything is immediate. There used to not be a place where people could go and talk about a movie the second they finish watching it. There also used to not be as heavy of a hype machine. She's extremely successful and really needs to just let it roll off her back. I can understand how it must hurt to see your baby thrashed apart by people but for everyone who tears the movie apart there is someone who genuinely liked it.

Who the hell has been calling Cody the next Tarrantino?

But ya gotta admit that there is a whole lotta misogyny in geek circles. Look how often women are referred to as bitches, cunts or any other names. It's particularly offensive when they are used as another word for woman or lady. Fear breeds contempt and a lot of geeks are afraid of women, particularly strong women like Diablo Cody.

I'm not a big fan of JUNO, but I actually find myself liking Diablo Cody as a person. Does that make me weird?

It doesn't help that she's a confident, assertive woman who's not shy about her sexuality. It's fine if you're rubbing one out to a picture of her tats and tits, but once she starts showing intelligence and personality, well, then she's a pretentious hack.

Yeah really. Her forehead is not nearly large enough.

And if you really want to read some geek misogyny, check out the AICN talkbacks for the Scriptgirl reports. They are some classy individuals over there.

I can't remember where exactly but I remember reading it. Maybe it was more a comparison to her being the first celebrity screenwriter since Tarantino.

Well, sure, and I'm not going to start defending the ones that call me a fag or a nigger over Xbox Live, either. But I'm also not going to be particularly bothered by it. Being afraid of girls is part of being a teenager. I'm aware some of them aren't teens anymore, but it's hardly worth getting mad at them about anything. In fact, doing so just gives them (some) power.

I like Cody and Juno, and I enjoyed this rant to a degree, but I've been much more impressed by LaBouef's take on the haters. He basically says 'Yeah, I'd hate me too, but there's not a lot I'm really able to do about any of that. What, am I gonna turn down Spielberg?'

These people are really beneath Cody's attention, even if she had no talent.

HA HA HA how did you know?!

She went on a roller coaster vacation.

Fuck the haters.

It's a petty detail, but I think the fact that Juno didn't contain one stripper, nor a reference to strippers, is a testament to her sincerity and talent as a writer.

Not that she'd automatically be a hack if she wrote some script about strippers right out of the gate, but it makes her look less self involved.

I loved Juno, and had similar feelings to what Devin expressed above when everyone bitched about the dialog. If you couldn't tell that it was very intentionally supposed to sound like stylized dialog, there's no helping you.

Oh, awesome. I liked her before; I love her now.

That was great. I still think any misgivings about Juno's dialogue comes from the first ten or so minutes, which is just getting your sea legs w/r/t her cadence and speech patterns. After that it's all gravy. The backlash is so deeply rooted in sexism and has nothing to do with talent that it's a shame she'd even have to acknowledge these ridiculous people, but knowing my thermo-nuclear levels of self-consciousness I would've done the same thing, except a year earlier.

It's called an OPINION for a reason, much like assholes we all have one.

Juno and the Dark Knight are TWO FUCKING TOTALLY DIFFERENT FILMS, so I find it not too surprised that someone might have enjoyed one over the other.

but I like my fake name. It's engraved on an Oscar. Yours isn't.
God I love that quote.. Only reason I can see someone bashing her is mostly because of jealously.

There goes my opinion, too. I'd rather watch Juno again than The Dark Knight.

Cody's response is hilarious and completely understandable. As for the misogyny, Kevin Williamson was mentioned earlier. Considering that, like Cody, he was derided for using stylized, pop culture-heavy dialogue, there wasn't anything close to the negative response that Cody gets from the pinhead segments of the geek community. It's totally about gender.

Also, you should read her book about the stripper business. Funny stuff.

What's her "stripper book" called? I'd be curious to read a 'smart' stripper's take on the biz.

And call me a pervert, but that "toys up my ass for money" line is nasty-hot.

Not a good comparison; Tarantino directed most of his scripts, and directors are way more visible to the general public. That said, Tarantino, while I love his work, isn't above writing the odd cringingly overwritten bit of dialogue either.

Edit: I liked Juno, and had bigger problems with the soundtrack than the dialogue, frankly.

She's talented. She's pretty. She seems very grounded, intelligent, and able to be self-deprecating when it's needed.

How dare she.

I've always taken issue with this arguement, as it pertains to nerd hate. Moving slightly away from Cody here, but not fully. When someone dismisses nerd hate against Shia LaBouef, or back in the day, Leonardo DiCaprio, it's always because the haters are just jealous. But I don't buy that. If that were the case, how come nerds openly embrace people like Matt Damon, Kurt Russell, or even Mark Whalberg? Not only are they in every way as successful as the hated, they nail just as many groupies, and they basically lead the kind of lives on display in Entourage. So why be jealous of some famous people and not others? Unpleasant as it is to wallow in this subject, it's something I've never fully understood.

Candy Girl.

JUNO was a terrific film. Cody's a terrific writer. And that blog was wonderful.

Here's the thing that the haters don't get, seems like, and it's what puts JUNO in the "Completely justified for the Oscar" camp for me - all of Juno's snappy dialogue is an act. She's really a pretty frightened girl, overwhelmed by what's happening to her, and she works through it by being extremely clever and sardonic the whole time. When she, at the end, has no comeback for what happens to her, she breaks down. And then she grows through it. I think JUNO's refreshingly uncliched for the subject matter and I think any parent would be proud to have both the character of Juno, and Diablo Cody herself, as their daughter. (J.K. Simmons should have been recognized too, imo.)

I loved JUNO, and I can't wait to see Ms. Cody's next work.

I could be wrong, but I've always seen it as a case of Shia or Cody being very easy to relate to. A nerd isn't gonna get jealous of Matt Damon or Wahlberg living the "Entourage" life because those guys are "MOVIE STARS", while Shia LeBeauf kinda seems like a regular, nerdy kid who made it big. Same with Cody. And because they ARE so relatable, the whole "What's he got that I don't?" mentality kicks in.

Hmm...I never thought of it that way, Nord. Really need to revisit this one, but there was something that never quite clicked with me (zomg! sexist!) that made it only good.

She definitely deserved the Oscar, I'll give you that 100 percent. Though it does sadden me that the best original screenplay Oscar is the only place where the Academy will even consider giving the little guy (or girl) a chance.

This. So very much this. Liked her before, love her now, as others have said.

Hm. Talented people have always been hated, nothing new. Women have always been marginalized, nothing new. She should make this the last time she responds to negativity because it's stooping to their level, which just feeds the fire. Ignore them and they go to the next victim.

If she is talented (I haven't seen Juno), good for her. But winning oscars, especially these days is not much to brag about...it's massively political and you can almost literally buy a statue with your campaign and schmoozing. The fact that she's a working Hollywood writer is all she needs to brag about.

I'm pretty sure this blog is dedicated to a bunch of subliterates and sexist morons, and not the people who found Juno to be a mostly uninteresting movie and think that her Entertainment Weekly editorials and blogs paint a picture of a fairly likable, friendly, educated but somewhat superficial personality.

I don't have any interest in Diablo Cody, and this sort of thing really doesn't endear her to me.

(Male) chauvinist.

Absolutely. Juno's all about artifice, down to the music she says she listens to (the noisy proto-punk stuff, like the Stooges), as I've mentioned in threads before.

If we're to take her soundtrack as representative of what she actually listens to - and it's not a baseless assumption, given the fact that she's an acoustic guitar player who does sweet little duets with her boyfriend - she's into twee pop. There's a similar self-taught simplicity that bridges the gap between The Stooges and the Moldy Peaches, but the fact that she plays up the aggressive stuff explains a lot about how much she's showing and how much she's hiding from Bateman's character and others.

In short, I think it's telling that the Velvet Underground is on the soundtrack, and it's not "White Light White Heat," but "I'm Sticking With You."

A Stripper! With rubber toys up her ass!

Uh, aren't any of you starting to feel a wee bit ... manipulated? I'm seeing all these geeky gasps of "oh, she's so real!" from you. But haven't you noticed that it's starting to look like that's all she's got to give you?

She wrote a book about stripping. She makes a big deal about it. And when she posts this "real" blog attacking her "haters", she gratuitously embellishes on the stripping. It wasn't just regular stripping, boys, it was toys-up-the-ass stripping! Let your virgin geek minds boggle! Please don't forget me, Diablo Cody, the stripper with rubber dildos up my ass!

And let's not forget that her "brilliant" film writing debut, JUNO, derives mainly from this stunted stripper view of humanity. This teenage girl basically power fucks a guy she is merely friends with, with typical stripper/prostitute detachment, and only learns to love him later. Not particularly insightful, just projecting her own Stripper-induced detachment from sex onto the character.

I'm not denying that she may be intelligent, but it's stunted intelligence, and it looks like she's already in a rut.

p.s. I agree that JUNO is still a better movie than "The Dark Knight".

Uh....