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Henry Shrugged

post #1 of 30
11/5/08 at 1:53pm
Thread Starter 
The Kwon family has plenty of company, representing an income group comprising five million households that earn between $250,000 and $500,000 a year and pay a large chunk of it back in taxes. These folks aren't America's hedge fund managers, investment bankers, or CEOs - who boast net worths in the multimillions and qualify as rich right now. Instead, these are the doctors, consultants, and attorneys, the marketing managers and CIOs, the owners of real estate agencies and security firms. They write the contracts, inspire the sales teams, and integrate computer systems. They own many of America's small businesses. A man aspiring to join this cohort, nicknamed Joe the Plumber, has put a face on a big issue in the presidential campaign: Whether it's fair or wise to raise taxes on the powerful job engine of America's corner stores, maintenance firms, and yes, plumbing contractors.

Glad to see those evil rich are going to get their comeuppance.
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post #2 of 30
11/5/08 at 2:00pm
Oh fer chrissakes...
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post #3 of 30
11/5/08 at 2:04pm
He's a wealth advisor for Morgan Stanley, he should be able to figure this out.
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post #4 of 30
11/5/08 at 2:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
Oh fer chrissakes...
Listen, someone has to stir the shit. Might as well be me. I've got the skin for it.
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post #5 of 30
11/5/08 at 2:25pm
Admitting that you're trolling is not really your best tactic.
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post #6 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:12pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
Admitting that you're trolling is not really your best tactic.
True enough that is but I still love you lefties to death. I just wonder when the engine of small businesses that run America are brought to a screeching halt in the name of wealth distribution if you guys will be able to see the mistake that was made last night.
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post #7 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:14pm
Yeah, because a 3% increase in the marginal rate is going to absolutely stifle small businesses, just like it did in the 90s.
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post #8 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:21pm
What a fucking ignorant point of view (Tzu).

How many doctors and attorneys marched in the streets protesting Obama's taxplans?

These people don't mind paying taxes. After tax they still have plenty of money for themselves and their families. It's only people like yourself (low income aspiring to become rich) who we hear complaining. Because you are ignorant and scared.
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post #9 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
wealth distribution
[/gracious winner]

Jesus...

Taxes. It's called taxes. It's not wealth distribution or socialism or anything else. It's making sure that the infrastructure and other resources and services that we need to run this country are actually funded. Don't try and pretend like someone who makes a quarter-mil a year is being persecuted. That's just offensive.

Moreover, I'm nauseated by this meme that's emerging on the right: namely, that recognizing our moral (moral) obligation to care for and tend to one another, whether that take the form of money or garden-variety tolerance, patience, and compassion, is somehow suspect and exclusively linked to socialism. The cognitive dissonance between this stance and the trumpeting of a repulsive, perverted, jingoistic strain of Christianity is enough to give me a headache. Or maybe that's all the champagne I drank last night when my right-thinking, fundamentally decent, compassionate, intelligent candidate won the Presidency. Of our country.

An aside to Devin - okay, yeah. That felt good.

[gracious winner]
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post #10 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
The Kwon family has plenty of company, representing an income group comprising five million households that earn between $250,000 and $500,000 a year and pay a large chunk of it back in taxes. These folks aren't America's hedge fund managers, investment bankers, or CEOs - who boast net worths in the multimillions and qualify as rich right now. Instead, these are the doctors, consultants, and attorneys, the marketing managers and CIOs, the owners of real estate agencies and security firms. They write the contracts, inspire the sales teams, and integrate computer systems. They own many of America's small businesses. A man aspiring to join this cohort, nicknamed Joe the Plumber, has put a face on a big issue in the presidential campaign: Whether it's fair or wise to raise taxes on the powerful job engine of America's corner stores, maintenance firms, and yes, plumbing contractors.

Glad to see those evil rich are going to get their comeuppance.
If you look at the non-partisan Center for Tax Policy chart, there's almost no change between $250k and $600k. Nice try, though.

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post #11 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:29pm
The thing is, the difference between McCain and Obama's tax plans is not that huge. It's not big or fundamental enough of a difference for one to be socialism and the other not. They're just different flavors, neither new, of the same kind of progressive income taxes America's had for a few decades now.

Tzu will agree and say he doesn't love either one, though, so that's nice.
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post #12 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:34pm
The right would have you believe two things:

1) The burden of all corporate tax increases rests on consumers and workers.

2) Corporate tax relief always benefits consumers and workers.

Even Arthur Laffer doesn't buy that. Speaking to income tax, I'm familiar the law of diminishing marginal utility. If you're lucky enough to be making 603,000 a year and you move to Ireland because you're fed up with this country, then you should probably piss off.
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post #13 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissZooey View Post
[/gracious winner]

Jesus...

Taxes. It's called taxes. It's not wealth distribution or socialism or anything else. It's making sure that the infrastructure and other resources and services that we need to run this country are actually funded. Don't try and pretend like someone who makes a quarter-mil a year is being persecuted. That's just offensive.

Moreover, I'm nauseated by this meme that's emerging on the right: namely, that recognizing our moral (moral) obligation to care for and tend to one another, whether that take the form of money or garden-variety tolerance, patience, and compassion, is somehow suspect and exclusively linked to socialism. The cognitive dissonance between this stance and the trumpeting of a repulsive, perverted, jingoistic strain of Christianity is enough to give me a headache. Or maybe that's all the champagne I drank last night when my right-thinking, fundamentally decent, compassionate, intelligent candidate won the Presidency. Of our country.

An aside to Devin - okay, yeah. That felt good.

[gracious winner]
Great, now even Zooey's gone rogue.
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post #14 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:42pm
No, no, no. I'm okay now. Just tired and kind of giddy, you betcha.



Wait.

What did I just say?
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post #15 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:43pm
You said you voted McCain by "accident", hence the splurge of alcohol.
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post #16 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:50pm
...and where did this "I <3 Karl Marx" button come from?!
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post #17 of 30
11/5/08 at 5:52pm
Look at your back in the mirror and find out!
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post #18 of 30
11/5/08 at 6:14pm
What a retarded argument.

a) $375,000/year is rich by any definition that matters.

b) He decided somewhere along the way he could support four frickin' kids.

c) If we traveled back in time and told Kwon's 14-year-old self "Look, you can work real hard and make $375k/year with Morgan Stanley and live in a nice house BUT you'll be taxed at a much higher rate than most, or you can take it realtively easy and make $32,000 a year as a construction foreman and maybe not be able to afford vacations (or an illness of any significant kind) BUT you'll pay much less in taxes than that sucker Richie Rich!" does anyone think Kwon's 14-year-old self would choose door number 2?
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post #19 of 30
11/5/08 at 6:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitch Leave View Post
How many doctors and attorneys marched in the streets protesting Obama's taxplans?
Or how many wannabe doctors like Tzu did the same?
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post #20 of 30
11/5/08 at 6:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by From the linked article~ View Post
She's saving $800 a month for the children's college fund and $4,000 a month for retirement.
I doubt she's going to suffer much as a result of the nominal change in her tax plan considering she can afford to sock away $4K a month for retirement.
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post #21 of 30
11/5/08 at 7:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Brasky View Post
I doubt she's going to suffer much as a result of the nominal change in her tax plan considering she can afford to sock away $4K a month for retirement.
What if thats what she absolutely needs to sock away in order to retire at the time she wanted while continuing to live the lifestyle she would like?

A decrease of $500-1,000/month in savings over a long time period (when you factor in an average 8% ROR) can have a significant effect on your ending balance.
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post #22 of 30
11/6/08 at 8:00pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan S~ View Post
Or how many wannabe doctors like Tzu did the same?
Yeah, it's weird how you never see productive members of society in the streets protesting shit. We're all too busy at our jobs. It's always college students and those who have nothing better to do than be rounded up by the local Leftist machine and be bussed into the protest that are taking to the streets to fight the man.

All the while, Atlas/Henry keeps things rolling along.
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post #23 of 30
11/6/08 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
Yeah, it's weird how you never see productive members of society in the streets protesting shit. We're all too busy at our jobs. It's always college students and those who have nothing better to do than be rounded up by the local Leftist machine and be bussed into the protest that are taking to the streets to fight the man.

Yes, thank God that could never happen.
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post #24 of 30
11/6/08 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
Yeah, it's weird how you never see productive members of society in the streets protesting shit. We're all too busy at our jobs. It's always college students and those who have nothing better to do than be rounded up by the local Leftist machine and be bussed into the protest that are taking to the streets to fight the man.

All the while, Atlas/Henry keeps things rolling along.
lol
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post #25 of 30
11/6/08 at 8:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
Yeah, it's weird how you never see productive members of society in the streets protesting shit.


Choose your next sarcasm wisely, fucker.
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post #26 of 30
11/6/08 at 8:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TzuDohNihm View Post
Yeah, it's weird how you never see productive members of society in the streets protesting shit. We're all too busy at our jobs. It's always college students and those who have nothing better to do than be rounded up by the local Leftist machine and be bussed into the protest that are taking to the streets to fight the man.

All the while, Atlas/Henry keeps things rolling along.
The productive?

I guess that was just poor and unfortunate wording. Or do you seriously want to imply that those how protest for higher wages, better working condition, higher minimum wages etc. are unproductive members of society?

But maybe it was indeed intentional since Atlas/Henry keep things rolling along. While others just leech the blood out of success.

ETA: Or just what Justin posted. Sometimes a picture does indeed say more than thousand words.
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post #27 of 30
11/6/08 at 9:59pm
If you make more money than me you deserve to pay more taxes than me. Period. And you'll never get me to shed a tear for you if you do.
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post #28 of 30
11/6/08 at 10:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Man Mundt View Post
If you make more money than me you deserve to pay more taxes than me. Period. And you'll never get me to shed a tear for you if you do.
They already do.

Thats the thing.
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post #29 of 30
11/6/08 at 10:43pm
This thread is too full of stupid...

Even for me.

I don't even care that that doesn't make sense.
Ladadtraasts
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post #30 of 30
11/6/08 at 11:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
They already do.

Thats the thing.

Too fuckin' bad. If it means they pay even more so I don't I am fine with that too. World's smallest violin and all that. And for the record, while I ain't rich I ain't exactly destitute.
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