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In an apparent attempt to one up the Republicans' support of Sarah Palin...

post #1 of 25
11/8/08 at 11:05am
Thread Starter 
...the Dems come up with an even worse idea.

http://www.augustreview.com/news_com...s_20081107104/

I would challenge anybody to come up with a thoughtful, valid reason why this would in any way be a good idea.
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post #2 of 25
11/8/08 at 11:58am
People are losing their 401k and IRA's anyway.

Quote:
GRAs would guarantee a fixed 3 percent annual rate of return, although later in her article Ghilarducci explained that participants would not “earn a 3% real return in perpetuity.” In place of tax breaks workers now receive for contributions and thus a lower tax rate, workers would receive $600 annually from the government, inflation-adjusted. For low-income workers whose annual contributions are less than $600, the government would deposit whatever amount it would take to equal the minimum $600 for all participants.
Good for the poor, shitty for the rich...but fuck em', they got money.
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post #3 of 25
11/8/08 at 11:59am
Double post....fuck you Internet Explorer!
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post #4 of 25
11/8/08 at 12:09pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheShadows View Post
People are losing their 401k and IRA's anyway.



Good for the poor, shitty for the rich...but fuck em', they got money.
1 bad year does not equal people losing their 401ks and IRAs.

Plus, why would you want a 3% fixed rate of return (that doesnt even keep up with CPI, much less what inflation actually is) when you can easily get an average rate of return of 8% by doing practically nothing?
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post #5 of 25
11/8/08 at 12:13pm
A professor testifying before a Congressional hearing about her ideas regarding retirement accounts hardly equates to "Congress is thinking about forcing your 401k into Social Security".
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post #6 of 25
11/8/08 at 1:11pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post
A professor testifying before a Congressional hearing about her ideas regarding retirement accounts hardly equates to "Congress is thinking about forcing your 401k into Social Security".
In the economy thread (somewhere) I referenced another link that had congressmen proposing the idea a few weeks ago.
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post #7 of 25
11/8/08 at 1:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
1 bad year does not equal people losing their 401ks and IRAs.

Plus, why would you want a 3% fixed rate of return (that doesnt even keep up with CPI, much less what inflation actually is) when you can easily get an average rate of return of 8% by doing practically nothing?
For the uninformed, "doing practically nothing" can be translated into "buying an index fund."

My 401(k) is down about 20%. Fortunately I don't need it for 25-30 years.
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post #8 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:12pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavez View Post
For the uninformed, "doing practically nothing" can be translated into "buying an index fund."

My 401(k) is down about 20%. Fortunately I don't need it for 25-30 years.
Indeed.

Index fund or a target date retirement fund, which is in pretty much every 401k these days.

1) Elect to have money invested into target date fund.

2) Go to sleep for 20 years.

3) Wake up and see an 8% annualized rate of return.

Everybodys a winner.
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post #9 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:12pm
As with the Fairness Doctrine, when the Democratic Party actually pursues it as something they try to achieve, I'll comment on it. But seriously, you're turning in to Sean Hannity.
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post #10 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:19pm
Since I am European I can´t really comment on this article and 401k´s and IRA´s since I know next to nothing about it.

But the source-site alone gives me the creeps. "Global warming is a lie to steal tax dollars", "The EU is really an evil empire"? Please. Whatever is written in that article I can´t take it seriously in that context.

Other than that, please continue raping one of the greatest and most influential socio-economical philosophies of the last centuries. Yeah, I am talking about Socialism.
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post #11 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheShadows View Post
Good for the poor, shitty for the rich...but fuck em', they got money.
That's pretty dumb. But, you'll never have any sort of money or success so I guess you don't have to worry about it.
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post #12 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:29pm
Exactly, Cordo. Exactly.

Now, give me your money.
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post #13 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:32pm
You misunderstand, Obama will give you his money.
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post #14 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:36pm
If he really wanted to be bold, he'd redistribute his campaign contributions.
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post #15 of 25
11/8/08 at 2:40pm
I think it would be fair to opt in or opt out. Not everybody wants their retirement in the hands of the geniuses on Wall Street (and not to forget Phil Gramm) to redistribute to their own Caymans' accounts. On the other hand, Closer is probably right about the "go to sleep for 20 years." But for comfort level alone, I think people should have the option of a totally safe SSA account. My sep-IRA is supposed to be very conservative and low risk but I still haven't looked at the balance since this whole things started.
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post #16 of 25
11/8/08 at 4:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by yt View Post
I think it would be fair to opt in or opt out. Not everybody wants their retirement in the hands of the geniuses on Wall Street (and not to forget Phil Gramm) to redistribute to their own Caymans' accounts. On the other hand, Closer is probably right about the "go to sleep for 20 years." But for comfort level alone, I think people should have the option of a totally safe SSA account. My sep-IRA is supposed to be very conservative and low risk but I still haven't looked at the balance since this whole things started.
Inside every 401k there is a cash/money market option.

Even that would on average earn more than the gubment would pay you.
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post #17 of 25
11/8/08 at 4:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by myk View Post
As with the Fairness Doctrine, when the Democratic Party actually pursues it as something they try to achieve, I'll comment on it. But seriously, you're turning in to Sean Hannity.
Its a slow news day.

Im grasping at straws here.
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post #18 of 25
11/9/08 at 1:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
Its a slow news day.

Im grasping at straws here.
In fairness to you, I was wrong in categorizing you as "turning in to Sean Hannity." That was unfair and inaccurate.

You're turning in to Rush Limbaugh:

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/11/09/...dia-shameless/

The LA Times listens to Limbaugh so I don't have to.
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post #19 of 25
11/9/08 at 2:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by myk View Post
In fairness to you, I was wrong in categorizing you as "turning in to Sean Hannity." That was unfair and inaccurate.

You're turning in to Rush Limbaugh:

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/11/09/...dia-shameless/

The LA Times listens to Limbaugh so I don't have to.
Yes, because Rush commented on the same story, he and I are obviously one in the same.
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post #20 of 25
11/9/08 at 2:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
Yes, because Rush commented on the same story, he and I are obviously one in the same.
It's not that you both commented on it. It's that you both commented on it in the same way, indicating that it was something the Dems are planning on doing without any evidence to support it.
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post #21 of 25
11/9/08 at 5:17pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by myk View Post
It's not that you both commented on it. It's that you both commented on it in the same way, indicating that it was something the Dems are planning on doing without any evidence to support it.
One of these days Ill dig through the economy thread and find the link posted in there.

I see what you mean, though.
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post #22 of 25
11/9/08 at 5:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
Inside every 401k there is a cash/money market option.

Even that would on average earn more than the gubment would pay you.
In the range of 4%.

Didn't somebody's money market just bust the buck? That's a bad sign, hopefully a one-time aberration.
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post #23 of 25
11/9/08 at 6:59pm
Again, just because a couple of Democratic Congressman may have mentioned this as a possibility doesn't make it party policy.
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post #24 of 25
11/9/08 at 9:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post
Again, just because a couple of Democratic Congressman may have mentioned this as a possibility doesn't make it party policy.
Exactly. This is just the latest paranoid right-wing meme trying to get traction. The house has hearings all the time on all sorts of bizarre shit. When a bill is crafted, we'll revisit this issue.
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post #25 of 25
11/9/08 at 10:41pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavez View Post
In the range of 4%.

Didn't somebody's money market just bust the buck? That's a bad sign, hopefully a one-time aberration.
Ya, the reserve money market busted the bucks for a short period of time.

I believe its only the second or third occurance in history. I may be wrong though.
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