Fuck Mike Hampton

Well, since he never really did any good anywhere else but the Astros where else?

Please. If he had to actually put in cheap service for massively disappointing seasons he'd be long dead before he paid the Rockies off and got to the Braves.

Well fuck, I guess we're completely out of the Peavy race now.

Didn't he get hurt this year warming up in the pen?

He'll still play in Houston as a Cub.

Another long year in Atlanta.

Good schools again in Houston, I guess.

He gets hurt wiping his ass after a shit.

I'd love to see a starts vs. $$$ statistic for Hampton after he came to Atlanta. Not even wins vs. $$$. Just starts. What do you guess, like $750k a start? Or more?

Wasn't he essentially Carl Pavano with a better pedigree?

Fret not Nick, looks like Vazquez is heading to Atlanta.

I like the idea of a team throwing away money on Hampton, as long as it isn't my team. Bonus, because the Astros are in the same division as the Brewers.

I honestly don't know what the Astros' "plan" is. Their farm system might be the worst in the majors, they're expensive, they're not young, and they probably have to dump salary. They probably won't be awful in 2009, but they're neither contending nor rebuilding.

You guys can have him. Maybe he'll fare better in the NL.

I believe the plan is called the "Ed Wade Special." Until Drayton figures out that his record attendance and the legions of cute girl fans with pink Astros caps mostly came from their boyfriends being excited in 2004/2005 when we were winning, then the 'Stros are fucked. Drayton expects a winner out there, and he won't completely rebuild as long as he can expect .500 or better.

Wade is going to patch this thing together as best he can for the next couple years, but Berkman and Roy aren't going to go for it. They might be hometown boys, but they don't want to lose. Basically, the Astros are going to piss away the prime years for Berkman, Oswalt, Carlos Lee, and Hunter Pence.

I mean look at those players. That's four all stars right there. Any team with four all stars and still this terrible has some BIG problems.

You're thinking of Carl Pavano, "The American Idle", who actually added 'buttock injury' to his list of accomplishments last year.

Agreed. The Astro's MO has and seemingly, always will be that as long as attendance is good they could give a shit about winning divisions. People really think bringing Clemens here was about winning when the truth is the 'Stros got lucky and that move worked out. Truth is that move was all about attendance.

I loved Hampton when he was healthy and making contributions, but to sign him now? Retarded. Be lucky you're not burdened with him Nick, his best days are LOOOOONG gone.

As a consolation prize you get Javier Vasquez. Just hope he never pitches past the 5th.

Oh, boo fucking hoo for the Braves.

As much as I dog the sCrubs, at least their fans show up for playoff games. Don't know the opponent or the score, but they're there.

Didn't they do two-for-one deals during the postseason not too long ago?

Do you have any evidence that this is the Astros MO? Because I hear that crap all the time on sports radio stations of fans calling and complaining that "Uncle Drayton" never spends and is just interested in the bottom line...but I haven't seen anyone give a convincing argument showing that to be the case. You say that the Clemens deal was just for attendance...how do you know that? It worked out pretty well for the Astros, on the field. They didn't win it all but he pitched damn well for them. Same with Randy Johnson back in '98. I just get tired of hearing this criticism of the team because to me it is knee-jerk reaction of people that long to be fans of the Yankees or Red Sox or Mets or any team that can spend willy-nilly because they have much more revenue.

Back on topic, I'm kind of excited for Hampton's return. He couldn't come back until now because Biggio finally retired so Craig wouldn't have to beat Bulldog's ass for sleeping with his wife. I don't expect much from the guy, but the way he ended last season with the Braves makes me think it isn't completely folly to think he could have half a season of decent starts.

Check the deals the Astros have made versus the people they have kept. You can disagree if you like but the Astros are a middle of the road team that make middle of the road moves. The fact that they hardly ever lock up any of the big names they sign should carry a little weight. I'm not sure why you're so offended by the premise that the team cares more about money than results, seeing as that's how most BUSINESSES are ran. And as far as "proving" anything, I don't have to prove shit to you. I'm in Houston just like you are and I see what team we field every year. I could give fuck all if you buy into my knee-jerk reaction or not.

Back on topic as well.....Signing Hampton, to me, is proof positive of the Astros MO. Let a guy go who is talented as hell, wait 6 or 7 years till he's washed up and useless, and sign him again.

Well, I don't get upset by the Astros being more about business than winning. I get upset by people claiming this as fact without giving any real evidence. I'm not sure why you got so upset by me asking you give reasons behind your opinion, but since you are obviously not interested in discussing it, I'll drop it.

And as for Mike Hampton, I don't know that there is any real evidence that we missed out on much of Hampton's prime years. I know he spent time in Colorado, which is career suicide for pitchers, typically, but who's to say he would have remained his old self had he stayed in Houston? The guy never really had dominating stuff, just good placement, for the most part.

Plus, and mind you I have no evidence backing this up, the rumor I always heard was that there was some infidelity between either Hampton and Biggio's wife, or Biggio and Hampton's wife and the players refused to be on the same team. Biggio being who he was, it was an easy decision who to trade. Probably BS, but I always thought it interesting if true.

I believe it was Hampton banging Biggio's wife. Might be reversed, but positive that there was someone's wife getting banged. And as for evidence that Drayton is behind attendance and playing to the fan's wallets instead of to smart baseball decisions, just look at Biggio.

I love Biggio to death, he's absolutely my favorite all time player...but he had no business being our every day 2nd baseman. Drayton squeezed every dime he could out of the chase to 3,000. By "committing" to Biggio just long enough to capitalize on the 3,000th hit we didn't pursue a decent 2nd baseman, and we continued to be an anemic offensive club. Any other evidence you need, well look at the fat contracts for veterans we have while having a complete shit farm system. This kills me, but the smart thing is keep two out of Berkman, Roy, Pence, and then start auctioning off contracts and rebuild the farm system. Accept 2-3 years of shit baseball, for another strong long term run. Instead the Astros will play mediocre ball, stay semi-competitive (.500), and Drayton will say "But I'm spending money!" and the fans will be too blind to see he is hurting the team.

This, and how many years and millions of dollars did the team fork over to Brad Ausmus? Granted Ausmus was, for a time, dominant defensively; however I don't believe he ever hit above .220 for any stretch of time. He was a detriment offensively and he was resigned for multiple years and multiple millions when Pudge Rodriguez was available. Could the 'Stros have landed Pudge? Probably not, but why sign Ausmus to that laughable contract if you intend to at least try?

Matt, I'm willing to discuss whatever you'd like, but it seems as if you are willing to ignore every minute detail by saying "Drayton has spent what he could." It's not about the amount spent but who he has spent it on. At least for me it is.

See: Yankees and lack of recent rings.

If I could interject something into this conversation here (as a former Houstonian), Drayton has spent what he could, while remaining loyal to those who helped build the modern system. Sure, he could have saved money by releasing some of the older members but these were people who helped build the Astros. You don't reward the people who were team builders by throwing them under the bus and retiring them. Biggio, Bagwell, et al. all earned the right to close out their careers with the Astros. They helped create/re-energize a club that was fun to watch (which IMHO is more imortant anyway, rather than buying a championship ring). That is what has earned Drayton and the Astros, the fan support they have enjoyed.

Biggio, Bagwell? Sure. Brad Ausmus, Hell no.

I wasn't really referring to Ausmus, more in general to the concept that Drayton runs the Astros like a business. IF he ran the club like a business, then he surely would have hacked his roster (cutting salary) to build up an upcoming young team. Instead it feels more like a family affair. As such, it appeals more to the families (and fans) in Houston. Thus his support from those families (and fans). Just my general thoughts.

Which then ties back to them signing Hampton, who got his start with this organization.

I never had a problem with the team hanging on to Bagwell and Biggio as long as they did. As HBarr mentioned, those guys were with the team for the duration. They helped bring the team into the long period of success it enjoyed during the 90's and early 2000's.

As for Ausmus, I must admit I always had a soft spot for the guy. Sure, he never hit for much (I believe he actually made the All-Star team one year he was in Detroit because he was hitting over .300 -- a fluke, though), but he was always good defensively and was renowned for being good with pitchers, both in calling a game and working with them. Unfortunately the team really hasn't had many prospects come up through their system that forced the team to supplant Bradley. Could they have gotten a guy like Pudge? Maybe. But depending on when he was available they might have felt, as I have, that he was well on the downside of his career and would likely end up as dead money on this team.

One major complaint I do have so far this offseason is the way that Wiggington has been handled. I don't necessarily think that he is the future at 3B for this team, but to non-tender him and get nothing for his value is ridiculous. They say they couldn't work out a trade, but I don't believe for a second that there weren't enough interested teams in a 800+ OPS third basemen with respectable defensive skills (okay, maybe a little below average, but not terrible). That smacked of a money move, to me. But overall, I can't think of too very many of those where there wasn't some aspect of baseball decision involved as well.

Wow, I'd figure you'd be happy about that. Let someone else worry about his puss-arm. He's shit. Total and complete shit.

And going to the perfect team.