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Polyamory and open relationships

post #1 of 83
Thread Starter 
I'm wondering what the Chewer consensus is with this, experiences, concerns, disapproval, etc. Currently, I'm married to a bisexual, polyamorous woman who I love to death, and the level of ease in our relationship in so many aspects compared to my monogamous relationships is nothing short of amazing, and it's harder to conceive putting the pressure of not allowing that woman to explore every emotional/sexual need she has and vice versa seem really selfish. Obviously, though, it doesn't stop people from staying monogamous.

Which brings me to a more specific question of how to broach the concept with someone who's strictly monogamous without setting off a red flag. The past two weeks, I've run into someone who might completely trash a budding, awesome friendship between us because she can't reconcile the fact that, despite the fact that we're attracted to each other, I'm okay with it not going any further, and another person who's going to have to be told at some point that we have been, and will probably continue to be emotionally and physically intimate with his new girlfriend.

Of course, if this is all too much, I'm sure I can find pictures of Jessica Alba in a bikini to make this thread fit in.
post #2 of 83
post #3 of 83
You're more evolved than I am, Justin. I don't want to greenlight another man ramming my wife, much less bear witness to it.
post #4 of 83
I feel like I have some insight into this as a gay man, since there seems to be a large percentage of us homos who don't adhere to the strict rules of monogamy.

I think that whatever works for you, works for you. I've been in a relationship that was strictly monogamous, a relationship that crashed thanks to both of us cheating with others, and a more open relationship. The open relationship was by far the least complicated and least dramatic of the bunch, but the key to it being a success was communication. You have to be comfortable enough with your partner to be completely open and honest about your wants and desires, which isn't always easy to do. I do feel that being able to say "hey, I'd love to fuck that person" ultimately leads to a more honest relationship, because we all have those thoughts at some point, even if we never act on them.

I personally find the idea of settling down with one person and never sexing it up with another to be depressing and limiting, but maybe I'm just overly horny.
post #5 of 83
Half a year ago, I came out of a pretty long relationship with a lovely woman. We both had sex with other people if the opportunity arose. We didn't actively pursue it, but if it happened, it happened. No harm, no foul.

Just don't tell people who you think couldn't handle it. What's the problem?
post #6 of 83
I'm with Phil. I am way too jealous to share my partner with someone else. But i completely respect others opinions on the matter.

And this thread is going to devolve into idiots posting idiot stuff like Scratch.
post #7 of 83
While were on the whole primate thing...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpYYblAJOq8
post #8 of 83
Well, sexuality is a very individual thing. We're like snowflakes! After experimenting with various one night stands, threesomes and other kinky situations I've discovered that I'm pretty much as straight and monogamous as can be. However, I have friends who are more the polyamorous type and that's just fine and dandy too.

I think when you're in a situation where you're dealing with multiple lovers and partners the important thing is total honesty.

Quote:
The past two weeks, I've run into someone who might completely trash a budding, awesome friendship between us because she can't reconcile the fact that, despite the fact that we're attracted to each other, I'm okay with it not going any further, and another person who's going to have to be told at some point that we have been, and will probably continue to be emotionally and physically intimate with his new girlfriend.
That last part really really doesn't sound good. Why has nobody told this poor guy what's going on yet? What if he isn't okay with it? Why in the hell would you ever ever get into a relationship with someone without bringing up the fact that you enjoy fucking other people on a regular basis and are you okay with that? That seems like an important thing to say right from the get-go, before you ever even kiss.

There's nothing wrong with sleeping with multiple partners in theory as long as all parties involved know what's going on and are cool with it, but when it's behind someone's back and there are secrets and lies going on then that's cheating, and it's a horrible thing to do to someone.
post #9 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werewolf Girl View Post
That last part really really doesn't sound good. Why has nobody told this poor guy what's going on yet? What if he isn't okay with it? Why in the hell would you ever ever get into a relationship with someone without bringing up the fact that you enjoy fucking other people on a regular basis and are you okay with that? That seems like an important thing to say right from the get-go, before you ever even kiss.

There's nothing wrong with sleeping with multiple partners in theory as long as all parties involved know what's going on and are cool with it, but when it's behind someone's back and there are secrets and lies going on then that's cheating, and it's a horrible thing to do to someone.
Yeah, sounds like his girlfriend really dropped the ball there. If I were Justin or his wife, I'd be pretty hands-off until this woman comes clean to her boyfriend.
post #10 of 83
I have nothing to add here except that communication is key and what everyone else has said.

Also, I laughed at the picture. If only because I heard his voice as soon as I saw it.
post #11 of 83
What everyone else says. But I would also recommend what Dan Savage says.
post #12 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Clark View Post
The past two weeks, I've run into someone who might completely trash a budding, awesome friendship between us because she can't reconcile the fact that, despite the fact that we're attracted to each other, I'm okay with it not going any further, and another person who's going to have to be told at some point that we have been, and will probably continue to be emotionally and physically intimate with his new girlfriend.

After reading your post, and the description of your marriage, I'm inclined to respond to your thread. While I personally have never been involved with polyamory, I'll pretty much fall in line with the others because of this little proviso... people will do what they will do, regardless of other people's opinions.

I will, however, add this... and let me be as clear as I possibly can.

Tread with fucking caution.

In situations like this, people will get overly emotional. I understand everyone is saying "communicate", and "be honest"... but there is a bit more to it than that.

These are primal emotions you are dealing with here. Most people, however liberal and open in their sexual preferences they may think they are, are not able to deal with what they may view as a betrayal. Your relationship works for you and your wife, and that is wonderful for you both... but some may not see your lifestyle with the same eyes as you do.

When I was stationed overseas, one of my comrades became involved in a relationship like this with a local man and his wife. He told me about it, and I advised caution. He went on and on about how this woman's husband would let him violate six colors of shit out of her, and not say a word about it.

Suffice it is to say, after several months, he became the alpha male in the relationship... effectively turning the husband cuckold. The husband then killed his wife, my friend, then himself. And not in a very nice way, either... knives were involved. Say what you will about civilians attacking trained soldiers, but I'm sure even an accomplished fighter would not be able to stop an attack from a furious husband. My friend certainly couldn't.

Justin, you have every right to tell me to blow my opinion out my ass... but just be careful.

Sometimes it's better to just walk away.
post #13 of 83
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luca S. View Post
Just don't tell people who you think couldn't handle it. What's the problem?
OK, to go into more detail, first situation, this other woman and I had been talking extensively/flirting for a little while, she obviously had an interest, and I had to say something before that went anywhere further. But we get along way too well to not want to at least be friends if that's what it came down to. At first it was no big deal, but we haven't talked in two weeks, and apparently, it's because she thinks the whole poly thing will prevent us having an organic friendship. And I'm kinda grasping at straws at how to approach the situation from here, because I would really just hate to lose her as a friend this early.

Second situation: my wife and I are both extremely close with a woman who's gotten into this whirlwind romance with a guy who's just left his ex-wife, and is apparently convinced he's going to get her to settle down, get pregnant, and drive across the country in his truck (yeah, you read that right) within the next 6 months or so. While there's many things about this guy that set off my facepalm reflex, they're both blissfully happy outside of this, more power to 'em. But at the same time, the emotional/physical intimacy between the three of us (and many of the people in her life, really) is extremely important and strong. The situation's been brought up and explained in detail, and while he's said, very calmly, that he's okay with it, even when confronted about it later, he's still very jealous and possessive whenever someone has so much as a deep conversation with her that doesn't involve him, and he seems to be moving forward with the idea that that'll all change when he moves in. Though he's apparently still okay with the idea of her having guilt-free sex with my wife. And none of us are exactly sure how to explain this respectfully without making it seem like either of us have a mind on making him feel like an outcast (he's doing a good job of that by himself, but thats neither here or there), or that any of us is stopping him from being with the person he loves.

He's coming this weekend to spend time with her, and at some point, all four of us are having dinner to discuss this, among other things. But for the first time, I'm just not sure the tone to strike, what to say to truly hammer this home, since I'm apparently the one out of the four of us who's good at confrontation. But these two situations are the first time I've *had* to truly justify this to someone who didn't automatically get it right off the bat, and I'm drawing a blank.
post #14 of 83
Polyamory question aside (I have no problem with it, in fact I often feel like I lean that way myself), I know from some experience that many people, while they might not condemn open relationships, CERTAINLY can't live with them.

EDIT: because "condone" doesn't mean the same as "condemn"
post #15 of 83
Both me and Carly are bisexual, so the temptation for decadent Roman orgies has been there, but we'd both be way too jealous for it to work out. We know some folks who are polyamorous, and that's cool that it works for them.

One thing: What about when/if kids become involved? Do you continue this way? How does that affect them?
post #16 of 83
I've never been involved in any, but I've known a fair amount of people who have (maybe a dozen). About half of them are still together but have stopped and switched to monogamy, and the other half have gotten divorced/broken up.

As far as general concerns, I think I agree with most other people here. I could never do it myself, but if everyone is being honest, it isn't any of my concern.

The two problems that seem to arise are with:
1) Not telling the whole truth.
2) Basic psychological concerns (even if a person thinks they are ok with it, or are trying to be ok with it, there can still be negative ramifications).

Now, in this specific case, it seems (and none of us really know what this guy is going through, but based on what you've said, it seems) that this guy is dead set on a long-term relationship (monogamous) that will start soon. He is obviously fooling himself, and at this point, I think it is probably unfair of your friend to continue leading him on. It seems that everyone knows how this will end up except him (that is with this fling lasting for a few more months perhaps, and then him leaving out of frustration or her dumping him as he gets too clingy for her).

Although there doesn't seem to be any real lies being told, this guy is being led on which probably isn't fair.

Also, worst case scenario, the explosion when he realizes things won't be going his way will likely only be worse the longer he gets led on.
post #17 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Clark View Post
Second situation: my wife and I are both extremely close with a woman who's gotten into this whirlwind romance with a guy who's just left his ex-wife, and is apparently convinced he's going to get her to settle down, get pregnant, and drive across the country in his truck (yeah, you read that right) within the next 6 months or so. While there's many things about this guy that set off my facepalm reflex, they're both blissfully happy outside of this, more power to 'em. But at the same time, the emotional/physical intimacy between the three of us (and many of the people in her life, really) is extremely important and strong. The situation's been brought up and explained in detail, and while he's said, very calmly, that he's okay with it, even when confronted about it later, he's still very jealous and possessive whenever someone has so much as a deep conversation with her that doesn't involve him, and he seems to be moving forward with the idea that that'll all change when he moves in. Though he's apparently still okay with the idea of her having guilt-free sex with my wife. And none of us are exactly sure how to explain this respectfully without making it seem like either of us have a mind on making him feel like an outcast (he's doing a good job of that by himself, but thats neither here or there), or that any of us is stopping him from being with the person he loves.
I'm no Dan Savage, and this is probably not the solution you want to hear, but sounds to me like either she's got to break up with the guy or you and your wife should commit to not being intimate with his girlfriend. It's pretty obvious that if she's not monogamous with him, he's going to flip out eventually, and it shouldn't be your problem.
post #18 of 83
It's really something that I have never actually dealt with this stuff. Can't say if that's sad or not. I am really on the outside looking in.
post #19 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdHocken View Post
It's really something that I have never actually dealt with this stuff. Can't say if that's sad or not. I am really on the outside looking in.
Yeah, besides having fun with a few girls casually while I wasn't in a serious relationship, I feel a bit like I'm watching the Walken/Ferrell/Dratch SNL skit "The Lovers: Patio".
post #20 of 83
I agree.
post #21 of 83
My main curiosity about open relationships has always been how they get started. Who brings it up? How does that conversation go? Does it come up on the first date? Where do poly singles find other poly singles to form a "main" relationship, or whatever you'd call it? Are there poly dating sites?

These things vex me. But then I've been married for 11 years and am therefore easily vexed.
post #22 of 83
Well, mine came about when I found someone I really, really wanted to sleep with. I brought it up with the boyfriend and basically asked his permission, then we discussed it from there. However, this was after we had been together for years, and I knew from various conversations that he probably wouldn't freak out and dump me over the idea.
post #23 of 83
I would think it could also come up when getting to know someone. We've all had those, "so what have you tried conversations" (I hope). Coupled with the inevitable "so is there anything that you haven't tried that you would like to try conversations."
post #24 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supremo View Post
Well, mine came about when I found someone I really, really wanted to sleep with. I brought it up with the boyfriend and basically asked his permission, then we discussed it from there. However, this was after we had been together for years, and I knew from various conversations that he probably wouldn't freak out and dump me over the idea.
That would probably be the best way to go. It stands to reason that a fairly new relationship would not stand up to a situation like this.
post #25 of 83
Thread Starter 
My wife and I met on OKCupid of all places. She mentioned she was poly was in her profile, but at the time, it had always been a concept I would throw around in the back of my mind but I was convinced it could never work in practice. I was accepting of the fact that she might still want to be with other people, and I was cool with that, but regardless, she decided to try and be monogamous with me.

Fast forward a few months of domestic bliss, we discuss it sporadically, but always in depth, and over time, it occurs to me that she pretty much lives up to my concept of what a poly relationship could be. She's willing to communicate, her priority is to her primary relationship first and foremost, everybody involved should know what the situation is, etc. She basically convinced me it could work, we had a long conversation laying some ground rules, making sure our relationship was strong enough to sustain anything that might happen, and that was it.

Not that much changes. We haven't actively gone out to pick someone up or something like that, but coming across people already in our lives who were more open that we initially thought has been fascinating to watch unfold. And the best thing in the world is realizing with all that can and has happened, afterward, she's usually the first one to call and say she can't wait to cuddle up with me at the end of the night.
post #26 of 83
What Dave said. It sounds like this guy is going to flip his fucking wig.
post #27 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake View Post
What Dave said. It sounds like this guy is going to flip his fucking wig.
Yep.
post #28 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Clark View Post
Though he's apparently still okay with the idea of her having guilt-free sex with my wife.
This is almost hilariously typical. Whenever we found a chick that was interested, she'd have a boyfriend who was all "NUH-UH (but the girl can fuck with us, that'd be cool I guess)".
post #29 of 83
I suspect, based on the people I've known in these situations that "I want to be in an open relationship" really means "I want to fuck around because you bore me, but I don't want to end our relationship because I'm afraid of being alone, or our relationship happens to be really convenient" and "I'm okay with an open relationship" really means "I'm totally not going to take advantage of this new agreement, but I'm also afraid of being alone".

If this is not the case then I'm fine with the concept.
post #30 of 83
If being polyamorous and/or having an open relationship fulfills you both and makes you stronger as a couple, then go for it. You will know in your heart whether or not it's right for you. Don't judge what YOU do as a couple based upon what anyone else does; it's YOUR business.

I took care of the 'two chicks at once' thing long before I met my wife, and I really don't have any nagging unfulfilled fantasies that prevent me from focusing on my wife when we're together. We chose to commit to each other and we're sticking with it. That's OUR relationship, and changing it to an open one is really not an option
post #31 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Clark View Post
we had a long conversation laying some ground rules
"Okay, first things first, you can't come inside her. If you come ON her, you have to be calling her a bitch at the same time."
"Would you accept 'daughter' as a substitute to 'bitch'?"
"Veto"
"Okay, 'bitch' it is. You can sleep with a black guy if you want, but he has to look or sound like either Samual L. Jackson, Terrence Howard or Mike Tyson."
"That just goes without saying. What are your feelings on ass to mouth?"
"Is the orifice clean beforehand or not?"
"I'm usually pretty drunk for ass to mouth."
"Veto"
"Okay, let's talk about midgets."

Sorry for the joking. I, like others in this thread, have absolutely NO experience with this and wouldn't begin to know what advice to give. But I have seen a lot of porno.
post #32 of 83
I'm kinda not sure the point of making the commitment of marriage then, besides taxes, etc. "... to forsake all others... until opportunities arise..." Not judging, just don't know what the point is. I'd think divorce would be more rampant in these kinds of situations. Therefore, marriage would be an inconvenience.
post #33 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake View Post
What Dave said. It sounds like this guy is going to flip his fucking wig.
Agreed. Obviously, there's a lot I/we can't read because we're not there in the flesh, but sounds like you've got a time bomb on your hands. And it's not his fault, really, because like it or not, your situation is a rare one and something most people can't handle.

And it sounds like, based on the info you've given, that he really is crazy about the girl and doesn't want to run her off, yet really doesn't like the shit she's doing.
post #34 of 83
A friend of mine had an open marriage and they had agreed that they would pick up people together. It worked fine if they had a threesome with a chick. But if she wanted a dude, not really. But she could have sex with another guy, if they picked up a couple and he could sleep with the chick. The problem became when the chick in the couple that he wanted to sleep with was more interested in my friend. Needless to say, they are divorced.

As someone who's been the third in a threesome, I found it enjoyable. But if I were part of the couple, I don't know that I would. Too much stuff like the above to work out. Good luck, Justin. That's all I can say. Any advice we give should take the back seat to good communication between you and your wife (which it seems you have).
post #35 of 83
Ive got friends in open relationships (two best friends in particular) and while I don't think I would be able to do it personally (my partner and I are just monogomous by nature really), am completely cool and respectful of those who can.

But Justin, Ive got to be honest, in regards to this guy in your second scenario, the 'time-bomb' comment being chucked around here seems spot on to me mate - he's going to go off - and sooner rather than later if he's already saying he's going to spirit your friend away in his truck in less than 6 months.

I hate to be vouyeristic, but I'd love to hear how this weekend dinner turns out.
post #36 of 83
Whatever gets you through the night, Justin, it's all right.

But I'll echo what everyone else is saying here - the second story is not going to end well. The warning signs on that one are about 45' high in letters of fire. My biggest concern is something happening along the lines of Lima Oscar Lima's friend; best of luck with you and everyone at your dinner this weekend, but keep your guard up and wits about you, and either you and your wife or the girlfriend is going to have to set this guy straight ASAP.

As to your other friend, if she's not into your lifestyle, don't bring it up. Since you haven't talked to her in two weeks, talk about something else, unless she brings it up first, then you can fill her in some more, and who knows? Eventually she might be interested in joining you and your wife. I'd watch the flirting a bit, just in case - it might make her uncomfortable or put her in a weird position.

Hate to go back to my life now... seems so damn boring.
post #37 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy225 View Post

Hate to go back to my life now... seems so damn boring.
I hear ya Tim, I just have the problem of not getting enough of regular sex.
post #38 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdHocken View Post
I hear ya Tim, I just have the problem of not getting enough of regular sex.
What, with you rockin' David Tennant's look? The hell you say.
post #39 of 83
As long as everyone is upfront about it I really can't see a problem with a couple having multiple partners.
post #40 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy225 View Post
What, with you rockin' David Tennant's look? The hell you say.
That's only on *ahem* special occasions
post #41 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdHocken View Post
That's only on *ahem* special occasions

Riiiiiiiight...

Do you find it difficult to walk correctly?

You know... with all the women hanging on your legs?


Ok... back on topic!

Threesomes rock! But only with people that you are definately sure can't take you in a fight!
post #42 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lima Oscar Lima View Post
Riiiiiiiight...

Do you find it difficult to walk correctly?

You know... with all the women hanging on your legs?
From what I hear, Ed can knock on and open a door from five feet away. At least according to what one reads on the bathroom stalls.

Anywho, threesomes... good! Fire ... BAD!
post #43 of 83
My girlfriend and I would be waaaay too jealous of the other. Also, something that troubles me about polyamory is what happens when your girlfriend starts fucking the other dude more than you? What if she starts to like him more and breaks up with you? He satisfies her in every way, and even slightly better than you.

I think that's the most common thing I've seen happen in those types of relationships. The people act all fine with it...then one of them actually talks about what happened and the other person gets insecure. I guess it could only work if they were one night stands and they never talked about it.

In the relationship before the one with me, my gf's ex made her have a polyamorous relationship with him because he wanted to do this other chick AND because he figured she wouldn't get any other dudes because she loved him. Then the moment when she liked some other guy, he freaked and told her she couldn't, but still said that he could do the other chick. He was an asshole.

I'm convinced half of these open relationships are based around wanting to get some strange ass. I don't count threesomes though because you're teaming up on someone and you're getting it equally. If you're doing other people alone then it's a little different.
post #44 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radb707 View Post
My girlfriend and I would be waaaay too jealous of the other. Also, something that troubles me about polyamory is what happens when your girlfriend starts fucking the other dude more than you? What if she starts to like him more and breaks up with you? He satisfies her in every way, and even slightly better than you.
Yeah. Call me old-fashioned, but my heart would not be warmed by a text from my life-partner, covered in another man's seed & sweat, saying she can't wait to come home and cuddle with me. That's an awful-sounding consolation prize.* I'd change the locks.



*from where I'm sitting. Not judging you if you're legitimately making it work.
post #45 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdHocken View Post
I hear ya Tim, I just have the problem of not getting enough of regular sex.
I've never understood this. I'm no Adonis, but I could always find someone (if I was in the mood). Are your standards to high? By the way, I don't mean this as a slight. Genuinely curious.
post #46 of 83
HBarr, you're a gay male, correct? Or am I misremembering?
post #47 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil View Post
Yeah. Call me old-fashioned, but my heart would not be warmed by a text from my life-partner, covered in another man's seed & sweat, saying she can't wait to come home and cuddle with me. That's an awful-sounding consolation prize.* I'd change the locks.
Gah! I'd do the same thing.
post #48 of 83
Especially covered in "another man's seed and sweat...".

Thanks, Phil... wonderful imagery.

:: throws up a little in mouth ::
post #49 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by HBarr View Post
I've never understood this. I'm no Adonis, but I could always find someone (if I was in the mood). Are your standards to high? By the way, I don't mean this as a slight. Genuinely curious.
Huh. I read his comment as "I never get bored with it" rather than "I can't get any," but I guess it works both ways... like so many things in this thread. *rimshot*
post #50 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveB View Post
Huh. I read his comment as "I never get bored with it" rather than "I can't get any," but I guess it works both ways... like so many things in this thread. *rimshot*

BOO!

:: throws a tomato ::
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