The Star Trek Thread - Page 42

I liked the Cardassian makeup. From a biological perspective, I thought the neck bones helped to protect from serious injury to vital arteries. Seemed to make sense to me. I wish we had gotten stranger aliens, or less obvious face appliance aliens.

Matt H indeed listed the greatest hits. I'd add Journey To Babel and The Menagerie but there are a lot of less "popular" episodes which hold up. Like Greg, I need to look them up.

Anyone pining for a 30 minute version should be forced to watch the cartoon.

Season 2 is my favorite. I feel like its the most consistent quality-wise and it really is a solid mix of sci-fi adventure and solid character melodrama.

Season 3 starts off really rough and then straightens out by the end.

I remember really liking Whom Gods Destroy.

No season that ends in Turnabout Intruder can be said to have "straightened" out.

Phil, I agree with The Menagerie as being of pretty high quality, especially given that it was a money-saving show. I just can't get behind your enthusiasm for Journey to Babel.

Journey To Babel is another "money saver", as it takes place totally on the Enterprise. It's one of the few episodes to show you the Federation's various alien races (and they seem to all hate each other), it's a murder mystery, and it gives good trinity (Kirk/Spock/McCoy). The dynamic between Spock and his mom is touching (and that had a ripple effect all the way to the Abrams movie). It's the TV edition of Star Trek VI.

If you quit around episode seven, you just missed "The Corbomite Maneuver", which is a solid season one episode. But if you didn't like the first seven, which had some winners, maybe you wouldn't love it. "The Conscience of the King" is underrated season one for my money, and of course "Space Seed" is Khantastic.

Season 3 is an easy target, but "Day of the Dove" and "The Enterprise Incident" and are standouts.

This.

I'd add "A Piece of the Action", "The Enemy Within" and "The Tholian Web" to a greatest hits of TOS list. The McCoy/Spock stuff in TOS is really good.

I'd add in "The Changeling" and "Space Seed," just for the added dimension they give to the first two films (the first as obvious inspiration, if not template; the second as prelude). Not that they're not good episodes on their own.

"Devil in the Dark," as well.

A Really? You wouldn't say that the 2nd half of season 3 is largely better than the 1st half? I mean, its an episodic show. One crappy ep does not really mean as much as a string of crappy eps. I agree that its not a particularly great episode, especially for a finale-- which would mean more if this was a serilized show. But since it isn't I don't think previous post was that off. I mean the DVD extras talk about how thenetwork derailed the crew and writing staff as season 3 opened. Then they eased off of the writers after the network's changes didn't help the show's ratings.

I don't see that borne out here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...2.80.931969.29

The best episodes are in the first half (though the series opens with "Spock's Brain"), and the second half is bogged down by quite a bit of crap. And space hippies.

Fair enough. Looking over the episode list, it looks like the crap is pretty spread out evenly throughout the season. Not that difficult a feat since the 3rd season isn't as strong as 2, imho.

But for some reason that I haven't quite sussed out, I really didn't like some of the boner eps at the beginning of the season. "Paradise Syndrome" and "Spectre of the Gun" really don't work for me. They feel like Trek trying to be a different show. Of course all that is arguably balanced out by "The Enterprise Incident" and "Is There No Truth In Beauty?" both of which are very good.

But the back half of season 3 has "Requiem for Methuselah" and "Whom Gods Destroy" both of which are some of my favorite Trek episodes. There are some other solid episodes that aired around then. "Wink of an Eye", which I dug, sorta marks the beginning of the back half. Space hippies are silly, but those kinds of things fit well within Trek's wheelhouse. It's when the show felt like it was apologizing for it's weirdness that it got under my skin so to speak.

Perhaps part of my appreciation for some of season 3's lows come from how unbelievably campy it got at times. "Turnabout Intruder" is not a notable finale, but it gets points from me for Shatner going full-on woman, and the guest actress doing a surprisingly convincing Kirk. Even "Spock's Brain" is just weird as fuck and the image of DeForest Kelly hovering and sweating over that med panel is burned into my retinas.

Yeah, I won't pretend that "Spock's Brain" isn't a lot of fun to watch. "A CHILD could do it...a CHILD!"

Okay, so now that I'm home, I can look through the episode list and pull my favorites:

Season One
The Naked Time
The Corbomite Maneuver
Balance of Terror (A rare worthy adversary for Kirk when it comes to Captaining)
The Galileo Seven (Yes, the monsters are cheesy, but it's all about throwing a group of people into a pressure cooker, so I forgive that)
Space Seed (Because, hey, Khan)
The City on the Edge of Forever

Season Two
Amok Time (origin of the iconic "Kirk fight music" that is now my ringtone)
Mirror, Mirror (The cast has a great time with this)
The Doomsday Machine
I, Mudd (Because it's completely insane)
The Trouble With Tribbles
A Piece of the Action (These last three episodes are the "comedy trifecta" of the series)

Season Three
The Enterprise Incident

Yes, that's really it for season three. Sad.

I enjoyed "All Our Yesterdays", especially the idea of being able to go back in time through the planet's history to live out your days rather than stay in the current year and be killed due to the impending supernova.

The interaction between Spock and McCoy was great, especially great as Spock "devolves" into his more animal self. It was certainly relevant that Kirk would be accused as being a witch considering the circumstances. I liked it.

Plus, while not in the 3rd season, I have a soft spot for "Shore Leave". I can't imagine what would pop up if some supercomputer read my mind and produced what I was thinking. Probably the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.

The third season may have the worst episodes in the series, but it actually has about as many episodes in it that I really like as season 2. For example, "Elaan of Troyus", "Whom Gods Destroy", "The Tholian Web", "Day of the Dove", and "Turnabout Intruder". Those were mostly episodes that I liked for how fun and campy they were. They're not like the great season 1 and 2 episodes that work as superior drama, but they were entertaining. I don't know why people hate "Turnabout Intruder" so much. I guess it's a little sexist, but it's SO funny! I always love seeing Shatner play an evil over-the-top maniac on "Star Trek".

Nobody's mentioned "What Are Little Girls Made Of?", which is easily one of my favorites.

P.S. Dang, Plinkett's put some work into this one!

"Star Trek: the... Star Trek".

Plinkett is on point as usual.

So apparently the lovely and talented Jess Fink has been making blog comics of TNG episodes and I only just now found out:

http://jessfink.com/StarTrek/9_Unification_p2.jpg

watched a bit of First Contact last night (it was on HDNet or something like that) and say what you will about the flick but above all the score is just so damned great.

How did this thread let the anniversary of Star Trek's debut go unmentioned?

Just busy I guess....I assume it's too late for Flowers?

Yep, she already dumped us.

shit

Netflix Instant has the Director's Edition of Star Trek: The Motion Picture in HD. I was convinced that particular cut of the film would never be remastered for HD, but there it is. Anybody know if they actually re-worked the new effects? Or did they just do an HD remaster on SD effects work?

Are you sure? The cover illustration they're using is the Director's Edition.

Huh. They should probably fix that. And the cover illustration.

In fact, with all the multiple versions of films that are running about these days, there needs to be some kind of notation about which version they're streaming.

I swore I read at the Bits that Paramount was working on mastering the effects for HD for TMP DC

I hope so. It's a pretty big improvement.

I have to disagree. I think TMP: DE takes a few steps forward, a few steps sideways and yes, a few steps back. That means it's kind of wandering around, disoriented, much like Robert Wise in his later years.

I think the new Vulcan matte paintings are nice. The revised version of V'Ger's second plasma weapon attack on the Enterprise is great. And the Enterprise's reflection over Kirk's smitten face as he approaches in the shuttle is lovely. But seeing demystifying full shots of the V'Ger ship and that super-cheesy bridge that V'Ger builds to the saucer section don't quite do justice to the majestic work of Trumbull and Dykstra. And while some of the trims work, I hate the omissions of Kirk saying "viewer off" a second time or "Oh my god" after the transporter accident.

I'm thrilled to have the Theatrical Cut on Blu-ray, as that's the version I grew up with. But ideally, it would have been nice to have it branched with the Director's Edition to make everybody happy.

I can take or leave the new effects work. But the new edit makes the film flow better, and feels like it's more focused on the characters.

I can kind of buy that argument, even though I never had a problem with the film's languid pace, especially thanks to Goldsmith's dreamy score. But if you're talking about cutting for character, the new cut adds fat like that awkward discussion with the bridge crew after Kirk heads off to confront Decker and that silly bit with Spock crying...but then deletes those other two far more revealing character moments I previously mentioned.

Another completely cosmetic change I absolutely hate: Those tacky gold titles with annoying blur-solves between them.

I will certainly agree there. The simple white-on-black was much classier.

The DC clearly makes the film into the story of Spock struggling with and finally accepting his human side.

Doesn't that make The Search for Spock and The Voyage Home massively disappointing though? Because if TMP and Wrath of Khan are about Spock's acceptance of his humanity, then surely having him be reborn and be seemingly more Vulcan than ever in those later films sort of eradicate that character development?

Yes, it does. I really wish they'd left Spock dead sometimes. As enjoyable as the later films were, they never really hit the character stuff as well as the first two films did. Basically, Spock's entire arc had been leading up to him telling Kirk "I have been and always shall be your friend." In regards to his human half, he's gone from contempt to confusion to acceptance, and in that final moment he's finally at peace with both halves of his nature -- he did the logical thing in sacrificing himself, and the emotional thing in his goodbye to Kirk. But after his rebirth, he seems oblivious of his dual heritage, or at least not at all conflicted by it, which, while not forcing us to watch a repeat of the exact same arc, sort of robs the character of his alienness.

See, I don't think he's "more Vulcan than ever" after the rebirth, at least not for very long. Once he gets his bearings in Voyage Home, he's much more human in V and VI.

It’s been a while (probably a decade) since I’ve watched most of the Original Trek films. I just remember Spock doing the weird test on Vulcan in Voyage Home where he’s perplexed by it asking him “How do you feel?”.

I also remember him and Sybok both representing different parts of that duality in Final Frontier. With Sybok being the emotional, almost utterly human, counterpoint to Spock’s more mannered and logical approach.

I took Spock's confusion at that question less about the illogic of it and more about its sudden unexpected appearance after a series of fact-based questions. Besides, by the end of the film, he's telling Sarek, "Tell her I feel fine." It seems like he made the journey in the course of that film.

And in Frontier, while Spock seems reserved compared to the over-the-top Sybok, he's still miles more laid back than he was previously.

I think I might just be misremembering then. Aside from Khan and Undiscovered Country I’ve not seen any of those films since I was 10 or 11 years old. I should probably give them another go on Blu-Ray.

Well, he has that awful pun at the beginning of Final Frontier ("I don't think you appreciae the gravity of your situation"), he gets downright furious at Valeris in Undiscoverd Country, and at the end of that film has that winking, "If I were human, I believe my response would be, 'Go the hell.' If I were human."

Granted, he wasn't totally stone-faced in the TV series, but the humor was of a more condescending "Oh you silly humans" sort. But when you consider he was ready to totally purge himself of all human emotions at the beginning of the first film and by the end of Khan he's all but telling Kirk he loves him, that's a much more satisfying arc than what we got after his birth.

Yeah, Post-III Spock is less half-human/half-Vulcan and more just a quirky pal. But one could argue that he was that way in II, as well. Spock was pretty straightforward and uncomplicated following the conclusion of TMP, no matter how dramatic the events unfolding around him were. It's just that the events of II were very dramatic and the personal stakes so much higher.

If anything, Kirk is the one with the internal baggage to sort out over all seven of his films. With the exception of IV, Jim's got a lot of emotional and psychological shit to resolve, mostly involving his fear of death.

In STV:tFF, Spock directly addresses the fact that he's not the same person that Sybok once knew. He's grown and he's accepted his human nature. Indeed, he's EMBRACED his human nature by this point.

In VI, Spock alludes to his regeneration and implies that the experience literally made him a different person physically and psychologically. I posted this earlier in the thread, but the old Spock would not have been so comfortable in his humanity as to display a Chagall in his quarters. And the bit where he claims Sherlock Holmes as "an ancestor of mine" may be Meyer at his literary worst, but it's also Spock acknowledging his human roots.

I posted earlier in this thread that I wish the TOS movies stopped at Wrath of Khan because I felt the essential arcs of both Kirk and Spock are resolved at the end of that film.

But the discussion of "post regeneration Spock" has me thinking..though not as dramatically satisfying (to me), the post WoK films (and Spock's appearance in STNG) are true to life. Post Heart Attack and coma recoverees are often quite different than in terms of outlook and personality post-trauma. They have simply gained a new outlook on existence, and perhaps we see that in Spock. At least, I think Nimoy is smart enough to bring that perspective to his portrayal

I have been reading the 1989 DC Comics Star Trek series of late, and mostly I find it entertaining though there are bizarre even disturbing moments such as this, which brings closure to Scotty and Uhura's Star Trek V romance... or does it?