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STAR TREK Post Release Discussion: The Reboot

post #1 of 1136
Thread Starter 
post #2 of 1136
I've been waiting for this review. Thank you. It sounds fun. I can't wait to see it.
post #3 of 1136
Pretty much what I expected. Not a big Trek fan at all, but I'm excited to see this one. Just a shame to hear Bana doesn't have much to do.
post #4 of 1136
Thread Starter 
Bana has nearly nothing to do.
post #5 of 1136
I was more baffled as to why Clifton Collins Jr. was in the film, and why he seemed to have just as much to do as Bana which, as stated above, is nothing
post #6 of 1136
Loved Kirk with the Mickey Mouse hands and Jar Jar tongue.
post #7 of 1136
I was oddly happy to see Collins, but marveled at Abrams' ability to have him stand almost menacingly. He really kills in that scene where he stands there while the red matter is put into the drillbombthing.

Am I going to be the only one that was distracted rather than entertained by Urban? He had some bits I loved, but I wanted to like him a lot more than I actually did.
post #8 of 1136
I'm kind of surprised you liked this movie so much, specially after what seems to be mostly a negative review.
post #9 of 1136
Regarding Urban...he worked for me all the way through...but like you said Russ, I felt like I was supposed to like him more. Maybe it was because Krazy Karl was really trying to make the most of his screen time (and his dialogue, which seemed like a hodgepodge of catchphrases from the Original Series & films) or that he appeared to be almost a decade older than Kirk. I always thought that Bones and Kirk were meant to be the same age, or close enough, and due to the disparity in their age, it didn't seem to have that immediate "old buddies meeting for the first time" feel.

Correct me if I'm wrong on any of those Trek facts.
post #10 of 1136
Thread Starter 
Bones was always older. Which is why him being a cadet is stupid.
post #11 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
Bones was always older. Which is why him being a cadet is stupid.
Not as far-fetched as it might seem, military doctors and the like wind up getting commissioned after med school and whatever other civilian training they may undergo, which means that McCoy could be considerably older than a cadet, particularly if he'd been in practice before deciding to join Starfleet.
post #12 of 1136
Thanks for the clarification. This leads me to wonder...Orci and Lindelof have been proclaiming since pre-production that this film was going to satisfy die-hard fans by honoring canon, as they are die-hards themselves.

And then the above inconsistency happens, one I assume is a pretty big cock-up of continuity.

What other non-nitpicky (acknowledging that among us nerds that can mean so many things) moments occur in this new Trek film that could really turn off a long-time fan for good?

In other words, was there anything that has truly gotten under your skin, even more so upon reflection?
post #13 of 1136
Thread Starter 
I don't think it's impossible. It's just that the movie shoehorns him in as an old cadet simply so he can meet Kirk in the academy.

Honestly, almost everything post Nero vs Kelvin and pre distress call from Vulcan could have been cut out. There's no reason they couldn't have just opened with the crew coming together instead of making them all buddies from school.
post #14 of 1136
By the by....what the FUCK was up with those musical selections during some of the character introductions?
post #15 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
I don't think it's impossible. It's just that the movie shoehorns him in as an old cadet simply so he can meet Kirk in the academy.

Honestly, almost everything post Nero vs Kelvin and pre distress call from Vulcan could have been cut out. There's no reason they couldn't have just opened with the crew coming together instead of making them all buddies from school.
The first half is the best stuff in the movie. We've talked about this and I know you disagree, but I think all of that works wonderfully. I could have watched an entire movie of them as kids then at Starfleet. It also makes the new dynamic of the crew more clear and enjoyable once they're in the thick of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickBongorno View Post
By the by....what the FUCK was up with those musical selections during some of the character introductions?
Kirk would listen to Beastie Boys.
post #16 of 1136
Thread Starter 
I think it would have been cooler if Kirk listened to real old school hip hop. NWA or something. The Beastie Boys, while I love them, are so square and will probably just be corny in 200 years.

I wouldn't mind a whole movie of them in the Academy. But it has no bearing on this movie. The film doesn't feel like it actually STARTS until the distress call. Hell, the events of the prequel comic feel more organically linked to the main section of the movie than the kiddie prologues in the movie itself. I think they did that tie-in backwards.
post #17 of 1136
Agree with the scorn directed at Orci and Kurtzman, I don't know who thought Kirk's hands swelling was going to go over like gangbusters when he could've been injected with anything really so long as he was ill. That and a few other gaffes (Do I really need to be told it's Iowa twice?) don't stop it from being an enjoyable opening for a summer season that does nothing for me.

The cast were all fine in their roles and I didn't have a problem with them scaling back the franchise to laymen terms with an eye for an eye plot on a grand scale. I do hope they can introduce some new ideas and not go for another revenge seeking nemesis for the sequel (Bone's wife?)
post #18 of 1136
Just seen it...I never actually cared much about Star trek in any of its incarnations (I do admit a soft spot for TNG's "First Contact", but the movie managed to pick my interest right away, and overall I found it to be a perfectly entertaining and well crafted movie.
Most of its credits goes to the cast's performances and the fantastic visual FX (The SFX fan in me wonders how the space combat feels right while not feeling "fake", a complete opposite from "Revenge of the Sith"`s opening battle); it may feel like popcorn science fiction entertainment, but it sure manages to be a blast to watch.
It would have benefited from more exposure on Nero and his crew to make the villians a bit more charismatic, though....Devin's pretty much nailed the film in his review.
As for the cut of Nero's escape from the klingon prison, I would rather had Nero and his crew actually go into active hiding while waiting for Old Spock to arrive...something like that would have hammered Nero and his crew's obssesion, waiting 25 years for the enemy to arrive while on the run from both klingons and the federation, becoming sort of a space ghost ship.
That aside, movie sure worked for me, the "familiar but not invested" in previous "star trek" lore crowd; its a damn good time at the theater.
post #19 of 1136
Enjoyed your review Devin, and I liked that little touch of giving it a "theater 8" and a "reality 7".
post #20 of 1136
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryoken View Post
Just seen it...I never actually cared much about Star trek in any of its incarnations (I do admit a soft spot for TNG's "First Contact", but the movie managed to pick my interest right away, and overall I found it to be a perfectly entertaining and well crafted movie.
Most of its credits goes to the cast's performances and the fantastic visual FX (The SFX fan in me wonders how the space combat feels right while not feeling "fake", a complete opposite from "Revenge of the Sith"`s opening battle); it may feel like popcorn science fiction entertainment, but it sure manages to be a blast to watch.
It would have benefited from more exposure on Nero and his crew to make the villians a bit more charismatic, though....Devin's pretty much nailed the film in his review.
As for the cut of Nero's escape from the klingon prison, I would rather had Nero and his crew actually go into active hiding while waiting for Old Spock to arrive...something like that would have hammered Nero and his crew's obssesion, waiting 25 years for the enemy to arrive while on the run from both klingons and the federation, becoming sort of a space ghost ship.
That aside, movie sure worked for me, the "familiar but not invested" in previous "star trek" lore crowd; its a damn good time at the theater.
The problem is that Nero hiding would make less sense. Why not go to the Romulan Empire and warn them? Hell, give them his very advanced ship to reverse engineer to conquer the Federation. It's all dumb script issues - having Nero kill Kirk's dad is a 'cool' script idea, but they never figure out how to make it work in a movie.
post #21 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
The problem is that Nero hiding would make less sense. Why not go to the Romulan Empire and warn them? Hell, give them his very advanced ship to reverse engineer to conquer the Federation. It's all dumb script issues - having Nero kill Kirk's dad is a 'cool' script idea, but they never figure out how to make it work in a movie.
damn good point, Devin...the Nero in hiding issue you point out could have worked if, i dont know, the actually added an scene were one of Nero's men actually pointed out the advantages of their situation to Nero, only to be executed right away...if Nero's sole reason for action is vengeance against Spock and all he holds dear, then hammer the point that it blinds Nero to the other posibilities of his current situation; make him actually despise the old Romulan Empire for even trusting the federation and Spock, make him aware that he's changed the timeline, that if his wife and kid may be alive in this new timeline, they wont be the wife and kid he lost; being a man out of his own time should be a good villin motivation.
then again, its obvious that Nero is simply a device for bringing the Enterprise crew together, rather than an actual "real" villian. I guess im giving the writers of "transformers" too much credit, fun as that film may have been.
post #22 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Chocula View Post
I don't know who thought Kirk's hands swelling was going to go over like gangbusters
It did with my audience. That whole sequence kills.
post #23 of 1136
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Bateman View Post
It did with my audience. That whole sequence kills.
I agree. You have to have something for the PAUL BLART crowd.
post #24 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
I think it would have been cooler if Kirk listened to real old school hip hop. NWA or something. The Beastie Boys, while I love them, are so square and will probably just be corny in 200 years.
When is the movie supposed to take place?
post #25 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
I agree. You have to have something for the PAUL BLART crowd.
Fuck you, dude.
post #26 of 1136
Nero lying in wait for old Spock to show up is ridiculous. First, as has already been pointed out, the fact that he doesn't even attempt to visit his home planet, the destruction of which is the whole cause of his quest for vengence, is absurd. Setting that aside, Nero says his new purpose is making Spock feel the same thing he felt when he saw Romulus destroyed. Doesn't it therefore make more sense that he would seek out young Spock, who has less control over his emotion and would suffer more because of that, and force him to watch Vulcan implode? I have to agree with the consensus that it's a poor, poor script buoyed only by strong performances all around.
post #27 of 1136
post #28 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Bateman View Post
It did with my audience. That whole sequence kills.
It does, but it has more to do with Urban's constantly injecting Pine with vaccines and their chemistry though it than the fatty fingers onscreen.
post #29 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Brasky View Post
Nero lying in wait for old Spock to show up is ridiculous. First, as has already been pointed out, the fact that he doesn't even attempt to visit his home planet, the destruction of which is the whole cause of his quest for vengence, is absurd. Setting that aside, Nero says his new purpose is making Spock feel the same thing he felt when he saw Romulus destroyed. Doesn't it therefore make more sense that he would seek out young Spock, who has less control over his emotion and would suffer more because of that, and force him to watch Vulcan implode? I have to agree with the consensus that it's a poor, poor script buoyed only by strong performances all around.
wasnt there a scene of old Spock with his mother on Vulcan on one of the trailers?
post #30 of 1136
post #31 of 1136
Even Anthony Lane thought Kirk had red hair in some scenes. He seems like a smart guy...
post #32 of 1136
Quick message to the asshole in the last row at my showing: yes, Vulcan translated to spanish is "Vulcanus"...go laugh at that elsewhere, fucker.
Also, echo the sentiment that the movie isnt perfect, but its pretty great and provides a great cast and a solid start point to new movies.
post #33 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Nunziata View Post
Great Great Great
can't wait to hear Steve's further thoughts in the podcast.
post #34 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
I think it would have been cooler if Kirk listened to real old school hip hop. NWA or something.
While awesome, he'd have to be listening to the radio edits to keep it PG-13.
post #35 of 1136
The problem with Sabotage is that it trades on Spike Jonze, though having typed that, if it was a reference to Shatner saying Sabotage, BRILLIANT!
post #36 of 1136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post
The problem with Sabotage is that it trades on Spike Jonze
Yeah, not really. The problem is that it's a tired song in an unnecessary sequence that relies on an absurd and overly attention-getting bit of product placement.
post #37 of 1136
When I hear that, I think of the video, which has cars chasing around. That video is one of the best of the last twenty years. I could argue that the video is more famous than the song, or the visuals have more pop significance than the music. It's in Rock Band, though, right?
post #38 of 1136
It is. Ten years ago you would have been right re: the video. Not the case any more. Most of the people who'll see this movie don't hold Sabotage as a pinnacle of video craft. Now it's just a song that's out of place in a sequence that doesn't belong.
post #39 of 1136
Sabotage did get the first F-word into a Star Trek movie. I guess there's that. And the hope that it is a subtle in-joke for Shatner fans. "I don't say sabotage. You say sabotage. You sicken me."
post #40 of 1136
Thanks for bringing back the Tag Team Reviews.
post #41 of 1136
Yeah if it's a reference to Shatner, the movie just kind of got better.

The problem with the film is that it's filled with "Enterprise being built in the middle of America" moments. If you don't think a lot it's cool, but when you start thinking "WTF were they doing for 25 years?" it starts falling a part piece by piece.
post #42 of 1136
I didn't understand why Chekhov couldn't beam Spock's mom up just because she dropped with the rocks when he could beam up Kirk and Sulu falling at a much faster speed. Can someone explain that one?
post #43 of 1136
Maybe he didn't have time to adjust for the falling by the time the beaming had started. He didn't have time to adjust for her drop before the beam began. He spent a lot of time locking onto Sulu and Kirk as they were free-falling, but she fell out of the lock pretty quickly.

I'm fanwanking, of course. I don't know.
post #44 of 1136
Same here...also, I rather liked the movie's red shirt death.
post #45 of 1136
I had Devin's "reality score" whilst in the theatre. The moment I realised Kirk happened to be born at the same time Nero happened to go through a black hole from the future, my cyincial brain turned on.

From there I was alternately engaged by the characters or rolling my eyes at the plot points.

It's hilarious that Old Spock actually says to Kirk in the Ice cave "Hoow did you find me?" and the script writers dopn't even know either. It was like they had some secret plot point about a 'Destiny Machine' that they weren't telling us about.

So yeah, another Trek movie with this cast could be a good movie. On the other hand, I'd much rather take an original set of characters in a real sci-fi story any day.
post #46 of 1136
I think this is one of those films - like an awesome old car that once you sit in, you can see that the floorboards are rusted through, and you can see the pistons firing while it drives. Why does Spock's mom die (etc?) because of fairly naked plot machinations.
post #47 of 1136
WOW! I really hope This...Enterprise will keep on...TREKking. First there was...Batman Begins, then Bond Begins, and now we have...Star Trek Begins. Chris Pine captures the brashness of Shatner's James Tiberious Kirk, without mimicing his predocessor's mannerisms. Kirk, Spock, and McCoy are perfect. The perfect 10 though in this...new Trek is Zoe Saldana, who speaks a language that all guys understand...her in a Federation Mini Skirt. This is easilly...My 4th fave film of 2009, and here is my new order of all things...Star Trek.
1) Star Trek II
2) Star Trek III
3) Star Trek IV
4) Star Trek VI
5) Star Trek (2009)
6) Star Trek: TMP
7) Star Trek: V
Star Trek TV...Star Trek, Star Trek: The Animated Series, and Star Trek DS9.
It was the...Best of times.

It was the...Worst of times...ST 7,8,9,10. Sure the Borg Busting was fun...then, but with a...new Enterprise there are always mishaps, so I threw out the baby (ST: First Contact) with the...Bathwater (Trek 7,9,10, Star Trek: TV Voyager, Enterprise, and...TNG.

I hope to see the next film (let us not think of it as...Star Trek II. Perhaps...Star Trek: The Adventure Continues or something...Logical.

I also love the new Enterprise 1701, it kicks A _ _
post #48 of 1136
I just came back from seeing it. I am not a big time Star Trek fan, mind you. I watched most of the movies, including the last two ones, and First Contact has always been my favorite.... to be honest, if it werent for Patrick Stewart, I would likely not cared much at all. The "old" crew around Kirk and Spock never did much for me... I am more the Star Wars guy I suppose.

Anyway, this movie worked. In particular, it had a lot of the intentionally goofy Star Trek humour about it, and it worked. I dont think a single comic moment misfired for me, and I am not one given to laughing easily in movies. The acting was really nice, and the chemistry worked. The one and only dark spot for me was, as has been said elsewhere, the paper-thin villain. Which is a shame, because what we saw from Bana left me wanting more, and I think the idea of a Miner, in a huge mining ship, who killed Kirks father and thus unintentionally already screwed with the timeline, could have been turned into a nice plotline.
Alas, I hope this does well, as I am now interested in seeing this crew in future movies.

Kudos to JJ Abrams for creating another franchise on my "must follow" list
post #49 of 1136
I just got back from seeing it. I loved it, and so did the wife; she's not a trekkie at all, so she was genuinely surprised at how much she liked it.

They got the cast 100% right. I was blown away by just HOW GOOD Chris Pine is in this. He absolutely nails the essence of Kirk without turning it into a Shatner homage.

I had absolutely NO intention of seeing this film until all of the positive WOM started kicking in. I'm glad that I changed my mind; this was a blast.
post #50 of 1136
Just got back from the movie.

I can only echo a lot of the sentiments already expressed in the thread. I couldn't believe how real the space battles felt, and I think it definitely made an impact on my after the hollow star wars battle sequences.

Characters all around I think were spot on, though Uhura, given her importance in the film...the actress just felt or looked generic. Liked that the ancillary members (Scotty, Chekov and Sulu) got something to do, as well as a few of the shout-outs to original Trek. Come on, did anyone not smile when the girl Kirk was making out with turned out to be green?

The villians definitely needed more. I agree with the opinion that they did a good enough job, but really left you wanting more of them, plot holes and reasoning aside.

And I have to support the love for the score. Especially towards the end, before the credits rolled, they had some vocal work which was to me reminiscent of the theme. Just no really strong (original, anyways), memorable theme.

Not amazing and perfect, but pretty good. I would like to see what happens next with this crew, but there is an odd disconnect with these guys. Perhaps that's just because of the association and familiarity of these characters with the original actors, having spent three seasons and six (sevenish) films with them. I felt as if we were all supposed to like them a little more than we did, simply because they were these characters, rather than on the merit of the actors portraying them.
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