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Daybreak of the Non-Living

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
HMT and I just watched Dawn of the Dead. I was very amused and I enjoyed the ancient effects and the laughably not scary zombie-mime-dolls. But HMT mentioned how terribly it was done. The make-up and human parts and entrail effects were rather sad. The plot (what plot?) dragged like a musical does and, though amusing was pretty dull. The best scare effects were not very scary. And so forth and so on.

So, yeah I enjoyed it for whatever reason. But I just want to know why YOU liked it (if you did) and what makes it a classic?
post #2 of 20
Bearing in mind that 'Dawn of the Dead' was released in 1978 I can excuse some of the less than stellar secial effects. It was shot on a budget of one and a half million dollars (think about that).

But the main reason I love this damn film is this, it is one of the great social commentaries of the consumer era. Underneath all of the gore and fake blood is a story of what we have become. Even in death we, as consumers, wander around a mall for no apparent reason other than it seems like what we are supposed to do.

No, the zombies aren't always seen in a horrifying light. They aren't supposed to be. Romero shot 'DotD' in plain day light for that very reason. If he had wanted to go for strict terror he could have shot, at least a large portion of, the movie in the dark. But all of the Dead movies reveal glaring details. They are not strictly horror films.

I don't want to get off on a 'rant' defending this film. It doesn't need my paltry defense. It has and will continue to stand the test of time even with it's 'lower end' fx.

Watch it again. There is more to this film than you've allowed yourself to see. Trust me.
post #3 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Tindalos, Magnificent Bastard:
But the main reason I love this damn film is this, it is one of the great social commentaries of the consumer era. Underneath all of the gore and fake blood is a story of what we have become. Even in death we, as consumers, wander around a mall for no apparent reason other than it seems like what we are supposed to do.
Aha! I mentioned that to HMT right afterward. I thought there was an underlying critique there!
post #4 of 20
ok,i got a ton of shit a while back for professing my utter hatred for this film.so,i re-watched it not too long ago and just let me say this:

it's...ok.

i dont hate it anymore.having matured some since the first time i saw it (when i was 13) my attention span has also grown.my major beef with the movie is the fact that its so fucking long.i mean, do we really need so many shots of zombies walking...slowly....down hallways.....slowly?when the shit is hitting the fan the movie really shines but alot of the in-mall sequences are yawners to be sure.Tom Savini is always a treat to see so i enjoyed the big biker fiasco.i dunno,to me this movie is alright but i still dont see what all the hub-bub is about.

xoxox
post #5 of 20
This whole thread depresses me. frown
post #6 of 20
Almost makes you want to give up and join a romantic comedy message board, doesn't it, Dan? I know the feeling.
post #7 of 20
I love the film because it's a bunch of things. It's a classic piece of social commentary, it has some of the most extreme (if not super well done) gore for its time, the character work was quite good IMO, and the focus was not just the zombies, but telling a STORY. To me, it was unique blending. As stated, it's not a totally HORROR horror movie.

It was a story about surviving a horror predicament. It wasn't about the coming of the end of the world. It was happening. And these people were trying to survive this undead apocalypse. That's different, creative, original to me. Or was when I saw it. There's another reason I love it.

As well, the script is well-written. I was taking a looksee at one of Romero's drafts for it a few weeks ago at the Script-O-Rama and I personally was taken aback by how well it was written. He has a certain writing style (I kinda noticed it in his RE draft, too) that I just really dig, and he transfers it beautifully into his films.

Sure, it ain't done perfectly or done really REALLY well. Low-budget, the era it was made in, tons of things attribute to it. If Romero wanted to redo it now with better quality - he could, and he'd probably knock you on your ass with it.
But, really - could you, under those same circumstances, have made a better movie? I'd love to see you try.

The zombies themselves aren't supposed to look scary, if you ask me - they're just supposed to be scary when you see about 30 of them hungry fuckers staring you down. But, that's just me, I guess.

Pity ya didn't dig it...or maybe not. Better to have you not appreciate it than appreciate it in the wrong way. wink

And Otik, I think you deserve another smackdown for reiterating your Troma comment.
*grabs a mallet and smashes Otik on the head with it, splattering blood and brain matter everywhere*

And indeed, this thread depresses me. frown
post #8 of 20
I don't know...there is just something about watching a insane fat white male go on a rampage in the Projects, an extreme close up shot of a head exploding, and that Hari Krishana zombie that just makes my heart melt for this film.

Even in the midst of a worldwide panic like zombies taking over the Earth, we would still loot the local mall.
post #9 of 20
I think having the zombies look the way they do makes them more terrifying. Instead of incredibly detailed decomposing corpses, which, by the very sight of them tells you you're watching an effect, Romero's zombies look like someone who just hopped out of the coffin a few hours ago. They're real people. You can look at the clothes they wear and get a pretty good idea what they were like before the became mindless, brain-eating monsters. And that's a key point, because not only do you care about the characters fighting them, but you also have this sort of sympathy for the zombies that elevates this and NOTLD above simply being dry-runs for House of the Dead.

And I also love how Romero build the mythology of the world with the TV broadcasts. It really gives the film depth, adding a sense that this isn't merely some isolated incident and that as soon as they get out of the mall everything will be just peachy. It's the Apocalypse out there, and watching the barebones TV newscast with people talking of bringing out the nukes (and the broadcasts in NOTLD with the shelter info scrolling across the bottom of the screen) really drives that home.
post #10 of 20
Quote:
WrappedInPlastic:
Even in the midst of a worldwide panic like zombies taking over the Earth, we would still loot the local mall.
That's my favourite scene in the whole film. It may even be one of my favourite scenes of all time. The idea that they're trapped, surrounded by flesh-eating corpses, the world as they know it is crumbling around them - and they go on a trolley dash around the shops. Grabbing consumer goods that became worthless the minute society fell. Seeking comfort from material things at a time when they most need emotional strength.

If you're missing all this stuff, then you just ain't watching it right wink
post #11 of 20
Quote:
Poxy Von Sinister:
And I also love how Romero build the mythology of the world with the TV broadcasts. It really gives the film depth, adding a sense that this isn't merely some isolated incident and that as soon as they get out of the mall everything will be just peachy. It's the Apocalypse out there, and watching the barebones TV newscast with people talking of bringing out the nukes (and the broadcasts in NOTLD with the shelter info scrolling across the bottom of the screen) really drives that home.
That's just it. These are bleak films. There's no happy endings, and the film makes it clear that the best we can hope for these characters is that they survive to fight another day. There's no solution. The world is ending, and the best you can do is try and prolong your life as long as possible. Those themes really hit home and make you think. What would you do? Friends, family, your entire life rendered meaningless. Could you survive in a world like that?

It's got nothing to do with fake blood. The hopelessness of the situation is why these films are called "horror".
post #12 of 20
You want horror? How about this scene:

"She's pregnant."

"Do you want it aborted?"

"What?"

"Do you want it aborted? I know how."

That's one of the most chilling scenes in the film, and not a zombie in sight.
post #13 of 20
Shit. Forgot about that. At least we've managed to turn this thread from DotD Haters to a DotD Love-In
post #14 of 20
I hate these threads. Every time a post comes up saying 'I saw DOTD/Jaws/TCM et al and they suck', I lose a little faith in the world, as the boy Wiskerando would put it.

And I can't believe you dissed Savini.
post #15 of 20
I'm like that because 9 times out of 10, people tell me they hate Chainsaw, and DOTD et al, and then come out and tell me the best horror movies are Scream and Urban Legend 9. It's their opinion, and I understand it, but inside it kills me that a generation are growing up believing that is horror, because to me, that is an insult to the genre that I love and all it stands for.

I understand some of you folks aren't like that. Caustic, you yourself sound like a stand-up intelligent guy/gal, which is cool. But a hell of a lot of people I've met are like that. To be honest, I blame the industry more than anything. Hollywood has spewed out so much crap in the name of horror, most people have forgotten what the term means, and as a result most of the movies have dropped greatly in quality and intelligence, and people have become sated by it. They're willing to accept lower-end product because they're so used to umpteen Friday the 13th or Freddy sequels. And they're used to them not being scary at all. To me, Dawn of the Dead is the total antithesis of today's horror movie. It's creepy as hell, it's intelligent, and it has more than one standard layer. It's also got one of the most unsettling atmospheres a movie has ever created, in my opinion. Here's hoping Dead Reckoning will meet the same standards.
post #16 of 20
I suppose I can accept that there are some out there who aren't as appreciative of the Dead flicks as the rest of us are. I suppose I can accept that there are some people who don't care that the whole idea of a good horror movie is being ass-raped. I however, cannot stand the fact that none of you mentioned Jennifer Love Hewitt's horrid karaoke shit in that awful "I Still Know What You Did Last Summer" as a reason for anyone even remotely associated with tripe like that to be banned from messing up the genre anymore.

The only reason I mention that is because someone told me that it was the scariest thing they'd ever seen, and I sort of thought maybe they were on the right track. I mean, that girls' ears are HUGE.
post #17 of 20
Yep, what Fett said.

I can handle the fact that people don't like the same films as me. But it bugs me to hear a great film like Dawn Of The Dead criticised for being "terribly made", or for having "sad" special effects and no plot. You don't have to enjoy it, but those criticisms just strike me as wrong and that the film is being pulled apart for what it isn't (a fast-paced modern splatter movie) rather than what it is (an intelligent apocalyptic horror from a period of great innovation in cinema).

I'm guilty of it myself, though. I've seen many a film where it's not remotely what I thought it would be, and the difference between expectation and execution is so wide that I'm unable to "get" the movie. But in those circumstances, I try and restrain myself from ripping it apart, because I know that at least part of the problem is with my own perception of the movie, not the movie itself.

No offence intended to anyone. Feel free to ignore the moaning old farts in the corner...
post #18 of 20
On the special effects, I mean common! So what if their isn't CGI ever other second. If I ever break into movies, I would do what Citzen Kane and Star Wars and all those did for something like large groups of people. Get a painting of what I want, mat it in, and know I saved about a few millions dollars.

When some one sees DotD and bitches about it being a crappy, non plot movie, just tell them about the social commentary and sit their ass down and point it out. Maybe they will change their ways...or just yell at you.

"Social Commentary!??! Wah WAH!?"
post #19 of 20
Thread Starter 
I just want to make sure things are straight here. I never said I didn't like the film. In fact, I enjoyed it.

Thing is, my friend slumped down afterward and said it was horrible. Now, I loved the story, I loved the social bit (even if I wasn't sure if it was intended), I liked the characters (especially the "big black man") and I even got a kick out of the low budget props. I didn't however find it chilling or scary or whatever, and those things in my first post (most of which HMT brought up)I had to agree with. So, in that I wasn't affected by it, my friend didn't get it, and I'm no expert on films (especially ones before my time), I just thought I'd ask you what makes this classic a classic. Thanks for the input so far. Don't criticize my ignorance. I'm not blowing the whole thing out and saying, "that sucked" or anything. And I don't like hollywood teen "thriller" crap much either. There's hope for me. Just give me a chance.
post #20 of 20
Thread Starter 
So someone check my hypothesis, too, if you please: Was a lot of this stuff (ie, camera technique, super gore, and volume of zombie extras) all new and innovative and genius for its time? Or does that have nothing to do with it?
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