Jesse Ventura hates torture

He's my hero. He was also on Stern, the View and Larry King. If he were to run for President some day, I'd vote for him in a heartbeat. But evidently he wants to be the ambassador to Cuba if we restore relations.

I think I have a lifelong mancrush on Ventura.

From the King interview...
And that could be Fathom Events most successful draw ever.


Well, get yours now...

How do you not title this thread "Jesse Ventura ain't got time for torture?" Chances to be that blissfully hacky don't grow on trees.

That video was sexy. A sexy tyrannosaurus, even.

I've said it before, and I'll say it here; Jesse Ventura has turned into Peter Boyle in Young Frankenstein.

In the next portion he goes into 911 conspiracies, though. http://www.newshounds.us/2009/05/20/...s_it_again.php

No wonder yt wants him to be President. I kid.

Anti-torture? What a pussy.

The heart condition would kill him before he ever talked. Nice try Ventura.

I say we put that hypothesis to the test!

(Note to the Secret Service: I have no intention of actually doing this. It's a joke.)

I've met Jesse and he's a class act. I've always been a big fan. Hell, the guy was in Predator and a Governor! No one else can say that! Oh wait...well, ok, two guys can say it.

But when he went 911 conspiracy wacko I lost all respect for the man. The only thing worse than his views on 911 are his hair. Holy crap Jesse, that look is horrible.

I can't believe that they are people who completely stand against torture no matter what.

My girlfriend's mom worked for him. He found her very attractive, and never failed to tell her so. On multiple occasions. In explicit detail.

Tell me you're kidding, Domingo.

You don't want Jesse to run for President; the theory of his presidency may have an appeal, but the reality of it would completely piss you off.

Much like his governorship, coincidentally enough.

That was my point, bendrix. He wasted his opportunity to effectively jumpstart an independent party with his failed governorship of MN.

I was just agreeing. And to expand further, the lumbering undead corpse of that failed jumpstart planted the seeds of the current senatorial election debacle.

But I guess you can't blame Jesse for that,

Come'on, man! You're Canadian, right? Represent!

It's not up to you or me or Cheney to decide to ignore the law.

If you believe that torture (which doesn't produce reliable intelligence, makes us hated around the world and is disgustingly immoral and, if you're Christian, unChristian) should be legal, you'll have to start working on your congresspeople to change US law and remove the US from the Geneva Conventions and the UN. Then, if it's legal and the police start torturing suspects legally, you could be faced with the prospect of getting busted for something and getting tortured for all your efforts. What a world you'd create.

I loved Bill Maher's point on torture. It was in regards to the ticking time bomb arguement. Basically, if someone has information that will prevent, for example, a nuke going off in LA within 24 hours, then the CIA will just break the law and torture him anyway, and we don't need to have it written into law, where it can be misinterpreted and abused.

It doesn't have to be legal to be justified in certain, albeit highly improbable, instances. I think we can all agree that torture should never be legal but I think we're mistaken if we say it's never justified.

Also, Jesse Ventura is great... except for the whole 9/11 Truth bullshit.

As official policy? Hell yes. I think the burden of proof is on those who would defend the use of torture. The whole Jack Bauer scenario used as justification is fantasy.

If there was a ticking time bomb scenario and a law enforcement agent used torture to try to stop it then he could be processed according to law and a judge or jury would judge him accordingly, which would most likely be a light if nonexistent punishment.

The torture Cheney forced on law enforcement and the armed forces wasn't in response to a ticking time bomb; it was largely in response to having lied about a war and needing to retroactively torture false confessions out of people to justify said war. One cannot understate the difference between this scenario and the Jack Bauer scenario.

I completely agree with all of the above.

I'm suspicious of the ticking time bomb scenario, too. If torture is fine so long as it's only used in an emergency, then we'd probably see an ever-widening definition of emergency.

Apropos of dumb statements about torture, this is sad.

The whole "marketplace of ideas" thing is such bullshit.

Adam Carolla is a stupid dick.

What I can't believe is the way the national conversation has veered toward the hypothetical "ticking time bomb" scenario. Many were not tortured to find a time bomb. They were tortured for general information. And many of them were released when it was discovered they had done nothing wrong and/or possessed no information.
Why are we not discussing the justifications of what actually happened instead of debating "24" fanfic?

Or, um... what YT said.

Who even uses time bombs anymore? What's the matter, don't have a cell phone? Jeez, some terrorists...

His argument is fine, and the way he rocks back and forth as if he can barely physically contain himself is entertaining.

But there was a great opening, when blondie says "...that America felt after 9/11 that the threats were imminent?"

The role of our government is not to react to what we feel, but to what is. Torture is a tool used in fear and cowardice. It is a thing used when other reliable avenues are not apparent, when people 'feel' that a threat is imminent rather than believing or knowing that one is.

Ventura's stance is well and good, but he doesn't look like much less of a dope than these Fox spokesmodels, because he's getting just as lathered up as they are. He's a dope I agree with, but that's all I see.

I can't believe anybody would want him to run for president. As to being our ambassador to Cuba that is pretty ridiculous but I can rest assured that this administration wouldn't try to be so comical.

Actually, the Iraq Invasion was a ticking timebomb scenario.... for Bush and Cheneys political career and realities

Either way, there is no ticking time bomb scenario. The only reason this is used is because its the only real scenario where you COULD try to sell torture and its necessity to a certain crowd, and because US TV has made it one of these "true myths" through series and movies. I dont think you could sell that concept anywhere else in the first world, it just works because reality lost to TV in some areas.

The only indicators that such a scenario ever happened at all is the noncommittal grunting of a few mid-level intelligence guys whose ass is on the line in that regard too. There is no proof, no evidence at all, no verified accounts, to published events, nothing to even indicate that such a scenario ever took place at all.
You know, I think once you can play politics with TV conventions and the belief in them, you got a problem far more serious than corrupt warmongers in office.

Torture is about revenge, and about stilling this thirst for blood born out of helplessness and lack of intelligence.

Indeed, and the counterpoint to the torture argument is yesterday's bust of the four would-be terrorists through good ol' law enforcement methods. Of course it remains to be seen if the four men were an actual threat or just hateful guys who were herded into some kind of entrapment, but the truth of that will be played out in the coming months I'm sure. Still, no torture, four arrests for a terror plot.

ps. Love this.

Yes it does, but until a prisoner is taken, processed and decided what to do with him, its over anyway. Plus, as I can tell you from past experience, you dont actually have detailed intelligence about such stuff in the day-to-day as a soldier. You pick up a guy at a checkpoint or during a raid, you put him in a truck with an escort and ship him to the basecamp, then forget about it and keep on doing your job. For this scenario, which is slightly more likely to happen, to work out you d need a LOT better intelligence on the ground, something which I am not sure can be done anyway.
Your guys in Iraq and Afghanistan, 90% of the time, get an order from high up usually with a roughly sketched objective, and then wing it from there. You dont hold enough intelligence to connect any dots in short order. You could basically just torture everyone and anyone on sheer suspicion, but as the information isnt reliable, the guy would just have to run down a clock, AND you usually have no way and no ressources to check up on the information gained, its as likely to get you into deep shit as it is to let you find that time-critical objective.

Aside, you wont find a lot of guys comfortable with risking their lives, and the lives of their men, going on a statement gotten from a "quick and dirty" torture.

I couldn't get through the Hannity interview. The fact that he truly believe that Bush inherited a worse mess from Clinton then Obama did from Bush...that the world is better off after Bush's presidency then Clinton's...it's disturbing. These aren't opinions; these are facts. But they just can't concede anything, anything at all, they're afraid of admitting they're wrong or that anyone in the republican party has done a bad job when they clearly have. It's okay. It's alright. We'll respect you more for admitted you've done a bad job when you clearly have done a bad job then if you vehemently deny you have ever done any wrong doing.

I'm not making sense.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/art...ates_bush.html

So whats the cut off date on when a future terrorist attack happens that it will be Bush's fault, much like 9/11 was Clinton's fault? Or since Obama has adopted virtually everything the Bush administration created, it gives a blanket blame?

Quick, someone ask Hannity that.

Jesus Christ. He doesn't spend two seconds thinking about his Spanish Inquisition parallel?

I really hate the current trend of people bolstering their show business career by spouting off controversial shit.

I hate to break it to you but this has been happening for a long time now. It's just the shit has gotten more and more crazy, but the phoniness has always been around.

...and here's a bit of news we get to file away under "Well, no fucking shit Sherlock"...

I lied after torture: terror suspect

I thought this thread was more apprpriate for this startling piece of news we all already guessed at rather than giving it it's own thread.

Somewhere Dick Cheney is manically huffing lithium and nuzzling a piece of blue velvet.

Sigh.

Name one instance - one - where torture has made a significant, morally-justifiable, life-saving difference in any matter whatsoever.

I'll wait.

The crucifixion.

Zing!

No zing!

Crucifixion isn't 'torture' the way Domingo's referring to it. It's the death penalty with torture built in.

Damn. You're good. And I was so proud.

Stay proud, Bendrix. That was both funny and incisive. But it doesn't technically count, and I don't want Domingo off the hook.