Back to the Future Franchise question... - Page 2

You're all nuts.

Hooey, time travel, hooey hoeey, but how did Jennifer turn into Elizabeth Shue? There's your paradox.

I love time travel movies. And I love the discussions about the possibilties even more. But what do I love the most? People who speak definitively about something that is so impossible, as if there really is a correct answer out there.

For all we know Doc already used up all the gas in the delorean. We know he tried to fix it for a while before hiding it. So, the gas would have been gone.

Also I don't know if gas sitting in a tank would still be there 70 years in the future, or be usable, so Doc in 1955 would have probably filled it up anyway.

You'd think Doc being such a genius would be able to make gasoline though. He could dig up some oil and make it with all his stuff there.

My point was his response had nothing to do with the original inquiry, which was why the car went back in time when it didn't go 88mph.

Now what I don't is ever made clear is why the car has to go up to 88mph (besides that being cool). Surely you can create a nuclear reaction without the car moving. Is it so you don't accidentally go back in time while just driving around at 40 miles an hour or because you accidentally push a button? So does the space time continuum somehow rip open at 88mph because of a nuclear reaction, or is 88mph just a failsafe so you know you're going to go back in time when you get to that speed.

It wouldn't have been sitting there for 70 years, it would've been the few months that Doc was living in 1885 after the Delorean was struck by lightning.

Yeah, it would. The moment Doc put the DeLorean away. That vehicle sat around for 70 years.

Plus, you figure Doc drained out all of the fluids before burying it.

You also have to figure that Doc coated the exterior with some sort of ant-rusting agent, as those things were supposedly very prone to rusting out. He must have buffed up the leather interior a bit to keep it from cracking.

From Wikipedia:

"The DeLorean was again struck by lightning in the year 1955 (in the very same electrical storm), this time by accident, causing it to malfunction, activating the flux capacitor, leaving a twisted fire trail behind. The lightning created an overload and the DeLorean vanished from 1955, traveling back in time to 1885 (earlier in the film, Doc had mentioned that the time circuits were not functioning correctly - several instances in the film that show the time circuit display show 1885 as the destination when the time circuits malfunction)."

I said, "The lightning short circuited the flux capacitor. Doc Brown mentions it in his telegram to Marty at the end of BTTF 2 and in BTTF 3. He sends back instructions on how to fix it using parts his 1950's counterpart can acquire." I apologize for thinking you understood that I was attributing the lightning short circuiting the flux capacitor to the immediate time travel without the requirement of 88 mph. By mentioning the repair, I was following up on the context in which this is discussed in the movie. This was the entirety of my thinking in my response. I'm sorry if I miscommunicated this in any way.

Oh, and fuck you, you fucking fuck.

Well I'm gonna throw my 2 cents:

If in part III, Doc goes to the mine and gets the gas from his DeLorian, then 1955 Doc would simply refill it.

Still I think he became so afraid of altering the future/past he didn't even try. He shows his discontent when Clara survives the ravine fall and with how he never invented that infernal machine. Maybe he just gave up, was happy fixing wagons and wanted Marty to go back to the future and just stop time traveling to avoid any possible altercations.

All it took was a hover board to make a new machine, so why didn't Doc just do that to get Marty home? I mean I understand they had the deadline of the shoot out with Mad Dog, but after that, they could of let the train go and Doc could just build a new machine.

Maybe that's why Doc just gives Marty a picture frame. "Marrtttty, you should of told me you had a hover board back in the past"

We were on a tangent about whether or not the gas from the Delorean that transported Doc to 1885 could have been siphoned out and used to refill the tank of the Delorean that transported Marty to 1885. Someone else said that the gas wouldn't be usable after 70 years, but you wouldn't be using it 70 years in the future. You'd be using it when Marty showed up in 1885, a few months after the Doc buried the Delorean. If he did drain the fluids the whole thing would be moot. But if he had he really should've put that in the letter to Marty.

Yes in the movie it did sit around for 70 years, but if they'd tried to get the gas out of it, it wouldn't have.

First, as has been said, Doc more than likely wouldn't have left combustible liquids inside the car he was trying to keep in that state for 70 years.

Second, you don't really know how long it took Doc to build that train. There's a good chance it took around 8 years (given the apparent age of his kids), since you don't know how long they've been traveling around in time when they arrive in 1985. You could figure he somehow used the hoverboard's components and other things he made out of whatever he could find to build a very simple time machine out of the train over many years, then flew it to the future and decked it out, then brought it back to 1985.

Now if Doc still had the delorean perhaps it would have taken shorter than 8 years, but you gotta think Marty wouldn't be wanting to stick around the old west that long.

I got another one. At the end of part III, how does Doc know precisely what time Marty and Jennifer will be looking at the wreckage of the DeLorean on the train tracks, so he can appear before them in his new time-traveling train engine?

The crash obviously made the news, hence "Eastwood Ravine". Doc could look it up from the future.

(ETA) Oh, the crash in 1985. Probably would have made the news too.

Doc installed a lojack in the Delorean in case the Libyans stole it from him. It's in a deleted scene.

Yes but Marty and Jennifer go back to look at the wreckage perhaps a couple hours after it got destroyed, since Marty goes to get the truck (who knows how far the house is from the train tracks) then goes to get Jennifer, then goes back to the train tracks, yet Doc knows when he's going to be there. That's what he's saying. This I think with all the time traveling he does though, he could have found out. Maybe there's a 2nd Doc's train a block away that sees Marty there at that instance then travels back five seconds to be right where it appears. Doc would know when Marty came back though, as he set the time machine, he just wouldn't logically know Marty would be there when he arrived.

Ah well played, then...

...why didn't he just leave another note in the delorian he stashed away, or wrote another letter telling Marty "ummm you fucked up and rip the fuel line, oh and tell me not to dress you up like that".

Yeah those things make no sense. It really just goes with what makes the first movie impossible. If you stop your parents from having you, thus erasing yourself, than how would you be around to erase yourself. Just a big paradox. So if you rip the fuel line then send a letter telling yourself to prevent the fuel line from being ripped, then you would have never sent the letter, just creating a big loop of endless alternate timelines.

Or, Doc Brown could have left himself a note in 1985 that said, "Do not call Marty to Twin Pines Mall tonight. You will get shot by the Libyans and he will take the time machine and completely fuck things up. Buy a tripod instead to hold the video camera."

In Part I - why does Marty have to drive to hit the cable at 88mph?

Why not either a: have the car on rollers already doing 88mph and already connecting the car/clocktower, or b: have a cable the length of the street connected directly to the car /clocktower so that when the lightning strikes and the car is doing 88mph it doesn't have to be doing so at the exact moment the rod connects/lightning strikes?

OK, that works. But here's another thing: there's no reason for Doc to bring the Time Train in on railroad tracks when it's already been modified to fly.

Regardless of what Wikipedia says about the tires spinning, it's well-established in the films that the time machine has to be physically moving through space at 88mph. True, this still doesn't explain the instantaneous travel at the end of II.

Maybe you move through time at 88mph, so if the vehicle isn't moving at that speed, the sudden acceleration tears it -- or its occupants -- apart?

I posited that the Delorean spun or looped when it was struck by lightning at the end of part two. Again, this can be seen in the "99" fire tracks it leaves behind. Could it possibly have spun or looped at 88 miles per hour? That's still physical movement.

Why would the DeLorean leave twin fire trails in midair?!

I've always wondered if George and Elaine ever think, "y'know, our son looks and sounds completely identical to that kid George's dad nearly killed with the car, Elaine molested, stalked George, caused Biff to eat manure, kissed like a brother and invented rock n roll"?

Or would the intervening years have eroded his face from their memories?

Alcohol. Lots of it. It's obvious Elaine loved the drink before the time travel shenanigans took place, after Marty corrects the timeline, they eventually become well off and her alcoholism is not an issue, seeing as she doesn't have to work.

George on the other hand, yes it is a wonder that after Marty grew up and started to look like Calvin Klein, he didn't murder her in a jealous rage.

It's Loraine and it's her dad, not George's, who hits him with the car.

Wasn't the "other" 1885 Delorean so thoroughly buried by Doc that they needed explosives in 1955 just to get to it?

Oh yeah I knew that, shit!

My mother's name is actually Elaine, that's where that must have come from.



Which now seems incredibly weird in context with BTTF

They have to blast into the mine because its been sealed up since 1885, but Doc didn't do that. Once they find the shaft with the E.L.B. initials they pry off the wood with a crowbar and just toss the rocks aside.

Answer: because someone on the production decided it looked cool.

I don't know if it was mentioned, but what happened to Doc's deloreon in 1855? Wouldn't that have had enough fuel for their journey back home? They simply needed to transport it from that vehicle to Marty's.

1885, and if you read the thread we've discussed that topic already.

Found it. Reading through this thread is a headache (time travel's a bitch), that's why I said, "I don't know if it was mentioned..."

Would they? They would have simply had to replace Marty's DeLorean with Doc's in the mine. It's the same one, remember, except Marty's DeLorean is in more working order... aside from loosing gas from a ruptured fuel line.

The question is not which Jennifer Parker is better.. it's which older Jennifer Parker would you rather spend the 'future' with..

Switching delorians would have created a paradox. They delorean that came back in time with Marty and had its fuel line ripped would cease to exist so it could never have been put there in the first place, as would Marty.

Because they eventually returned to have kids (at the end of BTTF3). They wouldn't have had kids in 2015 if they'd never returned to the original timeline. The problem solves itself.

OK, how is it that the 2015 versions of Marty and Jennifer don't remember BEING there in their younger forms? Wouldn't they have remembered traveling into the future and seeing their older selves? They should have been on the lookout for their younger selves walking around.

I kinda wondered how George McFly turned his entire life around with one sucker punch. Since we clearly see in Part II that the punch didn't suddenly emasculate Biff from that point on. Wouldn't Biff have made life for George even worse after that?

Hahaha. Fun thread. I love these movies.

Christopher Lloyd is mighty sexy in the wild west with his big shiny rifle. Oh yea.

In general, standing up to a bully will make them go after easier prey. As such, I can buy Biff leaving George alone and moving on to someone else after that altercation. From there, anything can happen with a George McFly who has discovered an inner confidence.

True! But we know that Biff isn't quite like that when it comes to the McFlys.

(my debate in this should be taken in the spirit of the entire thread; giggles)

It's not the same situation obviously, but Marty also stands up to Biff which only makes Biff go after him harder. I simply don't see Biff dropping his 'control' of the McFlys. Biff is still clearly more physically imposing than George and he knows that he got decked by a sucker punch (of love).

But that hadn't happened yet. And when they do travel to the future and see their older selves, they change the timeline and never have to go into the future to AKLJHLKA JFGHLIUYLAKJHBLKAFJHBLKJBLKJHLK.

Why would they? If they were smart, they'd know to avoid it. And Doc would have told them not to think about it because of the obvious consequences. Though this doesn't explain why old Jennifer fainted, since she should have known about her younger self possibly being around. But she might have forgotten and just had a plain old fright.

Yeah, but if the theory about time extrapolation is true, the moment 1985 Marty and Jenn go back, it HAS happened...it just did. And the old Marty and Jenn are extrapolated from the young Marty and Jenn, who've JUST gone into the future...everything they're seeing is based on a future where they traveled to the future back in 1985, so the old Marty and Jenn should know everything the young Marty and Jenn know. Right?

You're right, fuck it. Time for a scotch.

It's times like these that I think we could all take a little advice from Austin Powers: The Spy Who Shagged Me (an occurrence which will likely never happen again):

Austin: Wait a tick. Basil, if I travel back to 1969 and I was frozen in 1967, presumeably, I could go back and visit my frozen self. But, if I'm still frozen in 1967, how could I have been unthawed in the '90s and traveled back to...
[goes cross-eyed]
Austin: Oh, no, I've gone cross-eyed.
Basil: I suggest you don't worry about those things and just enjoy yourself.
[to camera]
Basil: That goes for you all, too.
Austin: Yes.

That said, to completely ignore that, I've always found it interesting that George and Lorraine waited through 2 kids to name the proper child Marty. Just always thought it would be interesting if he woke up having to answer to a new name.

Of course, on a larger scale, it's amazing how much of the family's life has changed along with what hasn't. They live in a much nicer version of the same house, Marty has the same room, etc. But it will likely be jarring when he finally returns home after his trilogy of adventure and has to cope with a timeline where his memories are not exactly in sync. Was his childhood the same? Would a more affluent Marty even hang out with Doc, and if he didn't would that not completely mess up time?

[goes cross eyed]

The explanation is simple.

The trip to the future is not in anybody's past, one assumes that in this movie universe when you travel into the future you go to the original timeline without creating a new one (which is what happens when you travel in time). In that timeline they were never in the future so that's why they don't remember. When they go back in time, then it is part of that timeline's past so that in that divergent timeline's future, they will remember themselves.

The question is, can they screw up their future by acting differently in the "new" future?

*brain explodes*

Like I said before I think it probably has something to do with the accident with the Roll's Royce. Except the Marty who got into the accident with the Roll's Royce couldn't have been the same one who went back to 1885, as we know that one came back and didn't get into the accident and completely negated the need to go back in the first place.

One might put it together that the Marty and Jennifer they met were based on the Marty and Jennifer of the timeline Marty came back to in BTTF 1. A Marty who technically ceased to exist when Marty came back from 1955, but there may have still been a future for him.

I used to like these films...