Chewer House buying advice - Page 2

this has probably been mentioned but if you have kids or plan of having kids.. make sure you brush up on the schools in the area as well.

Add to that: if you can get a homeowner's line of credit at the same, even if it's only for ten thousand, get it. You'll never regret having that kind of money in case of emergencies.

I just bought a house in July. These are random and in no particular order....

1. Definately get a 'whole house inspection', they don't cost that much, and can save you big headaches later.

2. Good news if you are a first time buyer, the $8000 credit has extended into next year!

3. Definetly try to get a home warranty.

4. Check with local police stations about crime statistics in the area. Don't take peoples opinions of an area for gospel, do the research, you can often find this info online as well. Visit the neighborhoods all hours of the day or night. You may be surprised how much the character of a neighborhood changes when the sun sets.

6. If you can, put down more than the minimum down payment. That will lessen your monthly payments and may get you a better interest rate.

7. Also, if you can, pay a little extra each month against the principle of your loan. This will save you money against interest payments in the long run. You have to specify the extra payment as counting against principle on your payment, otherwise they will count it against interest which really doesn't help you that much.

8. Seems like a no brainer, but check to see if the area falls within flood plain maps. Flood plain= bad news.

9. Try to get the seller to pay a large portion, if not all of the closing costs. Your realtor should really do this if they are worth thier salt. Don't forget, it is still a buyer's market.

After you pay money to have an inspector come in and take a look, go in YOURSELF and look for mold or water damage in the basement. THOROUGHLY. My "inspector" seemed to have had vision problems.

Good advice so far. A couple more.

Water or water stains in the basement? Get out.

Timber retaining walls don't last forever. You definitely want to evaluate how long before they need replacement.

Think about how much yard work you really want to do. A house may have a lot of curb appeal, but it may be more work to maintain than you're willing to do. Heck, if you have a green thumb, sprucing up a plain yard might be more fun than working with what's already there.

Don't worry about color too much. Paint is a cheap fix. And there's no better time to paint than before you move in. Worry a lot more about space, flooring, etc.

I strongly advise against buying as big a house as you can "afford". Yeah, I can afford a much bigger house than I'm in if I was content to eat Ramen noodles, sleep on the floor, walk to work, etc. Figure out how your lifestyle fits into your budget. There's no shame in starting in a smaller home and trading up when finances improve.

Lots of great suggestions, already!

• Condos: check various blogs/sites/etc for the history of a builder and, if possible, the building. Some builders quickly develop a reputation for shoddy work or poor aftersale service.
• Beware presale contracts: often the developer can renege with no penalties while the buyer has substantial fines if they have to back out.
• Property Details: check the survey (where's the property line, wtf is that fence doing there, etc.), make sure you're comfortable with any neighbourhood restrictions (e.g., siding/roof colour, size of trees, etc.) and covenants, check the zoning of the houses around you (e.g., is someone going to plop a mega-home/rental slum special beside you?), and find out where any city/state/county/etc right of ways are (e.g., we have to uproot your doggy's grave to fix the sewer).
• Get a good Real Estate Lawyer: critical if anything goes wrong.
• Get Title Insurance: for a few hundred bucks, if anyone tries to scam you (or the bank!) and claim title to your home, this little policy is worth your house's weight in gold.
• Stalk your future house: sit in front of that sucker at different times of the day to see the traffic patterns, who your neighbours are and how much fun it's to get there.
• Insist on a pre-possession inspection: Prior to taking possession, make sure you have a chance to walk through to make sure you have everything you're supposed to have and that nothing substantial has changed.

Finally, I've said to my wife that our next house will be a huge closet with a few partitioned areas for living. ;-)

You might not realize this but the people who are selling the house are probably the more desperate ones, all you have to do is walk away and they have to wait for the whole process to start again. Especially in this market (and depending how long the house you're interested in has been on it) you should have a lot of leverage. When my parents sold their house it was the buyers who were making all the demands and they could just agonize over whether to say 'No' or risk them just walking away.

How long has the house been on the market, and did you beat out any other buyers with your offer? If it has been on the market for a while and you weren't in any kind of competition, threaten to walk away from the deal. If you REALLY love the house, I'd maybe consider splitting the closing costs with them, but that's about as far as I'd go to close the deal.

I agree with most everyone else. You are likely in the driver's seat here. If the house has been on the market for more than three months I'd tell them what you want to pay, everything in, and be prepared to walk if they say no.

Or decide where you want to meet them half way and do so. And be prepared to walk away. You always need to be willing to walk away.

BTW, 110K for a house? Jesus, I gotta move somewhere cheaper.

By the way: $4400 sounds kinda high for a $110,000 house. Check the accounting on that total and see if it makes sense.

Yep. 1.5% is the norm, sometimes as high as 2.5%.

Yeah, that seems high. Check around with your mortgage rep AND a few others and see what they say on that 4% closing cost. I'm betting that a whole bunch of fees have been wrapped into that $4400 that you don't have to pay.

Also, having the house sell after being on the market for only 20 days would DEFINITELY make them bold. They called the other agents who showed your house to see if they could start a bidding war and jack up the price...the fact that they DIDN'T start a war tells me that you were the only ones interested enough to make a bid. If you're not in a hurry (and you're not emotionally attached to the house), I'd consider waiting for a month and seeing what happens.

I've never heard of closing costs that high. But there may be something in your area that costs more than it does up here. I'd get a second opinion on closing costs just in case.

Calling other agents is legal but borderline unethical. Still, it may work in your favour if no one else bites.

These might help you a little bit, this (http://www.titleminnesota.com/closcost.htm) is a breakdown of closing costs in Minnesota and this (http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/mor...g_costs_MN.asp) is a an example of closing costs on a 200,000 dollar house.

Sorry for the links, Safari isn't allowing me to paste in to the pop-up.

Alex is in Cleveland, Ryan. I'M the one stuck in the icebox of MN

sounds fishy, Alex. I'd call around to some different lenders and find out what their closing costs are.

Also: I've been hearing advertisements from some local lenders (can't remember the names, sorry) that are saying that THEY will cover the closing costs for the transaction. You might want to see if your lender will do that for you.

Alex: out of curiosity, is your agent employed by the same company as the selling agent?

Damn it. Still, Ohio shouldn't be that different.

Here and here might help.

Don't buy it for more than your offer unless you see the other bid in writing. They could be trying to drive up the price without having another bid on the table.

I've never heard of 4% closing costs. It's an outrageous sum of money.

Alex:

My brother works with the real estate industry. I asked him the following questions and he passed them on to someone a bit more knowledgeable on the subject. Hopefully the answers will help you.

- What are closing costs based on and who sets them? Closing “costs” are a combination of several things: the mortgage company and title company’s fees, certain state taxes, escrows, etc. The actual costs from the mortgage company are typically the origination fee, underwriting, processing, appraisal and credit report (although there can be other costs as well, and they can be called something different)

- Is it typically based upon a percentage of the selling price of the house? Some of the costs are based on a percentage and some are fixed regardless of the purchase price. For example an appraisal typically runs about $300-400 (on average)

- If so, will this percentage vary from state to state? it could; for example Minnesota charges a “mortgage registration tax”- which not all states do. MRT is calculated at $2.40 per thousand

- Will different lenders have different costs? Yes- although there should not be a huge variance

- What could account for a seemingly 'high' closing cost (4% of the price of the house)? This is a difficult question to answer without actually reviewing the Good Faith Estimate.

A good rule of thumb is that your lender fees should not exceed 2-2 ½ % of the purchase price- however I can’t tell what the 4% is based on. If they are simply looking at the cash required to close (down payment excluded)- it could seem higher- but that would not be an accurate depiction of the actual costs, as prepaid expenses could be in there as well. Also depending on the kind of loan it is (i.e. FHA ) there could be some upfront PMI shown on the Good Faith)

This is really fucked up. Wow, no inspection, and they haven't given a reason why? They probably know that there are some expensive, costly repairs that need to be done on the house, and they are counting on you being emotionally attached to the home and willing to forgo a home inspection. Which is ludicrous and has the potential to be financial suicide.

I don't even know if the house is worth pursuing at this point. If the sellers won't allow you to get an inspector in there, they probably won't be reasonable when it comes to repairs and/or seller concessions at the closing table.

Did you make the inspection part of the requirements for purchase? Get an attorney regardless. It'll be a better investment at this point!

Much as I would love having two full bathrooms - even 1.5 - it simply isn't something I can make a dealbreaker with my budget and the range of houses within my pre-approved loans. Most of the homes with two baths (even 1.5) require enough cosmetic and real work to make them impractical (I am NOT handy and won't have the budget for major remodeling for several years).

And while I have two daughters, they are with me only two weekends a month. It's likely to be less time (or, more accurately, less concentrated time) as they get older, get jobs, etc. (They're both in their early teens.) My apartment currently has two full baths, which I love and will miss, but it's not realistic to make it a condition for sale.

I WILL like look at putting at least a half bath into whatever basement I eventually own, if there isn't one already. That's not too hateful, expense or workwise, and would help give us something in an emergency.

The rest of thread is good reading.

So, you can't back out of the contract until you have a home inspection, yet the owners won't allow a home inspection unless you sign an addendum--which is bullshit, they should have included it in the original contract. I'm with you, you don't have to sign shit.
Fees associated with an FHA loan? What the hell are they talking about? Closing costs? Repair costs?

Well. They are in a worse position than you are, because they entered a contract with you, and cannot place the house back on the market until everything is resolved. I would wait for them to blink first, and either break the contract, or give in to a home inspection. What does your agent think you should do?

I have. And usually it means there's a broker rebate or some such chiseling going on.

Well, at least it won't be a long and drawn out process then. I hope you have better luck with the next house you guys find. We went through a similar experience when we tried to purchase our first house in Maryland back in 2004, and it was the worsts experience ever, and took us five years to even consider getting back into the game. Of course now, the house we bought has fallen to the housing crash and it worth an obscene 100k less than we would have paid for it, but it still felt rotten at the time.

Do you and your wife have any other properties in mind? Sometimes when you go back and revisit other homes, you find things that you love about them, and other things that might have been undesirable or deal breakers, turn out not to be quite so dire. I looked at about 70 houses and came back and looked at the model of our house at least 10 times before finally deciding.

Alex: run, don't walk, away from that property. If they blink before Wednesday and allow an inpection of the house, find SOME reason (ANY reason) to cancel the deal and get out of any kind of obligation to that property. You don't want it anymore. They're hiding something really bad that they KNOW will be a deal breaker (and cost the new owners a shitload of money). There's a better property out there for you.

Best of luck!

No, don't cancel it, but find SOMETHING, ANYTHING in that inspection report to cancel the purchase of the house. Let your realtor know your plans, and discuss the results of the inspection with both the realtor AND the inspector to find an 'out'. The cost of the inspection is peanuts compared to the money that you'd waste on the house.

You don't want this house anymore. Even if the inspection reveals nothing of importance, you'll always have this negative feeling towards the property because of this experience.

Alex, that is some weird stuff going on....but I've only been looking for a month, and have already experienced some weirdness.

Saturday, my realtor scheduled four properties for us to look at. Third place was, according to her notes, vacant and the realtor had given her the lockbox combo and the greenlight for us to look at the house.

We show up, completely within the time frame agreed to, but find an SUV in the driveway. It snowed Friday night, and I can tell the tire tracks from the SUV are fresh. We check the front door: no lockbox. My realtor rings the doorbell, while I go around back. The lockbox is on the backdoor, which also has a storm door on it. And there are footbprints from the SUV to the backdoor - again, fresh and clear, so it was done shortly before we arrived there.

The storm door is locked - we can't get to the lockbox. No one answers the door, despite there obviously being someone there. We left, as we were starting to get a weird vibe. No big loss, as the house was on the low end of what I'm looking for and had an overgrown yard.

But it was still strange. They knew we were coming, had agreed to the viewing - but then showed up first and locked up the house? WTF?

I can kinda top that, Michael.

When we were looking for our house, our realtor (who was GREAT) brought us to this one place that we really wanted to check out. She made arrangements, got the right permissions, etc... The place was empty (the owners had moved out), so we were really walking into a perfect situation.

This was on a Saturday.

We met our realtor at her office and we went over to check out the place at around noon. She opened the door and led us around the place, and we were really liking it up until the point that we went upstairs. Our realtor stopped us at the top of the stairs and had us be quiet. She listened, thinking that she'd heard something. We moved on and continued checking out the upstairs. I opened a bedroom door (why is this door shut?) and saw a guy sleeping in a sleeping bag in the middle of the floor. I quietly called our realtor over, and she FREAKED out.

Holy shit, this is supposed to be empty! She grabbed us and we booked down the stairs and out the front door. My realtor and my wife were both in OH MY GOD OH MY GOD mode while I just laughed. As we drove away, our realtor got on her cellphone and made a bunch of calls, and I honestly don't know what became of the house or the intruder.

My wife and I still laugh over that.

OK, you win the weirdness contest.

Back when I was married and we were looking for our first house (1995), we made an appointment to look at a property that could be politely called a "fixer upper." We were inexperienced home buyers, and from the outside, it didn't look that bad.

When the realtor for the property met us there, we went to the door and the first thing he said was "You don't want to buy this house." And he was right; it was a nice big house, but needed tens of thousands of dollars of work. They had PAINTED all the hardwood floors. The basement was also scary as hell; crumbling, wet walls that looked more cave than building and cables and wires hanging from the ceiling all over the place.

Looked at another house this weekend; beautiful big place, built in 1901. Gorgeous wood trim and arched doorways. BIG, too, with high ceilings. Except the basement...the first room was cramped and small, but OK for storage and tools. The second "room" was pretty much a cave: the furnace was there, but all dirt floors, with the "walls" being earth (you could actually see sedimentary layers). Part of me wanted to buy the house simply for the "!" factor...but my better judgment won the day.

Oh god, I know it's petty and ridiculous, but a squatter would have absolutely been a deal breaker for me. Grossness!

Trying to buy a house in California last year was the worst experience ever. The market was saturated with short sales, shitty foreclosures, and stubborn sellers who refused to face up to the realities of the market. After searching for a month and getting absolutely nowhere, I gave up on the fantasy of buying an existing home in an established neighborhood, and we went for broke on a brand new townhome in a "newish", developed area and never looked back. The builders were desperate and gave us everything we asked for, and threw in all sorts of incentives and extra cash just to make sure we didn't go to the other new housing developments up the block. We didn't get everything we wanted, but we got everything we needed, and in our desired area, for less than we originally planned to spend.

We're young, and maybe we can buy our dream house in 10 years or so once the market settles down a bit. We don't regret our choice, but it cost some serious money to give this place some "character", and to not make it look sterile and cold. Don't take for granted the work and love that previous owners already put in the house for you, including appliances, window treatments, paint, etc.

Alex, good luck with the inspection, but just remember that inspectors don't necessarily find everything, and those sellers are shady and definitely hiding something. And sad to say, their ages kind of give the idea that they probably were unable to care for the house the way a young couple might have, so definitely take that into consideration as well.

I'll throw in a couple of notes from my experiences (over 5 years old now and in Hockeyland) though I don't have anything "weird":
- One small house we were considering had lots of obvious nice renos and improvements done recently. Upon inspection, however, we found most of the renos weren't done to code plus evidence of a leaking building envelope was found.
- Another, much larger house we kept trying to see over the period of six months with various excuses being thrown our way to delay things ("it's Chinese New Year", "away on vacation", etc.). Owners finally fessed up to a leaky envelope.
- Our agent showed us the hidden realtor notes (realtors have a large info system that the public can't see as part of the listings database) for a place that confirmed it was a grow-op.
- Another set of owners wanted an open-ended clause in the purchase that allowed them to search for a new home and stall completion until they found one they liked, i.e., hold onto our deposit until they moved.

Two pieces of advice:
- find a great home inspector, and
- if it's an issue, at least title insurance and/or a great lawyer

House buying is probably the most stressful process for the average person. Important thing is to always get things in writing and to not panic when things seem to go wrong. It is your job to make sure everyone you've hired is doing their job. Call everyone every day and make sure the lawyer is filing the paperwork, make sure the realtor is constantly communicating with the seller, make sure the mortgage processor knows who you are and is processing. Keep calling them, keep asking what else needs to be done and ensure people do it. Keep on them because if you don't, your paperwork gets placed on the bottom of the pile and you miss your closing date. It's up to you to make sure no one gets lazy on you so bug the hell out of these people.

To add to odd stories, I'm surprised noone's mentioned walking into a crack house when house hunting. I've bought 2 places in the last 6 years and both times, i have encountered crack houses while shopping. And they were not in bad neighborhoods either. The 2nd time, we found crackheads all sprawled out in a room, zonked out and a whole walk in closet was full of voodoo-christian paraphelia with incense and demonic imagery everywhere. I immediately was reminded of Seagal's Marked for Death and nearly yelled to my wife and realtor, "holy shit, jamaican drug posses, let's get the fuck outta here." We hauled outta there and never looked back.

Good luck with the inspection but I'm with Judas. If there's a repair that will cost more than a hundred dollars take that as your chance to get the hell out.

BTW, tag along with the inspector. Ask him to look at anything that makes you feel oogy. You're paying him to help you out.

Jesus! That's some sad ass shit right there.

May not have been a squatter. Could have been a real estate agent saving money. We had a guy in Calgary who had his license revoked because he was sleeping in empty houses so he didn't have to pay rent. He'd been doing it for eight years!

When we bought the house I currently live in last year, we were lucky in the fact it was a highly motivated seller. Motivated to the point that our last offer was actually higher than the sellers final counter offer, contingent on us being able to close less than a week before Christmas (we first saw the house about a week and a half before Thanksgiving, so he was looking to get this thing done lickety split). Hell, he even threw in the fridge and the washer and dryer, which were less than 2 years old. Everything was going along very smooth all the way up to the day we closed. My wife and I meet up with our realtor and go to the house for the final walk-through (the seller was supposed to be making some very minor repairs, so we wanted to make sure they were done). We get to the house, walk inside - and find that the owner had seemingly done ABSOLUTELY NO FUCKING PACKING. Everything looked exactly like it did the last time we saw the house, maybe 10 days prior. There are still things hanging on the wall, furniture in every room, I mean it looked nothing like a house that was supposed to be vacated in 3 hours should look.
We also slowly realized that, despite the stereo being on very loudly and the front door being wide open, the owner was not home. My realtor is by this point on the phone with the seller's realtor, and the seller's realtor shows up 5 minutes later, apologizing profusely. Turns out that the seller DID NOT REALIZE THAT HE HAD TO BE OUT OF THE HOUSE TODAY. Time is slowly creeping by, and now we call our attorney to let him know what's up and tell him there is no way we can close today. The next 90 minutes included a flurry of phone calls between attorneys and realtors and us and the seller. We finally agree to give the seller until 9:00 pm to clear out (something that seemed to be impossible - how do you pack and move an entire house in, at that point, about 8 hours?). He ends up finishing getting everything out of the house around 11:00, we end up doing the final walk-through at 11:30 that night and sign the final papers just after 1:00 am.

Holy shit, Raspberry. How long did the idiot think that he had to vacate the house? Also, there's no way that the house was clean when you took possession of it. Having to do a full cleaning of the house before you could even move your stuff in...that would have sucked.

He had about a dozen people helping him, including one person who would just clean each room as it was emptied. His realtor was actually amazed at the efficiency in which everything was done.

As far as when did the seller think he had to vacate - I don't know. He just didn't think it was that day. His realtor swore up and down that, though it shouldn't need to be said, she told him he had to be out before the closing, and then told him again very recently after he had said something that led her to believe that he was confused.

Anyone thinking of buying a house and anyone who has actually purchased a house needs to listen to Spalding Gray's "Terrors of Pleasure" monologue. It details his horrible experiences buying a cabin in upstate New York. It's amazing and hilarious.

Also, there's a bit on the most recent Patton Oswalt CD about how Patton and his wife interrupted an orgy while house hunting. It's also amazing, and can be heard here: http://www.videosift.com/video/Patton-Oswalt-Orgy

Fucksquatch has just entered my vocabulary.

Also, first time homebuyers should engross themselves in HGTV's three house buying programs--House Hunters, Property Virgins, and especially My First Place. HH is actually real estate porn, but it's fun knowing about property values in different parts of the country (and Toronto), and some of the buyers are such idiots, fawning over cheap granite countertops when there's 50k worth of landscaping to be done.

PV and MFP is a more accurate look at the process of homebuying, what kind of fees and costs to expect, etc.
Every night during primetime is the First Time Homebuyer's block, so check it out.

Aesthetic Considerations:

Proximity — commute, schools, transit, employment (for renter, if sweeted), parks, grocery store,

Neighbours — check for signs of mental illness, obstinance, wierdness, or deliquence; a bad neighbour cause headaches and can reduce property values.

Community — is it a strong community?

Walkability — walkable neighbourhoods are preferable.

Demographic — is it a fit?

Structural Considerations:

1) Roof, obviously. New is best. Insulated attic or roofspace.

2) Soffit. A strong soffit is preferable; provides shade and protection form elements. In buildings with narrow soffting, look for staining below windows and at the apex of walls. (Builders will minimize soffits if projection is included in envelope calculations, in order to maximize square footage. Not a good practice.)

3) Siding. Condition; often dependant on soffit. Interior walls plumb to 1/4" over 8' — levels are cheap, use dicretion re: wall finish, building age, etc.

4) Foundation. Concrete. Sealed. Drain tile system in place and functioning. Building not positioned in geographical "valley." Bulding not constructed on expanding clay or unconsolidated substrate.

5) Electrical. Modern. Inspected and compliant.

6) Plumbing. Modern. Inspected and compliant. Taste tapwater.

7) Flooring. Level. Aesthetically pleasing. Laminate lifespan limited. Carpet should be new.

8) Heating and cooling. Ask to see bills. A good system is pointless in the face of poor insulating.

9) Doors and windows. Open/close. Drafts.

10) Appliances. Working.

11) Decks. Run hose on vinyl on concrete deck. Ensure drainage.

12)Cosmetic damage. Easy homeowner fixes: drywall, paint, electrical fixtures (ugly, poor lighting), door and cabinet hardware, gardens.