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A.V. Club's Best of the Decade: The Best TV series of the ’00s - Page 2

post #51 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:46pm
South Park is way hit or miss.

Should have had The Mighty Boosh, but I can imagine they were thinking of shows more available.
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post #52 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post

Should have had The Mighty Boosh, but I can imagine they were thinking of shows more available.
Tim & Eric is as available as Mighty Boosh.
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post #53 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:50pm
Man, I really need to watch Deadwood.

Couldn't be happier to see The Shield in the top ten. Also, I'd rank The Office (UK) higher but that's just me. Surprised to see The Venture Brothers on there and am a bit disappointed by no It's Always Sunny.
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post #54 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:53pm
Also, The West Wing should have been way higher.
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post #55 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:54pm
Tim & Eric = deserving.

Eastbound & Down = come on.

I mean, I liked that show and all, but it doesn't belong on this list. Not while so many other greats are excluded.
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post #56 of 169
11/12/09 at 6:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humanoid View Post
One foreign show?
Conchords counts too I reckon, it's NYC on HBO but the humour is pure NZ. So, two really. And good call on The Boosh Andre, they would have fitted into that company just fine.
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post #57 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:06pm
Pretty good top 10 with a few exceptions, but the rest? Meh... not so much. But, personal tastes and all that.
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post #58 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:09pm
Where's Wonderfalls or Pushing Daisies?

Also Veronica Mars ranked higher than The West Wing?
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post #59 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:26pm
Again, I think they viewed consistancy as a backbone, which is why so many short run shows did so well. Veronica Mars had three Stellar Seasons, I don't know a West Wing Fan that doesn't think at least one season stank on ice.
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post #60 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:29pm
I fucking hate Tim and Eric. It's such a bullshit pile of non-entertainment, and I am in a constant state of pissed offedness that so many respectable people enjoy it. It's fucking wannabe Kaufman horse shit, and sub Tom Green, but it's 'ironic' so it must be genius.
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post #61 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
It's fucking wannabe Kaufman horse shit, and sub Tom Green, but it's 'ironic' so it must be genius.

I vehemently disagree with all of that. It isn't "ironic." And it damn sure isn't aping Kaufman. If you think that, I'm not sure your understanding of Kaufman's humor is up to snuff (no offense).

It's genuinely hilarious most of the time. Is it bizarre? Wildly. But you certainly can't say it's unique.

And personally, when it's on (which for my money is about 96% of the time), it makes me laugh harder than just about anything.
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post #62 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:34pm
It's Dadaism for beginners who don’t want to read the textbook or graduate the class. I fucking hate it.
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post #63 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
I fucking hate it.
Duly noted.


While I love it and definitely think it belongs on that list, I'd be lying if I didn't cop to this show being a very love it or hate it show, and one that I can certainly understand people hating on.
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post #64 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:38pm
Tim and Eric is closer in tone to Wonder Showzen than to anything Kaufman ever did, though I agree that it doesn't quite deserve to be on this list. I'd put something like Extras over it any day of the week.
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post #65 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:39pm
For me, Tim & Eric is like looking at paintings of cubes and triangles at the MoMA. I know some people understand it, love it, and respect it, but I think it's crap and I'm a bit pissed off that somebody got money and acclaim for it.

But I don't fault other people for their enjoyment. Hell, what do I care?
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post #66 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Humanoid View Post
Tim and Eric is closer in tone to Wonder Showzen than to anything Kaufman ever did, though I agree that it doesn't quite deserve to be on this list. I'd put something like Extras over it any day of the week.
Oh, fuck me. I'd managed to forget the gross oversight of Extras until now. That show is every bit as brilliant as The Office, and easily deserves to be placed above the US Office, and damn near every other comedy on there.
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post #67 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:40pm
It also serves no important place on the list. It doesn't do anything other shows weren't doing in the late '90s, specifically Mr. Show.

Edit: or Wonder Showzen, which made the list.
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post #68 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
It also serves no important place on the list. It doesn't do anything other shows weren't doing in the late '90s, specifically Mr. Show.
Yes it does. It's radically different from Mr. Show in damn near every conceivable way.
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post #69 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
It also serves no important place on the list. It doesn't do anything other shows weren't doing in the late '90s, specifically Mr. Show.
Mr. Show should have been on this list. Yes, I know when it was made.
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post #70 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeypants View Post
Oh, fuck me. I'd managed to forget the gross oversight of Extras until now. That show is every bit as brilliant as The Office, and easily deserves to be placed above the US Office, and damn near every other comedy on there.
Again, that show was hugely inconsistant, and suffers in direct comparison to The Office (UK).
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post #71 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeypants View Post
Yes it does. It's radically different from Mr. Show in damn near every conceivable way.
That's hyperbole and you know it.
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post #72 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:45pm
First list in a while I don't have big problems with, but then, when the AV Club does a list, they do it right. I would rank West Wing higher on the strength of the second half of the first season through season four alone, but you all know I'm biased about that. Seasons five and half of six drag that show's points down, but it finishes fairly strong. Seven was the first time that the show felt like it did when Sorkin was writing it.

I also think Buffy should have been higher, but then I'm one of those freaks who prefers the post-h.s. years to the h.s. ones. Seven and five are my top two seasons of that show.

Glad to see Eastbound and Down. My obscure choice/selection would have been Slings and Arrows.
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post #73 of 169
11/12/09 at 7:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post
Again, that show was hugely inconsistant, and suffers in direct comparison to The Office (UK).
Strongly disagree. I don't think there's a weak or inconsistent Extras in the run of the series (thanks to their restraint in once again sticking with only two 6 episode seasons). I also think it holds up as a brilliant sophomore effort next to The Office. And it's slightly more accessible to snobbish American audiences thanks to the regular inclusion of widely known star actors.

It also manages to not succumb to being The Office: Part 2. Gervais plays about as different a character as he can while still retaining his patented comedic charm, and Merchant adds a whole new level of hilarity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
That's hyperbole and you know it.
They're sketch comedy shows. They both feature Bob Odenkirk and David Cross. They both have featured lampoons of various popular (and not so popular) products. That's about all I can think of.

Everything else is pretty different. I don't think I was being hyperbolic at all. Care to explain how they're so similar?
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post #74 of 169
11/12/09 at 8:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeypants View Post
30 Rock ahead of Curb? Fucking please.

Curb should've been much, much higher. That's a top 10 show, easy.
I don't get the love for Curb. Maybe it's my dislike for the schlemiel archetype but I find nothing to enjoy in the show.
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post #75 of 169
11/12/09 at 8:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeypants View Post
They're sketch comedy shows. They both feature Bob Odenkirk and David Cross. They both have featured lampoons of various popular (and not so popular) products. That's about all I can think of.

Everything else is pretty different. I don't think I was being hyperbolic at all. Care to explain how they're so similar?
You're word choice was hyperbole ('It's radically different from Mr. Show in damn near every conceivable way'). Besides the stuff you pointed out, both shows run on that awkward brand of humor, and both feature a similar sort of disdain for their audiences. It wasn't the best choice on my part. Wonder Showzen is a much better example. I concede.
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post #76 of 169
11/12/09 at 8:21pm
Yeah, I'll agree there. Wonder Showzen is much more of a companion. Ultimately, I like Tim & Eric a lot more. I found Wonder Showzen a bit too ugly at times (it's very hard to get me to feel that way, too).
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post #77 of 169
11/12/09 at 8:28pm
Well, I didn't like either of them. I'm desperately trying to find something positive to say about Xavier Renegade Angel (from the Wonder Showzen people) for a review right now.

On subject, my vote for something to add to the list is too childish and nerdy, so I'm just gonna keep it to myself...
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post #78 of 169
11/12/09 at 9:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
Where's Wonderfalls or Pushing Daisies?

Also Veronica Mars ranked higher than The West Wing?
There's a seperate "best of the '00 one season shows" article.
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post #79 of 169
11/12/09 at 9:35pm
I wish Pushing Daisies had made it, but oh well.

I think Tim and Eric are very talented. I still don't like their show.

EDIT: I would have also put AD at #2, simply because I think the best comedy of all time should be ranked ahead of the 2nd best drama of all time. Arbitrary? Absolutely.
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post #80 of 169
11/12/09 at 9:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
Well, I didn't like either of them. I'm desperately trying to find something positive to say about Xavier Renegade Angel (from the Wonder Showzen people) for a review right now.

On subject, my vote for something to add to the list is too childish and nerdy, so I'm just gonna keep it to myself...
Don't worry buddy, I know what you're thinking and I got your back on it. Angry Beavers all the fuckin' way!!!
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post #81 of 169
11/12/09 at 9:48pm
Well, you have the right network....
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post #82 of 169
11/12/09 at 10:10pm
Like the american Office, or Arrested Development, HIMYM takes a while to get really funny. It's not that the scripting was ever bad, it's just that the jokes aren't that funny until you know the characters and get the recurring gags. It is sentimental, but once you care about the characters, you probably won't mind as much. Worth watching the first half a dozen episodes in order. I watched a few random episodes and thought it was shit until I started from the beginning. Like I said, it is the most cleverly structured sitcom since Arrested Development. It has one of the best casts on TV too, not a single weak link.
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post #83 of 169
11/12/09 at 10:28pm
How did I forget about Carnivale and Pushing Daisies. Both shows I will champion until my death. Love them dearly and sad to see them not make the cut over some that did.
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post #84 of 169
11/12/09 at 11:48pm
I know it's not nearly as popular as The Office in the US but no Peep Show was surprising to me. I would think it's the type of show the chaps at The AV Club would be very much into.

It's just finished it's 6th series over here and for me it's as consistently funny as Arrested Development, Curb and The Office. It does the awkward/embarrassing comedy thing so well but also has the unique device of hearing the two main characters internal thoughts which are frequently darkly hilarious and bizarre.

Jeremy's crackhead best friend, Superhans, is one of my favourite comedy characters of all time.
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post #85 of 169
11/13/09 at 12:24am
Thread Starter 
I would have enjoyed a minimum amount of episodes requirement for the list. I'd rank The West Wing and South Park (which yes, I'll bring up again, as indefensible for being left off the list) warts and all than less than three hours total material from Eastbound.

Rating a great series has to include longevity (and yes, this is a major strike against The Office (UK) however, it's massive impact allows it to slide by) otherwise you end up with a "brilliant but canceled" list.
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post #86 of 169
11/13/09 at 12:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post
Again, I think they viewed consistancy as a backbone, which is why so many short run shows did so well. Veronica Mars had three Stellar Seasons, I don't know a West Wing Fan that doesn't think at least one season stank on ice.
Actually, season three of VERONICA MARS was borderline terrible. But, man, oh, man, is season one perfect television.

WEST WING should have been higher.
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post #87 of 169
11/13/09 at 12:46am
I agree with Joey, Extras was pretty amazing. And also agree on the love for Curb that show should be much higher than the way over rated 30 crock.

If the two seasons of Firefly makes it elligible for the list, shouldn't Rome be on it somewhere too? Peep Show!
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post #88 of 169
11/13/09 at 12:54am
I was pleasantly surprised by this list, especially with the inclusion of Friday Night Lights. But yeah, I'd make the argument for both Scrubs and South Park to be somewhere in there, as their highs are just as good as some of the top shows on the list. I've always felt that HIMYM was a weaker version of Scrubs (so basically Scrubs seasons 6 and 7), and the American Office is worse than both South Park and Scrubs.
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post #89 of 169
11/13/09 at 1:24am
Mostly very happy with this list and, yeah, we do live in a golden age of sorts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Powers View Post
It's Dadaism for beginners who don’t want to read the textbook or graduate the class. I fucking hate it.
Dadaism isn't really about reading the textbooks or graduating the class though, is it? Not saying that's a good thing mind.

Don't really get people saying West Wing shoulda been higher, either - I saw the first season of that show and I dug it but thought it was basically well written wish fulfillment fantasies for liberals. Great comfort food during the Bush era, but it painted politics as such a cleaner business than it really is.
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post #90 of 169
11/13/09 at 1:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielRoffle View Post
Dadaism isn't really about reading the textbooks or graduating the class though, is it? Not saying that's a good thing mind.
I know, that's not what I meant exactly. I'm not as clever as I wish I was.
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post #91 of 169
11/13/09 at 1:50am
I hate to post like a fucking fannerd, all screwy punctuation and all - but -

Where. The FUCK. Is SPACED???11?
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post #92 of 169
11/13/09 at 2:21am
Spaced was canceled in 1999.
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post #93 of 169
11/13/09 at 2:47am
It was never cancelled, Cap'n Powers - the creative team just got a bit busy.

There were two seasons. The first aired in 1999, and the second began in 2001. By the shotty rationale the list was assembled with (many of the shows began in '99, and Buffy started in '97 - so it would appear that, so long as there were first-run episodes broadcast in 2000, a series is considered eligible) - Spaced counts.
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post #94 of 169
11/13/09 at 3:46am
Pretty good list. I gotta agree with some that 30 is an awfully big number for a list of this type, but there have been a lot of shows coming and going within the past decade, many worth notice. That said, I find it interesting that they have a separate list for the one-season wonder shows, but put Firefly in the main "best" list. I loved the show, but mostly because it appealed to a lot of my personal tastes/sensibilities and I really don't think it belongs here. If another Whedon show had to be represented here it should definitely be Angel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post
Again, I think they viewed consistancy as a backbone, which is why so many short run shows did so well. Veronica Mars had three Stellar Seasons, I don't know a West Wing Fan that doesn't think at least one season stank on ice.
I would say Veronica had one Stellar Season, one More Ambitious But Not Quite As Good Season, and one I Can See What They're Going For But It Doesn't Quite Work Season. That said, I loved the show and would keep it on the list for the extremely strong performances from the leads, particularly Bell and Colantoni.
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post #95 of 169
11/13/09 at 3:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Pollock View Post
It was never cancelled, Cap'n Powers - the creative team just got a bit busy.

There were two seasons. The first aired in 1999, and the second began in 2001. By the shotty rationale the list was assembled with (many of the shows began in '99, and Buffy started in '97 - so it would appear that, so long as there were first-run episodes broadcast in 2000, a series is considered eligible) - Spaced counts.
Huh, I thought both seasons aired in '99. Shows how good my memory works. Kinda stupid that Buffy counts, though, gotta say.
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post #96 of 169
11/13/09 at 6:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diva View Post
How did I forget about Carnivale and Pushing Daisies. Both shows I will champion until my death. Love them dearly and sad to see them not make the cut over some that did.
Both of those shows had episodes on the "didn't make the cut, but still really good" list. Like I said, they did their homework.

And I think the idea with Spaced was that -- as opposed to the British Office -- it never got a full and uncut run on US tv, if I'm not mistaken. If we're going international, then yeah, there are some big gaps.

How I Met Your Mother: Come for Neil Patrick Harris' comic timing, stay for Jason Segel's.
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post #97 of 169
11/13/09 at 6:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielRoffle View Post
Don't really get people saying West Wing shoulda been higher, either - I saw the first season of that show and I dug it but thought it was basically well written wish fulfillment fantasies for liberals. Great comfort food during the Bush era, but it painted politics as such a cleaner business than it really is.
This is so unbelivably wrong I don't know where to begin. I mean, yeah, you're right, but what a shallow interpretation, especially since season two is, hands down, one of the greatest tv seasons out there -- not a single bad episode in the bunch, not a single good one either. All are very good or better.
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post #98 of 169
11/13/09 at 6:29am
THE WEST WING is a liberal show, but it's certainly not "wish fulfillment". It deserves to be higher, most definitely. Even the worst season has "The Supremes", which was a better hour of television than half the stuff on the list.

Second Andre's call for BOOSH to be on there. ANd maybe it's just me, but DEADWOOD shoulda been top five.
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post #99 of 169
11/13/09 at 6:52am
I'm under the impression that the reason South Park or Spaced aren't on the list is that they both started showing in the 90's, so technically they aren't series of the '00s. Because otherwise there is absolutely no excuse as to why SP wouldn't be on there.

EDIT: Oops, didn't notice that Buffy was on the list.
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post #100 of 169
11/13/09 at 7:16am
Personally I don't really rate the Boosh. If I was to add another british show I'd go for Peep Show and/or Jam, but sadly I don't think either have much of a profile in the US.
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