What ever happened to DVD extras?

I'm just speculating, but I think some of the controversies arising from comments made on commentaries and extras over the years have led to the watering down of extras in general. Also, putting together a comprehensive package isn't cheap, DVDs aren't selling as well as they used to (I think), etc.

Sometimes it's just prep for a double dip. Other times it seems like the filmmaker's choice. PT Anderson has been pretty selfish with the extras ever since the fantastic Boogie Nights dvd that came out. Then you have company's putting more on BD than on the DVDs as incentive to pay the extra money for BD. There are too many reasons on a film by film basis to know for sure if it's a real trend or not.

It may be as simple as the fact that what was once novel and guaranteed to get a consumer dollar just doesn't matter much to the public anymore. I'm as guilty as anyone. Give me a good commentary track on a new film and I'm a happy guy. I don't need to see computer programmers putting together a scene over the course of an hour long doc. Although for older movies I still like to gorge on minutia.

I can see actors and directors getting tired of doing commentaries after the first few as well.

As someone forced to watch all the extras on all the discs they send me I can say that the commentary is alive and well. PTA quit them after Boogie Nights for some reason, though. There are certain filmmakers that just don't like the process, and most big name guys are pretty consistent in their love or hate of the process. I actually think things kind of peaked with the Lord of the Rings EE releases, but every year there are plenty of releases with good extras. There are even a couple discs I've reviewed recently that were worth it for the extras over the film, like Gamer and Benjamin Button.

Here are a couple "Best of the Decade" lists that suggest some of the very best DVD/Blu-ray sets have come out in just the last few years, long after the LOTR sets:

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articl...man020510.html

http://www.dvdverdict.com/decadedecisions

Much like the movies themselves, I think the ratio of good-to-bad DVD releases is about the same as it ever was. It's just that maybe the general public's excitement for them has waned. And even DVD reviewers seem to have lost interest. I see so many reviews of discs filled with inaccuracies, not to mention a fair number of "reviews" that have clearly cribbed from those reviews, as evidenced by those same inaccuracies getting carried over.

That was an incredibly rare occurrence and limited to the relative early days of DVD extras. And Schwarzengger's fee was for TOTAL RECALL, not CONAN. And to say that DVD extras in general "went down the tubes" across the board over this makes no sense to me, especially since most actors are terrible at commentaries, and even more especially, since so many amazing DVD sets were produced in the wake of this.

I don't necessarily disagree with the thesis, but that list sucks.

I think the line between genuinely cool extras and studio sanctioned garbage EPK shit is pretty much what has turned people off. You had some really bitching extras in the early days from cool geek movies like T2, Boogie Nights, Fight Club, Alien Quadrilogy, LOTR, etc...these were movies people had loved and had always wanted to see how they got made...once all those films had come and gone, there really was nothing left to get excited about...the newer releases were too fresh to fawn over the extras...the people who actually enjoy the extras in the first place probably don't care to see the finer points of The Fast And The Furious dissected. I'm sure there are still cool extras out there, but all the really interesting stuff has come and gone for people who actually watch this stuff.

I think Ambler's got it right.

Also, I don't get the point of Rian Johnson's list. His thesis may be that DVD commentaries shouldn't exist, but I can't tell if he's criticizing some of those or not. Some of them read like praises.

I just saw TIOL with Ricky Gervais and it had some of the more interesting bonus features I've seen in a while. They're brutally honest and are full of actors saying nasty things about Gervais, and it chronicles the troubles the movie had (how it was supposed to be Gervais' directorial debut, but ended up being co-directed), how it had a 3 million dollar pre credits sequence that got cut because it sucked, ETC.

Mmm. Hated Invention of Lying (hate is strong, but whatever), but your description of the extras intrigue me. I may check that out. Thanks Kate.

NP. I was kind of shocked they included it. Like, I get that they were doing "honest" bonus features (The doc is called, like, "An 'Honest' Look at Ricky Gervais"), but still, it can't have helped Gervais to have everyone in Hollywood talking about how annoying he is.

Jason Bateman in particular seems to hate the guy. His description of Gervais' laugh is one of the cruelest things I've heard in a while.


I liked TIOL (or The Story of Truth or This Side of the Truth, or whatever it's called), it has moments of brilliance and it made me cry a few times, but it's very flawed and the scrip doesn't know what to focus on. The whole "invention of religion" should have been at the end of the movie, and the romance was incredibly annoying. I get what he was going for (saying that the "which guy will she choose? Ben Stiller or Ethan Hawke?" thing in rom coms is all about genetics and nothing else), but it went on far too long like a painfully unfunny sketch, and Garner had no chemistry with him.

Judging by the extras (no pun intended!!*) , that's not a surprise.

*To be honest, my use of italics is a clear indicator that I did intend to make a pun

Well, I figured this was the case anyway, but from the way you describe the features it's clear that this is just another example of Gervais taking the piss out of Hollywood backpatting. Still, sounds fun.

I think the problem is with the perception, not the actuality. People watch their DVD choices, which by and large only represent a tiny fraction of the overall content available worldwide, and assume that they have an accurate snapshot of the state of the industry. The percentage of disappointing extras in anyone's DVD collection might be high but that doesn't mean there aren't enough quality extras out there to make the whole endeavor worthwhile.

I agree that the bloom is off the rose in terms of overall novelty but to say that commentaries shouldn't exist because of a few clunkers is nonsense. I think a better argument to make against commentaries is that they can demystify the film to the point where you are no longer immersed in it moving forward or, worse, they provide specific authoritative interpretation of subtext and ambiguities that should remain open to consideration and debate. But as the consumer, it's entirely your choice as to whether you listen to the commentary or not, so I'm not sure that argument holds much water either.

Yes, they were definitely doing it as a joke about all the back-patting extras.. but that doesn't change the fact that there seems to be real (non tongue in cheek) venom towards Gervais coming from the cast and crew.

It's very unflattering.

Definitely. I have little doubt there is still quality stuff coming around, but when DVDs reached their peak a while ago, there was just so much saturation of 'SPECIAL EDITIONS' that I got pretty numbed to it. It takes a bit of research to find out whether or not the special features are actually any good and frankly, I've lost the energy for that. There's just too much obligatory crap out there to sort through.

And as someone mentioned above, learning how the big VFX extravaganzas were made by someone sitting at a computer for a year is dull compared to learning how the pioneers had to use their ingenuity to get what they wanted.

Right, I still think commentaries can be worthwhile, it completely depends on the quality of the film. I think it's absolutely admirable to see a great film broken down by the filmmaker, but I think it's a complete waste of time on most studio sanctioned stuff, which is just some journeyman filmmaker trying to justify his job. Or maybe he really thinks he's some auteur...which is even sadder.

On the other hand, I can see fans pulling back the throttle because commentaries and extras do really demystify the process and by the time people realize this, it's often too late, and they now know more than they wanted to know.

My interest level in extras has dipped significantly over the past ten years, but I still feel a pang of disappointment when I pick up a DVD and notice that it doesn't have a commentary or the special features are nil. "The Dark Knight" has almost next to nothing in terms of extras, but "Hellboy II" is packed to Abe Sapien's gills with additional content. You can tell which filmmakers really are DVD aficionados like us.

I've found that the films that took awhile to land on DVD have some of the better features. I couldn't get enough of all the making-of docs and short films on the "Hardware" disc. Cult movies tend to have less toothless EPK bullshit, too. Nothing's more tired than talking-head interviews where everyone goes on and on about what a pleasure it was to work with everyone.

I think this is MAJOR reason people aren't really into extras anymore...with the older films, it had been so long since release, that filmmakers and crew saw the dvd extras as the time to vent and clear the air...they weren't afraid of admitting it was a shitty, hellish production where people nearly came to blows...my favorite is the Alien Quadrilogy, just the best dvd box set in the history of the medium...with the biggest silent answer ever in Fincher's total absence and refusal to participate. That one gesture said more than he could ever have in a tell-all-interview. Or on the Boogie Nights tracks where PTA had certain actors over to his to his place to record the actor commentaries...you can even hear him cooking eggs in the background...when does that ever happen in a commentary??? My favorite is when Riley and Cheadle spoke about how much of a douche bag Mark Wahlberg was, and PT had talked to Marky Marky about it when he was over for his portion, and Wahlberg's cell kept ringing.

I want that DVD more than I want my next meal. I want to see the movie before Harvey Scissor Hands got his hands.. er, scissors, on it. GONY is one of my favorite films, and I want to see the 3-5 hour version

I'm sad to learn that the fee was for Total Recall and not Conan, because his Conan commentary is only the greatest of all commentaries. WORTH IT.

I'm sad to learn he didn't just do it because he's a decent guy who'd have fun revisiting a classic film from his early career. I like the TR one alot, but if he's getting paid 75k to do it that's kind of lame.

There's something to be said for novelty, and I have to hand it to whoever it was at Criterion who realized they could use Laserdisc's parallel digital and analog tracks to support alternate content. But the original commentaries were done by film scholars, for films 10 years and older. There was a historical reason Film A was getting a commentary, and the speakers had given considerable thought as to what they wanted to say.

If there's a problem today, it's the way that generating supplemental material has become an entrenched part of the production process, with the artists plunging right into commentary as soon as the film is locked. They often sound exhausted, and in some cases aren't familiar with the final version of the film. There's no opportunity for distance and reflection.

That said, Observe and Report was one of my favorite movies of the year, and yet I find myself holding off on DVD until an SE comes out. Clearly, I'm spoiled.

I thought NEW WORLD did finally get released in a long cut? (not like it matters because Netflix still just has the theatrical)

I'm pretty sure that TR track is from 2001 or 02 or something. It came out when I was in Highschool I think, because I remember watching it in 10th grade at a party (I did not see Richter there )

It's been over 5 years and I still don't own KILL BILL! I am a proud man.

I went to that movie on a field trip from school, oddly enough. I also do not own it on DVD.

Do you not like the film, or are you waiting for a definitive version?

Quentin Tarantino's an odd one actually. The extras on Resevoir Dogs are amazing, great documentary, great commentary. Pulp Fiction is interesting but it's nowhere near as loaded and Jackie Brown, Kill Bill and Death Proof might as well be bare bones. Even Inglourious Basterds feels fluffy, which is a shame because you'd think a man like QT would be all about the extras and special features.

He's definitely waiting for the definitive version.

Unlike me... who got bot Vol. 1 and Vol. 2 on release. AAAAND got the Japanese special edition with all the trimmings. The Crazy 88 sequence in color! Okinawa T-shirt! Hanzo Sword! Oh... the money I threw away. I'm weak.

How is that sequence in colour, I always liked the black and white. It felt, appropriate, and I loved the blink segue back into colour.

You're not missing anything. Other than color. Though I think there was a little more stuff with The Bride really toying with that Yakuza Kid she paddles with her sword later. I'm not totally sure. It's been a while since I watched it.

1. The knowledge of the "Whole Bloody Affair" cut makes me wait.
2. When I read that interview with the smug Miramax exec who likened holding out on the extras to "taking multiple bites of the apple," I got pissed and didn't pick them up out of protest.

I love KILL BILL and have seen it many times, but I'm not owning it until I get the Whole Bloody Affair. Is it an immature decision to make? Yes, but I'm a proud man, dammit.

That 'multiple bites at the apple' thing pissed me off too. And yet I ponied up the dough anyway. I'd say you're a lot more 'mature' about it than I was. At least in the fact that you showed patience and self-control. Hahaha.

Also, Spike... here's the wiki of the differences found in the Japanese cut of Vol. 1.

EDIT: Not really a list of anything. Just this paragraph.

The commentary track for the Coen Brothers' "Blood Simple" is hilarious. One of the first commentary tracks I listened to when I got my first DVD player.

I just got "Blade II" on the 2 disc New Line Platinum series DVD, and the commentaries are gold. Del Toro and Snipes especially. I found it fascinating to contrast Snipes & Goyer's commentary together, vs. Del Toro and Peter Frankfurt. Once I watched Del Toro's commentary on the deleted scenes, however, I realized that all Del Toro's comments on the main film about how the film needed "flow" were kinda overstated, since he seemed to like a lot of the deleted scenes. Frankfurt seemed to be the one who was the most enthusiastic about having cut lots of stuff out.

John Boorman's commentary on EXCALIBUR is gold. He really loved that movie, and the Arthurian myths.

Milla Jovavich's commentary track to "Ultraviolet" is a lot of fun too. Like Snipes in Blade II, she really gets into the film whenever her character is kicking some ass.

The cap is 30 minutes per video piece. Under that run time, it's considered promotional. That's why so many longer documentaries are broken up into sub-30-minute chapters. The "Play All" button then makes for a nice loophole in simulating a longform documentary experience.

It's much better in color.

The reason for it being in Black and White was aribitraray anyhow, (for the MPAA I believe) It was shot and composed in color, and that's how it should be seen.

There is nothing immature about being patient and not allowing yourself to be ripped off and double dipped (triple in this case) by greedy cocks. I wish there were more consumers like you so we could put an end to the nonsense and get proper value for our money THE FIRST TIME.

EPILOGUE: I saw KILL BILL vol 1 and 2 used for $2.50 a pop today. I didn't bite.

Yes yes, you're mature! We get it already!

I remember Chris Nolan and Spielberg saying something on the lines that the reason they don't do commentaries is they don't want to give away too much of the movie process and that movies are a collaborative process and its hard to just have a one or a few people really represent the total process.

Many other reasons special features are going down: double dips, costs, incentive to get the blu ray, & film makers not wanting to take away from the "magic" that is cinema. I kinda agree on the last point, as when you start to see little things you didn't see, it can take away from the experience you're supposed to be watching. When the truck flipped in the TDK, I was surprised. When I found out how they did it, the surprise was no longer there and it took away from the scene.

Of course different strokes for different folks. Some are not bothered by knowing.

I never knew this!! This makes so much sense, and is so depressing at the same time.

Edit: I still don't get this forum though. I've got Blade Runner, Iron Man, Hellboy 2, Night of the Creeps, Monster Squad, Hardware, Dust Devil, Wall-E, Star Trek (in all forms), Up, and especially Zodiac all looking at me as I type this. These are all incredibly packed discs, but any standards.

Well the forum exists because if you start to wonder if DVD's are lacking extras then all you will notice are those DVD's that lack extras. Also, if you Netlfix you're getting a lot of "rental" copies these days that totally lack extras. It's a perception thing. In the end, there are plenty of DVD's still packed with extras and plenty that aren't... as there always have been.

I still say the double dipping and rental copy BS has to stop, goddamnit.

This thread reminds me that I want to pick up that new AMERICAN WW IN LONDON disc with the new full-length doc, "Beware the Moon", on it.

I think that is a more specific subject, and interestingly applies much to the filmmakers themselves, along with studio interest. I've heard there was more to be done for the Fountain, but the studio didn't have interest in putting money into it. On the other hand Aaronofsky had no real interest in extras for The Wrestler. I think your memories of the Requiem For a Dream extras are a little off too. It felt like a big release in 2000, but compared to modern discs it doesn't have a lot. The website was more interesting, and I think Aaronofsky was simply excited by the two newish mediums.

Younger filmmakers seem to be more excited by the possibility of DVD extras. Eli Roth and Edgar Wright are good examples, we'll see what happens in the next ten years, though DVDs and Blu-rays might not last that long, making the whole discussion moot.

Criterion's the best about extras hands down and they still put out great commentaries from film scholars.
I wish I could remember where I read this but there was some guy who was hired to record a commentary for Criterion. After doing so, he wrote about his experience and talked about how much preparation and time he put into his research. It was great to see how much effort he put into it.