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CHUD Film Of The Month Club: Searching for Bobby Fischer/The Last Days of Disco

post #1 of 24
Thread Starter 

"He's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life."

Searching for Bobby Fischer
1993
Wr./Dir: Steven Zaillian
Starring: Max Pomeranc, Joe Mantenga, Ben Kingsley, Lawrence Fishburne
Cinematography: John Corso, Conrad L. Hall
Music: James Horner


"I consider you to be a person of some integrity, except in your dealings with women."

The Last Days of Disco
1998
Wr./Dir: Whit Stillman
Starring: Chloe Sevigny, Kate Beckinsale, Chris Eigeman, Mackenzie Astin, Robert Sean Leonard
Cinematography: John Thomas
Music: Mark Suozzo

I'll post my write-ups on these two movies later in the week, but definitely by the 1st of the month. I went for two fairly well known films, one which recently got a Criterion release on DVD after years of being out of print, but films that we haven't really talked about at length in this forum. Both of them are available on Netflix.

The theme is, roughly, coming of age in New York -- a New York that can be anywhere, but is still distinctly evocative of the city. More on that later...
post #2 of 24
Great! They'll be seen and posted about starting next week.
Haven't seen any of them, though i heard about Searching for...

Good picks!
post #3 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by RathBandu View Post
The theme is, roughly, coming of age in New York -- a New York that can be anywhere, but is still distinctly evocative of the city. More on that later...[/i]
Yeah, I'd like to hear a little more about this idea and how you mean it to relate to BOBBY FISCHER in particular. Do you mean in a visual sense? A "spiritual" sense?
post #4 of 24
'Searching for Bobby Fischer' is an excellent film. You'll love it, Tati.
post #5 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judas Booth View Post
'Searching for Bobby Fischer' is an excellent film. You'll love it, Tati.
My all-time favorite movie, for what it's worth. Hopefully we can get some discussion going. I'm very curious about DISCO, which I haven't seen.
post #6 of 24
Never seen either of these films so I'm guessing this is going to be a good start for me and the Film of the Month Club. It's a shame that this thread has gotten almost as many replies as the previous one, but I guess accesibility is paramount.
post #7 of 24
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan Banks is my hero View Post
Yeah, I'd like to hear a little more about this idea and how you mean it to relate to BOBBY FISCHER in particular. Do you mean in a visual sense? A "spiritual" sense?
I'll talk about this a little bit more later, but both films are universal when it comes to their themes (gifted children, fathers & sons, talent for Fischer, general twenty-something ennui and love in Disco). The films work on those levels because they feel very real, very relatable, very identifiable, regardless of when the viewer is watching them. I've seen Last Days of Disco at three key points in my life: as a teenager and as a young twenty-something not living in New York, and recently as an older twenty-something living in New York. The themes resonated with me for different reasons at each of those times.

However, while the themes they're discussing are universal -- the way they are about them is distinct to New York City. The chess community of Greenwich Village and the tables at Washington Square and the club scene of the early 80s are both places and periods that are unique to the city*, and those affect the way the stories are told. They feel like stories that can and are taking place anywhere -- there are always twenty-somethings looking for love, there are always white people with problems, there are always fathers trying to live out their dreams through their sons -- but these stories could only take place in New York.

Plus, neither of those places really exist anymore (I might have to take some pictures to show you what I mean, because the chess tables in Washington Square are gone due to this atrocious renovation the park's going through). The monologue at the end of Disco where a character talks about being old enough to having "lived through a period that has ended" is something that is universal, true, but it's also something that can be felt very keenly and very personally in New York, which Pete Hamill called "the capital of nostalgia."

...And I've said too much.

*Although you could argue that one of the reasons Disco works is because while it has a disco soundtrack, Stillman doesn't go for the obvious hits, choosing more obscure stuff, and he doesn't pop culture the place up. His mentions of current culture feel very natural, with the characters discussing Lady and the Tramp and Bambi and Wild Kingdom the way trying-too-hard intelligentsia discuss them.
post #8 of 24
Thread Starter 
Bumping this because it's now the first. I've decided I'm going to do my write-ups a little differently and spread them out over the month, so each week, I'll post a different write-up about one (or both) of the movies.
post #9 of 24
Just watched Searching for Bobby Fischer and I thought it was fantastic. Just pitch perfect performances, script and direction. It works on so many levels, an underdog story, a family story, a sports story, a gifted kid story, father-son issues and all that.

Loved Lawrence Fishburne, wished he'd have a little more to do specially at the beginning of the film, we see him taking notice of Josh and then he's already playing with him. I bet there are a few scenes missing there.
My favorite scene (besides the obvious "He's got it" at the end) is Joe Mantegna at the School. The way he talks to the teacher and says "he's more gifted at this than i'll ever be at anything in my life. Than You'll ever be at anything in your life".

If i have a small complaint, it's Josh himself. Even if the deadpan look and droopy eyes work for the character, he's a little stiff on some scenes.

Anyways, great great film.
post #10 of 24
Thread Starter 
The way Mantenga plays that scene is so brilliant. It makes the father-son story much more powerful, and makes Fred much more than a "bad dad." He knows that what he's saying is true, and it kills him. Part of the reason he goes off on Laura Linney is because he's being confronted by his own failures, as a writer, as a husband, as a father (because that's the implication there). In the book, Fred was also an amateur chess player inspired by Fischer's original run at the title. I'm glad they didn't make that as obvious, but it's still sort of there in the background.
post #11 of 24
Yeah, you can see in his eyes a hint of jealousy. Even if he's as proud as they get, he resents his kid a little bit for being so gifted. Really a fantastic scene.
post #12 of 24
http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...308110301/1023


btw, i should watch The Last Days of Disco either today or on Thursday.
post #13 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by RathBandu View Post
The way Mantenga plays that scene is so brilliant. It makes the father-son story much more powerful, and makes Fred much more than a "bad dad." He knows that what he's saying is true, and it kills him. Part of the reason he goes off on Laura Linney is because he's being confronted by his own failures, as a writer, as a husband, as a father (because that's the implication there). In the book, Fred was also an amateur chess player inspired by Fischer's original run at the title. I'm glad they didn't make that as obvious, but it's still sort of there in the background.
What I love about the writing and the way Mantegna plays it is that Fred never becomes someone he isn't just to tidy the story, and yet he never becomes a villain either. He does some arguably despicable things. I'm thinking especially of the heartbreaking scene when Josh is in the bath and Fred is trying to explain to him why he has to go to a new school. You can see the push and pull between Fred's instincts and his wanting what's best for his son. Even through the end that tension is evident, as seen in Fred's face when Josh offers Jonathan a draw when he knows he's beaten him. It's more that he reaches a peace with who he is and who his son is, and not so much that he has an epiphany and all of the sudden becomes this ultra-understanding father.

I didn't realize Fred was a chess player in the book. I'm actually glad they didn't address that in the movie, because to me part of what works so well is the distance between Fred and the game. He's treating Josh as he would having a gifted athlete because he doesn't know any better. It also helps put him in starker contrast with Bruce.

A couple of random trivia bits: The real Bruce Pandolfini is in the movie, as the mustached man in the park who says "A young Fischer..." to Kingsley when he goes to meet him. The real Katya Waitzkin is also in it, as one of Josh's tournament competitors (the nervous girl with the dark complexion).
post #14 of 24
Gotta add to the love for Fischer, and it introduced me to a number of great actors when I was young (Kingsley, Fishburne, Mantegna and Joan Allen).
post #15 of 24
Thread Starter 
Also, William H. Macy (who brings his Mamet rhythms to such classic dialogue as "I'm gonna get you a tuna-fish sandwich."), Tony Shaloub, Austin Pendleton. EVERYBODY is in it.
post #16 of 24
I kinda didn't connect at all with The Last Days of Disco.

Will elaborate later!
post #17 of 24
And Elaborate i do!

Took my time to write about this one because my opinions changed a lot through the days.
At first i kinda hated it, thought it was a mess, with a non cohesive storyline, bland characters and poorly put together. Also, the script felt forced and i couldn't relate to that lifestyle or period of time. Felt like Swingers made in the east coast by less capable people.

Now i maintain that the film is poorly structured, some characters leave no impression at all (really, all the guys except for the club manager are blank pages to me) and some actors were terrible.
But among all of that, there are some good performances, some good conversations and portrayal of a certain time period.

Beckinsale is annoying as hell, which i guess means she's doing a terrific job with her character. Also, smoking hot.

The second best performances is the club manager guy (really i can't remember a single character's name), honestly the only one that kept me interested through most of it.

It's well shot, but poorly put together. I really got lost in the middle with the "story". Events happened that i had no idea about and characters came and went without any logic.

Overall, i'm glad i saw it. But it's going to be forgotten soon.

And once again, i seem to be the only one willing to watch new films!
post #18 of 24
Thread Starter 
You hurt me, Tati. You hurt me.

In fairness, I'll agree with you that the story is almost secondary to the experience these characters are going through, which is that post-college period of wanting to have a real life with dinner parties and worthwhile work and trying to fit that into railroad apartments and conversations about Lady & The Tramp until 4.
post #19 of 24
Spike?
post #20 of 24
I quite liked LDOD. Cloe Sevigny was a revelation and gave one of the best performances of a female lead in the 1990s. Her character had real depth and I felt sorry she had to be friends with such an awful person like Kate Beckinsale. There are not enough characters like her in movies, people with realistic struggles and dreams. Most of the people in the movie in fact seemed very true to life. They weren't stereotypes so much as they were just types of people you'd encounter in life (Robert Sean Leonard, Beckinsale, ETC). Over all, it seemed like a more intelligent more relevant version of the (awful) STUDIO 54.

PS Did anyone notice that when Beckinsale sings in the hospital scene she has a robot auto-tune voice? I was cracking up the whole time lol

PPS This film sort of gives you an appreciation of Disco, where as STUDIO 54 made me glad it was dead. It *would* be nice to have a cool club to hang out at, a place to socialize. Where I am in Massachusetts we don't really have anything like that. In North Hampton you might have more night life options, but here everything closes at 6 pretty much. We have candlestick bowling (which I actually really like, it's hella fun) but that doesn't mean that I wouldn't also like a disco. We had a roller disco here when I was growing up, but it closed when I was 7 or so..
post #21 of 24
Thread Starter 
I actually feel bad for Beckinsale through most of the movie. She's such a kid, and she so desperately wants friends, but she also so desperately wants to be an adult -- and that being this raging bitch is a good way to be an adult. She's the kind of person that thinks being tactless and speaking her mind are signs of adulthood. Also, given what limited information we learn about these characters' backgrounds, she's probably rebelling against the environment she was raised in, big time. (The cameos from METROPOLITAN are cute, but also telling, because that film informs this one -- the characters went to college in that world of debutante balls and penthouses, and are now trying to exist in the 'real world' of railroad apartments and shitty jobs.)

Kind of surprised you liked the film, Kate, but glad you did.
post #22 of 24
P kate watched it??? Damn, we cant get real users to watch the films but we can atract the faux ones?? Guess we are done with the club.
post #23 of 24
Thread Starter 
Hey now, Kate can be annoying, but I appreciated what she had to say on the film.

I know we've got a few days left in March, and I didn't do a formal write-up on the films, but I might throw some more thoughts down in the next couple of days. Regardless, I still really enjoyed sharing these movies with you guys.
post #24 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by RathBandu View Post
I actually feel bad for Beckinsale through most of the movie. She's such a kid, and she so desperately wants friends, but she also so desperately wants to be an adult -- and that being this raging bitch is a good way to be an adult. She's the kind of person that thinks being tactless and speaking her mind are signs of adulthood. Also, given what limited information we learn about these characters' backgrounds, she's probably rebelling against the environment she was raised in, big time. (The cameos from METROPOLITAN are cute, but also telling, because that film informs this one -- the characters went to college in that world of debutante balls and penthouses, and are now trying to exist in the 'real world' of railroad apartments and shitty jobs.)
.
Eh, I guess so, but some of the things her character did in the film were simply unforgivable. If she was a person I knew in real life, I'd immediately implement a strict policy of permanent non communication
Quote:
Originally Posted by RathBandu View Post
Eh, I guess so, Bandu, but there are some things that she did in that movie that are just unforgivable. If she were a real life person I know, I'd immediately impliment a strict policy of permanent non communication.


Kind of surprised you liked the film, Kate, but glad you did.

Me too!

PS I think that the cinematography was a little flat. The film was very talky and while the dialog was very clever and interesting, the flat look of the film made me think that I was watching a stage play with a series of elaborate sets.

I think if you'd had more energetic photography like STUDIO 54, it would have better captured the free wheeling energy of the disco movement
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