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Mad Men - Season 4 - Page 21

post #1001 of 1040
10/19/10 at 12:04pm
Thread Starter 
She looks like James Brolin from the Planet of the Apes makeup test.
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post #1002 of 1040
10/19/10 at 12:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Allen View Post
Me and the missus were going "What is this, a dream scene" when Don was proposing to Megan. Don't know why, but something seemed off (the Cali lighting maybe?)
For me it was the change in space and time.
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post #1003 of 1040
10/19/10 at 1:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Woods View Post
For me it was the change in space and time.
It was the fact that it was clumsily handled.
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post #1004 of 1040
10/19/10 at 2:06pm
It felt awkward because it was awkward. It felt sudden because it was sudden. Giving it a more graceful setup would have eliminated the "is this actually happening?" feeling that both the characters and the audience had. It's clearly not a well thought out decision by Don, and that was reflected in how they handled it.
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post #1005 of 1040
10/19/10 at 2:22pm
What were people expecting? Don's proposal isn't supposed to be the happy outcome of a romance. It's supposed to feel awkward and wrong and sad and kind of mean because it is these things. It isn't Don reaching some kind of epiphany. It's Don once again snatching disaster from the jaws of contentment because he's a complete mess of a man.
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post #1006 of 1040
10/19/10 at 2:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post
Or wake up dying in the field in Korea.
Draper's Ladder!
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post #1007 of 1040
10/19/10 at 3:51pm
I just don't think the show earned where it went. It was not only sudden, it was unnatural. They tried very hard to show us what Don was seeing, but it was all too on the nose and imo clumsy.
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post #1008 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:02pm
Thread Starter 
I think it was a misstep, but I'm fully willing to roll up my pant legs, wade into the seas of Apologia, and say this show's had about 2.5 missteps in almost 50 episodes, so let's see what happens.
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post #1009 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:05pm
It almost reminded me of the way Peggy's pregnancy in S1, while it made sense, felt improperly handled. A little too rushed.

EDIT: Also, is there no fall-out from Cooper leaving? Unless I missed something, there wasn't even a reference to it. Was he really that non-vital, or could they just not fit that into the episode?
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post #1010 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:06pm
Yeah, I had lots of problems with the pacing and the abruptness of the proposal, but at the same time one bad season finale ain't exactly going to kick me off the MM tit (they're bigger).
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post #1011 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:10pm
I think it's still a great show, and I don't think it's anywhere near the end of its rope. This season raised some red flags for me though, especially after what I consider to be an absolutely brilliant 3rd season where I thought the show had really hit its stride.

I am concerned, that's all.
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post #1012 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:13pm
I don't know how they could have illustrated running headlong into a rushed marriage proposal more directly. If anything, the problem is with where the story went, and if it will go anyplace interesting, than how it was delivered. That sense of disorientation was absolutely intended.
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post #1013 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:19pm
Maybe my problem is that I don't buy the way it went down as being something Don would do, as much of a mess as he is. Aside from his philandering and the anti-ad, when has this severe impulsiveness manifested itself previously?
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post #1014 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuddL View Post
Maybe my problem is that I don't buy the way it went down as being something Don would do, as much of a mess as he is. Aside from his philandering and the anti-ad, when has this severe impulsiveness manifested itself previously?
Season One. When Pete found out about Dick Whitman. He was ready to abandon his wife and kids and run away with Rachael Mencken. His cowardice dried up her girl parts and she threw his ass out.
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post #1015 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:25pm
I think that's who Don really is. He had just built up such a "perfect" life when we dropped in on his story in season one, that he had a comfortable routine established. The show spent the next few seasons dismantling it, and now we're at the core of the man.
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post #1016 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:32pm
Isn't the very existence of "Don Draper" the result of an impulsive act?
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post #1017 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:34pm
And I think that nervousness ties into that great exchange between Don and Roger about why men drink. And, while I don't think that the show's making Roger's generation out to be how he would have Don believe it was when he said "We drink because it feels good, because it's better than unbuttoning your collar, because it's what men do.", certainly the increasing anxiety of modern life is reflected in Don, as a representation of his generation.
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post #1018 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:46pm
I'm wondering if Megan isn't going to turn out to be a stronger character than expected. For some nutty fan plot prediction, and the way Don is almost inherently self-destructive with his relationships, and with the burgeoning feminist/women's rights movement, I wouldn't be surprised to see her take him for a good chunk at the first busted infidelity, the way Betty never did (or could). Hell, to crazily extrapolate, picture her getting a piece of SCDP. And then picture the office politics. Gah, thousand pardons, must stop wanking.

Part of what felt so unreal about the finale was the somewhat unclear sense of time once they returned from Cali. I honestly couldn't tell whether the proposal scene was playing out days or weeks later. But the rapid Topaz turnaround provides the context.

Quintessential Pete Campbell moment: "You don't tell a bride 'Congratulations'! You say, Best wishes." /high octane smarm charm
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post #1019 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trav McGee View Post
Part of what felt so unreal about the finale was the somewhat unclear sense of time once they returned from Cali. I honestly couldn't tell whether the proposal scene was playing out days or weeks later. But the rapid Topaz turnaround provides the context.
I thought he proposed in California?
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post #1020 of 1040
10/19/10 at 4:51pm
It was in his apartment.
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post #1021 of 1040
10/19/10 at 5:41pm
Jon Hamm is apparently in town. Part of me wants to hunt him down and convince him he needs to play Travis McGee. Part of me wants to interrogate him about this last episode.
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post #1022 of 1040
10/19/10 at 5:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post
Isn't the very existence of "Don Draper" the result of an impulsive act?
Exactly.
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post #1023 of 1040
10/19/10 at 10:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trav McGee View Post
I'm wondering if Megan isn't going to turn out to be a stronger character than expected.
Perhaps because it being Mad Men means I spend a bit more time thinking "why was each line scripted", but I'm wondering if the bible reference isn't supposed to be a red flag.
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post #1024 of 1040
10/20/10 at 1:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Wolcott View Post
Perhaps because it being Mad Men means I spend a bit more time thinking "why was each line scripted", but I'm wondering if the bible reference isn't supposed to be a red flag.
The fact that she made a Bible reference or the specific content?

As for making the comment, I think it's just more evidence that she's smart. She's French Canadian, thus likely had a Catholic upbringing, and she was also an English major, which means she's probably got some background in the Bible as a piece of literature. At that point in history, being able to drop Bible knowledge still probably suggested you were cultured, not a wingnut.

As for snakes with legs... well, I guess it depends on whether you take Megan to be the serpent or Eve, but the problem with that analogy is that fig leaves don't really become Don or Megan. To quote from one of our great contemporary poets, "she's not that innocent."
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post #1025 of 1040
10/20/10 at 4:36pm
Thread Starter 
The future Mrs. Don Draper as a vampire in Suck:

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post #1026 of 1040
10/20/10 at 5:08pm
Aw, shit. Am I going to have to rent Suck now?
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post #1027 of 1040
10/21/10 at 7:03pm
Hell yes I want a Mad Men Role Playing Game/Drinking Game.
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post #1028 of 1040
10/22/10 at 12:00am
I think this article is quite must-readish, re: Betty.
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post #1029 of 1040
10/22/10 at 12:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Wolcott View Post
I think this article is quite must-readish, re: Betty.
An incredible read. Makes one appreciate the depth of the writing & character work on this show. Really fascinating.
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post #1030 of 1040
10/22/10 at 1:14am
Thread Starter 
Thanks for sharing, Francis. Great stuff.
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post #1031 of 1040
10/22/10 at 2:47am
Fuck yeah. MissZooey turned me on to Tiger Beatdown a while back and it's quality stuff. Thanks for the link!
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post #1032 of 1040
10/22/10 at 3:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Wolcott View Post
I think this article is quite must-readish, re: Betty.
OK, this is going to get a lot of use.
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post #1033 of 1040
10/22/10 at 3:37am
On repeat viewing, I think this scene was my favorite moment in the finale.





Betty inadvertently being the catalyst of the chain of events that led to Don proposing to Megan (firing Carla), adds extra pathos to her manipulating that meet-up with him. What was she thinking in this scene? Now that she realizes her happiness/unhappiness transcends being married to Dick Whitman/Don Draper, was she getting nostalgic about their marriage? Was she giving Don an 'opening' before he utterly closed it forever.

I don't know, I think Betty and Henry can still make something positive for their future. Their were good seeds planted this season. amid all the depictions of her frustrations. They do communicate in a way that Don and her didn't. But that finale does leave you with the feeling that Betty's life trajectory will remain tragic.
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post #1034 of 1040
10/22/10 at 4:01am
Betty being there signals that she's still feeling things. She even says it "things aren't perfect..."
She was there, waiting for Don, putting make up on herself when she knew Don was coming in, etcetera. She want's the excitement of being Mr's Don Draper back! But MEGAN has it!
That Bitch!
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post #1035 of 1040
10/25/10 at 5:44pm
Just a quick thought, Megan SAYS she wants to be more than a secretary but has she really done anything to prove that? The only time we see that she wants to be more than that, she and Don end up hooking up.

And the Peggy/Joan response to Don getting engaged to his secretary is great. And the fulfillment of the prediction that he'd be married again in a year from earlier in the season. Still, marrying a secretary seems too common for Draper and I am anxious to see what happens in the next season.

The response to the spilt milk is great though and how Don is so used to needing to get angry about these things that the fact that he doesn't have to is such a welcome relief.
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post #1036 of 1040
10/25/10 at 6:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontEATnachos View Post
The response to the spilt milk is great though and how Don is so used to needing to get angry about these things that the fact that he doesn't have to is such a welcome relief.
I think he was getting angry because that is what Betty told him good parenting should be. Don had such a terrible childhood he doesn't trust himself to react naturally. He got angry because that is what his dad did, and that is what Betty did. Megan just shows him how it doesn't have to be that way and in the end it helps Don impulsively marry her.

Don's checklist:
✔ Lady on the Street
✔ Freak in the Bed
✔ Good with Kids
✔ Cooks breakfast

Faye was only 2 out of 4, where Megan hit all 4.
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post #1037 of 1040
10/25/10 at 6:22pm
I'm going to predict that Don's new wife is going to be the cheater next season.
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post #1038 of 1040
10/25/10 at 6:24pm
That last post was at least 200% more interesting, due to the use of actual check marks.


ETA: By MrTyres
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post #1039 of 1040
11/7/10 at 9:32pm
Watched this show from beginning to end over the last 2 months.

Amazing.

Last finale kinda wasn't up to snuff (even last season, while great, not as good)
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post #1040 of 1040
8/14/11 at 8:47pm

First of all, I just marathoned all four seasons of Mad Men in three weeks.  Mother of God.  Where has this show been all my life?  It was impeccable.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil View Post

Compare previous seasons' fan predictions vs actual plot with this one's. Holy hell. Did this show just jump the shark?



This is an interesting notion that I've seen mentioned many times in relation to many shows; i.e., that if something is predictable, it's inherently disappointing.  My argument would be that -- Mad Men or otherwise -- storylines occasionally have very natural places to go.  The sheer act of surprising the audience doesn't make for a better story, nor does pushing one down a path that can be anticipated automatically make for a lesser one.


Edited by The Dark Shape - 8/14/11 at 9:03pm
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