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Car bomb found in Times Square

post #1 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:21am
Thread Starter 
Local or international terrorism?

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/05/02/...ex.html?hpt=T1

Quote:
A T-shirt vendor who noticed smoke coming out of a tinted, dark green sport utility vehicle alerted police to what turned out to be a potential bomb placed in Times Square.

"We avoided what could have been a very deadly event," said Mayor Michael Bloomberg early Sunday morning. "It certainly could have exploded and had a pretty big fire and a decent amount of explosive impact."

President Obama, who was updated on the situation late Saturday night, said the federal government was prepared to provide support. The Department of Homeland Security also said it was monitoring developments.

Two federal officials said Sunday it was too early to tell whether the incident involved al Qaeda or another international terror group. The national threat level remained at "yellow," or elevated.
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post #2 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:25am
Like most things, if this was from overseas, the device would've worked.

So, local.
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post #3 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:29am
Thread Starter 
Propane tanks, fireworks, amateurish wiring ... sounds like somebody from Arizona.

I only wish the t-shirt vendor who found it was an "illegal immigrant".
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post #4 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:22am
Quote:
The national threat level remained at "yellow,"
I guess that's appropriate, as the national mettle level is also currently at "yellow".
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post #5 of 235
5/2/10 at 12:57pm
All this monitoring for terrorists while Tony Soprano slinks away again.
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post #6 of 235
5/2/10 at 1:45pm
Tony's from Jersey.

Also, the CNN article says that a Vietnam Vet and a guy with a Middle Eastern-sounding name were the first two that spotted the smoke. I smell a wacky buddy comedy!
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post #7 of 235
5/2/10 at 1:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RathBandu View Post
Tony's from Jersey.

Also, the CNN article says that a Vietnam Vet and a guy with a Middle Eastern-sounding name were the first two that spotted the smoke. I smell a wacky buddy comedy!
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post #8 of 235
5/2/10 at 3:06pm
Meanwhile, the next day...

PITTSBURGH — Police say they have found an explosive device near the course of the Pittsburgh Marathon, forcing them to detour the final part of the race.

Police say the device was found in a small microwave oven on the sidewalk after the leaders had finished the course Sunday morning. Several blocks were cordoned off near the original finish line for the marathon and half-marathon.

The bomb squad used a robot to disable the device. The all-clear was given for the area shortly before 11 a.m. About 5,000 people took part in the full marathon.

The disruption comes a day after a car-bomb scare in New York emptied Times Square.

So, it's a busy weekend for mad bombers. We should start a betting pool on the identity of the culprits. Jihadists? Texan secessionists? Anarchist unibombers? Aztlan movement radicals reacting to the Arizona legislation? Land shark pissed about the oil spill?
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post #9 of 235
5/2/10 at 3:41pm
CNN claimed this morning that, due to the NYC bomb being placed next to the Viacom building, police were investigating a South Park link to all this ballyhoo.

Not sure what that has to do with someone overcooking a hot pocket in Pittsburgh, though.
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post #10 of 235
5/2/10 at 4:09pm
Good on the vendors for being vigilant and getting help.

That bomb does sound local. Hate to say it, but foreign terrorists seem to be pretty efficient with their car bombs.
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post #11 of 235
5/2/10 at 4:20pm
Associated Press update: SITE is a group of private contractors who monitor the World Wide Web for the Department of Defense. They're saying that the Taliban in Pakistan have claimed credit for the New York attempt and that it was retaliation for the deaths of its leaders. Baitallah Mehsud was killed last August by a Predator drone somewhere near the Afghanistan border.
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post #12 of 235
5/2/10 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyQuinn22 View Post
That bomb does sound local. Hate to say it, but foreign terrorists seem to be pretty efficient with their car bombs.
Because they stay in the cars till they blow up.

CNN had investigators going to Penn to see a guy who claimed to get the bomber on tape. He's white and in his 40's. I'm thinking Tea Party nut.
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post #13 of 235
5/2/10 at 5:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anyawatchin Angel View Post
He's white and in his 40's.
The suspected bomber or the guy with the camera? A stupid question, but no one has been absolutely clear about it.

And for what it's worth the NYPD chief all but dismissed the Pakistani Taliban claim, saying they've made illegitimate claims before.
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post #14 of 235
5/2/10 at 6:02pm
The bomber was white in his 40's. With all the cameras in Times Square I find it impossible that they don't have a pic of this guy.

Does NY have plice cameras all over like Chicago?
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post #15 of 235
5/2/10 at 6:25pm
There are cameras, but they're not nearly as widespread (yet) as someplace like London. It's entirely possible they've got the guy on camera and aren't releasing it because it's impossible to tell who it is.
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post #16 of 235
5/2/10 at 7:25pm
Or they want the guy to think he's safe so he's easier to nab.
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post #17 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anyawatchin Angel View Post
The bomber was white in his 40's. With all the cameras in Times Square I find it impossible that they don't have a pic of this guy.

Does NY have plice cameras all over like Chicago?
Is it wrong for me to be hopeful (since nobody got hurt) that this is one of the Teabaggers?
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post #18 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:35pm
And God help us if it's not. The Tea Baggers will never let us hear the end of it.
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post #19 of 235
5/2/10 at 9:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by C.Swicegood View Post
Is it wrong for me to be hopeful (since nobody got hurt) that this is one of the Teabaggers?
Why would you?

Oh, right...the whole sweeping generalizations thing.

I personally would be pretty pissed and feel a bit more uneasy if it was one of our fellow Americans. Neither of which are things I tend to be hopeful for.
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post #20 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:05pm
Sounds like 'white guys from next door' again.

Let's all party like it's 1995.
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post #21 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:12pm
It probably was a tea bagger.

Of course, this wouldn't be the first TEA (TAX ENOUGH ALREADY) Bag attack on the country. That asshole in Austin who flew his plane into an IRS building was more successful.

It's not a sweeping generalization when elements of the (anti-government, anti-tax and anti-Dem) movement previously blew up a federal building to the deaths of well over a hundred innocent people.

Is it unfair to colour the Tea Party movement with McVeigh's radical attempt?

Is it unfair to colour the extremist Islam movement with al-Qaeda's actions?

The answer is no, on both counts. Both are inextricably linked to their extremist results. Don't show up on the National Mall toting automatic weapons in protest of the Obama administration, and maybe you get the benefit of the doubt. Otherwise, you get the same response Lakshar e Tayyiba and the others get: go fuck yourself.
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post #22 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:21pm
Friend of mine took these shots- http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_c...uth_park_.html

Find it pretty funny that they're trying to make heroes of the guys who noticed the fire. It's not like they broke in the car and ripped the lit fuse out.
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post #23 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:23pm
And you don't see a difference in the fact that to 99% of Islamic extremists, violence against your enemies is job 1, whereas for 99% of the tea partiers, it's a stretch to even get them to not file their taxes?

This is the very definition of apples to oranges.
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post #24 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:28pm
The person who set that bomb was an idiot. If that doesn't make the Tea Baggers a prime suspect, I don't know what does.
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post #25 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
And you don't see a difference in the fact that to 99% of Islamic extremists, violence against your enemies is job 1, whereas for 99% of the tea partiers, it's a stretch to even get them to not file their taxes?

This is the very definition of apples to oranges.
Actually, there is an overwhelmingly majority of Islamic 'extremists' who advocate the establishment of an Islamic Caliphate and the rejection of Israel who disapprove of al-Qaeda (which has killed more muslims, by a number of degrees, than anyone else).

I find your 99% Tea Partier figure hard to believe, once you account for the Mid-West militias, Confederate glorifiers, "Obama is a Muslim Communist" crowd (because if he were, it would be your duty as a patriot to overthrow him, yes?), and old-school Taxation types (since our ancestors rebelled against the government for similar or less reasons) . . . well, that's probably more than 1%.

REGARDLESS: my point was that the movement, as a whole, doesn't get a free pass for their extremist elements, when those elements are so distinctly bound to their effort. Even if just 1% advocated violent overthrow of the government, the movement (which helped spawn that group) is partly responsible.

EDIT: also, what Devin said.
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post #26 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:31pm
Oh wait, I do know. The Tea Baggers are an extreme movement that use violent rhetoric and talk about revolution. That sounds like a terrorist group to me.
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post #27 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
Oh wait, I do know. The Tea Baggers are an extreme movement that use violent rhetoric and talk about revolution. That sounds like a terrorist group to me.

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post #28 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post

REGARDLESS: my point was that the movement, as a whole, doesn't get a free pass for their extremist elements, when those elements are so distinctly bound to their effort. Even if just 1% advocated violent overthrow of the government, the movement (which helped spawn that group) is partly responsible.
I won't challenge that, especially when there's no prominent voice of reason within the group. I just think that comparing them to Islamic extremists...even for this forum...is a bit much.
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post #29 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
I won't challenge that, especially when there's no prominent voice of reason within the group. I just think that comparing them to Islamic extremists...even for this forum...is a bit much.
Well how many terrorist attacks (OKC, Austin, Times Square) would it take to convince you otherwise?
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post #30 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
I won't challenge that, especially when there's no prominent voice of reason within the group. I just think that comparing them to Islamic extremists...even for this forum...is a bit much.
Really? They're religious extremists who are talking about armed resistance to the government. They just haven't gotten as far along as the jihadists have, but they're getting there.
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post #31 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:53pm
You really believe that a "tea bagger" would set up a bomb on times square?
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post #32 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonBaseNick View Post
You really believe that a "tea bagger" would set up a bomb on times square?
Would he fly a plane into a building?

(yes)

Are there any other extremist factions claiming 40 year old white guys?
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post #33 of 235
5/2/10 at 10:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonBaseNick View Post
You really believe that a "tea bagger" would set up a bomb on times square?
Conservative terrorists were just arrested planning to murder a cop and then attack his funeral.

Timothy McVeigh blew up a federal building.

Why wouldn't I believe that a Tea Bagger would try to blow up Times Square?

These people are dangerous fanatics. They're unstable, ignorant racists who are whipping themselves into a violent frenzy. It's only a matter of time before they finally do something very extreme. That time may have come.
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post #34 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:01pm
I work at a whole sale firework warehouse and a large majority of our customers are from NY. I can only imagine what this is going to do for our business.

Cops and toll attendants are probably going to be noticing people transporting fireworks a bit more now. The customers are probably going to extra paranoid because of it.
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post #35 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:01pm
Nine militia members are awaiting trial right now for plotting to kill police, then kill more police and a bunch of civilians at the funeral for the first police.

Timothy McVeigh blew up a day care.

Some of our nation's best and brightest have have caused over 4,000 American deaths in Iraq and an estimated 1,300,000 Iraqi deaths* to serve their own profit.

Devin beat me to some examples, but do you really believe someone would be incapable of doing this because they're white?

*Source: AntiWar.com
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post #36 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

but do you really believe someone would be incapable of doing this because they're white?
This forum rocks.
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post #37 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:06pm
I don't think your average Tea Bagger who was standing outisde the Capital holding a poorly spelled sign is plotting to park a bomb outside a building. They talk a good game, but if it involves anything more than standing in the sun for a few hours, they're not having it.
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post #38 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post
Would he fly a plane into a building?

(yes)

Are there any other extremist factions claiming 40 year old white guys?
I'm sure there are a bunch. These kinds of groups arent new.
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post #39 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
I'm sure there are a bunch. These kinds of groups arent new.
ELF?
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post #40 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
I'm sure there are a bunch. These kinds of groups arent new.
It would be interesting if you said something in this thread. Like why you doubt that it's Tea Baggers. Like why the previous history of violence on the part of right wing extremists isn't something to keep in mind. Like why you think the violent rhetoric of these protesters is no big deal.

In other words, enough with the 'This forum rocks' meaningless bullshit. Take that off to Free Republic or something. If you have a point to make, make it. Or just quit posting.
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post #41 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:13pm
Thread Starter 
Yeah Closer, I don't often agree with Devin, but you've been doing the same exact thing on the immigration thread. Pretty much not really saying much, and just complaining that people who are offended by the law are just interested in calling their opponents racists (instead of ... you know, being offended by a law that targets oneself in the first place!!!)
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post #42 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
It would be interesting if you said something in this thread. Like why you doubt that it's Tea Baggers. Like why the previous history of violence on the part of right wing extremists isn't something to keep in mind. Like why you think the violent rhetoric of these protesters is no big deal.

In other words, enough with the 'This forum rocks' meaningless bullshit. Take that off to Free Republic or something. If you have a point to make, make it. Or just quit posting.
Says the man who occasionally pops in simply to call people racists and Holocaust deniers.

How about this...point out where I said that I doubted it was a tea bagger, and I'll start there. I can't really defend myself against something I didn't do.

My original post in this thread was in response to someone stating that they hoped the culprit ended up being a tea bagger, which led to Zhu comparing tea baggers to Islamic extremists. While I'm no friend of the tea baggers, my discussion in this thread had been limited to challenging Zhu's notion.
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post #43 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:21pm
Oh so you're playing the role of the guy who is above the fray and just keeping everybody honest. Variation on the Concern Troll!
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post #44 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:23pm
Yeah, while I would shed no tears over the black eye the movement would get if it panned out that way, I'm in no rush for this to turn out to be a Tea Bagger. That's a little more unsettling than the temporary victory would be worth, unless it somehow managed to shatter the movement altogether. Which, with the cloudy logic most of them have, wouldn't happen. They'd just reaffirm how they're not embracing that element and can't be held responsible for the actions of a few.
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post #45 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
My original post in this thread was in response to someone stating that they hoped the culprit ended up being a tea bagger, which led to Zhu comparing tea baggers to Islamic extremists. While I'm no friend of the tea baggers, my discussion in this thread had been limited to challenging Zhu's notion.
That as far as successful attacks on the U.S. go, right-wing reactionaries and Islamic extremists aren't that far apart? Yes, al-Qaeda took down some buildings - McVeigh got one too. If it's an issue of scale - the scale isn't markedly different. We're talking more about success vs. failure than anything.

Let me clear: anyone attacking the United States for political reasons is equal in my eyes. Fuck them. If your argument can't win in the marketplace of ideas, than I react aggressively to an argument should it take the form of localized violence. (And I am saying here: the tea bagger argument cannot win in the marketplace of ideas, because it's a bunch of bullshit)

Fuck tea baggers, fuck violent extremists. That is my notion. I don't make an arbitrary distinction between the two because one worships Jesus and the other Mohammed.
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post #46 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElCapitanAmerica View Post
Yeah Closer, I don't often agree with Devin, but you've been doing the same exact thing on the immigration thread. Pretty much not really saying much, and just complaining that people who are offended by the law are just interested in calling their opponents racists (instead of ... you know, being offended by a law that targets oneself in the first place!!!)
I also attempted to start a discussion on what forum members here would like the law to look like (along with giving my own opinion on the matter). I mentioned off hand in one of my first posts in that thread that I thought the new law was retarded. Nobody disagreed with me, so I didn't see the need to keep reminding folks where I stood.
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post #47 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by devincf View Post
Oh so you're playing the role of the guy who is above the fray and just keeping everybody honest. Variation on the Concern Troll!
Not at all. But if you're going to suggesting that I'm doing something (eg saying that this could in no way, shape, or form be a tea bagger's offense) I would at least hope that it was true.
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post #48 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post
That as far as successful attacks on the U.S. go, right-wing reactionaries and Islamic extremists aren't that far apart? Yes, al-Qaeda took down some buildings - McVeigh got one too. If it's an issue of scale - the scale isn't markedly different. We're talking more about success vs. failure than anything.


Let me clear: anyone attacking the United States for political reasons is equal in my eyes. Fuck them. If your argument can't win in the marketplace of ideas, than I react aggressively to an argument should it take the form of localized violence.
I know what you mean. One of the other thoughts in my mind...and I may be way off base or simply naive...but so far when you take a look at from McVeigh up until the douche that flew his plane into an IRS building, it seems like all "homegrown" attacks are against specific political/government targets and serve a sort of "purpose" aside from simply inciting fear. What does blowing up a bunch of tourists in Times Square accomplish on the whole Tea Bagger agenda? Even the plan to take out the cops at the funeral was directed against The Man.

Like I said, I could be wrong, but it's a question to consider, dont you think?
Quote:
Fuck tea baggers, fuck violent extremists. That is my notion. I don't make an arbitrary distinction between the two because one worships Jesus and the other Mohammed.
Fair enough.
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post #49 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Closer View Post
it seems like all "homegrown" attacks are against specific political/government targets and serve a sort of "purpose" aside from simply inciting fear.
Transplant this to Iraq and you know what it is.

EDITED for: clarity
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post #50 of 235
5/2/10 at 11:36pm
There's a real big logical fallacy going on here.


Comparing the Austin guy to the entire Tea Bag movement is like comparing Mohammed Atta to the entire Muslim population.

Just because one bad egg exists doesn't make the whole dozen spoil.

The tea bagger movement is vastly peaceful. Sure, they are loud, obnoxious, and sometimes racist, but you don't see tea bagger riots in the streets overturning cars either.

Just because one may share a viewpoint with others does not mean the "others" hold similar viewpoints to the "one."
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