Car bomb found in Times Square - Page 5

Generally I get the impression that the real big planners like Bin Laden count on us doing as much damage to our way of life in response to them as they want to do to us.

Look at how scared the right is of Islamic terror that they tremble at the thought of trying these thugs by the rules of our system. They're terrified of putting them in a conventional prison. And I was responding to Joe Lieberman's desire to revoke that attempted bomber's citizenship. Al Qaeda and the like have to be thrilled that the American right wants to throw out civil liberties in response to a guy half-assedly loading a truck up with propane and low grade fertilizer.

Al Qaeda give two shits about what rights and freedoms we have or don't have here in the States. They want our government to stop tinkering with Middle Eastern governments. Bin Laden has never been coy about this. If he had a problem with jury trials and the miniskirt, he'd have said so in his video diatribes.

Well, that´s pretty much the text book definition of what constitutes terrorism, isn´t it?

I absolutely agree with you by the way, the "Wut" was rather about the seemingly random quote of my post.

Anyway, it is a shame that our hysterical reactions always err on the side of broadsword rather than floret. The West, if there is such a monolithic thing, does seldom disappoint the radicals in whipping up the frenzy of us vs. them. And by the same toke we are all to happy to concede our hard fought liberties if "our way of life! Bwaaaah" is attacked. If you fight a "war on terror" (Which is an idiotic thing to say - terror is a tactic, not an enemy) by actually cutting down the liberties that have been fought for in centuries with an axe, the liberties those terrorists allegedly hate so much, we have already lost indeed.

I thought I read somewhere that Bin Laden DID want that. It's only human to want to see damage done to our society for what he sees as wrongs done to the Middle Eastern world even if that's not his main goal.

But Al Qaeda (though a kind of franchise system rather than a monolithic entity by now) does everything possible to fuel the flames in this conflict, because what else does lead to a "rally around the flag" mentality easier than having an opponent that, at least by perception, did pretty much declare war on Islamic terrorism, which sadly can be twisted into a war against Islam all to easy.

Therefore whipping up the frenzy by the predictable reactions to terroristic attempts is straight out of their terror playbook 101. Just look at those idiotic Lieberman suggestions just the other day or the collective panic attack subsequently to the failed bombing attack on that plane around christmas.

It's not for the sake of being disagreeable, but I do disagree on what the goals of Islamic terrorism are. When we go to war, it's to reshape the politics of the region we're invading, to be certain. But that's just a means toward the end of installing some colonial governor who will do business with us on our terms. Politicians pay lip service to the idea of worrying about how the little guy in Kabul is getting by for the benefit of the TV cameras, but that's not what launches the troop transports and naval cruisers. All politics is local.

After Desert Storm and before 9/11, our continued presence in Kuwait, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia and our unconditional loyalty to Israel were much bigger fish to fry for these guys than worrying about American domestic politics. I'd go so far as to suggest that ignorance of American culture enabled the miscalculation of staging the 9/11 attacks. Instead of scaring us into pulling up stakes and deserting the region, the attacks let loose a vengeful neocolonial America the likes of which hadn't been seen since Vietnam. Recruitment's up for Al Qaeda, sure, but look how quickly they get promoted due to death via Predator drone at the top of the hierarchy. Guys like Bin Laden and al-Zawahiri thought they'd live long enough to come out of hiding in caves. This isn't the outcome they wanted.

I think that saying that there isn't a cultural component in Islamic terrorist organization would be a bit of an oversimplification. Wahabism which is the actual spark that ignited Islamic fundamentalism in the 20th century is very much a rejection of Western culture and ideals. Saying that terrorists simply hate our freedoms is an oversimplification, too. Their condemnation of Western culture has the same source as various other similar movements that appeared in every religion. "Why are we doing so badly? It's because God/Allah/Cthulhu is punishing us for being immoral and straying from the proper path. Therefore we must reject foreign influences so we can return to God's/Allah's/Cthulhu's grace again." Add to that the very real grievances Muslims have with the way the West handled the newly liberated from the Ottoman empire states after WWI and you pretty much have their motives covered. So it isn't as simple as either "They hate our freedoms" or "Western Neo-Collonialism did it."

The problem is, it's hard to turn that into rhetoric. "They hate our freedoms!" makes it so much easier.

In fairness, I think they hate alot of our freedoms, but in the way that I hate AMERICAN IDOL. With vague disinterest.

And then there's this.

Is this like some sort of 'Bob Roberts'-style satire?

My god, he's just standing there talking while terrorists work behind him!

I'm afraid it's not. Personally I'm waiting for his next one, where a bunch of 30 year old black men molest a white 16 year old girl.

Times Square just got evacuated again, because someone left their cooler on the sidewalk.

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/...treet_and.html

While I can sort of understand why this is major news in the wake of the failed bomber, I don't really understand why it's the only thing CNN is covering. Either it will explode or it won't, either it's a cooler or a bomb. Either way the area is evacuated and I think most everyone outside of NYC has more important news to worry about. The oil spill, for one, which just hit our coasts

How long is this going to continue? Will we be breathlessly updated on each and every abandoned cooler in a major city from now till the end of time? Or is America some day going to realize that the threat of terrorism isn't that big of a deal and it is a problem that alot of countries have to deal with. Don't ignore it, but don't get any more disproportionately freaked out about it than other threats to life and limb (car accidents, cancer, climate change). The cooler was noticed, the area evacuated, and now professionals are dealing with it. That's the news. Untill there is more to learn, we should move on

I'd rather be a little paranoid than blown the fuck up. Glad it was a false alarm.

Right, I'm not criticizing the local response, I'm criticizing the news coverage. How is someone in Massachusetts in any danger from this? The only thing I need to know is "Cooler discovered, place evacuated, police on the scene". Instead it was 20 minutes non stop featuring a web cam shot of nothing happening in TIME SQUARE. Why do that? Hopefully not some weird fear that it could explode off camera when no one on TV is looking

Plus, now you can be a tea bagger and know that you don't even have to make a real bomb to disrupt things and break into national news. Just leave your old junk on the side walk and you're an instant terrorist. We have CNN to thank for that.

Would you want to be the news outlet who decided not to cover this and missed the shot of the thing blowing up half of Times Square?

I'm not saying they were hoping it would happen, but -- OK, yeah, I'm saying they were hoping it would happen.

We seriously need to start taking crib notes from the British on how to respond to shit like this. So far, every single response to a possible post-9/11 terrorist attack on American soil has been met with naked fear and pathetically apparent panic. When the "Anthrax Killer" got started, we evacuated the entire fucking Capitol. When a small private plane entered DC airspace without getting proper clearance, every man, woman, and child in the Capitol literally ran panicked into the streets. Now, this is happening.

It would be nice to give the world the impression that we're not some jumbled assortment of white separatist terrorists and sopping pussies now and again.

For crying out loud. I didn't say "don't cover it!" I said report that it's happened and what's being done about it and move on. When updates happen, update us. Don't spend an entire half hour looking at empty Times Square for no reason other than it's apparently good TV

Does your remote have numbers on it? Try a different channel. They show that sort of shit because people watch. If you stop watching they'll move on.

There is only one CNN. My complaint is totally reasonable, stop trying to pretend it's not.

You haven't had a reasonable complaint, thought, image, post, you name it since you showed up here.

No one is going to be the first to blink and cut away. No one wants to be the one who wasn't broadcasting live when it happened.

Then America is in for a future of darkness and sorrow if we can't cover real news because a stray cooler turned up somewhere in NYC

Then why does Culchulain agree with me? We need to take a queue from the Brits and keep a stiff upper lip. This "OMG ITS A KOOLER!@@!" nonsense is embarrassing and sad

What real news was happening while this was going on that you were missing? What had the potential -- the potential, mind you -- to be a bigger story?

I already mentioned the fact that the oil spill is hitting the coast today. How about a live shot of oil washing up on our beaches? How about a discussion of the regulation and BP's clean up? I mean, it's a cooler that is being looked at. There is no other news so spending a half an hour on "The cooler... yup, still there nothing else to report" is dereliction of duty for "America's News Network"

Welcome to the world of the 24-hour news cycle. Only been going on for about 20 years now.

And you really want to see coverage of oil washing up on a beach? We've known that's going to happening for days now. It's not news, it's eventuality.

It's easy to sit here after the fact and say sticking with that cooler was a waste of time. But in the moment, if you're a news organization in this day and age, you don't leave that story. A possible terrorist attack in the nation's largest city a week after an averted attack takes precedence over pretty much everything.

Absolutely right I do. America is just ignoring what is happening and then they'll forget and go back to "Drill Baby Drill". Make them watch what off shore drilling really means
Are you people reading what I am typing? I did not say ignore it. I said report it but not at the exclusion of nearly every other story in the world. The word news has a definition, and once you've reported about something, and nothing new has happened, it's no longer news.

AND I already said that I understood this was in the context of just having caught a guy trying to blow up his car. But I *asked* if we should in the future expect reporting about every stray package left in a major public area

It was 45 minutes of coverage, or thereabouts. Big deal.

If it makes you feel better, PK, if you live in the Gulf COast Area the oil spill si 24/7 on every news station and channel.


I only heard about a cooler in NYC by checking up on this thread.

It does, a little. Thanks.

I still have major complaints about what the news chooses to focus on though.

Are we sure this isn't just viral-marketing for the release of 'Four Lions' in Britain this weekend?