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THUD Column: Lost & Found - Page 3

post #101 of 751
One of the things I found the most unsettling about the series was the Homecoming/Prom photo of Laura that was used over the end credits of almost every episode. I got to where I could not get to the remote fast enough to turn that shit off. It's like Laura is staring right into your fucking soul and grinning at the damage she's about to do to it.
post #102 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike Marshall View Post

Xagrath, did you pick up the Gold box edition of Twin Peaks? Was wondering if it was worth fully upgrading the Season 1 boxset I got a few years back.
No, I gave up and imported season 2 from the US years before we actually got it released here. Wouldn't mind knowing how worthwhile the gold box is myself.
post #103 of 751
I like how Andy can be the posterchild for Twin Peaks' ability at being both a parody of soap opera/melodramas and the thing itself. Like the way he is introduced crying already (and inexplicably) before he even sees the body mirrors the way the pilot will show us reactions to the murder of characters we haven't yet met and still, like Andy, it'll go a bit overboard with every "grief" scene, so its both unsettling because it goes always a step further than we'd expect from a scene like that, but also becomes about itself, because it draws attention to the absurdity (not sure if the right word) of caring about characters that are being introduced and characterized through their reactions to the death of a different character we don't even get introduced to. Of course, the thematic concern in Lynch's work between the "reality of the world" and the utopian idyllic version of places we tell ourselves is present in that dynamic, as that over-reaction is unsettling precisely because near unexplainable murders (in the "why" sense) happen often, but its also incredibly funny because the way its presented is as absurd as feeling Andy crying in the beginning. And the series is aware of that, and guiding us, because since we somewhat "laugh" (if not out loud) at Andy at the very beginning, it gets harder to take every subsequent "crying" scene as seriously as one would otherwise.

What's great though is that Twin Peaks isn't merely a parody or satire of a genre, so this quote is also accurate:

Quote:
But as the police find the location where Laura and Ronette were tortured/raped, Andy’s tears suddenly don’t seem even remotely comic, even in the nervous uncomfortable way. It’s moving. Andy, who seems like a sweet, gentle soul, has stared Evil’s handiwork deep in the face, and it’s shaken him. It’s very easy to feel for him in that moment.
Except by then we've already gone full snake eat snake, not unlike what Lynch would be doing later on in more explicitly structural terms.
post #104 of 751
I loved this show, only watched it a few years ago. Your column was great, totally hit on all the reasons I loved it. I don't know if I can watch it again though. The whole show just made me sick, generally. That ceiling fan, that stop light, that photo of Laura....ugh, I can't believe these things make me so uneasy.

Then just as I started to get comfortable with my uncomfort, those jump scares with you know who. I feel disturbed just talking about it. Horror does nothing to me, but Lynch and this series? Ugh.
post #105 of 751
Great start to the column.

And maybe it's because I didn't watch a lot of TV in the ten years or so before Twin Peaks, but when it first aired, I remember thinking how unusual it was to see a button-down (in appearance, anyway) FBI agent presented in such a positive light. It had always seemed to me that, in pop culture, the suit-and-tie uniform suggested something ranging from bland indifference to outright evil.
post #106 of 751
Has anyone read the The Diary of Laura Palmer book? Apparently its mostly canon and they were clues to the killer in it.
post #107 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
Has anyone read the The Diary of Laura Palmer book? Apparently its mostly canon and they were clues to the killer in it.
Definitely. Major clues. I know it seems easy to say this now but I figured out whodunnit strictly from the Diary, which was released in the summer between Seasons 1 and 2. There were a few red herrings before the reveal in Season 2 but I was just biding my time until the real killer was revealed. And I was right...thanks to the Diary.

And by the way, The Gold Box is very worth it. All the episodes have been remastered, includes both versions of the pilot and tons of extras.
post #108 of 751
What I liked were the missing pages inside. The Diary really showed how Laura was spiraling down in her Final Days. There was an 2 entire pages full of initials that represented all the people Laura slept with.

I need to revisit that book again.
post #109 of 751
Creepy, slightly-hinting-at-spoilers fact:

The Secret Diary of Laura Palmer was written by Lynch's daughter.

*shudder*
post #110 of 751
Very serendipitous, I decided to embark on a re-watch about 4 days before this piece appeared. I'm now up to Episode 7 but content to wait until the column catches up to this point so it will be twice the fun.

The major thing that got to me watching the pilot was the scene with Sarah Palmer and her animalistic outpouring of grief. It was hard to watch, especially with hindsight knowing who the killer is it makes it that much more upsetting.

Also like the way the Cooper says into his recorder ' Take this to Albert and his team, don't go to Sam, Albert seems to be a little more on the ball' Could this be reference to Sam Stanley, Kiefer Sutherland's character in Fire Walk With Me? And people say they made it up as they went along, pfffff....
post #111 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
What I liked were the missing pages inside. The Diary really showed how Laura was spiraling down in her Final Days. There was an 2 entire pages full of initials that represented all the people Laura slept with.

I need to revisit that book again.
Read the Diary about 6 months after the show ended. I was 13 and it was disturbing stuff, also one of my first introductions to sex, probably warped my opinion of females at an early age...
post #112 of 751
Great recap, but you have to do the film as well. I don't think the Twin Peaks experience is the same without it (Though sadly because of disputes at the time some details end up getting retconned and needlessly confusing).

There's also the Agent Cooper book that was released. Both that and the Laura Palmer diaries were treated as canon, which again gets muddled when the film comes out.
post #113 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by James View Post
Great recap, but you have to do the film as well.
Disagree! The series stands on its own. And as you point out, the movie messes things up canonically.
post #114 of 751
The film is a tricky thing because while it messes things up canonically, it also adds another layer to the proceedings as well. It's an incredibly emotional film, and I think in a lot of ways it's acts as the heart of the Twin Peaks saga. I've just always viewed the show and film as one complete package, you just need to consider that the film is lying part of the time (Though there have been explanations to try and fit FWWM into canon). Whenever I watch Twin Peaks I have to watch the film as well, doesn't seem right without it.
post #115 of 751
So odd to me how the film has become so well-loved. At the time it was an aberration even to fans of the series, a noisy mess that completely missed the point of the show. Maybe I'll rewatch it at the end of revisiting the series.
post #116 of 751
I think, in light of the series, the film fares poorly, but in light of Lynch's career, its an entirely different game.
post #117 of 751
At the time the film came out, the girl I was dating was obsessed with the series. I'd never (And still haven't) seen a single episode. I loved the film / she hated it. Go figure.
post #118 of 751
Because the film taints the series. And it came too soon after the show, and relies too heavily on the show as its own backstory, to stand on its own.
post #119 of 751
You see, I love Fire Walk With Me just because of how unrelentingly sinister it makes the series. The finale achieves a similar thing, but Fire Walk With Me turns Twin Peaks into something truly horrific, and I've still never encountered anything which terrifed me on such a primal, inate, level than Bowie's recollections of his time in The Black Lodge.
post #120 of 751
I don't know, I always figured it was a pretty cut & dry movie about a girl who is raped by her father and creates an alternate persona because she can't deal with the truth. As her life spirals out of control and she abuses drugs increasingly heavily, she has a breakthrough, realizes it's her father, he realizes that she knows and kills her. With the usual Lynchian flourishes.

Edited to remove spoilers. Apologies.
post #121 of 751
You might want to edit some of the spoilers out of that post.
post #122 of 751
I really can't stress this enough- please do not post spoilers in this thread (invisible text seems fine by me, since you're not surprising anyone). There's the "Welcome to Twin Peaks" thread I started last year if you want to talk about future reveals/details. When I say "spoilers" regarding this show I'm referring to two things, specifically: the identity of Laura's killer and the final fate of a main character at the end of the show. A surprising number of people are watching this for the first time.

Not trying to be dickish or overbearing at all. I'm just a big believer in giving people a space where they don't have to worry about being spoiled.

To reiterate: I will absolutely cover FWWM here IF you vote to keep the column going. If you don't vote, or if the overwhelming majority of people reading vote to cancel the show again, then I'll move on. It's entirely in your hands.

I'm loving your thoughts. Thanks very much for reading my scribblings and for playing along.
post #123 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil View Post
So odd to me how the film has become so well-loved. At the time it was an aberration even to fans of the series, a noisy mess that completely missed the point of the show. Maybe I'll rewatch it at the end of revisiting the series.
Weirdly I saw the film after seeing only the first two episodes of the show, not knowing that it would reveal who killed Laura Palmer, so I did have that aspect of things ruined for me. However watching the show after seeing the film just enhances the theatricality of the series, seeing how all these people carry on with their normal lives after doing the most horrible things.

I totally think it's worth rewatching Phil, despite Bowie's dodgy accent. It is at times overly sinister, and unrelentingly grim. Even moreso given how sympathetic Lynch is to Laura Palmer, which again for me added another layer to the show. It's why I can't separate the two despite the contradictions.
post #124 of 751
I'm going to kick the column up to two episodes a week unless you folks have strenuous objections. Please let me know.
post #125 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse Custer View Post
I'm going to kick the column up to two episodes a week unless you folks have strenuous objections. Please let me know.
Bring it on.
post #126 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse Custer View Post
I'm going to kick the column up to two episodes a week unless you folks have strenuous objections. Please let me know.
Great to hear. Will you be revisiting Season 2 as well?
post #127 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse Custer View Post
I'm going to kick the column up to two episodes a week unless you folks have strenuous objections. Please let me know.
Just what I wanted to hear.
post #128 of 751
Great start, Jess! (would you prefer to be addressed as Jess or Matt?)

Glad you set-up context for the show. It was really out there back then. It's weird even by Lost standards.

You're right about pacing. When I try to show my kids some older movies (well old for them) like Planet of the Apes or The Bad News Bears, it strikes me how they get a little impatient. I even notice the much slower pace, yet us as kids never had a problem with it.

That said, Twin Peaks works on a whole other level. Lynch sometimes has excruciatingly long takes. One comes to mind from the finale (don't worry, no spoilers) in the bank with an old man. I saw that recently and even remarked, "you can never get away with that today."

Glad you pointed out the West Side Story connection. Always liked that aspect of the show, along with other connections, like the MOD Squad.

I concur that I hope you see this to the end and on to FWWM.
post #129 of 751
Just watched the pilot. Very interesting stuff. Can't wait to keep going. I'll probably watch the next episode tomorrow just in time for Jesse's friday column. I only got the first season, should i try to get the second one as well? I remember reading it wasn't essential.
post #130 of 751
There are a couple of amazing moments in Season 2 (scattered throughout some godawful pacing), but I think S1 stands on its own just fine.
post #131 of 751
Tati, watch the next two. I'll be covering eps 1 and 2 tomorrow. Glad you're onboard! As for Season 2, there's some very worhwhile stuff there, including the reveal of the killer and much elaboration on some of the show's key mysteries. Plus, there's the fact that the finale is the most harrowing, most unusual episode of television that I've ever seen.
post #132 of 751
Column's in to Eileen. Hope you'll vote!
post #133 of 751
Thread Starter 
Traces to Nowhere & Zen, or the Skill to Catch a Killer (S1, eps. 1 and 2)

http://chud.com/articles/articles/24...p-2/Page1.html
post #134 of 751
Renew!

Great read.
post #135 of 751
Damn good stuff. Renew!
post #136 of 751
Man, the thing I hate most about Jessie's recaps/columns is also what I love: they're so long and dense.

Just been so busy lately, having a hard time carving out time to sit down and read these. So at least in that sense: RENEW!
post #137 of 751
I was only able to watch the first episode, so i only read the first part of the column.I guess this RENEW thing comes on the second part if we want to keep following the show?

So yeah, Renew!

I'll catch up with the second episode tomorrow and post my full thoughts.

But the loglady is awesome. And she will ever be in my mind.
post #138 of 751
Thanks so much for the votes, guys. Keep 'em coming!
post #139 of 751
Absolutely renew.

I remember I could not wait to got to work the next day to talk about the Zen episode with my one other co-worker who also watched the show. We were both "OMG!" before that acronym even existed.

Michael Ontkean was the unsung secret weapon on this show. Imagine how the dynamic of the show would have imploded had the chemistry between he and MacLachlan hadn't gelled. Plus, he was in Slap Shot, so Lifetime Pass.
post #140 of 751
Excellently done, again.
Renew.
post #141 of 751
Loving this. I propose complete renewal for the entire run.
post #142 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litmus Configuration View Post
Loving this. I propose complete renewal for the entire run.
I was just about to say that. Can you just go ahead and work out a "Lost deal" complete with an end date and everything? I don't think there's anyone here who doesn't want to see you barrel through the whole thing, wonky James-subplots and all. In fact, those will arguably be even more interesting reads.
post #143 of 751
When the 'picnic' video goes full-screen, it's shown on original tape instead of film-transfer. I always thought that was jarring in just the right way.
post #144 of 751
I'm with Litmus-- let's just settle in for the long haul on Twin Peaks; I suspect that will be much more satisfying than the potential of following votes from show to show for an episode or two at a time.
post #145 of 751
Renew this

it feels like it's 1990 all over again!

I think that episode 3 is undoubtedly one of the best pieces of television we will ever see along with the finale. Love the way Cooper's hair stands up when he wakes from his dream, just like a duck...
post #146 of 751
Renew the hell out of this.

Takes me back to college, when friends and I would dissect each episode like disputatious monks the day after.

Also — for me, anyway — time has been kind to the movie.
post #147 of 751
Re: The dream sequence in Episode 2.

The end dream sequence (with Mike and Bob) is partially made up of footage culled from the extended pilot/movie which aired over in Europe. Did that version of the pilot ever get shown in the states? Because if it didn't I assume that a lot of people would have been thrown for a loop by a few indiscrepanices (Bob in particular looks really different in the Pilot than he does throughout the TV show, less shaggy, more grungy looking).
post #148 of 751
The movie version, aka the 'closed ending' cut, was released on home video in the States. I don't think the TV version reappeared until the Gold Box came out.
post #149 of 751
Just saw the second episode. Holy shit indeed. You were totally right. The show goes head on into batshit insane. Loved the stone throwing so much. It's so stupid, yet it works so well within the show. THe only thing that bothers me is that 10 different characters have a J in their name.
I had the same "blair witch" thoughts when those 2 were running through the forest.
And the dream, my god. That little shaking man disturbed me to no end.

Totally renew. I'm gonna watch this till the end. And i love that on the comments, only 2 or 3 cancelled it while dozens renewed it haha.
post #150 of 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammerhead View Post
The movie version, aka the 'closed ending' cut, was released on home video in the States. I don't think the TV version reappeared until the Gold Box came out.
A few more bits about this: The U.S. rights surrounding the pilot were kind of convoluted until The Gold Box. So if I recall correctly, the only way we could get the pilot in the States was on the LaserDisc released by Warner Home Video, which did indeed include the closed ending. (I believe there might have been a VHS version of this released by WHV as well.) When TWIN PEAKS was released here on DVD by Artisan, it was only the seven episodes of the first season, not including any version the pilot. Until The Gold Box, the best way to get a legit version of the televised version of Pilot on DVD in the U.S. was to import the surprisingly legal South Korean DVD release. But the PAL conversion speed up made everyone's voice sound like they had each inhaled a full tank of helium which, in the Lynch universe, is not entirely inappropriate.
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