Matrix Reloaded (2003)

Ever since that MTV Movie Awards skit with Will Ferrell as the Architect, the real Architect never fails to crack me up from start to finish. He may actually be funnier than the parody.

Oh, I dread getting dragged into this fight again, but fuck it, it's been long enough.

Everything the Architect says is relevant to EVERYTHING that came before, in both movies. And the irony of this post is that you basically proved the point of the film. Our characters are sent from place to place with the promise of ending the war, without ever questioning how or why. Nobody cares about the why. The machines whole methodology of keeping humanity under control is that we don't question why, even when we think we're rebelling. And for people so hung up on fighting a war to preserve free will, the fact that they so readily accept being told what to do, thats irony. Also, amazing.

I was pretty riveted during the Architect scene because it was actually spewing a ton of answers after 2 hours of lollygagging from scene to scene. During that opening night screening, I was deathly afraid that it would end with Neo opening the door to the source and fading to white on TO BE CONTINUED. The fact that it didn't was such a relief, I was fully ready to love that scene. That, and I think the Colonel is awesome. So condescending.

I loved Matrix Reloaded. I also loved Matrix Revolutions, though it wasn't as beautiful as Reloaded was. Reloaded and Revolutions are one story, and I watched them as such on DVD, so I don't see the Father of the Matrix's speech as a "stop gap" to make sure people return for Revolutions. It was just a shocking revelation that Neo was not as "in control" as he had thought.

The films do have forward momentum, but it's more in the sense of exploring the Matrix universe, a feeling I loved. Understanding how it works. Perhaps the explanations were vague and imprefectly filled out, but that lent an illusion of reality to it ... the first film was flawed by overly precise explanations that made no fucking sense (people as batteries). The handwavium in the sequels was much more elegant.

As for your complaint that the fight scenes existed merely for their own sakes, I believe you are wrong. The very first fight with the "upgraded" smiths demonstrates an important plot point ... that Neo's godlike agent-killing powers have been weakened by the "upgrading" of the agents. Neo's fight with Seraph (whose yellow code reveals he's from the machine world) foreshadows Neo's ability to connect with and hack machine code, which is fulfilled when he first wirelessly hacks the squiddies at the end Revolutions. (Neo's fight with Seraph shows he can hold his own with Machine code beings). Neo's fight with the ever increasing horde of Smiths in the courtyard emphasizes, again, that Neo's godlike abilities have limits and a problem that even he can't solve with his agent hacking power. This all is in aid of an arc where Neo becomes a savior not by conquering but by providing a Peace between Machine World and Human World (psychologically, a peace between the determinism of a mechanical universe and the desire of men to believe they are free agents, with free will). These three fights are not gratuitious, but demonstrate Neo's limits AND start demonstrating new abilities. Since the last film basically ended by suggesting that Neo had become God, de-Godifying Neo is actually NECESSARY for these films to have any tension, and I don't understand the cries of the fans of the first film that bewail Neo's loss of Godlike power. Neo is clearly more powerful in Reloaded than in Matrix, but for many fans of the first film, that's still not enough ... they want him invincible. I don't get that. What fun would that have been to watch?

As for the Architect's speech at the end ... It utterly destroys Neo's feeling of supremacy, that he's in control. The architect's speech is impressively blathery and condescending, but that's the point, to reduce Neo, and the audience who identifies with him, to feel as if they are children being condescended to. It totally works. It's kinda devastating. And the momentum you say is absent reacher it's lowest point here ... despite Neo's increased mastery of the Matrix, his ability to influence events in God mode is shown to be almost zero, regarding the fate of humanity. The was momentum, but it was downward momentum, and perhaps that's unpleasant if you only approve of upward momentum, as in the first film. Neo starts an upward journey in Revolutions, but it's outside the Matrix, which is sad for fans of the Matrix God Mode, but it's a brave and necessary narrative choice for filmmakers that don't want to just repeat themselves.

And "You don't know someone until you fight them" isn't a ridiculous statement, it means something. Seraph is a machine code. Only "The One", who can hack machine code, could have fought him to a draw. It is part of the foreshadowing of Neo's machine code hacking/communicating abilities that Neo depends on to resolve the war in Revolutions, one film later.

I agree with most everything you just wrote. But I'm sure all of that has been covered in past threads.

None of that changes the fact though that the price the Matrix sequels paid for being so daring (for a big Hollywood blockbuster) is that it became dramatically inert to the point where most of its attempts at drama and tension became laughable.

This movie was in the 'unfortunate' position of having to deliver more incredible action sequences while the Brothers attempted something different in terms of Hollywood sequels. I admire what the Wachowskis attempted and actually do love a lot of stuff about the sequels, but I think most people agree that they didn't achieve the right balance between 'making good' on the promise of the first movie and satisfying their ambitions and idiosyncracies as artists/showmen.

Yeah, I see your quotes around "unfortunate". I see "incredible actions sequences" and "somthing different in action sequels" to be a double Win. I suppose that Revolutions was disappointingly sparse in it's action compared to Reloaded (and had another leather fetish scene, something refreshingly absent from Reloaded) but I was glad to see the story guiding things instead of the need for more and more action.

I've always really appreciated how the brothers opted out of the audio commentary and provided insights from two groups that had completely different reactions to the sequels.

The thing about the Matrix sequels is they require a lot of work to enjoy their deeper meanings.

Oh and Neo wasn't god at the end of the first film. Morpheus clearly told him that some rules can be bent, some can be broken. He can't break every rule. There is also a symbolism of Jesus wasn't god, but the son of god and did preform miracles.

Reloaded seems to have no forward momentum because we think we know what will happen with Neo taking the machine empire down. Sadly that last scene was important to tell him he wasn't. That people were blinded by their paths, thus acting like machines.

Oh and The Animatrix is required watching to get a few more details. The video game also filled in a lot of gaps. It was interesting to see a story spawn over several mediums, but it sucked that the film really couldn't stand on its own like the first.

...which was not so different from LOST as it neared its conclusion.

It was refreshing to see a hero so uncertain of what to do, but it really did kill a lot of the momentum to have Neo so lost as Morpheus became more and more pompous about his beliefs. One imagines if the final moments of Reloaded would've had more punch had that aspect of Morpheus more present in Neo as well. To have the Neo at the end of the first movie (a world with no borders or boundaries) start all gung-ho only to be slapped down by the Architect at the end would've probably been a lot more dramatic than what we did see. It certainly would've been a very different movie. One in which Tom Cruise played Neo or something. Hahaha.

Actually, I think Morpheus's arc was similar to Neo's. He starts in Reloaded as pompous as ever, and then is devastated by Neo's revelation that finding the Architect does NOT resolve things. He then spends Revolutions in a state of uncertainty and unhappiness until the the Peace appears, when his hope finally reasserts itself. I think his final lines where he conveys slow realization of a dream he had thought smashed were really well done.

Fishburne did a great job of selling that moment. Performance-wise, it's probably his strongest moment in the two sequels. Though I find it funny that even in such a moment, there is an element of pomposity as Morpheus seems to be speechifying even as "shit gets real."

But I'm theorizing that the movie could've been stronger had that arc been more present in Neo. As it is, Reloaded begins with Neo being unsure of everything and ends with him being REALLY unsure of everything. That's not a very clear and satisfying arc in terms of conventional narratives.

I can give Reloaded a pass because I can see what the Wachowskis are trying to do and I do respect it. I can't let Revolutions go because I just don't give a shit about the people of Zion. There was nothing in Reloaded or Revolutions that ever made me empathize with these people, and then to spend almost two-thirds of Revolutions on them makes it a sludge to get through.

In terms of the Matrix vs Lost
Lost had a couple of year of time to get crazy. The Matrix films come out as theatrical films, with time between them. It was a massive jump between the 1st and 2nd.

Neo is uncertain pretty much till the final battle with Smith, when he realizes he has to die (being the opposite of Smith, the equation trying to balance itself out, if he didn't exist, Smith dies as well). The thing is, he is still human, and prone to flaws.

The funny thing is about the topic of choice and blind devotion is interesting, as all the characters seem set in their ways, and only Neo makes the choice to try something different (peace and dying).

Well, yeah, if you see it as a self contained film, but if you view the back to back it's just a dark part of his journey. By the end of Revolutions he is sure of himself again. The films ARE written as one story.

I actually do think Neo's journey throughout the two sequels is a beautiful idea in theory. It just doesn't play out like that in reality till you give it that chance after watching both sequels. And that's all I'm talking about; how the drama comes across in that first viewing experience of Reloaded. It's really not surprising that people turned on the franchise the way they did.

You'd think people had never head of "The Empire Strikes Back". Though "Return of the Jedi" didn't really pay off the way "Matrix Revolutions" did.

Okay, now that's just ridiculous. I'm not even a huge Jedi fan and that still sounds crazy.

As much as Jedi is just treading water for most of its running time, the Ewoks are still more likeable than the humans of Zion.

Yea, The Wachowskis were trying something different with their sequels and I love that but the real problem the films have (even the original) is that the characters are too flat to produce any real drama.

Neo has almost no personality or character traits beyond the fact that he is The One. Morpheus in the first film is about as cliche as a mentor character can get, although I think his character had much more potential in the sequels when it was revealed that the prophecy of The One was not widely believed, but the films never really go anywhere with that idea or with Morpheus' character in general. Trinity, especially in the sequels, is barely a character at all and really just serves as a McGuffin to motivate Neo to action.

Despite these shortcomings I feel the first film still works because it constantly moves along and for the most part the action scenes serve a narrative purpose. Also, having recently re-watched the first film for the first time in a few years I feel like there's this wry sense of humor running throughout the whole film that keeps it from getting too serious for its own good. The sequels, by contrast, are bloated and filled with even more dour-faced, flat characters.

I think the biggest problem with the sequels is that they probably should have been one cohesive film. As it stands now they basically are one really long film and I think the structure of both Reloaded and Revolutions suffer because of that. There was really no need to try and make The Matrix series a trilogy.

I think that's pushing things WAY too far in favor of Jedi, and against Revolutions. You may have issues with some of the acting, but the characters are fine. I liked Michael Perrineau's "Link" and his woman back home worried about his ass. You do want to paste the council in the faces with pies though.

The only character from Zion I liked was Mifune... and that was mostly because he screamed a lot and went out like a champ. I could care less about anyone else. The only strong feeling I had towards Zion was that I wanted to butcher the council.

Mifune was pretty cool, and Link's wife and her Vasquez-esque buddy were hot. That's it. The Ewoks were funny and cute (opinions may vary, of course). That's all there is to them. Edge: Ewoks.

I'm sorry, I forgot Captain Roland, record-holder of the Zion fleet for saying the word "goddamn".

Cornel West just booked a plane ticket to wherever you are for that shit.

Not that I disagree with you. Just saying. He will whoop your ass.

I'd be honored to have my ass whooped by the real Cornel West. Just as long as he remains true to his passionate self instead of the wet blanket he was in the movie (along with the rest of the old people I wanna butcher!).

It was AMAZING how a character who was already a total wet blanket (Harry Lennix) faced an entire council of wet blankets. I actually felt sorry for the character despite the fact that the guy was a hateful bore, GODDAMN IT.

"The city has been breached!"

"GODDAMN IT!"

"Your pizza is gonna be late!"

"GODDAMN IT!"

"Everything you ever desired will come true!"

"GODDAMN IT!"


There was a line during one of his dreadful council meetings where he says something along the lines of, "Council, if it were up to me, I would recruit every man, woman, and child in Zion to fight!" Right then and there, I wished that the character were more like Zap Brannigan and imploring the council to have every person on Zion make their beds and fire their lasers wildly into the air.

I liked Locke because he's such a Negative Nancy and shits all over the heroes' ideas and philosophies, which I could fully empathize with during the turgid second movie. It's kind of amazing that the second and third "Matrix" films, particularly the third, actively try to make you become completely indifferent towards the characters they'd taken such pains to develop in the first installment. Locke, Mifune and some of the other Zionists seemed much more interesting and empathetic because they weren't sitting around talking like a bunch of first-year philosophy majors between CGI-heavy slapfights.

My problem with Zion is that it does not mesh with how it was described in first film. Morpheus painted a picture of bleak desperation, of a city in ruins. We're led to believe that humans are almost extinct and that there is just a rag tag bunch of survivors who have been unplugged and are waging a guerrilla war against the machines. Instead, we are shown a vibrant metropolis that has a governing body and a pretty large military. A military that had Agent Smith not possessed Bane and triggered the EMPs early, would likely have been able to thwart the sentinel's attack on Zion. I know expectations are a bitch. But my expectations didn't come out of thin air.

Hahah, I remember reacting to Zion the same way.

I love when people say "bullshit philosophy", "first year philosophy majors" and "philosophy 101" in relation to The Matrix trilogy (and Lost, too, while we're at it).

Being a philosophy major approaching the finish line of his BA, those kinds of assertions are always totally hilarious to me. I know a lot of phil majors who have a sense of entitlement over their chosen vocation but the dismissive haughtiness of those sorts of comments outdoes a pompous philosophy student any day.