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Metallica - Page 3

post #101 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhp1608 View Post

Metallica are going to be for the next few generations what Zeppelin was to mine.

 

No way. They aren't even on the same plane as Zeppelin.

post #102 of 181
Here we go.
post #103 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by catartik View Post

Here we go.

 

There's nowhere to go. 

 

One is Led Zeppelin, the other is not Led Zeppelin.

 

This is like comparing someone else to The Beatles. As far as hard rock goes, Zeppelin is the zeitgeist and it's unreasonable to expect anyone else to reach that point.

 

I'm not the biggest Metallica fan but I would argue they and Van Halen (possibly Guns N' Roses as well) came the closest at their peaks but ultimately none of them pulled it off (and VH is my all-time favorite band). 

post #104 of 181

Production issues aside I can easily put the Kill 'Em All/Ride The Lightning/Master Of Puppets/And Justice For All period against any band. Ever. 

post #105 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike J View Post

No way. They aren't even on the same plane as Zeppelin.

post #106 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post
 

Production issues aside I can easily put the Kill 'Em All/Ride The Lightning/Master Of Puppets/And Justice For All period against any band. Ever. 

 

You can rightfully claim a lot of albums by a lot of artists to be among the best ever. I was addressing the idea that Metallica is going to have the same legacy and long-term impact as Zeppelin. They won't. And nobody probably ever will. 

post #107 of 181
That comparison isn't that radical. There are only so many bands that were there at the beginning of a fledgling genre, helped evolve it creatively *and* achieved massive crossover success. They've already had long term impact. They've been around like 35 years!
post #108 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

That comparison isn't that radical. There are only so many bands that were there at the beginning of a fledgling genre, helped evolve it creatively *and* achieved massive crossover success. They've already had long term impact. They've been around like 35 years!

 

So Metallica is as big and influential as Zeppelin?

 

I'll save you a post: They're not. 

post #109 of 181
Garth Brooks pwns both of your lame-ass favorite bands.
post #110 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virtanen View Post

Garth Brooks pwns both of your lame-ass favorite bands.

 

And Elvis and The Beatles own everybody. 

 

Unless Metallica is also as influential and popular as them. 

post #111 of 181
This just seems to be about you wanking off Led Zeppelin, now.

Yes: Zep were and are great and huge. But acting like a long running band with several multi-million selling albums (inc. one of the biggest selling albums of all time), and who routinely see several albums ranked among the greatest metal albums of all time, are forgettable flash in the pan chancers is ridiculous.
post #112 of 181

Plus, there is heavy metal before Metallica and heavy metal after Metallica. Their rise pretty much transformed their genre and helped lead another hugely influential one (the LA scene) into its grave. There is a handful of music acts that can claim such things.

 

The fact alone that for a while a thrash metal band was the biggest band in the world should be enough. 

post #113 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

This just seems to be about you wanking off Led Zeppelin, now.

Yes: Zep were and are great and huge. But acting like a long running band with several multi-million selling albums (inc. one of the biggest selling albums of all time), and who routinely see several albums ranked among the greatest metal albums of all time, are forgettable flash in the pan chancers is ridiculous.

 

I never said they were a forgettable flash in the pan. And they're not the only ones to hang around. Guns N' Roses played Dodger Stadium tonight and Van Halen had a successful tour last year. The latter has been around since the 70s. Black Sabbath and Rush also managed to maintain sizable fanbases over a long period of time. It's rare to have that kind of longevity but Metallica isn't the only band to do that.

 

My point is that Zeppelin achieved a level of success and mystique that can't be replicated. That isn't an opinion. It's a fact. 

post #114 of 181

So I'll make it simple:

 

Is Metallica as big and influential as Led Zeppelin?

post #115 of 181
Within culture as a whole, probably not. Within their specific genre? Probably.
post #116 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

No.

FTFY. 

 

And considering the original assessment was that Metallica was going to carry on like Zeppelin, that's the only answer I needed. 

post #117 of 181
Can we rename this the "Mike J wanks off Zeppelin" thread?
post #118 of 181

Y'all can keep your Zeppelins and your Beatles. I'm all about Bad Company, 'til the day I die.

 

Just kidding. This battle of the megapopular bands is amusing and reminds me of music discussions/arguments my friends and I would have in middle school.

 

The new Metallica song is soggy balls, but it's inoffensive. It lacks the hilarity factor of the St.Anger highlights, though.

post #119 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

Can we rename this the "Mike J wanks off Zeppelin" thread?

 

I would love to hear where you stand on The Beatles ("Yeah, they're pretty good and important and what not but honestly, U2 is up there!"). Zeppelin isn't even my all-time favorite band but to say Metallica is in the same league as them is wrong. There's no wanking about it. 

post #120 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle Reese View Post
 

Y'all can keep your Zeppelins and your Beatles. I'm all about Bad Company, 'til the day I die.

 

Just kidding. This battle of the megapopular bands is amusing and reminds me of music discussions/arguments my friends and I would have in middle school.

 

The new Metallica song is soggy balls, but it's inoffensive. It lacks the hilarity factor of the St.Anger highlights, though.

 

It is very middle school-ish but it's the rare case where the scope and influence of a band is a cold hard fact and not really up for debate. 

post #121 of 181

I met Robert Plant once in 2005, and he didn't say anything to me about Led Zeppelin being huge or influential.

post #122 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle Reese View Post
 

I met Robert Plant once in 2005, and he didn't say anything to me about Led Zeppelin being huge or influential.

 

Would that have been news to you?

 

And to wrap this up before it gets too out of control, my original point was that overall, Metallica doesn't have the same popularity and influence as Led Zeppelin (no other hard rock band does). Paul C (eventually) responded with this:

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

Within culture as a whole, probably not. 

 

So we actually agree. Let's move on.

post #123 of 181

Beating a dead horse, but I assume this started with:

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhp1608 View Post

Metallica are going to be for the next few generations what Zeppelin was to mine.

 

 

Now how do we measure jhp1608's cryptic prediction? In terms of record sales? It's a very different business than it was in the 70s. Influence on other musicians? Ie. people born between 2000 and now, who will pick up an instrument and go on to shape the future musical field? I assume they'll more likely will grow up to Metallica's albums than to Zeppelin's, just because that's what they'll hear from their parents and big brothers. Or to something else. This is something that you really can't measure. Tomas Haake, the drummer of Meshuggah, has cited that his main influence and reason to start playing drums was the music of Björn Ulvaeus. Without ABBA, we wouldn't have Meshuggah. Logical, isn't it?

 

It's also funny that one thing that Led Zeppelin and Metallica have in common is that they probably have the most famous and discussed drummers. But for entirely opposite reasons.

post #124 of 181
Sorry, I shouldn't have lit that fire. I meant that Metallica seem to be the sort of fountainhead band for younger metalheads and fans of various -cores that Zeppelin was held out as being for my generation of rock fans (I'm 41).
post #125 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhp1608 View Post

Sorry

YOU SHOULD BE!

 

Nah, it's all good. I let it blow up and that's my bad.

 

As I said earlier, it's only rock and roll. 

 

And I played a piano arrangement of Nothing Else Matters at a recital in seventh grade. I have some positive history with Metallica. 

post #126 of 181

I think the Metallica/Zeppelin comparison has merit, at least in terms of commercial success and influence. They may not release new albums very often but can sell out huge venues at the drop of a hat (not to be sniffed at for a 35-year career, especially way past their commercial heyday), and I really can't see how you don't give them points in terms of influence. Countless young bands have been influenced by them and still are, and many of them are young enough to have first discovered them during the post-Black Album era, one that many of us would consider their creative nadir. In terms of legacy bands people are raised with as groundbreaking and godlike - yeah, Metallica are very much at the status us old farts knew Zeppelin for.

 

The only difference is, arguably, in terms of consistency and creative confidence. There's a certain cringe-factor at play in Metallica's work between 1995-2008, as if they were trying to prove themselves as being 'more than some metal band', and that led to some dodgy creative diversions that Zep mostly avoided. Still, that meandering seems to have hurt the band's legacy way less than I expected post-St. Anger/SCOM. 

post #127 of 181
About the new song: listened to it, liked it. And can't remember anything about it 15 minutes later. Reminds me when System of a Down dropped Cigaro as the first taste of their Mezmerize/Hypnotize double.
post #128 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Workyticket View Post

I think the Metallica/Zeppelin comparison has merit, at least in terms of commercial success and influence. They may not release new albums very often but can sell out huge venues at the drop of a hat (not to be sniffed at for a 35-year career, especially way past their commercial heyday), and I really can't see how you don't give them points in terms of influence. Countless young bands have been influenced by them and still are, and many of them are young enough to have first discovered them during the post-Black Album era, one that many of us would consider their creative nadir. In terms of legacy bands people are raised with as groundbreaking and godlike - yeah, Metallica are very much at the status us old farts knew Zeppelin for.

The only difference is, arguably, in terms of consistency and creative confidence. There's a certain cringe-factor at play in Metallica's work between 1995-2008, as if they were trying to prove themselves as being 'more than some metal band', and that led to some dodgy creative diversions that Zep mostly avoided. Still, that meandering seems to have hurt the band's legacy way less than I expected post-St. Anger/SCOM. 

Like I said upthread, I was honestly astonished at the regard St Anger was held in by the exchange student - and her friends. What came over to long time listeners as a really wrong headed, poorly written, hollow attempt to follow the zeitgeist appears to be a source of credibility for younger metalheads. Small sample, I admit.

Actually, I wonder whether the Stones might be a better analogy.
post #129 of 181
I've always had a soft spot for St. Anger. I like it more now that it's been 13 years removed from release.

Reload is absolutely terrible save Low Man's Lyric. That is a bad, bad album. I will take the coffee can banging and vocal improvising of St. Anger over Reload's nonsense any day.
post #130 of 181
Low Man's Lyric is fantastic. The way his voice opens up in the last verse is probably the last time I got chills from hearing Hatfield.

I'm a fan of "Load" from the perspective of it not really being a Metallica album.
post #131 of 181
Great song.
post #132 of 181

From Saturday night's concert at the new US Bank Stadium here in MN:

 

 

I like this live version better, although I think Kirk kinda botches the solo somewhat.  

post #133 of 181
https://metallica.com/blog/news/433809/track-two-moth-into-flame

Here's the video for their second single. I like this one quite a bit, very groovy and well-constructed. The mix sounds better to my ears as well, the bass is higher and the drum sound is no longer overpowering every other instrument.
post #134 of 181

Yeah, that one's rockin'.

post #135 of 181

Here's a video of the writing process for Moth Into Flame.  I really wish more bands would post stuff like this because I find it really interesting.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmCaNgQDKWk

post #136 of 181

Fucking shave your dumb head, Lars you tool. You look ridiculous.

post #137 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by catartik View Post

Here's a video of the writing process for Moth Into Flame.  I really wish more bands would post stuff like this because I find it really interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmCaNgQDKWk

I'm with you man, ever since Some Kind of Monster I could watch hours of behind the scenes stuff from these guys and the songwriting process is always fascinating to me no matter who's doing it.
post #138 of 181

Here's the third song Metallica dropped before the release:

 

 

On first listen, I was sort of unimpressed, but it has grown on me after a few listens.  Possibly a grower.

post #139 of 181
I'm going to skip this one and wait for the album to listen to it. Already heard the other two songs, want to leave something to surprise.

Speaking of surprises, Avenged Sevenfold pulled off a good one releasing their new album out of nowhere.
post #140 of 181

By tomorrow, Metallica will have released official music videos for every song off the new album.  Here's what we have so far:

 

"Now that We're Dead"

 

 

"Dream No More"

 

 

"Confusion"

 

 

"ManUNKind"

 

 

"Here Comes Revenge"

 

 

"Am I Savage?"

 

 

"Halo on Fire"

 

 

I'm still collecting my thoughts, and songs tend to grow on me over time, so anything can change.  With that said, I'm not exactly blown away so far.  There are a lot of mid-tempo tracks - nothing inherently wrong with that, but a few of them sort of plod along.  "ManUNkind" and "Am I Savage?" are the main culprits; I don't exactly hate these songs, but I don't foresee me listening to them a lot either.  "Here Comes Revenge" is a step above, but seemed like it could've been trimmed a bit.

 

"Dream No More" works well, though.  It's an inspired song, and a bit different for them.  Yeah, it's another mid-tempo song, but it's heavy as hell and Hammet's solo is pretty cool.  "Confusion" is solid; I get the feeling that one will grow on me the more listens I give it.  "Now that We're Dead" is a lot of fun.  Of the tracks released so far, though, "Halo on Fire" is the one that's sticking with me the most; I particularly like the last few minutes.

 

Regarding the videos, I got a kick out of the Mayhem-inspired concert for "ManUNkind."  The animation of "Here Comes Revenge" should interest many here, I think.

 

I know it leaked, but I haven't gone out of my way to find the other tracks.  I hear "Spit Out the Bone" is the best song (it seems pretty unanimous from the people I've talked to). 

post #141 of 181

Meanwhile:

 

post #142 of 181

I'm digging this album a ton. It does lose a bit of steam in CD2, but Spit Out The Bone makes for an amazing closer. It's their best honest-to-fuck Thrash song since AJFA. CD1 is all gold IMO, I particularly love Dream No More - it's basically Thing That Should Not Be filtered through Load, and it works like gangbusters. Even the mid-paced songs on CD2 I generally enjoy, they just haven't gripped me like the first few songs and Bone have (And Murder One just isn't doing it for me: love the sentiment, dull song).

 

I will say this, though: this feels to me like the first Metallica album in nigh-on 30 years where it doesn't feel like they're reacting to anything, or shoving some reinvention down our throats. They pull bits and pieces from all their eras, and it feels like a band comfortable in themselves for the first time in decades. Relaxed, yet somehow even heavier. And you can hear the fucking bass! They still have issues with self-editing - this really didn't need to be a two-CD album - but the good way outweighs the bad for me.

post #143 of 181

Yeah, not everything on it is gold but there is a bunch of great stuff. And Spit Out the Bone kicks fuckin' ass.

post #144 of 181
To be honest on first listen this album sounds exactly like the last one, only at least there you had the novelty of hearing them revisit their old 80's album template decades on. Not terrible or embarrassing or anything (except some of the lyrics, but that's to be expected), but I can't see myself coming back to it a lot.
post #145 of 181
More I listen to it, the more I'm enjoying it.

Moth Into Flame, Halo on Fire, Dream No More and Spit Out the Bone are great.

Spit is my current favorite.
post #146 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

To be honest on first listen this album sounds exactly like the last one

Except this one is at least recorded properly. Four musicians and I can hear four instruments! Astonishing!

I also think it's superior to Death Magnetic in that it's fun. DM had that feeling of the band gritting their teeth and providing a "return to form" whether they liked it or not. But at points this one actually swings. It's like they read their own biography and remembered they were inspired by the NWOBHM.
post #147 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightning Slim View Post


Except this one is at least recorded properly. Four musicians and I can hear four instruments! Astonishing!
 

 

Sometimes Lars' seeming cymbal obsession becomes a detriment because of this. Damn, he likes banging on them. Ting ting ting ting ting ting ting.

post #148 of 181

Personally, I think this is their best work since The Black Album.

post #149 of 181
I had to spend a lot of time with this album to really get into it. It is easily their best record since the Black Album, and I do enjoy Load quite a bit.

I've been loving the 10 minute segments they've been releasing of the making of each song. Can't wait until the Spit Out the Bone one. Looks like it will be the last.
post #150 of 181
Disc 1 is good solid stuff. Disc 2 is the rightly-praised Spit Out the Bone plus a look into what St. Anger might have been if they hadn't fucked it up.

On the whole it's a worthwhile endeavour.
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