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Civilization 5 - Page 3

post #101 of 135
I would have liked to have seen how last night would have played out. I would assume after Monty, TCJ would have set his sights on me. I was prepping for that anyway. I'm not saying you couldn't have broken through my defenses but it would have been very tough. I even had my eyes on New York although homeland defense was my first priority.
post #102 of 135
Thread Starter 
I had just rolled out my first cannon before taking his capital, but I would have had to truck the majority of my fleet over to Paris to try for the kill shot. It would have been tough and I only had an archer and a knight sitting on my home continent so any counter attack of worth would have been successful.
post #103 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcjsavannah View Post
I had just rolled out my first cannon before taking his capital, but I would have had to truck the majority of my fleet over to Paris to try for the kill shot. It would have been tough and I only had an archer and a knight sitting on my home continent so any counter attack of worth would have been successful.
I was about 4 turns from building Himeji Castle and I had the Freedom City defense bonus going (two things which I wouldn't normally go for but I was scared of an invasion). Plus I think I was ahead in Tech, I had infantry defending the cities. I'm still trying to figure out how you expand so fast, I guess I'm just a little more conservative with my city building.

I'd love to get a deep game going where we are actually using modern tech advancements vs one another. I think everybody should grab their cheetos and mountain dew, settle in their chair or couch and prepare for a 5 hour contest. 7pm - midnight tonight. Anybody in?
post #104 of 135
Got a victory on King level last night. I can't imagine what a bastard some of these AIs are going to be on higher levels.
post #105 of 135
Are we ready to crank this up again?
post #106 of 135
I am free Tuesday or Wednesday night if you guys are up for it?
post #107 of 135
Thread Starter 
I'm in a crap part of my work schedule.. on the road this weekend and next week we are hosting a huge event. The week after is good though.
post #108 of 135
I'll be available once I have my papers done, which will be a couple weeks. I still have that autosave should you want to finish the game with Tyres.
post #109 of 135
Just picked this up yesterday. This is my first go at the Civ games. Gotta say that the diplomacy seems really lacking. I'd like to wheel and deal with the other empires but they don't really bite off on anything.

I'm getting the hang of not building nearly as many military units. It's kind of odd not needing lots of units to run through cities. The whole resource thing is coming to me slowly. I like this game a lot though.
post #110 of 135
Thread Starter 
Another patch is due out soon that will help out with diplomacy.. some new actions and you can see why or why not an AI is upset with you. Thank god.
post #111 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcjsavannah View Post
Another patch is due out soon that will help out with diplomacy.. some new actions and you can see why or why not an AI is upset with you. Thank god.
That's what I've been reading. Hopefully it drops soon.

Have any of you guys been to any Civ forums? Those guys are fucking scary with their obsession.
post #112 of 135
As a semi-regular poster on CivFanatics, I'd say their obsession is no worse than CHUD's obsession with film. You'll find a lot of helpful posts in their Strategy & Tips forum, as well as good examples of gameplay in the Stories & Tales forum.
post #113 of 135
Thread Starter 
I was huge on CivFanatics during III and the early stages of IV, now I just read to pick up tips and laugh at the obsessive people who like to bitch just to bitch.
post #114 of 135
No kidding. Just about all the problems they're complaining about happen with every Civ release anyway. I am kind of irritated over how ICS can overwhelm other strategies, but really, Civ's always been like that.
post #115 of 135
Are you fuckers ever going to play again? Enough with this work and school bullshit.
post #116 of 135
I'll definitely have more free time next week. This is the last big crunch for me, followed by more crunching under tcjsavannah's feet.
post #117 of 135
Thread Starter 
I'll be around tonight and tomorrow night if you guys want a game.
post #118 of 135
This game sucks up hours at a time. It's really not conducive to light and breezy gaming. I find myself losing interest in the latter portions of a game. Maybe the AI isn't just engaging me. Hopefully the diplomacy fixes help that and maybe bumping up the difficulty level.
post #119 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shen Annigans View Post
This game sucks up hours at a time. It's really not conducive to light and breezy gaming. I find myself losing interest in the latter portions of a game. Maybe the AI isn't just engaging me. Hopefully the diplomacy fixes help that and maybe bumping up the difficulty level.
The singleplayer is easysauce on Prince level and below. Once you get above that you have to become more active/aggressive about your relationships with the city-states and other Civs.

Multiplayer can be fun but it can be difficult finding a decent game (at least that's been my experience). We have a few guys on this board (TCJ, Monty, Mr. Tynes) who are good sports. I'd love to get a roster of guys from CHUD and play regularly, but it seems as if real life often gets in the way.
post #120 of 135
Out of all the complaint threads I see over there, this is the best one:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=396943

Considering how much the developers are changing diplomacy already, I wouldn't be surprised if they redesigned the diplomatic victory soon.
post #121 of 135
Monty, are you done with your little book reports yet?

I'm thinking we need to get a game going for Tuesday or Wednesday.
post #122 of 135
I'm game for tonight. Let's get Tyres in and try to finish that island war.
post #123 of 135
Thread Starter 
Civ V for Mac is out.. and if you've already bought it for PC, you can install the Mac version for free. For once, the sandwich-heavy portfolio pays off for the hungry investor!
post #124 of 135
Anyone up for a game tonight?
post #125 of 135
Thread Starter 
I'd like to try just to see if multiplayer with the Mac will work nicely with PC
post #126 of 135
8pm? Also, a hearty chuckle at the sandwich heavy portfolio
post #127 of 135
Thread Starter 
Sounds good to me. 8 pm it is!
post #128 of 135
Apologies for the dropping out last night. My wireless router somehow cut out as Tyres was marching to the sea.
post #129 of 135
Ill be on for some Turkey night games if anybody is interested. 8 pmish.
post #130 of 135

So the new patch came out the other day that balanced a lot of things nicely.  But something still feels off.  I like to play on smaller maps.  The lay of the land (or lack thereof, rather) makes it easier to read what's going on.  Things aren't as complicated...right?


Sure.  In fact, that's the problem.  When used well, city-states make a great presence on the map.  Why are France and Greece mad at you?  Well, there's Brussels taking up your land.  Putting a conflict of interest like that on the map is a fantastic way to ramp up the tension.  So I played another game with that in mind the other day.  I chose Gandhi with a one-way trip to Alpha Centauri in mind.  Steadily I went, attempting a balance of vertical growth with adding more cities.

And yet, something didn't seem right.  This was a tiny map, but everything felt so...empty.  It wasn't the other AIs; they were actually doing their best to expand as rapidly as I did.  It wasn't the lack of units; there were plenty of spearman, settlers, barbarians, and war elephants marching around.  But the overall gameplay still felt rather flat.  It was a new feeling that I couldn't quite put my finger on...  I popped a social policy and chose a free Great Person, a Scientist actually.  I moved him over to the city to build an Academy...huh?  You're supposed to build it on a nearby tile?  Well...

That's when it came to me.  The map felt empty because there really wasn't much to freak out over except for cities, city-states, and the odd weakling unit.  What about taking buildings out of the city and placing them on the actual map? Or put another way, how about translating more infrastructure and game concepts into actual objects to protect?

Civ 5 does some of this already, actually.  Civ 4's spaceship is no longer stationed safely at an abstract dock, the parts are literally on the map, just waiting to be gobbled up by Mongol hordes.  The Great Scientist's Academy is also another building that can be destroyed, never to return if you let that idiot barbarian wander where it pleases.  I'm sure there are a couple more Great Person buildings I'm not thinking about...

But what does this mean for the rest of the game?  The point of 1UPT is that if there's a unit on a hex, it can potentially block other units from accessing other territory.  Put more victory-crucial objectives on the map, and you have a warzone.  As mentioned already, City-States are the diplomatic game translated into something that can be conquered.  So you have that ally over there, huh?  Too bad, my units are over there. Whatcha gonna do about it?  My spaceship parts are over in Hong Kong but they need to get to Stockholm.  How can I maneuver them around Hiawatha?  

So let's throw some ideas out there.  How can we best create more conflicts of interest on the map?  Here are some implications for you:

City Slots Out Of The City:  Civ 4 introduced the fun visual of seeing all your Wonders and buildings on the map without needing to go to a separate screen.  With 1UPT, that could make things very risky.  Suppose a tile could only hold so many buildings...say, 4 buildings on this marsh, and the Pyramids took up two.  There they are, just waiting to be taken.  How do you protect them?  Can you expand the number of slots for one tile with research?  You're not just showing more stuff for the AI, you're changing the terrain itself.  This also makes the player more mindful of which buildings to construct if there is limited space, unlike the Infinite Bag of Holding that is the current city system.

Sorry, Civ 4 builders.  Civ 5's 1UPT system is just going to make it harder...is it?  Here's the thing.  With more buildings on the map, you can literally see your civ grow with every turn.  That leaves you more vulnerable, but at the same time, you can bask in the glory of your expanding empire, turn by turn.

Domination?  On my culture and science?  It's more likely than you think.   Right now the Domination Victory is the condition in the least need of attention.  This system simply makes it a lot easier for military civs to stomp around all over your stuff, and again, that's not a bad thing.  The more incentive you have to protect yourself and do more things on the map, the more the other civs and players are going to take notice.

But here's where it gets interesting.  A three-city empire is small, right?  Wrong.  Because it has more wonders and cultural buildings, a "tall" empire could be spitting out its crap all over its territory.  If you're going to be the high-falutin' one, you might as well make other people notice by taking up their potential territory with your god-awful lawn gnomes.  Sound familiar?  Polynesia already does this with their Maoi statues.

The Diplomatic Victory Is One Sensitive Baby  And notice they will, if more keys to diplomatic success are tied to the map.  Maybe that research agreement is represented by a couple scientists running back and forth between capitol cities.  What if Polynesia had something to say about it?  Or maybe that maritime ally has actual caravans of food parading down the road.  There's actually a mod already out there that requires diplomatic units to be exposed to military action.  While I'm not sure if there are consequences to killing diplomatic units, it's a great step.

Civ 5's map currently doesn't know which Civ it wants for work for.  Does it work for Civ 4's city system, where all the buildings were in one tidy place?  If it does, then there's a huge opportunity being lost by not cluttering the map with other people's stuff.  With 1UPT, your units should be in other people's business, whether you want them there or not.  

So it comes back to France's pet Brussels, sitting there like a rotten egg on my land.  What do I want to do about it?  After all, all our toys are spread out in the room.  Let's stop thinking of production and improvements in terms of stacks and spread them out like units.


Edited by Monty Underhill - 3/12/11 at 12:21pm
post #131 of 135

Very nice. I like this idea a lot. In one of my more recent solo games, I built three forts and a citadel across the one little land bridge that separated my land mass from my enemies to the south. I had a navy to blow stuff up with. I then put 4 troops and 4 ranged behind them. I never had to worry about an invasion by that Russian bitch Catherine again.

post #132 of 135

I was amused in my last game when I checked Greek and Roman units between their own borders and my new city.

post #133 of 135

Ohhhhhh my goooooddd I'mdonewithschool.  Done.  With.  School.

 

Let's do this.  Barring evening shifts next week, I'm ready for some multiplayer.

post #134 of 135

Give me one more week and I am in as well. Sunday, Tuesday, Wednesday or Saturday.

post #135 of 135

Sunday and Saturday would work best for me, if you're willing to wait till 9 CST on Sunday.  Otherwise Tuesday would be okay; I have Mon-Tues off, with Wed-Fri being 12-9 for work and Sat 11-6.

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