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THE DARK KNIGHT RISES Pre-Release Thread - Page 2

post #51 of 4802
10/27/10 at 8:05pm
Richard Jenkins would make an incredible Ventriloquist.
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post #52 of 4802
10/27/10 at 8:38pm
Jason Statham, IS...Mr. Freeze!
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post #53 of 4802
10/27/10 at 9:37pm
I know it'll never happen but it'd be awesome if they recast Batman. And since its the final movie in Nolans trilogy, it should be the definitive chapter in Batmans life. It should end with his death. Its the only way Nolan can redeem the franchise.
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post #54 of 4802
10/27/10 at 9:43pm
I do like the idea of Batman dying to be honest.
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post #55 of 4802
10/27/10 at 9:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
I know it'll never happen but it'd be awesome if they recast Batman. And since its the final movie in Nolans trilogy, it should be the definitive chapter in Batmans life. It should end with his death. Its the only way Nolan can redeem the franchise.
Mind. Boggled. Close to 2 billion in box office receipts isn't redemption enough?
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post #56 of 4802
10/27/10 at 9:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelM View Post
More good news: the source article has Nolan saying it won't be in 3D, but will focus on HD and IMAX technology.
That's interesting to me since I remembered coming across an article that relayed this quote via AICN:

Quote:
Pfister, just like Nolan, does not like digital cameras: "The image quality of film" exceeds that of the high end digital cameras like "the Genesis camera and the Red camera." He said that he and "Chris [Nolan] are 'devotees' of film.""]Pfister, just like Nolan, does not like digital cameras: "The image quality of film" exceeds that of the high end digital cameras like "the Genesis camera and the Red camera." He said that he and "Chris [Nolan] are 'devotees' of film."
Although I believe they did use digital cameras for the super slow motion in Inception I wouldn't be surprised if Nolan and Pfister devote the non-Imax sequences to the variety of large scale formats they've been toying with (65mm, Vistavision) in addition to the bankable 70mm brand.
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post #57 of 4802
10/27/10 at 9:52pm
I think we can all agree the most logical, fanboy pleasing and all-around awesome title would be The Dark Knight Returns.
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post #58 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:01pm
Which will never happen for a Batman film that isn't an adaptation of that specific story. The suits at the WB aren't that stupid.
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post #59 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:04pm
The Dark Knight Cometh. Or The Passion of Dark Knight. Be bold Nolan. But seriously Batman needs to die in this one. The fanboys will elevate his trilogy to legendary status if he does the right thing.
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post #60 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:06pm
I nominate Philip Seymour Hoffman as king Tut.
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post #61 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
The Dark Knight Cometh. Or The Passion of Dark Knight. Be bold Nolan. But seriously Batman needs to die in this one. The fanboys will elevate his trilogy to legendary status if he does the right thing.
Up until the title announcement, I've been sort of expecting Batman to die in the third film. He still could; maybe the resolution of the saga is the people of Gotham collectively taking up the mantle, and through many means keeping the city clean.

But the "rises" makes me wonder if the resolution of the saga is Bruce accepting he'll always be Batman, and figuring out a way to live with it.

Dunno. I like the ballsiness of killing him off, but I love the character so much I don't want to see him die.
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post #62 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:11pm
Nabster, There is no reason for, Batman to...die. Batman's death, does not bring anything interesting to the franchise, at all.
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post #63 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
I know it'll never happen but it'd be awesome if they recast Batman. And since its the final movie in Nolans trilogy, it should be the definitive chapter in Batmans life. It should end with his death. Its the only way Nolan can redeem the franchise.
What on Earth are talking about?

I don't mind the idea of Batman dying; if nothing else it would put a period on the end of this iteration of the character. But as of now the franchise has made more money than God, done more to legitimize the genre than any other film or series, and restored the character's place in popular culture after years in the punchline-wilderness. You can't "redeem" something that has been universally accepted and wildly successful.
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post #64 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:39pm
I think you meant, " What on earth are you talking about?"

And yes THANK YOU Shwartz, no one realised The Dark Knight was popular or that it made a lot of money. No shit.

Yes it can redeem itself if one didn't like the franchise. Just because other people loved it, or it made a lot of money doesn't mean I liked it, so maybe it needs to redeem itself to me. I don't rate movies based upon their popularity or money. And honestly it was in jest, a bad stab at sarcasm.

But even if it wasn't, is this how you view movies? Based on other people's opinions and its popularity? That's dumb.
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post #65 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:52pm
How to appease both Warner Brothers and the fanboys? "The Dark Knight: Detective".
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post #66 of 4802
10/27/10 at 10:53pm
I refuse to label this fanwank, even if it is. This whole thing with Batman dying is interesting, I've said that before but I couldn't help but think that Batman retiring, and for the right reason, being the better option.

Let's say he meets Catwoman, a character much like himself, she has this view of herself that may not be accurate but nevertheless, she's trying to force it on others. She differs from him in that she's really burning the candles at both ends. They meet, drama happens, and it all culminates in a big heroic gesture on Batman's part that somehow allows both of them to walk away from a world that they realize will eventually eat them alive. Maybe in all of this Wayne fakes his death or whatever, whatever allows him to walk away from the role and for the proper reason.

Epilogue this shit with both Bruce and Selina, no longer Batman and Catwoman, meeting outside of Gotham somewhere with different lives, no baggage, and maybe a chance at something new and normal.

I like that, it may be melodramatic, but it's not dark or heavy, it's human and doesn't feel wrong for an ending,
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post #67 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:00pm
I actually think that would be awesome. We've become so accustomed to Superhero films remaining open ended, that an actual end would be fantastic. Other than a conclusion being fresh, it'd also give us a satisfying end. And a satisfying ending would be the perfect cap to this trilogy. Ending with Batman's death would be very cool indeed, but I wonder if WB would allow him to do this if he wanted. I honestly think Nolan maybe thinking about these possibilites.
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post #68 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
I think you meant, " What on earth are you talking about?"

And yes THANK YOU Shwartz, no one realised The Dark Knight was popular or that it made a lot of money. No shit.

Yes it can redeem itself if one didn't like the franchise. Just because other people loved it, or it made a lot of money doesn't mean I liked it, so maybe it needs to redeem itself to me. I don't rate movies based upon their popularity or money. And honestly it was in jest, a bad stab at sarcasm.

But even if it wasn't, is this how you view movies? Based on other people's opinions and its popularity? That's dumb.
Please don't point out an obvious typo in an effort to question someone's intelligence, it's painfully transparent
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post #69 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
I refuse to label this fanwank, even if it is. This whole thing with Batman dying is interesting, I've said that before but I couldn't help but think that Batman retiring, and for the right reason, being the better option.

Let's say he meets Catwoman, a character much like himself, she has this view of herself that may not be accurate but nevertheless, she's trying to force it on others. She differs from him in that she's really burning the candles at both ends. They meet, drama happens, and it all culminates in a big heroic gesture on Batman's part that somehow allows both of them to walk away from a world that they realize will eventually eat them alive. Maybe in all of this Wayne fakes his death or whatever, whatever allows him to walk away from the role and for the proper reason.

Epilogue this shit with both Bruce and Selina, no longer Batman and Catwoman, meeting outside of Gotham somewhere with different lives, no baggage, and maybe a chance at something new and normal.

I like that, it may be melodramatic, but it's not dark or heavy, it's human and doesn't feel wrong for an ending,
I like this quite a bit, actually. I also wouldn't mind if the epilogue included hints or outright showing someone else taking up the mantle of the Bat. I think one of the ideas that's been in both Nolan films is that this is a neverending fight; indeed, Bruce uses the words "eternal" and "indestructible" to decribe Batman's symbolic power.
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post #70 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
Please don't point out an obvious typo in an effort to question someone's intelligence, it's painfully transparent
I think you meant, "Please don't point out an obvious typo in an effort to question someone's intelligence; it's painfully transparent."

j/k.
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post #71 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattioli View Post
How to appease both Warner Brothers and the fanboys? "The Dark Knight: Detective".
As I've said elsewhere, if they were going to keep "Dark Knight" in the title, they might as well have called it "The Dark Knight Detective" since that's as much an official nickname of his as "The Dark Knight" and "The Caped Crusader". However, that title makes more sense if there's actually someone trying to track him down like a detective (hello double meaning) and who else could that be but The Riddler? I can imagine Nolan ending this with an Inception-like cliffhanger ending where it looks like Batman may have died, but we can't be sure. And the debate will rage on.
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post #72 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:14pm
I wasn't questioning his intelligence, just his line of thinking on that particular issue. Judging by his numerous posts, especially those Buffy dissections, I'm sure Shwartz is smarter than I am.
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post #73 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:18pm
I can see Catwoman stumbling on Batman while he is underground, or you know Batman stumbling on her, while being chased by Deadshot or Deathstroke. I guess another version of Catwoman would not turn me off of the movie.
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post #74 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:32pm
I know her lack of canon + recasting makes her feel smaller than other characters, but considering Begins ends with the promise of Wayne retiring with Rachel and her fried chicken situation in DK, I really really doubt a Batman retired, Wayne frolicking in peace with Selina ending is likely.
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post #75 of 4802
10/27/10 at 11:46pm
I agree with you on that one. Nolan said he originally had the Joker in TDK to set him up to be the main villain in TDKR, but obviously that didn't work out. These are people who think big picture, so I think if they were going to set-up a Bruce Wayne/Selina Kyle hook-up they would have introduced the character by now. Him jumping from his life long love Rachel to someone who is essentially a criminal doesn't seem like it fits for the character they've constructed.
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post #76 of 4802
10/28/10 at 12:15am
Catwoman is a character than can understand and relate to him, which is a thing he's never experienced, he'd find that appealing, irrespective of her criminal leanings; it's the central premise of their relationship in the comics. Also, he's still a guy for Pete's sake.

And who's to say how much time has passed between films? I doubt he'd be dry humping Catwoman on Rachel's still smoldering corpse.
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post #77 of 4802
10/28/10 at 12:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
I think you meant, " What on earth are you talking about?"

And yes THANK YOU Shwartz, no one realised The Dark Knight was popular or that it made a lot of money. No shit.

Yes it can redeem itself if one didn't like the franchise. Just because other people loved it, or it made a lot of money doesn't mean I liked it, so maybe it needs to redeem itself to me. I don't rate movies based upon their popularity or money. And honestly it was in jest, a bad stab at sarcasm.

But even if it wasn't, is this how you view movies? Based on other people's opinions and its popularity? That's dumb.
Easy, friend-o. Nothing in the original post set off my sarcasm detector, so I was trying to express honest incredulity. The reason for the incredulity was not that I couldn't fathom someone having an against-the-grain opinion on a comic book movie (this isn't the first time I've been on the internet), or that such an opinion would be objectively wrong. It was because that terminology suggests some kind of drastic change in approach, which is not what anyone with a foot in reality expects from the third entry in a franchise that's been a huge financial and critical success.

Nothing personal. I'd be similarly surprised if someone suggested the next Transformers needed to really shake things up to redeem itself. I have no love for those movies (and they don't get much in the way of critical acclaim), but I'm sure no one involved in their production views them as remotely "broke".
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post #78 of 4802
10/28/10 at 1:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
Catwoman is a character than can understand and relate to him, which is a thing he's never experienced, he'd find that appealing, irrespective of her criminal leanings; it's the central premise of their relationship in the comics. Also, he's still a guy for Pete's sake.

And who's to say how much time has passed between films? I doubt he'd be dry humping Catwoman on Rachel's still smoldering corpse.
Honestly, you won me over with that argument. If they go that direction I'd be all for it. I know that angle is the comic universe's bread and butter, but I think it would be a welcome aspect to Nolan's Batman.
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post #79 of 4802
10/28/10 at 1:06am
Yea, it wasn't obviously sarcastic at all, my bad. Other than that if I was trying to stir shit, my choice of words was a bit off, redeem might not have been the most acurate word.

But seriously Nolan should look to improve the action this time around. He tried to address it in TDK, the action in that one was far less choppy and had fewer close ups. Most of the action in TDK was shot with wide lenses which was good. But I actually appreciated the action in Returns more since Batman just seemed slow and clunky in TDK, the villains seemed to attack around his handicap. The same arguement can be made about Tim Burtons Batman, where Batman was hobbeled even more than Nolan's version. But at least Tim Burton shot his action with moments of flair and awesomeness.
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post #80 of 4802
10/28/10 at 1:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by matches View Post
I agree with you on that one. Nolan said he originally had the Joker in TDK to set him up to be the main villain in TDKR, but obviously that didn't work out.
When did he say that?
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post #81 of 4802
10/28/10 at 1:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
Yea, it wasn't obviously sarcastic at all, my bad. Other than that if I was trying to stir shit, my choice of words was a bit off, redeem might not have been the most acurate word.

But seriously Nolan should look to improve the action this time around. He tried to address it in TDK, the action in that one was far less choppy and had fewer close ups. Most of the action in TDK was shot with wide lenses which was good. But I actually appreciated the action in Returns more since Batman just seemed slow and clunky in TDK, the villains seemed to attack around his handicap. The same arguement can be made about Tim Burtons Batman, where Batman was hobbeled even more than Nolan's version. But at least Tim Burton shot his action with moments of flair and awesomeness.
No arguments there. The vehicular action in Nolan's films is pretty great, but the hand-to-hand is inching upward but still subpar, which is weird for a blockbuster action series.

One area where I think Nolan is doing fine is the Batman's character. While I'm not opposed to the idea (mainly, like I said, because it would be a for sure ending ending), but I don't think it's the only possible way to wrap things up. Nolan's on a very hot streak, and he's getting as much benefit of the doubt as I give out at this point.
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post #82 of 4802
10/28/10 at 2:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
No arguments there. The vehicular action in Nolan's films is pretty great, but the hand-to-hand is inching upward but still subpar, which is weird for a blockbuster action series.

One area where I think Nolan is doing fine is the Batman's character. While I'm not opposed to the idea (mainly, like I said, because it would be a for sure ending ending), but I don't think it's the only possible way to wrap things up. Nolan's on a very hot streak, and he's getting as much benefit of the doubt as I give out at this point.
I still think the final confrontation with the Joker is very effective in TDK. The way the Joker starts to bark like a dog and beat Wayne with that animalistic fury is very disturbing. Nolan can bring grit and 'punch' to an action scene when he needs to, IMHO. The opening car park fight too features some perfectly serviceable hand to hand action
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post #83 of 4802
10/28/10 at 2:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
But seriously Nolan should look to improve the action this time around. He tried to address it in TDK, the action in that one was far less choppy and had fewer close ups. Most of the action in TDK was shot with wide lenses which was good.
I believe it will be very similar. Those actions scenes were shot in IMAX which Pfister is planning to incorporate again. Closeups don't really work in a medium meant to show scope and depth. Not to mention the faster lenses are the shorter primes.
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post #84 of 4802
10/28/10 at 2:25am
Something just occurred to me

IDEA: TDKR should take place during winter. It would be thematically appropriate and visually compelling
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post #85 of 4802
10/28/10 at 2:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Princess Kate View Post
Something just occurred to me

IDEA: TDKR should take place during winter. It would be thematically appropriate and visually compelling
Do you mean because the film will end with spring? Or because BB started in Winter?
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post #86 of 4802
10/28/10 at 2:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post
I think you meant, " What on earth are you talking about?"

And yes THANK YOU Shwartz, no one realised The Dark Knight was popular or that it made a lot of money. No shit.

Yes it can redeem itself if one didn't like the franchise. Just because other people loved it, or it made a lot of money doesn't mean I liked it, so maybe it needs to redeem itself to me. I don't rate movies based upon their popularity or money. And honestly it was in jest, a bad stab at sarcasm.

But even if it wasn't, is this how you view movies? Based on other people's opinions and its popularity? That's dumb.
Switch out the Batman trilogy and put in Raimi's Spiderman trilogy and you'd mask my thoughts perfectly.

Hate the title of the film but Nolan just can't be beat right now in my eyes hoping this one is really special and Hardy being cast is already getting me excited.
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post #87 of 4802
10/28/10 at 8:15am
I could see them running into a Green Goblin-type design problem if they opt for Black Mask.
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post #88 of 4802
10/28/10 at 8:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather View Post
I could see them running into a Green Goblin-type design problem if they opt for Black Mask.
There's not a single thing Nolan could achieve thematically with Black Mask that couldn't be equally achieved with Deadshot while also employing a rogues gallery character that fits much more realistically into his Nolanverse.
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post #89 of 4802
10/28/10 at 8:52am
Black Mask's millionnaire history and relationship with Bruce could be put to use. He's got that over Deadshot.
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post #90 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather View Post
Black Mask's millionnaire history and relationship with Bruce could be put to use. He's got that over Deadshot.
Not quite when you consider that the Deadshot that was rejigged in the Gotham Knight cartoon bridging Begins with TDK also had a socialite alter-ego...

Deadshot appears as one of the villains in Batman: Gotham Knight voiced by Jim Meskimen. According to the writers of Batman: Gotham Knight, Deadshot was given a visual makeover for the movie. In the story, he is presented as an "anti-Batman", with a sophisticated socialite secret identity as his disguise. They also describe Deadshot and Batman's battles as very interesting because "it's battle of man using guns against one who isn't".
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post #91 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:09am
The most basic wiki description of Deadshot basically screams "Dark Knight Rises plot synopsis". Have him take out a Joker-inspired villain while trying to take control of the vaccuum left by the Joker himself, have Batman not know Deadshot's all criminal and think, like the Joker was a response to his existence, Deadshot is the consequence of his Dark Knight myth thing, do some brooding and whining and then eventually have whatever third act clusterfuck Nolan will go for this time. Or, if you guys are so desperate for Catwoman, have her distract Batman for half the movie and, because this is Nolan after all and Catwoman is a woman, have Deadshot kill her and get Batman to a position in which he might actually become the Dark Knight he said he was to cover up Dent's thing.
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post #92 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:39am
No one is desperate to see Catwoman, I'm just arguing against the vehement and wrong-headed insistence that she be excluded (that she's been done before can be said of the Joker and Two-Face, and it's a bullshit reason). By virtue of being the better known character and the one with the most history out of all of the posited villains, she simply has it all over Deadshot and Black Mask (though, admittedly, they'd be great), she's certainly more appropriate for the end of a series than Killer Fucking Croc. Seriously, that's my biggest beef w/ that idea outside of Nolan's aversion to overtly fantastical characters (yeah, yeah, I've seen the Azzarello version). Who the fuck wants to see Killer Croc as ostensibly the last villain Batman will face?
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post #93 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:41am
This is obviously a moot point now that Ledger's gone, but in Hell would Batman and Gordon's Dent lie stand when The Joker is very much alive and probably squawking about it to anyone who will listen from his cell at Arkham?
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post #94 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:44am
True, because when I think of the Joker, I think reliable source.
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post #95 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:45am
He would just be dismissed as crazy. How often do the rantings of people in padded cells make it into the press anyway?
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post #96 of 4802
10/28/10 at 9:55am
Joker: It's a conspiracy, Dent killed those people, I drove him to it!

Doctor: Well, that's very interesting, Mr. Joker, and I'd like to hear all about it, but right now lets focus on cleaning up all that feces you smeared on the walls of your cell, we really must do something about that.


Seriously, though, it looks like a plothole, and maybe it is, but I think the Joker would dig that and not be a snitch about it. Besides, he caused them to break their moral code, win/win.
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post #97 of 4802
10/28/10 at 10:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
Seriously, though, it looks like a plothole, and maybe it is, but I think the Joker would dig that and not be a snitch about it. Besides, he caused them to break their moral code, win/win.
I think he'd be more inclined to figure out a way he could use Gordon and Batman's cover up to put them in even more untenable moral positions. The Joker could care less about credit - he's interested in creating chaos and corrupting authority figures.

And this is completely outside the text, but I always figured, in TDK, that the Joker put the bounty on the accountant's head because he figured out that knowing Batman's "true" identity was beside the point for their weird dance - the Joker, like Rachel, intuitively figured out that Batman was or was becoming that person's real identity, with the every day life persona being a mask.
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post #98 of 4802
10/28/10 at 10:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by grubstreeter
He would just be dismissed as crazy. How often do the rantings of people in padded cells make it into the press anyway?
When they're charismatic terrorists/mass murderers? Fairly often. Also, there's a whole trial process where Joker would get to flap his gums.

I think in the modern world of conspiracy theories and 24/7, Joker would have his say on the subject if he wanted to, and a sizeable amount of people would give it credence. Buuuut, like Johnny, I also think he'd get a kick out of keeping schtum and holding it over Gordon and Bats.
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post #99 of 4802
10/28/10 at 10:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Wolcott View Post
I know her lack of canon + recasting makes her feel smaller than other characters, but considering Begins ends with the promise of Wayne retiring with Rachel and her fried chicken situation in DK, I really really doubt a Batman retired, Wayne frolicking in peace with Selina ending is likely.
No but ending a film where he has inspired the right kind of reaction from Gothamites, fakes his death and then wanders off into the sunset in an inverted echo of his prodigal arc in Begins would work, IMHO.

Frankly, I then feel tempted to fanwak a ten year later (in real time) Nolan DKR version where it didn't turn out alright for Gotham after all.

I'll stop now...
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post #100 of 4802
10/28/10 at 10:49am
I would love to see a faithful film version of DKR, but it wouldn't be complete without Batman kicking Superman's ass, and I don't see WB going for that. Mainly in straight-to-DVD animated thing, but never a big budget film.
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