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HAS KEVIN SMITH FOUND A HIGHER CALLING WITH RED STATE?

post #1 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:00pm
Thread Starter 
The teaser trailer for Red State

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post #2 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:04pm
Hmm ... that was marginally effective.
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post #3 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:12pm
I have to agree, but I must admit, I'm a sucker for religious horror.
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post #4 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:16pm
I dug the sound design but the images completely fail to evoke anything more than "Huh, this isn't shot like a normal Kevin Smith film". I hope it's great (who doesn't like a redemption story?) but I doubt it will be.
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post #5 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:19pm
I don't get it; I thought COP OUT was fairly successful-ish?

Anyway, cool trailer, but I don't hate Kevin Smith.
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post #6 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:20pm
Looks the way I imagine a trailer to a Mark Borchardt film would look.
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post #7 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:24pm
Pretty effective trailer, and it certainly is a full 360 from anything else Smith's done. I've been anticipating this movie for some time, as it seems that doing something in the horror genre instead would work better for him. Seems that could be the case.

Love that final shot and line from Michael Parks.
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post #8 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evi View Post
Looks the way I imagine a trailer to a Mark Borchardt film would look.
That reminds me - it's about time to rewatch that movie. It always puts a sharp focus on my own creative frustrations.

As for Red State, this still looks cheapish. I'm not saying I could do better, just that it wouldn't be terribly out of place with the 3,491 or so trailers on That Suburban Psycho Horror Collection I reviewed. Except Misty Mundae isn't in this. That I know of.
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post #9 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:29pm
Yes, it looks different from any Smith film to date, but it reminds me of the Gobstopper parody trailer from a few years ago on Funny or Die. Meaning it seems to be a perfect collection of all the moments you need for a post-Hostel horror film. And I don't mean that as a compliment.
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post #10 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:30pm
Looks like i got together with some friends at my fathers ranch and shot a movie using the Video function on my canon powershot.
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post #11 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:39pm
Not impressed. Take Smith out of the equation here and would anyone be talking about this? Doubtful.
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post #12 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:39pm
I actually applaud Smith for trying to get out of his wheelhouse and doing something different. It may end up being total crap but at least he's attempting to stretch himself and not retreat into the same boring and familiar territory all his other films have tread (some more successfully than others) over the years.
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post #13 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:45pm
Not what I expected at all. Quite surprised actually. Hm.
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post #14 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:48pm
If Smith manages to deliver something effective on any level it'll be a huge improvement on his recent work.
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post #15 of 120
12/23/10 at 5:57pm
That felt like I watched some rough draft of a trailer.

Smith has said that this is based on Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptist Church. As a soldier in the army who has seen these fucks face to face on funeral detail, I can easily say that this is fertile ground for a horror movie.
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post #16 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:13pm
The only thing that intrigues me is the cast. Goodman, Parks, Melissa Leo are all people that get my attention in whatever they do. Hopefully Smith uses them well.
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post #17 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walker View Post
That felt like I watched some rough draft of a trailer.

Smith has said that this is based on Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptist Church. As a soldier in the army who has seen these fucks face to face on funeral detail, I can easily say that this is fertile ground for a horror movie.
Have you ever seen the documentary "Most Hated Family in America?" I think it's still on YouTube. I think that was all the horror film I needed.

I'm convinced Fred Phelps is the preacher from Poltergeist II.
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post #18 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:42pm
This looks like a marginally terrible little home movie level production only with name actors. Bizarre.
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post #19 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:46pm
Looking forward to it! The look of it does scream 'cheap but trying to look bigger,' but I don't mind it in this case. And yes, I probably wouldn't be as intrigued if not for Smith being responsible... but still. Hahaha. But I'm definitely looking forward to the cast.
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post #20 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walker View Post
That felt like I watched some rough draft of a trailer.

Smith has said that this is based on Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptist Church. As a soldier in the army who has seen these fucks face to face on funeral detail, I can easily say that this is fertile ground for a horror movie.
He also said that Race With The Devil was an inspiration as well.
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post #21 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walker View Post
That felt like I watched some rough draft of a trailer.
You did.
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post #22 of 120
12/23/10 at 6:55pm
As a person who watches lots of straight to video horror, this looks very much on par production value wise. I'm not saying that as a bad thing, just pointing it out as a point of reference.
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post #23 of 120
12/23/10 at 7:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmNerdJamie View Post
Not impressed. Take Smith out of the equation here and would anyone be talking about this? Doubtful.
A meaningless hypothetical. Smith is in the equation.

I like the trailer, it did what a trailer is supposed to do, convince me to see the movie.

And yes, at first I thought "this looks like cheap liquored shit"...then I kept watching and I forgot how cheap it looked and marveled at how the cheapness made it creepier.
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post #24 of 120
12/23/10 at 7:23pm
Thought it was a nice teaser. Really, anything with Parks has my interest. Lots of interesting actors in this. Looking forward to see the thing.
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post #25 of 120
12/23/10 at 8:08pm
I like the talent assembled, but the last time Smith worked with such high caliber actors, we got Dogma. And in Dogma, Smith managed to get career-worst performances out of Alan Rickman and Chris Rock.
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post #26 of 120
12/23/10 at 9:10pm
Filmmaking-wise, that actually looked....competent. Color me impressed.
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post #27 of 120
12/23/10 at 9:15pm
The real question here will be the script. Smith will really not be able to get away with 'everyone in the movie talks like Kevin Smith' this time.
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post #28 of 120
12/23/10 at 11:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tati View Post
Looks like i got together with some friends at my fathers ranch and shot a movie using the Video function on my canon powershot.
To be fair the footage hopefully hasn't been color corrected yet.

The cast is what has me intrigued, so I'm gonna give Smith one last chance before finally not giving a shit about what he does anymore.
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post #29 of 120
12/24/10 at 12:55am
Even if you take into consideration the fact that the footage hasn't been color-corrected yet, it still doesn't look like anything more than a bunch of shaky-cam and people running a lot. I dunno...I'll wait until I see a proper trailer. Right now it just looks like something I'd see on a SyFy marathon sandwiched between Children of the Corn 10 and Lake Placid 4.
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post #30 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:00am
There were only 8 Children of the Corn movies. Get you shit straight.
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post #31 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:05am
That trailer was already more visually interesting that Smith last several pictures, so there's that. I'm willing to give it a chance based on the talent and premise.
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post #32 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by J David Rhodes View Post
That reminds me - it's about time to rewatch that movie. It always puts a sharp focus on my own creative frustrations.

As for Red State, this still looks cheapish. I'm not saying I could do better, just that it wouldn't be terribly out of place with the 3,491 or so trailers on That Suburban Psycho Horror Collection I reviewed. Except Misty Mundae isn't in this. That I know of.
Hey, hey, hey...we established a long time ago (when Creature Corner was still in existence) that she would forever be referred to as "The Oft-Nude Misty Mundae." Just a head's up.

As for the trailer...I'm not sold yet, but I could come around. Like most folks around here, I used to worship at the alter of Smith, but then I grew up and he didn't. I liked Zack and Miri Make a Porno well enough, so I haven't written the guy off entirely, but it's going to take a lot more than that sort of boring teaser for me to give this flick a chance. I hope the full trailer is more effective.
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post #33 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:37am
To me that seemed like a decent enough first half of a trailer, but it didn't really build to anything.
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post #34 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Dellamorte View Post
I like the talent assembled, but the last time Smith worked with such high caliber actors, we got Dogma. And in Dogma, Smith managed to get career-worst performances out of Alan Rickman and Chris Rock.
Career-worst perf out of Chris Rock? How could you tell?
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post #35 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:54am
He was great in CB4!
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post #36 of 120
12/24/10 at 1:58am
Anyone who falls into this trap based on a series of "cool shots" is a sad, sad, easy slut of a bastard.
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post #37 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:00am
And then hopefully Jake lets us know how it is.
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post #38 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by horrid View Post
And then hopefully Jake lets us know how it is.
Merry Christmas.

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post #39 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:15am
I don't get all the complaints about the cheapness with regard to the look...it's just another aesthetic to tell a story that happens to be used by most low budget filmmakers. We've been so conditioned on high gloss filmmaking. I think for Smith to shoot in DV he's obviously doing it for a very good reason, I'd like to judge the movie based on what he's trying to accomplish with the image, not the quality of the image as a stand alone element.
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post #40 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:22am
I'm not slamming it for looking like DV, I'm slamming it because it looks like every other super-cheap-low-budget "religious horror" slasher that just sticks a bunch of "cool" shots together and some sort of supposed "edgy take on religion and the south" and calls it a trailer. Big problem there is that it hasn't been edgy or cool for about three decades. There's nothing of note in the trailer, and it wouldn't have more than a few hundred hits on YouTube if it didn't have "directed by Kevin Smith" attached to it. Throw that on there and suddenly people are looking at the punch bowl and feeling thirsty again. It's befuddling.

To put it in a sum-up: I don't think Smith has the talent or the vision to winkingly use a "cheap look" as an aesthetic choice, nor do I think that someone who's been making movies for 15 years with access to all its big toys has an excuse to make something so shoddy looking.
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post #41 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:25am
I'm interested in Smith's career, somewhat.

I like the actors in it, esp. Parks and Leo.

Plus, I thought, for a teaser, it worked pretty well.

There's my confession. Can everyone else in here please explain themselves to Greg too?
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post #42 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Clark View Post
I'm not slamming it for looking like DV, I'm slamming it because it looks like every other super-cheap-low-budget "religious horror" slasher that just sticks a bunch of "cool" shots together and some sort of supposed "edgy take on religion and the south" and calls it a trailer. Big problem there is that it hasn't been edgy or cool for about three decades. There's nothing of note in the trailer, and it wouldn't have more than a few hundred hits on YouTube if it didn't have "directed by Kevin Smith" attached to it. Throw that on there and suddenly people are looking at the punch bowl and feeling thirsty again. It's befuddling.

To put it in a sum-up: I don't think Smith has the talent or the vision to winkingly use a "cheap look" as an aesthetic choice, nor do I think that someone who's been making movies for 15 years with access to all its big toys has an excuse to make something so shoddy looking.
Plenty of trailers look like every other movie, it doesn't stop people from going. If it didn't have directed by Kevin Smith on it, we wouldn't be having this conversation, sure, but it does, and we are. I'm intrigued enough to check it out. It's just a trailer, which is so superficial, there's no sound argument to be made for or against seeing it, which is all we're doing right now. It's got me excited enough. If the movie sucks, then I'll add it to the long list of other Smith movies I don't like.
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post #43 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:36am
Point being: if Smith's been sucking for as long as he has, what outside of battered wife syndrome keeps you guys coming back?
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post #44 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:45am
We see a lot of movies?
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post #45 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:48am
Well, listening to audio from clips of the movie on his podcast, I get the feeling that the basic premise is "What if a Phelps-like clan of fundies crossed the line and became violent?" I still maintain that this article is scarier than even a masterwork of a film based on that same premise:

http://www.godhateshomophobes.com/homphelps.html

Quote:
Sometimes Pastor Phelps preferred to grab one child by their little hands and haul them into the air. Then he would repeatedly smash his knee into their groin and stomach while walking across the room and laughing. The boys remember this happening to Nate when he was only seven, and to Margie and Kathy even after they were sexually developed teenagers. Nate recalls being taken into the church once where his father, a former golden gloves boxer, bent him backwards over a pew, body-punched him, spit in his face, and told him he hated him. Mark's very first memory in this life is an emotional scar: their mom had gone to the hospital to give birth to Jonathon. Mark remembers being very upset, since now they would be alone in the house with their father, his threatening presence left unmitigated by her maternal concern. Though only five, already Mark could use the phone and, one day while his father was out he dialed the number she'd left.
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post #46 of 120
12/24/10 at 2:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Olson View Post
Hey, hey, hey...we established a long time ago (when Creature Corner was still in existence) that she would forever be referred to as "The Oft-Nude Misty Mundae." Just a head's up.
My bad! Although Oft-Nude Misty Mundae is a bit redundant. That's like saying "Occasionally Grizzled Danny Trejo"

Back to the point, you can hope all you want that this isn't color corrected, but based on how Cop Out looked, I would prepare for the worst.

I don't have huge problems with Smith (as a writer/director... as a human he seems kind of repellent). I'm one of the folks that found Clerks 2 enjoyable. In fact, I'm waiting for him to direct his Match Point. But I don't see it happening. I don't think he's been humbled enough yet. If he was, he'd let someone else direct one of his scripts.
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post #47 of 120
12/24/10 at 3:02am
Waiting for his Match Point seems to imply that somewhere along the way, he had an Annie Hall. Or Small Time Crooks.
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post #48 of 120
12/24/10 at 3:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Clark View Post
Waiting for his Match Point seems to imply that somewhere along the way, he had an Annie Hall. Or Small Time Crooks.
I knew someone was gonna latch onto this point if I didn't throw a disclaimer in there about how Smith was no Woody Allen and I was merely speaking proportionately.

It's late. I'm tired. Give me a pass this time. It's Christmas, after all!
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post #49 of 120
12/24/10 at 3:19am
I hope that Smith has focused all the hate and vitriol that he has for the critics and people who don't like him, and has focused it into this movie. Should make for one disturbing picture.

I say this as a fan of Clerks II, and also a guy who hated Cop Out.
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post #50 of 120
12/24/10 at 6:49am
I wonder if Smith repeatedly namedropping Phelps is an attempt to provoke the Westboro clan into outright attacking the movie and a)raising its profile and b)giving Smith a very public, very hateable figure with which to butt heads.
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