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Oh, Stelios... like many before me, you haven't yet begun to be gut-punched. I am rewatching as well, currently on disc 2 of Season 2. Jesus this show.
I don't have cable anymore, so I hope beyond hope that they will release episodes on Amazon as they air. I don't want to go to Itunes for it.
AMC has released on their website a scene from the premiere episode, "Box Cutter". It features Mr. Saul Goodman so you already know it's entertaining as Hell, but part of me wishes I waited to watch it. I wouldn't really consider it a spoiler considering it's part of the official marketing campaign but I know there are some purists out there who want to go in completely cold. So consider yourself warned.
As per Hank - he will never become Walt's lackey, just as Walt says "Never the DEA". They will never crossover. I don't see Hank bringing him to justice either. For some reason I imagine a Rorshach-type ending for Hank. Walt thoroughly corrupts everyone around him and when Hank cannot accept it, he is killed and the cook goes on. I really wouldn't mind an ending where the crime empire is essentially a success and Hank's death is the final obstacle, clearing Walt and Jesse to rule the drug trade. No comeuppance, no justice, no major deaths or tragedies - just the establishment of a true American enterprise and the death of the show's moral center. The show deserves that ending I think. But knowing Gilligan and his propensity for karmic / pseudo-religious retribution, the series will most likely end with every character being destroyed in some terrible fashion. They could definitely make that ending gripping, but looking at it as a whole piece of work, I really think the series is aspiring to higher things than "Hank finds out about Walt and arrests him, Jesse dies tragically."
I caught up with the show over about six months, finally finishing it this past weekend. There are a lot of big questions leading into the next season, but the most intriguing one to me is, can Gus really keep Walt working for him (even for free) after discovering that Walt and Jesse killed Gale? Really? I know Walt is relying on Fring's need to keep production going no matter what, never stopping for even a minute, but I just have trouble picturing him keeping Walt on staff after such an egregious offense.
It did save Walt's life for the moment, sending his would-be executioners dashing off to try and stop Jesse, but not killing Walt and continuing to work with him are two different things. There's a lot of talk about Hank here, but what do you guys think is going to happen with the arrangement between Gus and Walt?
And also, I have to say that even though I feel I should be sad the most for Gale after what happened at the end of season 3, the person I most felt sorry for was Jesse. Even though Gale was more of an innocent caught in the crossfire of the conflict between Gus, Walt, and Jesse (although not totally innocent given the business he's in), to me Jesse was the more tragic victim. It just broke my heart to see him pushed to the point where he has to cross the line into cold-blooded killer. I know Jesse isn't innocent either. A lot of his behaviour has been reprehensible, like trying seduce girls into taking drugs, but I've always found him to be one of the most sympathetic characters on the show (much more than Walt).
I think one reason it's easier for me to forgive his immoral actions is because his ineptitude, goofiness, and soft spot for kids make him endearing. Walt, despite his illness, is harder to root for because he's so much smarter as well as ruthless and often abusive towards Jesse. It was heartening to see him show that he cares about Jesse towards the end of season 3, though.
Jesse's begging Walt not to make the kill was really hard to watch...every time he pleaded, "Don't do it, Mr. White", I found it agonizingly sad. His quivering, crying final act left me conflicted. I was very satisfied by the audacious pay off to such a tense, suspenseful episode (the most intense one I've seen so far), but that corruption of Jesse just devastated me. I held out hope that one day Jesse would emerge from all of his traumas somewhat better for them, with a chance at being redeemed, but now I don't see anything but misery in his future.
It did save Walt's life for the moment, sending his would-be executioners dashing off to try and stop Jesse, but not killing Walt and continuing to work with him are two different things. There's a lot of talk about Hank here, but why do you guys think is going to happen with the arrangement between Gus and Walt?
I think a lot of us are taking it as a foregone conclusion that they'll hammer out some sort of short-lived truce, but sooner or later (sooner, in all likelihood) Gus has to take a dirt nap so that Walt and the show can move onward and upward.
I caught up with the show over about six months, finally finishing it this past weekend. There are a lot of big questions leading into the next season, but the most intriguing one to me is, can Gus really keep Walt working for him (even for free) after discovering that Walt and Jesse killed Gale. Really? I know Walt is relying on Fring's need to keep production going no matter what, never stopping for even a minute, but I just have trouble picturing him keeping Walt on staff after such an egregious offense.
Thats what I'm questioning too. I was given the believe that Gus has been in this buisness for at least one decade maybe even longer. The idea that he would be in a position where he has to go to Walt seems weird. I mean sure the production goes down one day, but there are other meth dealers out there I image. (I know not to Walt's quality, because meth addicts would just quit if the quality of the meth wasn't kept to high standards).
I hope we are going to see a cat and mouse game between Gus and Walt and not just a "well I must do whatever Walt say, he makes the best stuff".
I hope we are going to see a cat and mouse game between Gus and Walt and not just a "well I must do whatever Walt say, he makes the best stuff".
Knowing this show, I'm almost certain there's going to be some serious cat and mouse going down.
I seriously doubt Hank would ever allow himself to become a mole, even for Walt. Just the end of last season where he refused to lie about assaulting Jesse because he knew he'd done something wrong and was willing to take the consequences of it show what kind of a man he is.
but then he's still in a lot of pain (I'd guess). Possible medication addiction? I don't want to see him become Walt's 'mole' but I suspect they're going to put him through the ringer somehow. Getting him hooked on pain killers would be a believeable break in his character but I'm not sure where they'd go with it. I mean it's not like it's a gateway drug to meth.
Just as long as they don't resurrect Marie's kleptomania
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I asked a friend of mine the same question about what he thinks is going to happen with Gus and Walt, and he too almost immediately guessed that Gus will die. I have a hard time believing this could happen. My friend's reasoning was that any time a rival dealer gets in Walt and Jesse's way, it comes down to a showdown being between him and them, and they win (i.e. with Tuco). I just can't see that happening with Gus.
He's not just some reckless thug like Tuco. He's a smart businessman who has been successfully running his business for many years and has extremely deadly and intelligent people like Mike the Cleaner working for him. Like Walt said, "when it comes down to you and me versus him, I'm sorry, I'm truly sorry, but it's gonna be him". I don't see this being resolved as easily as Jesse and Walt killing Gus and taking over his business. It's possible, but I would be disappointed. It would feel too easy, and I would expect the writers to cook up (heh) something less tidy and predictable.
I'll give you predictable, but this is not a show that does "tidy".
Gus has quite an operation going, but if, say, a Mexican cartel already wanted him out and his biggest producer was looking for an excuse...not to mention that Mike strikes me as a very pragmatic type of fellow when the chips come down.
I'll give you predictable, but this is not a show that does "tidy".
Gus has quite an operation going, but if, say, a Mexican cartel already wanted him out and his biggest producer was looking for an excuse...not to mention that Mike strikes me as a very pragmatic type of fellow when the chips come down.
That's what I always figured (which of course means nothing with this show). Mike's smart, and pragmatic. He's now aware that Walt is done with half measures (unlike Gus). When push comes to shove, Mike knows where the bodies are buried both literally and figuratively. I could see him helping to bring down Gus for a bigger cut.
I'll give you predictable, but this is not a show that does "tidy".
Seconded. I don't remember* if the show has made explicit the following: Walt can't control White Noise, unpredictable stuff that alter the expected results. Gillian has been on record saying he enjoys putting Walt on the edge with no logical way to escape. Yes He could gain the upper hand doing some weird gamble on Gus. Enter the random stuff, like when his wife entered in labor just in the right moment.
*I think it was pretty clear in the first episodes when you followed every Walt's reasoning (and they ended awfully wrong).
The AV Club has a new interview with Bryan Cranston, and it is achingly tease-y.
Finished up season 3 last night. I'm freakin' exhausted from it, in the very best way possible.
Chuck Klosterman declares Breaking Bad the GOAT television accomplishment, just edging out the other three contenders Mad Men, The Sopranos, and The Wire (!!). Sometimes Klosterman's writing feels like junk food, but this essay "Bad Decisions" put a big smile on my face.
It doesn't have that effect on everyone however, and there are those who have been feverishly criticizing it. Like Jason Whitlock:
Anyway w/r/t/ Gustavo, I agree Walt simply killing him would be anti-climactic. I think instead Walt will strike a deal with the cartels and serve up Gus as a peace offering. Maybe the last glimpse we have of Gus will be getting stuffed into a trunk with ducktape over his mouth, en route to an agonizing death in Juarez. Speculating on the show sure takes one's mind to dark places.
As a review is cheating, as a teasing is the best you can read. http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/whats-alan-watching/posts/review-amcs-breaking-bad-still-brilliant-in-season-4
Is it ok to bump this thread, just to keep the #%$@*&^ wrestling thread out of the top?
I think Mike has a more than grudging respect for Walt.
My wife and I have been piggy-backing Season 3 of this show and Season 4 of The Wire. Finally finished Season 3 of Breaking Bad a couple of nights ago. I probably shouldn't bring up a dead old horse, but it totally looked to me like Jesse was moving the gun when the camera swirled around in front of him. But after the camera was pointed directly into the barrel of the gun, there really wasn't much question that the *intent* was that Jesse was killing him. I mean, if he was intentionally missing, I think you'd see some relief there in Jesse's eyes.
Anyway, love this show. Just got my brother and his wife hooked on it, too, by forcing the first couple of seasons on them. (I'm a pusher!) I'm debating whether or not I should watch the show on a weekly basis. I think my enjoyment of Season 4 of Mad Men suffered quite a bit by watching it broken up, after having watched the previous three seasons on DVD. I'm afraid my experience will be the same with this show.
Depending on my decision, I guess it might be a long, long time until I visit this thread again. And I'm leaning towards waiting for the DVDs.
Good God, man!
My wife and I have been piggy-backing Season 3 of this show and Season 4 of The Wire. Finally finished Season 3 of Breaking Bad a couple of nights ago. I probably shouldn't bring up a dead old horse, but it totally looked to me like Jesse was moving the gun when the camera swirled around in front of him. But after the camera was pointed directly into the barrel of the gun, there really wasn't much question that the *intent* was that Jesse was killing him. I mean, if he was intentionally missing, I think you'd see some relief there in Jesse's eyes.
Anyway, love this show. Just got my brother and his wife hooked on it, too, by forcing the first couple of seasons on them. (I'm a pusher!) I'm debating whether or not I should watch the show on a weekly basis. I think my enjoyment of Season 4 of Mad Men suffered quite a bit by watching it broken up, after having watched the previous three seasons on DVD. I'm afraid my experience will be the same with this show.
Depending on my decision, I guess it might be a long, long time until I visit this thread again. And I'm leaning towards waiting for the DVDs.
See, if you've watched the first 3 seasons I can't even comprehend knowing the show is on and choosing not to watch it for months. That would literally be impossible for me.
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Good God, man!
Yeah, sometimes I feel like Knives Chau when she said "I didn't even know there was good music until like two months ago!" It's not been that bad, but I have had a lot of catching up to do.
That said, we have kind of taken up residence in the swamps of sadness lately as far as entertainment choices go.
I've only ever watched it on a week-by-week basis and it's never bothered me before. Mad Men is a different animal, because there are entire episodes where not much happens but BB moves at such a pace that you're almost grateful for the time to breathe.
And I'd be too scared of having things spoiled for me!
EDIT: Also, I've recently introduced the show to a friend so I'm busy rewatching it with her, and one scene that struck me in a way it never did before was the scene of Walter justifying the plane crash in front of a hall-full of students. First time watching it, I laughed my head off but this time, for some reason, I was quite taken aback by the brazenness of it all. Such an unfiltered view into Walt's way of thinking.
That said, we have kind of taken up residence in the swamps of sadness lately as far as entertainment choices go.
I was primarily referring to the emotional rollercoaster you've probably been on for the last week. Hopefully, it won't require counseling.
I definitely agree with Evi. Mad Men benefits from watching on disc, but BB is so damn intense that sometimes a break from it is a relief. Of course, I mainlined 4 S3 eps last night, so...
...but this time, for some reason, I was quite taken aback by the brazenness of it all. Such an unfiltered view into Walt's way of thinking.
And that scene is nicely mirrored (in the next episode, I think?), when Walter's talking to Marie about "survival" in the hospital. At first, his words seem wildly innappropriate, but he works his way into a profound reassurance for her.
Woo! One episode left and I'll be caught up. All due props to Cranston of course, but the supporting cast rocks the fucking house. I could very well see myself hating Hank and Marie to death but I'm actually looking forward to their scenes. Hank especially would be so easy to fuck up. Gilligan has crazy skills and Norris acts his ass out.
Woo! One episode left and I'll be caught up.
2 days before the new season starts? Wow, amazing timing.
In case people haven't seen them, Nick's been running interviews with the cast:
Yeah, I'm really enjoying these.
Also, done with season 3! Bring on the new stuff. It's nice how Walt heavy the last couple of episodes have been.
Interesting article comparing BB to Mad Men, Sopranos, and The Wire (the last of which I've never even watched, believe it or not!) I also enjoy the fact that BB has such an obvious moral center... whereas Sopranos and Dexter, for instance, seemed/seem to become more relativistic the longer they run, it's clear watching Bad that Walt (and those around him) are continuously growing more and more corrupt, and that the show is not afraid to acknowledge that for what it is.
For the record... as far as an endgame, I think Jessie (despite, in the final analysis, being less corrupt/more sympathetic than Walt) will be caught by Hank and go to prison; in fact, I think that Walt will sacrifice Jessie in order to save himself. And I think that Walt, while avoiding death and/or prison, will lose his family once and for all in the process, leaving him alone and miserable with all his riches...
Timed this perfectly! I finished Season 3 this evening. How the hell have all you folks not been ripping your hair out for the last 14 months?
Timed this perfectly! I finished Season 3 this evening. How the hell have all you folks not been ripping your hair out for the last 14 months?
We have been :(
Just wanted to give everyone the head's up on this. Anyone who has an interest in Breaking Bad (and a Kindle) should probably check it out.
, is our first venture into the world of Kindle publishing with Kindle’s bargain-priced eBooks. But don’t let the $2.99 price tag fool you: Buy The RV contains a lot of material for your money, including past interviews with Bryan Cranston, Vince Gilligan, and Bob Odenkirk and every episode review from the show’s first three seasons. All that plus a new intro from The A.V. Club’s resident Breaking Bad expert Donna Bowman and a great cover illustration from Danny Hellman.
Just wanted to give everyone the head's up on this. Anyone who has an interest in Breaking Bad (and a Kindle) should probably check it out.
Very cool, thanks for the link. Hopefully we got an updated print version when the series is said and done.
I was thinking recently about how Walt is still, three seasons in, a complete mystery to viewers. Who is this guy, really? Where did he grow up? How much (or little) money did he have as a kid? I imagine he was someone raised in poverty. He apparently has no siblings, uncles, cousins? Never mentioned a father. He seems to have no relationship to his still living mother and has not even told her about his cancer (it's also clear Skyler despises her). He has no friends except two people whom he hates because he perceives they screwed him out of a fortune. But we don't know the full story there, not by a long shot. In the flashback of Walt seeing his 'starter' house for the first time, he seems like a cocky guy on the up-and-up. What happens to make him into the guy in Season 1?
As the series plays out, the clearest picture I get of Walt is that he was a guy who grew up poor, in a cold environment, and was able to raise himself up with his own intellect. This is probably why he hates getting hand-outs (I think of Saul's line "Yeah, no deep-seated issues there..." in response to Walt's disgust at the idea of accepting charity). Things were going extremely well for awhile, but as we know Walt is a hopelessly self-destructive individual, and he gets into a love triangle situation with colleagues that leaves him alienated and embittered. So he shuts down, turns his back on advanced chemistry, and grows into a shell, only to be snapped back to reality by cancer. I'm beginning to suspect he was always a dark, selfish prick, but he was also enough of a milquetoast blank slate to gain audience sympathy and endearment. I'm hoping Season 4 continues the use of flashbacks to fill us in on his story.
I doubt he grew up poor, probably not rich mind you, I'm thinking middle class maybe even lower mid class.
I see Walt as someone who had up until the show starts taken the easy path in life, if he had grown up in poverty there are doubt that he would feel safe taking the easy path.
Speaking of the AVClub, there's an excellent article on one of Vince Gilligan's X Files episodes that frames its Monster of the Week as a rough draft for Walter White. (The ep is Pusher)
http://www.avclub.com/articles/apocryphapusherteso-dos-bichos,43896/
It's mostly about X Files, naturally, so here's the high lights.
Stop me if you've heard this one before: there's a man, and he's not really happy with the way his life is going. He thinks he's a great man, and he thinks he's entitled to great things, but so far, his is a history of failure, compromise, and rejection. Then one day he finds out there's something wrong inside of him. Something terminal. But instead of being destroyed by this possible death sentence, the man uses it as an excuse to finally reach for his destiny. He takes the freedom granted by the limited time he has left to risk everything, to become, as the pop psychologists call it, self-actualized. Only problem is, this guy is kind of a bastard. And if he's gonna get what's coming to him, a lot of people are going to get hurt in the process.
"Pusher" is Vince Gilligan's is second episode as a writer on The X-Files, and it's his first great one. I don't want to over-stress the connections between this ep and Gilligan's current claim to fame, Breaking Bad, but it's not impossible to draw a line between the two
Also, if you like X Files, you should be reading these articles, fo sho.
Holy shit, did they wring every drop of tension out of Gus getting undressed (and then redressed).
Gotta love Jesse's "trust us."
Great first hour.
Ok season opener. Walt's meth nerd stuff was pretty funny.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Victor's death was nice and messy (and I liked the shot of Walt's shoes and the pool of blood, also the classic horror style cut-to-ketchup), but that was the weakest, most telegraphed "shock" ever for this show. Hope they have some better ones lined up.
This was as amazing as we expected it to be. Yeah, Gus getting undressed and then dressed...the tension. I mean, when you sit there WORRIED about what's gonna happen...not just curious, but WORRIED....that means you're witnessing something special. The tension is just unmatched anywhere else.
I loved Skyler maneuvering her way into Walt's apartment. It proves that she can be devious beyond what we expect from her, and I'm so intrigued by how much she will actually be involved in all of Walt's doings this season.
We don't deserve this greatness, do we?
On a side note, the brief look at The Walking Dead was pretty nice. Not like it was anything monumental, but still nice.
Ok season opener. Walt's meth nerd stuff was pretty funny.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Victor's death was nice and messy (and I liked the shot of Walt's shoes and the pool of blood, also the classic horror style cut-to-ketchup), but that was the weakest, most telegraphed "shock" ever for this show. Hope they have some better ones lined up.
Yeah, I kind of figured that's what was coming. But it was still seriously effective because of the pacing of the scene and brutality involved. (This violence they show on AMC -- not just on this show but on THE WALKING DEAD and elsewhere -- blows my mind.)
Without spoiling anything, I agree that we all saw it coming. Didn't lessen the "holy shit!" of it for me, though.
And it's not just shocking for the shocking's sake. It's character (re)defining and completely sets up the stakes/mood for the season.
The thing that stuck with me was the difference between Jesse and Walter's reactions to it.
Great opener. And when you combine it with "Half Measures" and "Full Measure", a nice little trilogy.
This was my first time watching a full episode on television, as I just got into the show in January by buying the first season, and then getting seasons 2 and 3 in June. Great season opener. Very minimalist, and that's an awesome way to start out the season. I can see things just escalating from here on, and the preview for episode 2 seems to solidify that notion.
Couple of thoughts.
-Loved the callback to the "let's dispose of the body by way hydrochloric acid" from season 1
-Walt and Jesse wearing the exact same clothes, and Walt still had his size sticker on his. Also Kenny Rogers rules.
-The already mentioned tension with Gustavo undressing then dressing.
-Nice almost fake out with showing the tea kettle with the bullet hole. Almost makes you think Gale wasn't dead and had run off.
Once again, great season opener, and looking forward to the rest of the season.
Nice opener. I agree the "shock" was expected, however, who it involved was indeed surprising.
I will say, though, that if AMC continues to return from commercial break with the warning, "Warning, the following segment contains strong violence, etc." I'm going to be kind of pissed. I should think that by season four, viewers should know what their in for and should not be shocked and outraged by violence so much so that AMC needs to essentially tell the viewer what's coming next. I really hope they just use the standard "Warning, the following program is intended for mature audiences, etc." because I dont appreciate the network itself spoiling the show, however vague and non-specific that warning may be.
I liked that by the end it seemed like Walt realized Jesse had changed to the point that Walt no longer has him figured out. Of course, it's Walt's fault anyhow.
I also liked Mike watching those two trying to put a body in a barrel. As many bodies as Mike has taken care of he seemed kind of amused to let somebody else do it.
Well that didn't disappoint.
As mentioned the 'shock' was telegraphed but the whole scene was so masterfully done that it still managed to shock. Amazing, amazing, ten minutes of television.
need to get my thoughts together on it
Fantastic. Even Mike was shocked. I could see Walt trying to turn him against Gus somehow. Or at least exploiting his unease.
Maybe the DEA will think Gale was Heisenberg after they look at his lab notes.
I'm sure how the "telegraphed" complaint matters here. The guy was dead as soon as Mike asked him if he was seen at the crime scene. The absolute brutality of his death is what is shocking here. And what it means to Jesse and Walt. And, actually, Mike. Pretty incredible moment, I thought.
I thought Jesse's transformation from utter to despair to cool with it (at Denny's, no less) was a little too quick. But Gus and Walt basically changed his world, and his make-up, overnight.
Anyway, great show as usual. Excited for the rest.
I just about lost it when I saw Jesse and Walt wearing the same outfit. Then food practically shot out of my nose when I saw the size sticker on Walt's shirt. Hilarious. And how many people wanted Walt's prediction about the aluminum to be right? I wonder if there is any significance to Hank buying rocks? I have theories but they are probably far-fetched.
Has it ever been discussed on this board why Marie likes purple so much? Is it just a quirk to her character or is there a theory behind the symbolism of it. I only know of purple as being associated to royalty from art history, but I cannot make the connection with her.
