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post #51 of 93

I've stuck up for this a bit, but yes, the fact we are going to spend another 40 minutes+ on his origin is incredibly frustrating.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Clark View Post

While there weren't oneliners per se, to say that there wasn't any humor in Raimi's films is something that gets repeated and makes me wonder if I've been watching different films than everyone else. Or maybe I'm just an easy sell, and am fine with Spidey cracking two or three jokes while the rest of the time is filled out with humor at Peter Parker's expense. Especially in Spider-Man 2; the guy just can't win, even when he's tying his shoes. It's heightened, it's tongue-in-cheek, and it totally WORKS. I sometimes feel that fans want him to be Deadpool sans guns, but then, they're probably the same fans who think Carnage was a good idea.

 

Spider-Man isn't Deadpool, but he does wise-crack a lot, just in a less irreverent way. There is humor in the Raimi films, but a lot of it is more slapsticky and campy (not anywhere near as bad as the 'humor' in the Transformers films, but it is a similar approach) than dialogue based. That wasn't helped by the fact that Maguire isn't funny.

post #52 of 93

I kinda half hope such a blatantly cynical exercise such as doing yet another, cheaper Spidey origin film for the tween set not ten years since this was last done (no doubt much more effectively) will finally be the shark jumping point for the whole superhero genre. Give the old girl a rest so she can reinvent herself a bit like all good film genres.

post #53 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Clark View Post

While there weren't oneliners per se, to say that there wasn't any humor in Raimi's films is something that gets repeated and makes me wonder if I've been watching different films than everyone else. Or maybe I'm just an easy sell, and am fine with Spidey cracking two or three jokes while the rest of the time is filled out with humor at Peter Parker's expense. Especially in Spider-Man 2; the guy just can't win, even when he's tying his shoes. It's heightened, it's tongue-in-cheek, and it totally WORKS. I sometimes feel that fans want him to be Deadpool sans guns, but then, they're probably the same fans who think Carnage was a good idea.


Never said there wasn't any humor in the films. ("Look - poor Peter really need a drink, and the glass he grabbed is empty!") But a Spider-Man who frustrates his opponents with wisecracks goes all the way back to the Lee/Ditko days - it's part of who he is. He gave Doc Ock a quick "Here's your change!" in S-M2 (and that was great) but that's about it. Check out the now defunct Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon - they really got it right. Carnage? I'm old school - always hated all the symbiote stuff. 

 

post #54 of 93

Lame puns > old-style physical comedy, apparently.

post #55 of 93

Meh...not impressed at all.

post #56 of 93

Bored.

Puzzled by the pointlessness of it all.

Skipping.

 

 

post #57 of 93

You know, I was never so enamored by Raimi's films that I felt they rendered any subsequent take on the character superfluous (I'm actually in the tiny minority that prefers Raimi's first Spider-Man film to the sequels.  I feel like it strikes a balance between the earnestness of II and the goofiness of III).  And the studio had me on board when they hired Webb.  500 Days of Summer may not be a perfect film, but it's almost infectiously cheery and a pretty impressive debut.  On top of that, I like the cast, I like that they're going back to the Gwen Stacy storyline and I even like the costume.

 

The trailer though took me from cautiously optimistic to lukewarm.  

 

You almost have to admire it though for how unapologetic it is in refusing to justify its own existence.  You would think that the trailer would try to distinguish this film from the previous series instead of focusing on recycled story beats.  And that POV shot at the end.  Jesus, that was bad. 

 

post #58 of 93

Studio-meddling flaw aside, I loved what Raimi did with the series.  But yeah, where's the wise-cracks.  I'm not much of a Kevin Smith fan anymore, but it always surprised me that they didn't bring in his flair for comedy dialog and general comic book geek cred to punch up Spidey's one-liners.  Seemed a pretty obvious move.

post #59 of 93

No one but the Weinsteins were ever seriously interested in being in the Kevin Smith business. Even Entourage used him as a punchline.

post #60 of 93

Heh..

post #61 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather View Post

Lame puns > old-style physical comedy, apparently.


No, but we should've gotten both in the Raimi movies (which I like/love/like).

 

On topic, am I the only one who suspects that the POV scene may be stuff shot specifically for this teaser? I just figured it was like the original Spidey teaser, with him webbing the thieves' helicopter to the Twin Towers. I also suspect that the POV would be much better received with Raimi's name attached.
 

 

post #62 of 93

I agree on the teaser point. I doubt you'll see much, if any of that in the film (though a POV shot of him running off a building pulling wide on an arc into a helicopter shot of Spider-Man swinging would be pretty effective).

 

    Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil View Post

No one but the Weinsteins were ever seriously interested in being in the Kevin Smith business. Even Entourage used him as a punchline.


There was a time he was punching up a lot of scripts (before he became an increasingly self-indulgent stoner mess anyway).

 

The point stands though, they obviously didn't want a wise-cracking Spidey otherwise they could have hired someone to take a pass at the script. Patton Oswalt was talking on WTF about how he now does that for a dozen or so films a year, getting paid a relative fortune to add/change a couple of lines of dialogue and jokes to existing scripts.

post #63 of 93

I'll echo what everyone else has said, but I'd also like to add something that's inherently wrong with Spider-Man's concept and is never justified by the movies: why is he a vigilante?

 

This is something that I increasingly feel like street-level superhero movies need to justify, not just out of simple logic but to distinguish from eachother. The likes of Iron Man and Thor don't count because they're fighting terrorists and godly threats, and Superman is so powerful no one could stop him anyway but he at least voluntarilly works with the police.

 

Daredevil at least gives lip service to Matt Murdock feeling constrained by the hypocrisy and bureaucracy of the legal system, and that he may be a little crazy. In Batman Begins, Batman can't work with the police because they're apart of a citywide conspiracy, and in Dark Knight he's an unofficial deputy (what with the signal and everything)...and may be a little crazy.

 

But why is Peter's first impulse to make a costume and go out and punch criminals? I understand the character of Peter Parker could be afraid of being turned into a government lab rat, but it would be nice if the movies took a moment to throw that out there.

 

As is, I'm burned out on anything superhero not The Avengers or Dark Knight Rises in 2012, and this trailer does nothing for me.

post #64 of 93

Erik Larsen's Savage Dragon dealt with this - he had his superhero just join the police, at least for a time.

 

As for Spidey, I think it's the old 'my loved ones would be in danger if my identity were public' chestnut. 

post #65 of 93

Because with great power comes great responsibility. DUH!

post #66 of 93

Yeah, but that's what any cop has to deal with. Plus, in the 2002 movie (and basically any version of the character), he becomes Spider-Man before he's aware of the existence of super-villains. Plus, if he wants to wear a mask he could still do that as an official member of the NYPD.

 

As is, he's only making things more difficult. Remember the scene in the first movie when that cop tries to stop him? "Not coming back, chief." Or the simple existence of J. Jonah Jameson? Spidey isn't so powerful that he's untouchable like Superman, and he's not an urban legend like Batman. If anything, he's an incredible narcissist that believes he's the only one powerful enough to shoulder the responsibility of crime-fighting.

 

Consider this: Green Goblin and Doc Ock could be taken out with a well-placed sniper's bullet. It's not until Sandman that Spidey faces a threat that any competent police force or National Guard could take down.

 

My point is the tone is off. Traditional superhero stories only work if there's a heightened sense of reality, like the Power Puff Girls (which I love). Once you start cementing things in reality, you need to consider the ramifications of a superhero's existence.

 

Captain America is a soldier working for the U.S. government. The Avengers eventually get U.N. sponsoring, or work with S.H.I.E.L.D.. I'm one of the few that thought the superhero registration act in Civil War was a good idea, because what's to stop Spider-Man from going rogue?

 

You see, I love the implied moral ambiguity, and a way the new movie could differentiate itself from the old trilogy is by exploring that. But it won't.

post #67 of 93
post #68 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimoald View Post


There was a time he was punching up a lot of scripts (before he became an increasingly self-indulgent stoner mess anyway).


It's Kevin Smith, so there's no way there's not a detailed account of every film for which he did that. Anyone got a link?

 

post #69 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by grubstreeter View Post

 

As for Spidey, I think it's the old 'my loved ones would be in danger if my identity were public' chestnut. 


On top of that, there was always the "Aunt May would have a stroke if she knew I was putting myself in danger" rationalization.
 

 

post #70 of 93

I've been a cheerleader for this reboot since it was announced because I've always downright hated the Raimi films, but I will say that this trailer left me a little unimpressed. However, this is a trailer for a film that doesn't come out for a year so I'm withholding making a formal opinion. 

 

post #71 of 93

Saw this in front of Captain America last night. The main irritant is that it's an origin reboot for a nine-year-old film. That's silly and I picked up a sense of bemusement from the audience that may have been rooted in that. That aside, the teaser is fine, and I have zero love for the first film so I think I can live with a reboot if I decide to see it at some point. Though I must say, I honestly don't give a shit about any superhero film beyond TDKR. 

post #72 of 93

According to all comic con reports, this trailer is misleading and does not accurately reflect the tone of the film, both for good and ill. There's lots of wisecracking Spidey, which I'm sure we're all happy with, but also an incongruous and bulky CGI Lizard.

 

I'll echo Johnny's sentiment in that there isn't an upcoming superhero movie I can't live without, and I'll go one step further in that even TDKR isn't something I can't live without. 

post #73 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian OB View Post

but also an incongruous and bulky CGI Lizard.

 

 



fuck, thats lucky.  After reading the trailer was (unsurprisingly) misleading I was starting to be concerned there wouldn't be anything for t'internet to bitch about.

 

post #74 of 93

I haven't seen the footage with the Lizard, but how is the bitching about his size any different from the bitching about Venom being too small in Spider-Man 3? Honestly, internet.

post #75 of 93

the lizard looks fine. the fuss shouldnt be about that

post #76 of 93

Count my Cap-viewing crowd in with those vocally expressing disappointment/anger that this is a retread of Spidey's origin.  It will be interesting to see how this one does in the theater................especially considering everyone I know who ISN'T a comic fan seems pissed off that they are restarting the series so soon.

post #77 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by S.D. Bob Plissken View Post

Count my Cap-viewing crowd in with those vocally expressing disappointment/anger that this is a retread of Spidey's origin.  It will be interesting to see how this one does in the theater................especially considering everyone I know who ISN'T a comic fan seems pissed off that they are restarting the series so soon.



The new merchandising doing the rounds suggest not just a new creative direction for the film itself...

 

41RH46XKD6L._SS500_.jpg

post #78 of 93

In the leaked photos I've seen the Lizard looks like something from the SUPER MARIO BROS. movie.

post #79 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherman Davies View Post

 

On topic, am I the only one who suspects that the POV scene may be stuff shot specifically for this teaser? I just figured it was like the original Spidey teaser, with him webbing the thieves' helicopter to the Twin Towers. I also suspect that the POV would be much better received with Raimi's name attached.
 

 


POV will almost certainly be in the final film.  Studios are not in the habit of wasting money creating effects heavy shots just for trailers.  The twin towers scene from the first one, didn't make it in the final film due to 9/11. 

 

Conceptually, I think the POV shot is actually really cool.  Usually, I'm not necessarily a fan of POV shots, but I think it'd be pretty awesome to get that kind of view from above of NYC.  It could potentially be awesome on the big screen.  One of the problems with that shot was, how it felt Spiderman was floating or rolling along, when he was running.  It didn't have the dip and sway of a man running, thus it felt fake and cheap.

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post

Saw this in front of Captain America last night. The main irritant is that it's an origin reboot for a nine-year-old film. That's silly and I picked up a sense of bemusement from the audience that may have been rooted in that. That aside, the teaser is fine, and I have zero love for the first film so I think I can live with a reboot if I decide to see it at some point. Though I must say, I honestly don't give a shit about any superhero film beyond TDKR. 


I really agree.  I'm not completely sure why, but my enthusiasm and interest for superhero films has drastically dropped.  Maybe it's because even the best ones only aspire to be just good.  And the only one I'm really dying to see is TDKR.  And I'm not even one of those die hard TDK fans, but I really think Nolan is going to create an insane and amazing film in the last one, partly because it's going to be the definitive end to a trilogy where Nolan can really end it almost however he wants. 

 

I'm much more excited for all these potentially awesome sci fi films, like Prometheus, Ellysium, and In Time. 

 

post #80 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabster View Post

POV will almost certainly be in the final film.  Studios are not in the habit of wasting money creating effects heavy shots just for trailers.  The twin towers scene from the first one, didn't make it in the final film due to 9/11.

 


They may not be in the habit of doing that, but there are exceptions. The Twin Towers teaser was a "special shoot" by one of Raimi's 2nd unit directors and featured no footage intended for the film itself. It's a costly way to market your movie, but it happens from time to time.
 

 

post #81 of 93


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by User_32 View Post


Yeah, he's definitely a much better looking Spider-Man than Tobey Maguire ever was. But I think that has to do with approaching his character as an outsider rather than a nerd.

 

Thanks, TWILIGHT!!! Just kidding. You suck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherman Davies View Post

On topic, am I the only one who suspects that the POV scene may be stuff shot specifically for this teaser?

 

Quote:
Quote:Originally Posted by Nabster View Post

POV will almost certainly be in the final film.  Studios are not in the habit of wasting money creating effects heavy shots just for trailers.

 

I think you both mean "specifically lifted from Mirror's Edge for this trailer".

 

PARKOUR!

 

office-parkour-425x212.png

 

"BOO HOO! I lost another father figure!" Don't worry, Pete, there's also plenty to go around. Possibly 3+ in this installment. And pretty girls-next-door? And to spare. Super powers? You got em. With that luck, I'd be cracking-wise all the live long day too.

 

Dollar theater or rental for me, unless WOM is exceptional.

post #82 of 93

You know what? I'm a wimp. After watching Garfield's introduction at Comic-Con I've decided to give this movie a break. It may have been genuine, it may have been completely marketing driven, it may have been a mix, but fuck it. I choose to believe it.

 

Being a sap sometimes is good. 

post #83 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather View Post

In the leaked photos I've seen the Lizard looks like something from the SUPER MARIO BROS. movie.



 as long as you arent talking about that 90's piece of crap then yeah

post #84 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCatfishCommander View Post





 as long as you arent talking about that 90's piece of crap then yeah



Is there another Super Mario Bros movie he could be talking about? Some hidden gem of great narrative strength and emotional cohesion?

post #85 of 93

I can see the SuperMario resemblance. But very komodo-dragonish too. Which also makes me think of US' GINO Godzilla. But better than either comparison brings to mind.

 

Could be worse. We could be getting Andrew Bryniarski's wrestler turned reptile (Killer Croc anyone???) character from BLACK MASK 2. Course, I wouldn't mind some topnotch practical monster FX.

post #86 of 93

it certainly cant be any worse than what raimi had planned. but what ive seen is quite blurry, but i think itll work quite fine. im more interested in seeing how the action scenes will be shot, because raimi certainly didnt go cheap in that department, and so far this movie looks INCREDIBLY small scale imho

post #87 of 93

So it looks like The Lizard from the MTV cartoon that was voiced by Rob Zombie?

 

lizard.jpg

post #88 of 93

That cartoon was really good. I was bummed there was never a second season. If you wanted a wise cracking Spidey, NPH delivered.

post #89 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCatfishCommander View Post

it certainly cant be any worse than what raimi had planned.



Where can I get a copy of this Raimi script?

 

Oh, you don't have one? SHOCK.

post #90 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by S.D. Bob Plissken View Post

So it looks like The Lizard from the MTV cartoon that was voiced by Rob Zombie?

 

lizard.jpg

Not from the pic I saw floating online. More streamlined. That thing above looks like something from a D&D manual. How many HP does that thing have?
 

 

post #91 of 93

For some reason a friend sent me a link of the leaked pictures, I'm not going to post them of course, but this bust is a somewhat decent indicator of what to expect in terms of size (the design is more streamlined as mentioned earlier)... http://api.ning.com/files/QHO-ed-E7o4dHBcEgf28PaFoOftu2Yr3j1c*FseLd7gOoHN-gv0ekR61WaYXgYZZRRqPnsFA179bV58xPtofPQ__/Spiderman_vs__The_Lizard_by_FritoFrito.jpg

post #92 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post

For some reason a friend sent me a link of the leaked pictures, I'm not going to post them of course, but this bust is a somewhat decent indicator of what to expect in terms of size (the design is more streamlined as mentioned earlier)... http://api.ning.com/files/QHO-ed-E7o4dHBcEgf28PaFoOftu2Yr3j1c*FseLd7gOoHN-gv0ekR61WaYXgYZZRRqPnsFA179bV58xPtofPQ__/Spiderman_vs__The_Lizard_by_FritoFrito.jpg


I'd have that piece of nerd merch on my shelf.

 

post #93 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather View Post





Where can I get a copy of this Raimi script?

 

Oh, you don't have one? SHOCK.

 

haha

i meant all the action pieces were great in the three raimi movies, even the third movie finale, which could have been better but was still shot great

 

whatever, i actually dont even really care, aside from the casting i had no problems with the first three movies

 

 

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