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ATTENTION CHEWER PS3 OWNERS!

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 

SONY has just changed their EULA on the PS3. They added a clause that if you accept the EULA you cannot participate in any sort of class action lawsuit against them and are instead forced to accept arbitration. The only options are not accepting it and therefore not being able to play online or sending an actual letter to SONY saying you do not accept this clause.

 

 

post #2 of 20

That's a bit of ass-covering that promotes confidence in their future service!

post #3 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post

SONY has just changed their EULA on the PS3. They added a clause that if you accept the EULA you cannot participate in any sort of class action lawsuit against them and are instead forced to accept arbitration. The only options are not accepting it and therefore not being able to play online or sending an actual letter to SONY saying you do not accept this clause.

 

 



I know Sony has amazing attorneys but I'd be absolutely and utterly shocked if this held up in court.

 

post #4 of 20

Is it bad that I dont really care what the EULA said? I always accept those things without caring/reading.

post #5 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Dylan View Post

Is it bad that I dont really care what the EULA said? I always accept those things without caring/reading.


Its okay, as long as you dont care about your internal organs, first amendment rights and getting recognition for saving "Itchy and Scratchy".

Also, you might get hunted down by rich people for sport in the near future; wear jogging shoes.

post #6 of 20

Who fucking cares?  Seriously, you know what consumers win in class action suits? A 20% coupon off of some product you don't give a flying fuck about.  The only people that profit from class action suits are attorneys. 

 

Also hysterical is most of the gaming community's reaction to this.  As if they don't have credit cards, haven't purchased software, own an appliance or use banks.

 

The only shocking part is that this wasn't already in the Ts&Cs.

post #7 of 20

I'm with Jcassady on this one. I'm not sure what kind of damages Sony could do to me that would warrant a suit in the first place, and class-action suits are, as he mentioned, pretty much useless. And yeah, internet gamers are hilarious in their attempts to shout "I'LL SUE!" at every percieved aggravation. There were people in the Steam forums the other day threatening to sue Valve because they published the Beta version of Dead Island by accident.

 

 

post #8 of 20

....kthnxbai

post #9 of 20
Thread Starter 

Meh. I just thought I'd give a heads up to my friends in case some of them weren't so comfortable giving even more rights away. No skin off my back.

post #10 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryoken View Post


Its okay, as long as you dont care about your internal organs, first amendment rights and getting recognition for saving "Itchy and Scratchy".

Also, you might get hunted down by rich people for sport in the near future; wear jogging shoes.



If those things were in it I would be totally awesome with okaying it without thinking!

post #11 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post

Meh. I just thought I'd give a heads up to my friends in case some of them weren't so comfortable giving even more rights away. No skin off my back.



You bastard.

post #12 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post

 

And yeah, internet gamers are hilarious in their attempts to shout "I'LL SUE!" at every percieved aggravation. There were people in the Steam forums the other day threatening to sue Valve because they published the Beta version of Dead Island by accident.

 

 


I remember someone on the IGN forum's going absolutely BATSHIT when it became apparent the PS2 version of Spider-Man Web of Shadows wasn't free-roam. I mean ballistic.

 

 

post #13 of 20
Thread Starter 

Yes, that is exactly the same thing.

 

It's funny. Anyone who isn't a gamer that I've asked how he feels about such a thing treated it with derisive laughter at SONY's expense at least. The only people I've seen treat this as nothing or blaming the usual 'gamer entitlement' straw man are gamers themselves.

post #14 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post

Yes, that is exactly the same thing.

 

It's funny. Anyone who isn't a gamer that I've asked how he feels about such a thing treated it with derisive laughter at SONY's expense at least. The only people I've seen treat this as nothing or blaming the usual 'gamer entitlement' straw man are gamers themselves.


I wonder if Toyota fired off some emails to sony after seeing this saying thanks for the idear brah....next batch of cars requiring a major recall will probably have a kill switch on the ignition until the driver accepts similar terms of service before they start up the car they already paid for. And down the road from that you'll be locked inside your burning vehicle until you accept terms indicating you won't hold their faulty fuel lines responsible when sideswiped by another car....

Home loans, credit cards, and big boxy appliances are one thing. You know what you're buying into upfront and you have the option to read the fine print and if you don't like what you see you can always go no buy. This is different, through software updates Sony has at times removed core functionality of product features...in this case holding online services such as netflix/online gaming hostage until you accept. I find it scummy of them to do so and would find it hilarious if a group of disgruntled gamers class action sued them for trying to remove the option for class action lawsuits.

This move was unnecessary, or should have been integrated with the relaunch bonus package they did last spring. I was happy with the games and year of identity protection offered by Sony in response to the hacking and loss of service. They should've just done it then and there saying if you want to sue us don't accept these reparations. It's just a clumsy pr mess all around; haven't lost any sleep over this.
post #15 of 20

As a PS3 owner I appreciate you bringing this to my attention Stel..I'm sure next time I boot up my system I'll just click yes and go on with my day but I don't worry about this sort of thing too much. I never give them any of my card numbers anyway but I've got a 7/11 right down the street so it's easy to buy Microsoft Points or PSN Points. I can't think of any reason I would want to sue anyone either but I don't really roll like that, go figure.

 

Anyway, you're a Prince among men for posting. One of the reasons I like Chud so much is the little things like this, I might not catch it on any of the sites I read but I know there's always one good egg that's gonna throw it up just as fyi.

 

Thanks again.

post #16 of 20

Quote:
Originally Posted by mongycore View Post

Home loans, credit cards, and big boxy appliances are one thing. You know what you're buying into upfront and you have the option to read the fine print and if you don't like what you see you can always go no buy. 


Why is this OK for "big boxy" appliances? A faulty refrigerator could actually electrocute and kill you, a defective stove could burn your house.

 

Compared to that, who really cares about class action suits against a game product?

post #17 of 20
Eh? Who the fuck was saying big boxy appliance can kill you when they want to and get away with it? Are there parts of America where Maximum Overdrive is real? The whole point of that spiel was to illustrate that such traditional items have static agreements that aren't dynamic or are updated when it conveniently suits the manufacturer, in this case Sony who at a whim can seemingly do whatever they want with the ps3 you paid for.

Getting mad over Xcom or some weirdo Spiderman game is one thing, but it amuses me at how apathetic people are when it comes to their consumer rights on physical goods they purchased. Trying to boycott any corporation is kind of fruitless given the wide array of products any one entity offers for consumption. Just look at the available infographics detailing the pots Monsanto, BP, Koch or Fox have their hands in and good luck trying to avoid their products in your daily life...When a situation demands it a messy 'useless' class action suit is one way to hit a business for wrong doing in which they will feel the consequences of any malfeasance. Even if it amounts to some piddly $5 dollar coupon for shitty dlc or avatar item - the executive(s) responsible at the end of the year will have to answer to the shareholders on why they paid out a settlement.

The wholesale nuking of consumer rights via forced arbitration undoubtedly will favor Sony. It doesn't matter what financial advisor you subscribe to (Suze Orman, Dave Ramsey, Rob Black, or Clark Howard) the common pattern when hearing the forced arbitration stories on their radio/tv shows for the past decade is that of having the deck stacked against you in a setting separate from the legal system, that tips the table in the corporations favor.
Quote:
from the linked site:

In arbitration, there is no judge, jury or right to an appeal. The arbitrators do not have to follow the law, and there is no public review of decisions to ensure the arbitrator got it right. Moreover, contracts typically name the arbitration that must be used – the one preferred by the company.

Forced arbitration frequently costs more than taking a case to court, and can cost thousands of dollars. Individuals often have to pay a large fee simply to initiate the arbitration process. Then in order to arbitrate, individuals sometimes have to travel thousands of miles on their own dime. In the end, the loser (usually the individual) often pays the company’s legal fees.

Forced arbitration strips our most basic rights and makes many employee and consumer protections unenforceable. The laws that protect us from discrimination based on age, sex, religion, race, disability, and unequal pay for equal work, such as the Civil Rights Act and the Equal Pay Act, become meaningless and unenforceable in arbitration. Employees lose important protections for blowing the whistle on waste or fraud or for fighting retaliation for taking the family medical leave, for example.

Consumers cannot sue for negligence, defective products or scams. Even if a retirement account disappears, a home is dangerous and defective, or a loved one suffers harm in a nursing home, a forced arbitration clause means there is no right to take the company responsible to court.
post #18 of 20

Quote:
Originally Posted by mongycore View Post

Eh? Who the fuck was saying big boxy appliance can kill you when they want to and get away with it? Are there parts of America where Maximum Overdrive is real? 

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/turkey/1468327/Briton-electrocuted-by-fridge-in-Turkey.html

 

I thought you were saying that it's ok to have such agreements for big boxy items ... I see your point is that the features and the agreement are static, so maybe I misread you. 

 

I do think these clauses that strip away your rights might not hold up in court in the first place though.

post #19 of 20
And I apologize for being so dickish in my reply.

Reading the thread I think I come off kind of bipolar on the issue. I was okay with Sony's post-hack freebies and had no real desire for the class action suit against Sony due to those anonymous hackers (who should be held guilty for that fiasco). Not a fan of forced arbitration in any form, more people should be upset about that development, and I hope smarter minds in congress push some decent fair arbitration laws to reclaim lost rights that have been eroding the past couple of years. Haven't turned on the ps3 in some time so I haven't accepted the new terms - will probably fire off some of those available stock letters to be exempt from it all, and will be sending letters to my regions elected representative on the issue supporting fairer legislation for consumers against forced arbitration tomorrow.
post #20 of 20

AT&T put in a similar clause in one of their contract updates, which caused a big uproar.

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