THE MUPPETS Discussion Thread - Page 2

Loved it.

One disappointment? The "celebrity" cameos. Was it me or were they pretty low grade (minus two or three). I mean, I was really expecting an Orson Welles type moment that never came. Also the numerous callbacks to Steve Martin I was kind of hoping he'd put in an appearance. It doesn't ruin the movie or anything but I remember one of the early script reviews had Christian Bale and George Clooney as potential cameos. I guess it's pretty hard to top the first movie in that department.

Ultimately, Arthur demonstrates himself as improbable male protagonist at the end by his magnificent job.

"SOFA PILLOWS!"

If you don't have a smile on your face by the end of this movie, I don't want to be your friend. End of story.

It's so fucking fantastic to see a movie so completely unironic, so non-cynical (yet being able to poke fun at both of those things) and include a New Coke joke. An absolute joy of a film. Took the whole family to see it and the entire theater was either singing along or bobbing their heads to The Rainbow Connection. One of the best family movies of the year.

Originally Posted by User_32 One disappointment? The "celebrity" cameos. Was it me or were they pretty low grade (minus two or three). I mean, I was really expecting an Orson Welles type moment that never came. Also the numerous callbacks to Steve Martin I was kind of hoping he'd put in an appearance. It doesn't ruin the movie or anything but I remember one of the early script reviews had Christian Bale and George Clooney as potential cameos. I guess it's pretty hard to top the first movie in that department.

Apparently Clooney, Billy Crystal, Ben Stiller, Mila Kunis, Lady Gaga, Kathy Griffin, Ed Helms, Eric Stonestreet, Wanda Sykes, and Danny Trejo all had parts that were shot but cut, which seems like utter madness to me.

Seriously. You don't have to love the movie (I doubt it'll be among my top ten or even fifteen at year's end), but like Renn said: if you don't like it? Asshole. This is a perfect asshole-test movie, and wow that came out wrong but you get my meaning I hope.

Yeah, Sykes and Trejo were in the trailers too. Hopefully, those cameos will be on the DVD, as I'm guessing they were cut for time or pacing reasons.

Loved this. My only complaints are Walter's whistling should have been introduced earlier (I think he's whistling while cleaning up the theater, but it could've been emphasized more), and Animal's big moment of returning to the drums should have been bigger. There's lip service to the rest of the crew needing a beat to get their groove back, but they get back into it just fine without Animal and his moment during "Rainbow Connection" needing more oomph.

Minor complaints. Had a smile on my face the whole time.

I don't have much to add other than I agree, this is great and almost a miracle that a movie this sweet could get made today.  And I do hope those celebrity cameos wind up on the blu-ray.

I absolutely fucking loved this when I saw it the day before Thanksgiving and I'd love to see it again if I get the chance.  Easily one of my absolute favorites of the year and I'm psyched that it is doing so well.  It's looking to clear its budget before the middle of this week!  Woohoo!  Let's just hope the inevitable sequel is just as good.

I absolutely love the fact that my three favorite movies (in no particular order) of the year so far are The Muppets, Attack the Block, and Drive.  I think that's a perfect summary of my taste in film.

Also, I've seen it said elsewhere but wanted to reiterate it here.  This is probably the best use of Jack Black in a decade.

Just checking, but how does the Rainbow Connection rendition here compare to the previous versions?

Like this one.

Better than that one. Not as great as this one:

So, I'd say it's neck and neck with the original. There's a hell of a lot of emotions in the performance in the film, with Kermit and Piggy dueting for the first time in ages, the other Muppets remembering what got them together to begin with, and Animal getting his groove back at the end.

My only complaint is that Sarah Silverman and Miss Piggy didn't have a duet.  

There's got to be way more of her on the cutting room floor too. No way did they have her show up for JUST 10 seconds.

Jack Black being the celebrity host was disappointing for two reasons:

1) We already had a Jack Black cameo earlier in the film

and

2) It's Jack Black

I saw it in a packed theater yesterday morning and it killed.The old folks behind me liked it, my wife and kids dug it, the younger kids in the theater seemed to be into it,  and the group of twenty-somethings next to me that stunk of pot (seriously, twice I checked to see if they were actually lighting up DURING the movie) were REALLY into it.

It might not have been the best movie of the year, but it's certainly the most joyful.

Yeah, I don't dislike Jack Black as much as some people, but I wish they'd kept him as Animal's sponsor and gotten another celebrity to host. Preferably the biggest they could get, like if Clooney was in the movie, why not use him for that? Or even NPH. I guess schedules are a thing, but still.

Honestly, Jack Black didn't bother me that much at all. There's an X degrees thing going where they're connected to him via Animal, for one; for another it's much funnier to kidnap the poor bastard than it is to just enlist someone willing to host the show for them. I'm not a huge Black fan these days but it's a ton of fun to watch them torment him with various awfulness, particularly the terrible Nirvana cover.

That said I was kind of surprised that they couldn't come up with someone better, but maybe the fact that they went for Black kind of plays into how out of touch with the times they all are.

I love how aware the movie is of itself, and I love how it just doesn't give a damn about it.

I actually think Black's shtick worked for his hosting scenes (though I really wanted to see the discussion he and Kermit had in regards to saving the show).

Oh, and fart shoes? Always funny. Always.

Sam the Eagle as a Fox News correspondent. Of course! Also not one but TWO Community cast members wooo! (People were cheering for the ten seconds Donald Glover was on screen!) 

My favorite flick of the year so far. And tied up there at 2nd place (with CAPER) for my Muppet Movie list, behind the original. I got misty-eyed so many times during this. In the MUPPET MOVIE, I related to Kermit so much for wanting to follow my dreams and in this, as a Muppet-superfan (and someone who's seeked out Henson-employment) and struggling with relationship stuff I related so much to the Walter/Gary combo. Loved all the callbacks to the show and the Muppet Movie (Sweetums at Mad Moonies!). Loved that Uncle Deadly was a "major" character. Who doesn't love Mahna Mahna? And loved the new Flight of the Conchord songs, especially "Man or Muppet". Like the flick overall, that tune is both funny and touching.

Shocked that Rizzo and Pepe were barely in this. But glad it gave the original team more time to shine.

Anyone else chuckle at the ironic idea of the Muppets having their theater and name taken over by a large corporation, considering Disney recently bought them? A tad lazy that this plot point was borrowed from the It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movies, but I'll forgive them due to execution. And does Whoopi G have a contract with them (she's even played God in a Muppet flick)?

The Muppets are back. I soooo wanna see this again.

I think it is great that so many people are responding to the movie on first viewing. To be honest, I didn't love it until my second viewing. With a movie like this it is hard not to walk into it with personal baggage and preconceptions of what a Muppet movie needs to be in 2011. The whole finale fell flat for me on my first viewing, but the second time around it not only didn't bother me but I found myself enjoying aspects of it.

Liked it quite a bit, not sure I loved it. The Chris Cooper rap was hilarious. Liked that they rode the line between "cheesy" and "fun" (it worked.) It really made me feel like an asshole for not liking the last few Muppet movies.

My only gripe was the end. If you're going to go that way, don't cop out!!

IN CONTROL 

loved it 

also, I completely forgot about Rizzo! Where was he?? 

This movie leapt straight past my hard, cynical exterior and into my heart in no time. I even managed to find the exact spot where it happened!

Lifes a piece of cake

        with someone to give and someone to take

Lifes a piece of pie

        with someone to wash and someone to dry

Lifes an easy road

      with someone with you to share the load

Life is full of highs

      with someone to stir and someone to fry

Life's a leg of lamb

      with someone there to lend a hand

Lifes a bunch of flowers

     with someone to while away the hours

Life's a fillet of fish, eh?

   ...yes it is?     <-------------------right there

Really, I thought the songs in this were incredible. None of them overstayed their welcome, they all informed and moved the plot along, and what's best, they're catchy as HELL. I've been humming "Life's a Happy Song" for the last two weeks.

Also, did anyone find Rowlf's rejoining of the group the best of all the "let's get the band back together" scenes? I was actually hoping Rowlf would get more airtime, since he's one of my favorites, and also because no one's given him much to do since Jim Henson died. I got that initially, since he was Henson's first Muppet and all that, but it's been 20 years now (good God). Let's give Rowlf his own song next time!

Asshole, table for one, please?

I'm sorry, but this just didn't work for me at all beyond a purely nostalgic twinge at seeing the Muppets.

Too much human not enough felt.  Although weirdly I feel there weren't enough cameos.  What I mean by this is past Muppet films have felt like Muppet films with cameos, this felt like a movie with puppets who just happened to be Muppets.  Sorta a felt spin on Who Framed Roger Rabbit? down to the villains plotline which was dropped like a bowling ball along with the plot overall.  I understand Renn ascribing a meta/Muppet ideal in making that feel right but I don't think it was intentional and it hurts the film overall.

Too much mugging for the camera from Segel and Adams; I will have to go back and watch Caper(my favorite) to see if Grodin and Rigg break the fourth wall so ham-fistedly. 

Walter's talent needed a much better set-up for his finale. 

Tex's "maniacal laugh" gag needed much better set-up and conclusion to make the film stick the landing. 

The more I think about it I wonder if Galifianakis wouldn't have served better as the "host".  Jack Black's schtick is so ungodly annoying to me for some reason.  Maybe I have hated him subconsciously ever since he was floated as a comedic Green Lantern.

What the hell was up with all the subtitling and karaoke sing along shit?  Especially for the Swedish Chef, what blasphemy.

My gawd I hate bringing him up but Devin has a great article about the possibly mangled ending. 

The CGI sections involving the Muppets pulled me out of the film; CGI doesn't mesh well with the already felt characters.  I want to see the Muppets with the limitations of being Muppets, I don't want to see Walter being electrocuted by CGI electricity.

Kermit did feel off but it wasn't his voice.  His body seemed way too round from top to bottom instead of more slightly-almond shaped as I recall the puppet appearing.

For some reason the best moment in the film for me was the Beauregard reveal.

I think the ending we got is much, much better than the one that was supposedly cut. It's funnier, more subversive, and truer to the characters (I mean, Statler and Waldorf saving the Muppets?). The "original" ending is more narratively logical, I suppose, but is narrative logic really the reason we watch a Muppet movie?

And I think "Maniacal laugh" is way funnier as a non-sequitur.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Clark 
Also, did anyone find Rowlf's rejoining of the group the best of all the "let's get the band back together" scenes?

Yes. Loved that moment. I think it made laugh hardest after the Tex Richman rap. Like you though I do feel that Rowlf was a bit discarded here, but any Rowlf is still good Rowlf.

Yeah, after being reduced to an extra in the previous three Muppet films, I'd say that Rowlf now having one of the funniest bits in the movie is a pretty big deal for the character.

I think Dr. Teeth and Rowlf should've done a dueling piano bit on the telethon. That would've been a great way to reintroduce the characters after two decades of relative silence and do-nothingness.

I just want to say now, how annoying would the movie had been if there were sequences where Walter whistles and then says "what could my talent possible be?"  I perfered the comes out of nowhere approach.  As it was I was expecting it do with Walter's ability to be thrown.

Also wouldn't the time have run out of when the Muppets could pay for the theater anyway for the alternate version.  As it was the plot seemed a little close to A Very Muppet Christmas Movie.  Which reminds me, isn't Muppet Theater a historical landmark and hence you can't drill for oil anyway?  Granted I think the movies went with the TV specials never occuring.

Great now I have a new idea for a Muppet film, Muppet Fringe.  When the Tv special muppet reality and movie reality collide.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerekT 

Also wouldn't the time have run out of when the Muppets could pay for the theater anyway for the alternate version.  As it was the plot seemed a little close to A Very Muppet Christmas Movie.  Which reminds me, isn't Muppet Theater a historical landmark and hence you can't drill for oil anyway?  Granted I think the movies went with the TV specials never occuring.

 

Great now I have a new idea for a Muppet film, Muppet Fringe.  When the Tv special muppet reality and movie reality collide.

Yeah, they play fast and loose with the business side of things. On the show (and the VERY MERRY special), Scooter's Uncle was the owner, but in the new flick, it was part of the "Rich & Famous" contract and owned by the Muppets. I can certainly overlook something like that in a franchise where the gang meets differently in nearly every single movie (even in the first 3 where they play themselves). I'm soooo glad they paid tribute to the Show and the original flick though, as it was the era that introduced me (child of the 70s) to the Muppets and ultimately my favorite material.

Not only does the new movie borrow from that special plot-wise, but look at the villain names.... BITTERMAN / RICHMAN.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerekT 

I just want to say now, how annoying would the movie had been if there were sequences where Walter whistles and then says "what could my talent possible be?"  I perfered the comes out of nowhere approach.  As it was I was expecting it do with Walter's ability to be thrown.

The lack of foreshadowing made it feel very much like they ran out of steam with the script and had nothing left on the table.  Walter's ability to be thrown wasn't that great an ability as evidenced by the electrocution he received and this ineptitude would have put him squarely into Gonzo territory.

Had they given him some sort of Rain Man style OCD quirk that got two to three laughs throughout the movie or something that hinted even the slightest bit I think it would have worked better. 

See, I actually liked that they didn't have a big red arrow pointing at Walter's talent.  As it is, when he starts whistling, you can remember him whistling earlier in the movie and it's a nice "oh, yeah!" moment, but it's still a surprise, which I think is a good thing.  Same with the original ending - having someone in the theater pay the last dollar is the obvious solution in that scene, and arguably out of character for Statler and Waldorf.  By having them not even get close, you not only take the story in an unexpected direction, but you take the Muppets to their absolute lowest before they meet the cheering crowds outside.  Much more effective, to me. 

I just got back from this, and oh God so much looooovvvee. Laundry list!:

-The meta gags that killed me the most were "Automatic Destroy Plumbing Company Button" (or something like that; I don't remember the exact wording) and "Travel by map!"

-"The Rainbow Connection"=Instant lump in throat, almost weeping.

-Kermit in a strange sort of smoking jacket while talking to Piggy alone in Paris makes him look surprisingly dapper and badass.

-The songs, new and original, were all great, especially "Life's a Happy Song", Amy Adams and Miss Piggy's intercut duet, hell even Starship worked. And I couldn't stop myself from singing along to the Muppet Show theme.

-The movie really gets you on its side early on with Walter, Adams and Segel's infectious enthusiasm. Segel in particular looks so damn happy to be there.

-Cooper's rap was indeed great, and his commitment to being such a nasty is incredible.

-I love how even Rashida Jones' stern executive was won over by the end. YOU CANNOT RESIST MUPPET JOLLITY.

-The Toy Story short was a perfect primer, and I want all those damn toys right now.

-Brave and Arrietty are going to rock ass.

Just want to say that I loved this as well. The nostaliga for me was off the charts, bringing back all kinds of memories since I haven't seen a muppet movie in quite some time. Add me to those who got a little choked up during "Rainbow Connection", as well as the finale when they walk out of theater to a horde of screaming fans.

The Jack Black celebrity cameo/host was a bit uderwhemlming, but ok. Would have loved to see Kevin Spacey in that role. For some reason I kept thinking he would have fit perfectly in that Telethon Celebrity host role.

I know this was Jason Segal's baby from beginning to end so I hope the film does well enough that Disney will bankrole a sequel.

Also, I literally could not stop laughing at Muppet!Segel and his hypnotizing chin line. And even though I've never watched The Big Bang Theory before, Jim Parsons as Human!Walter still made me laugh as well.

I liked it, but I can't bring myself to love it.  It just felt lazy to me,  If you're going to essentially remake The Muppet Movie, it might behoove you not to constantly remind your audience you're essentially remaking The Muppet Movie.  It's just another iteration of "Get the band back together and put on a show," and while there's a certain nostalgic pleasure in that, I wanted to see them do something different with it besides essentially recreating an episode of The Muppet Show.  They could have really had some fun with what the Muppets are currently doing in a world that seems to have no interest in them anymore, and I would have liked to have seen the film spend more time on this aspect.  But it feels like we get the gang back together too soon and the film sort of loses steam.  Putting the show together seems sort of rushed, the complications seem contrived, and the resolution seems a bit flat (the ending Devin mentioned would have fantastic).  And it seems like an entire plot thread was cut -- Richman mentions going to Plan B to stop the show, but the next time we see him he's seeing the announcement of Jack Black as the host, and he seems surprised by it.  What was Plan B?

I mean, it's fun while you're watching it, and yeah, I teared up hearing "Rainbow Connection," but it never crossed over that threshold into magical for me, so I find some of the rapturous reviews a little baffling.  Of course, my opinion may have something to do with having seen the transcendent Hugo an hour before.

Well, I'm certainly glad you at least liked it. That does remind me I still need to see Hugo, though.

And I disagree about the ending thing; for one thing, it's more than a little out of character for Statler and Waldorf. For another, Richman actually winning but the audience still loving the Muppets again anyway feels more in the subversive spirit to me.

Really?  The good will of the masses is subversive?

And you could easily have Statler and Waldorf give the dollar simply so they have the show continue to be a punching bag for them, that without the show to mock, their lives are empty.  They save the thing they hate because they need to hate something.

Well, I was talking more about the fact that they actually didn't get anywhere near their financial goal, but that it didn't matter.

And I suppose you're right about Statler and Waldorf, but who knows. It could've ended up playing as badly as, say, the original ending to Scott Pilgrim.

By the way, the Toy Story short was gold.  The little Buzz skating around singing his playtime song was just killing me.

Absolutely agreed. And I think the Brave trailer plays much better a second time around, and with an audience.

On a side note, the trailer progression went something like this-Brave, Secret World of Arrietty, some nice and inoffensive-looking movie about saving whales with Drew Barrymore, then ALVIN AND THE CHIPMUNKS THREE. It's like they wanted us to know true pain before knowing true joy.

Yes, the Brave trailer did sit a bit easier seeing it on a big screen.

I also kinda loved the trailer for the Aardman Pirates movie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

Yes, the Brave trailer did sit a bit easier seeing it on a big screen.

 

I also kinda loved the trailer for the Aardman Pirates movie.

Bastard! I get Chipmunks and you get Pirates? Clearly, I need to live where you do theatre-wise.

The Pirate cartoon looks sort of great. Weird. Brave still ain't doing it for me, but then, most of their movies look downright bad in trailer form. I'm sure it'll be just fine.

Devin's original ending doesn't sound all that different, and getting down to brass tacks, I prefer what they ended up with, because finding out they were millions off was really funny to me, especially Fozzie saying it actually made him feel better to be way off. 

Delightful movie, on the whole. I'm not really a big Muppet guy, but this was a very enjoyable time at the movies, and even if the narrative wasn't tidy, they hit the tone with a bullseye. Best of the year talk doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but it was a very well executed family film. I do wish Trejo had made the cut, and a more self-serious host than Jack Black would have killed. Someone like Leonardo DiCaprio or the like.

I took my 3 year olds to it (their first time at the movies) and they loved it. The songs had them dancing down the rows, putting on a show for the other viewers. They lost interest a couple of times, shortly, but I expected that. I loved it. When Walter joined in on "We Built This City" I questioned why that was thrown in there but then he started on the talent thing so that worked for me. I really loved the short before hand though. It seems like Toy Story anything just makes me happy.

My only real complaint? Using tired rock and pop cues (Bad 2 the Bone, seriously?). Not necessary (unless they would have went the cover route ala the Show), especially when they already have so much original and classic Muppet tunes. Small small small nitpick though. The Starship tune during the cleaning montage should have been a new Conchords song.

I actually thought We Built This City worked fine, and considering the wealth of riches offered by the new songs we *did* get, I'm not too put out by it.

 I liked this movie so much I even enjoyed the Starship tune, and I hate that song! I really did think I was going to cry because this movie made me so happy! I will cut Jack Black some slack in this movie. One of my favorite moments is when he yells that he is being held captive, then Walter yells, "Now you know how we feel!

  I got a kick out of gangster Fozzie.

By the way, wasn't that exact gangster Fozzie joke used on Family Guy a while back? In a joke about the new muppet voices?

I mean, it is a pretty good joke to steal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaz One of my favorite moments is when he yells that he is being held captive, then Walter yells, "Now you know how we feel!

 

Statler or Waldorf, ya mean? Or did you "Voltron" the 2 names together into one entity, which coincidentally is the name of the new character?

Best part about gangsta Fozzie was him flashing the W "westside" gang sign during his wokka wokka.
 

To be honest I forget which one is which. I haven't watched The Muppets much since I was a kid.