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2012-2013 NFL season - Page 7

post #301 of 3167
3/21/12 at 4:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farsight View Post

 In the Favre playoff game, their D was called for -one- penalty on Favre. Every other hit was legal. 



No, they just weren't called.

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post #302 of 3167
3/21/12 at 5:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farsight View Post

 

I've seen no evidence that the Saints' bounty system actually made their games more dangerous.



That is so beside the point.  I think you're a smart guy, and honestly I am surprised this is your reaction.  You can't have coaches paying players to deliberately injure people.  It doesn't matter if the games overall don't seem more violent.  It doesn't matter if players sometimes do it anyway.  All it takes is one guy who was motivated by the culture of bounties to go for a guy's knees when he otherwise wouldn't have to make it something the NFL should take seriously.  Just because there's violence in the game, and just because sometimes the line between clean violence and dirty play gets blurred, doesn't mean the NFL should throw its hands up in the air.  This was clearly over the line from an institutional perspective, at the very least.

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post #303 of 3167
3/21/12 at 7:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post



No, they just weren't called.



No fines were given after the fact, either.

 

If the officials considered the hits legal, and the league using replay also considered them legal, I'm going to call them legal.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey View Post



That is so beside the point.  I think you're a smart guy, and honestly I am surprised this is your reaction.  You can't have coaches paying players to deliberately injure people.  It doesn't matter if the games overall don't seem more violent.  It doesn't matter if players sometimes do it anyway.  All it takes is one guy who was motivated by the culture of bounties to go for a guy's knees when he otherwise wouldn't have to make it something the NFL should take seriously.  Just because there's violence in the game, and just because sometimes the line between clean violence and dirty play gets blurred, doesn't mean the NFL should throw its hands up in the air.  This was clearly over the line from an institutional perspective, at the very least.



I'm not saying it should be allowed. I'm saying the furor over it is overblown, and that no evidence has been provided by -anyone- that Saints players were deliberately trying to injure opponents or that these bounties had any effect on the games.

 

The NFL found out about the bounties, and their big reaction was, "Hey, knock it off." This batch of penalties is for lying and thumbing their noses at the NFL's warnings.

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post #304 of 3167
3/21/12 at 7:36pm

The NFL found out about the bounties, told the Saints to stop, the Saints said, "Oh, sure, we will," and didn't.  I mean, you might be dismissive of it, but the Saints are part of the NFL.  Them "thumbing their noses" at the league is a pretty big deal.

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post #305 of 3167
3/22/12 at 5:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post

The NFL found out about the bounties, told the Saints to stop, the Saints said, "Oh, sure, we will," and didn't.  I mean, you might be dismissive of it, but the Saints are part of the NFL.  Them "thumbing their noses" at the league is a pretty big deal.



I've been agreeing with you. smile.gif

 

The deceit is the major cause of the penalty. This isn't really about the bounties that had some people so up in arms. When originally caught, the Saints were not penalized. The Saints screwed themselves by not taking it seriously.

 

It's like if a cop pulls you over for speeding, gives you a warning, you promise to slow down, and then you rip by him at 130mph. That cop is unlikely to be as friendly the 2nd time.

 

I just remembered that the Super Bowl is in New Orleans. We'll see exactly how big Goodell's balls are, because he could spend a full week getting himself and every event he attends booed to the point of distraction / ruination. Should be a blast!

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post #306 of 3167
3/22/12 at 6:30am
Thread Starter 

Yeah, I think the part that's getting lost in some of the discussions is the fact that, it wasn't the bounties themselves, it was the fact that paying any incentives outside of contracts is illegal, plus the Saints were warned already and continued to do it.  Payton, the GM, etc., were all found to have been aware of it and did nothing, so that's why they're being punished as well.  There have been several teams implicated in the past of doing "bounties", but other than someone's slip of the tongue, no damning evidence was presented, so nothing was really done, other than a warning.

 

As Richard said, a cop pulled you over for speeding, gave you a warning, and then caught you again (and again) on the same stretch of road, doing the same thing.  So you're getting a ticket and a fine and possibly a suspended license.

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post #307 of 3167
3/22/12 at 7:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farsight View Post
I'm saying the furor over it is overblown, and that no evidence has been provided by -anyone- that Saints players were deliberately trying to injure opponents or that these bounties had any effect on the games.


Again, that doesn't really matter.  We may never know what kind of impact the bounty system had in a game that's already violent.  But we don't know that any of the injuries or late hits in Saint games weren't as a result of the bounty system either, and that's a problem.  And yeah, the punishment was much more severe because of not listening to Goodell.  The league is trying to change the culture, and they gave the Saints every opportunity to comply with the new program.  But you can't separate the act from that, and say that the punishment was primarily about not doing what the NFL said.  If it had been something that the league considers minor, and the Saints had repeatedly done it despite warnings, we wouldn't be seeing an unprecedented penalty for a head coach and a GM.  It's a combination of the two.

 

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post #308 of 3167
3/22/12 at 7:01am

This is the NFL's version of the NCAA's "lack of institutional control."  Except if this had been the NCAA, Peyton would have already moved on to another school by now and would be laughing right now as his old school got the death penalty.

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post #309 of 3167
3/22/12 at 7:20am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post

This is the NFL's version of the NCAA's "lack of institutional control."  Except if this had been the NCAA, Peyton would have already moved on to another school by now and would be laughing right now as his old school got the death penalty.


Yeah, but the NFL would never allow a guy like that to come to the league.

 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTqDTnLocylWh2-HhuQr50xGNUK817IGdPBNhEt_mUad7BzJSDW

 

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post #310 of 3167
3/22/12 at 8:39am

How ironic would it be if the Saints rally behind their Payton, have a great year, end up in the Superbowl-in NO- becoming the first team to ever host a SB, and WIN IT, then have the Lombardi trophy ceramony with Goddell. Jesus, talk about AWWWWWKWAAARD!!!

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post #311 of 3167
3/22/12 at 9:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by History Buff View Post

How ironic would it be if the Saints rally behind their Payton, have a great year, end up in the Superbowl-in NO- becoming the first team to ever host a SB, and WIN IT, then have the Lombardi trophy ceramony with Goddell. Jesus, talk about AWWWWWKWAAARD!!!



And then, whilst still on the podium, someone takes takes out Goddell at the knees, and then Payton runs on the field and throws a fist full of hundreds at the perpetrator.

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post #312 of 3167
3/22/12 at 9:37am

Leaving Jim Nantz completely speechless!

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post #313 of 3167
3/22/12 at 9:55am

Apparently Drew Stanton wants out of NY now, after the Tebow signing.

 

And the Bears signed Michael Bush.  I guess they're anticipating a holdout from Forte?   

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post #314 of 3167
3/22/12 at 10:03am

Or him getting hurt again.

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post #315 of 3167
3/22/12 at 10:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post

Or him getting hurt again.


That too.  And I guess the fact that he's downright awful at the goal line.  

 

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post #316 of 3167
3/22/12 at 10:23am
Thread Starter 

Is Marion Barber not still there?  Or did the "Immaculate Fumble" cement his status as gone at the end of the season?

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post #317 of 3167
3/22/12 at 11:22am

Oh...

 

 

Quote:
"There's only so many times a man that has done everything he's been asked to do can be disrespected!" read a post on Forte's Twitter account. "Guess the GOOD GUYS do finish last."

 

crap.

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post #318 of 3167
3/22/12 at 11:28am
Thread Starter 

And as Lee Corso say, "Not so fast my friend..."  Apparently the contract situation has held up the Tebow trade, and basically he can choose NY or Jax.

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post #319 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martianman View Post

And as Lee Corso say, "Not so fast my friend..."  Apparently the contract situation has held up the Tebow trade, and basically he can choose NY or Jax.



You sure you're not posting from yesterday?  I thought this had been resolved.

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post #320 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:03pm
Thread Starter 

Huh...that's weird.  it had today's date on it...but looks like it's been fixed now.  But Drew Stanton has said he wants out.

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post #321 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:11pm

Yeah, he's saying he was brought in with the assurance that the Jets wouldn't add another QB.  That team is going to be an absolute mess.

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post #322 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:13pm

Going to be?

 

How awesome would it be if Sanchez melts down, Tebow comes in, starts winning, and Rex does a complete 180 and becomes a super Christian religious zealot?

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post #323 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farsight View Post

No fines were given after the fact, either.

 

If the officials considered the hits legal, and the league using replay also considered them legal, I'm going to call them legal.


I'm not saying it should be allowed. I'm saying the furor over it is overblown, and that no evidence has been provided by -anyone- that Saints players were deliberately trying to injure opponents or that these bounties had any effect on the games.

 

 

My theory is the Saints WERE deliberately trying to injure and knock opponents out of games, it's just that they're a buncha pussies. 
 

 

 

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post #324 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raspberry Leper View Post



And then, whilst still on the podium, someone takes takes out Goddell at the knees, and then Payton runs on the field and throws a fist full of hundreds at the perpetrator.



The NFL should just shut down if that happens, because there would be no topping it. 

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post #325 of 3167
3/22/12 at 12:58pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey View Post

Going to be?

 

How awesome would it be if Sanchez melts down, Tebow comes in, starts winning, and Rex does a complete 180 and becomes a super Christian religious zealot?



"The only feet I worship at now are at the LORD'S!"

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post #326 of 3167
3/23/12 at 2:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey View Post

Going to be?

 

How awesome would it be if Sanchez melts down, Tebow comes in, starts winning, and Rex does a complete 180 and becomes a super Christian religious zealot?



I would probably laugh myself into a prolapse.

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post #327 of 3167
3/26/12 at 8:30am
Thread Starter 

William Gay to the Cardinals...if only Ike Taylor went with him.  Thank goodness, as now maybe the Steelers will take a serious look at some DBs in the draft/FA.

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post #328 of 3167
3/28/12 at 5:16am
Thread Starter 

So, the Big Tuna may flop into New Orleans for a season while Payton serves his time.  Is that a weird thing?  Could it be even weirder if New Orleans went to the Super Bowl?  Or will Parcells just be a fill-in CEO while the other coaches actually "run" the team.

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post #329 of 3167
3/28/12 at 6:59am

Saints just need a figurehead. Someone to do the press conferences, the interviews and wear a big headset on the sidelines while the intern relays in text messages from a burner phone Payton has watching the game on DirecTV.

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post #330 of 3167
3/28/12 at 8:41am
Thread Starter 

Yeah, I'm sure Payton will have "notes" that he sends in after every game.  No way in hell he has no contact with the team, whether direct or indirect.

 

New Orleans asst coach: "Whoa!  Hey Sean!  Fancy running into you here at Costco!  Ok, see you later!  Oh, Sean, you dropped this notebook...Sean?  Sean?"

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post #331 of 3167
4/3/12 at 12:56pm

So do Baltimore Ravens' fans know that they have the best QB in the NFL. At least, according to the QB himself. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/04/03/joe-flacco-thinks-hes-the-best-quarterback-in-football/

 

This is pretty interesting how Flacco continues to think he's in the same league as Brady, Manning, Rodgers, and Breese. I admire the guy for thinking that, even though he isn't in their league. Then again, Eli said he was an "elite QB" last summer and it kinda worked out for him.

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post #332 of 3167
4/3/12 at 1:33pm

Copycat league. It obviously worked for Eli, so Flacco is hoping it works for him.

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post #333 of 3167
4/5/12 at 8:23am

A recording of Gregg Williams before the playoff game with the 49ers...AFTER the NFL warned the Saints about the bounty issues.

 

Oh my.

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post #334 of 3167
4/5/12 at 10:03am

Hoo Boy.  Blackball.

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post #335 of 3167
4/5/12 at 10:03am

double post

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post #336 of 3167
4/5/12 at 10:13am

This probably doesn't bode well for Payton's appeal.  

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post #337 of 3167
4/5/12 at 10:15am


Quote:

Originally Posted by fuzzy dunlop View Post

This probably doesn't bode well for Payton's appeal.  


And isn't it interesting that this was released the day of the appeal?

 

After hearing that, every time I see Crabtree from now on, I will think of the phrase "fake-ass prima donna".

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post #338 of 3167
4/5/12 at 11:15am

ESPN is calling it "The Smoking Gun", I guess.  This is exactly the kind of thing we already knew he said, so why are people pretending it's shocking to actually hear it?  I just find that odd.  But I wouldn't be surprised in the least if this was released to sway public perception when Goodell denies any sort of leniency on the appeal.  Of course, I wonder what Payton hopes to accomplish with the appeal anyway.  Even if Goodell makes it less than a year, what is Payton going to do?  Come back in week 14?  If the Saints are in playoff position with whomever is running the team at that point, is switching back to Payton really going to be that much of a competitive advantage right before the post-season starts?

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post #339 of 3167
4/5/12 at 11:21am

And btw, Goodell is completely right.  The whole "this is how it's always been in the NFL"... even if that's true, who cares?  In fact, that makes it worse.  It's not like "how it's always been in the NFL" has been relatively peaceful, with guys rarely getting injured.  Guys get serious injuries all the time.  If this is how it's always been, then changing this practice will almost certainly reduce the number of injuries.  So, in either case, whether it's an extreme isolated incident, or just the norm coming to light, it needs to stop.  And this extreme punishment for the Saints send a clear message to that effect.  You can play NFL football without targeting specific players for injury.

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post #340 of 3167
4/5/12 at 2:16pm

I usually don't agree with Bill Simmons unless he's talking basketball, but I agree with him here about Goodell and the NFL's hypocrisy:

 

 

 

Quote:

The truth is, the NFL doesn't know what the hell it wants. It's the most successful sports league ever; the value of its franchises has never been higher; its television money haul has never been greater. Only there's an elephant in the room — and it's not the Williams tape, Bountygate or even the hundreds of concussion-related lawsuits from former players that are coming. If they change how football is played and turn it into a glorified version of the Pro Bowl, there's a chance people won't like the sport as much.

So what do you do? You pretend you care. You make an example of the Saints. You crack down on the language of your game. You overreact to cheap hits, and you fine players because sometimes they can't control their bodies at 18 miles an hour in the split second after an opponent ducks his head. You lean on media cronies and convince them to spin stories your way. You hope and pray nobody notices, and that CTE awareness never moves into the mainstream. But meanwhile, your players are bigger and faster than ever, and they're colliding at speeds at which human beings aren't meant to collide.

 

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7779341/when-do-draw-line-nfl-violence

 

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post #341 of 3167
4/5/12 at 2:23pm

It's a mistake to equate this to Goodell fining players for hits they couldn't control.  They're two completely separate issues that Simmons is pretending are the same so his point can sound more all encompassing.  Goodell's motivation is the same on both, but the issues are different.

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post #342 of 3167
4/5/12 at 7:18pm

I'd take issue with Simmons comment about bodies "colliding at speeds at which human beings aren't meant to collide" - I don't believe bodies are meant to collide AT ALL. 

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post #343 of 3167
4/5/12 at 7:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavez View Post

I'd take issue with Simmons comment about bodies "colliding at speeds at which human beings aren't meant to collide" - I don't believe bodies are meant to collide AT ALL. 



Rick Santorum?

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post #344 of 3167
4/6/12 at 11:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mangy View Post

A recording of Gregg Williams before the playoff game with the 49ers...AFTER the NFL warned the Saints about the bounty issues.

 

Oh my.


I won't lie: that shit pumped me up.  I've never so much as worn football pads, but that speech made me want to go knock a motherfucker out!

 

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post #345 of 3167
4/7/12 at 9:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarleyQuinn22 View Post


I won't lie: that shit pumped me up.  I've never so much as worn football pads, but that speech made me want to go knock a motherfucker out!

 



Hell yeah.  Just mix that speech together with the beat of 'Shut Em Down' by Public Enemy and I'll be ready to start headbutting brick walls into submission.

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post #346 of 3167
4/16/12 at 3:36pm

Jaguars sign Lee Evans to a one-year deal.

 

Hell, if he drops a TD pass in the end zone in the AFC Championship game for me next year, I'm all for that.

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post #347 of 3167
4/17/12 at 8:06am

Apropos of nothing, I'd just like to say that if the Browns don't get Trent Richardson, I will kick puppies. Analysts keep bringing up Justin Blackmon, but how many #1 receivers in the league are only 6' 1"?

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post #348 of 3167
4/17/12 at 8:10am

Redskins re-sign London Fletcher! Never thought I'd be so happy to lock down a 37-year-old linebacker.

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post #349 of 3167
4/17/12 at 8:24am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trav McGee View Post

Redskins re-sign London Fletcher! Never thought I'd be so happy to lock down a 37-year-old linebacker.


Yes!  I was starting to get really nervous - it makes business sense to let a guy like London go - but he's the beating heart of this defense.  We need him.  

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post #350 of 3167
4/17/12 at 10:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trav McGee View Post

Redskins re-sign London Fletcher! Never thought I'd be so happy to lock down a 37-year-old linebacker.



Will the Redskins ever learn?  You want to get younger. 

 

NFL schedule tonight

 

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