In Sanford, Florida, murder is not a crime as long as the victim is African American - Page 5

So he's a neighborhood watch captain in the same way that Joe the Plumber is a plumber?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

Anybody can get a bunch of residents together and designate themselves a neighborhood watch, and anyone can be chosen as the captain, but those who want to be official have to follow the national program's guidelines.

Hey, it's a grand American tradition.  It's called a posse, and it's makin' a comeback!  

Good on this guy.

I love the chair somehow knowing the chapter and verse of not being allowed to wear hats.

Right fucking ON.

He was technically correct.

The BEST KIND of correct.

The fact that people in the House completely & irrationally lost their shit pretty much proves Rush's point. People on the Right like to paint themselves as being "strong", but the way they cling to their guns & are so hostile to inert things like non-white people, gay people, assertive women, & any thought that challenges their small belief systems - I can only imagine just how truly terrified they must be of the world around them.

I feel sorry for them.

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Originally Posted by Art Decade 

 

I feel sorry for them.

I sure don't.

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Originally Posted by mcnooj82 

I sure don't.

 

Me neither.  They're willfully ignorant in my eyes.

Fuck these cowards. If there's one thing history has shown is that the huge majority of the "proper," "traditional," "conservative," "good family folk," are the ones who hide under their beds, the ones that wear hoods, the ones that shit themselves with fear, when the call for actual bravery is heard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

I think it's that neighborhood watch in this community isn't affiliated with the official Neighborhood Watch program.  Anybody can get a bunch of residents together and designate themselves a neighborhood watch, and anyone can be chosen as the captain, but those who want to be official have to follow the national program's guidelines.

...and whats the difference between that and an armed gang exactly?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Art Decade 

The fact that people in the House completely & irrationally lost their shit pretty much proves Rush's point. People on the Right like to paint themselves as being "strong", but the way they cling to their guns & are so hostile to inert things like non-white people, gay people, assertive women, & any thought that challenges their small belief systems - I can only imagine just how truly terrified they must be of the world around them.

 

I feel sorry for them.

Seriously, to live in fear your entire fucking life - what kind of an existence is that? No wonder so many of them seem simply morally and emotionally broken.

Uh oh, spaghetti-o's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ambler 

Uh oh, spaghetti-o's.

Hoo boy, this gonna get really fucking ugly...

I've always thought Spike Lee was an idiot. Now I think he should be jailed. For a long time.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/03/spike-lee-incorrectly-tweets-address-of-george-zimmerman/

To be fair, he could've been cleaned up at the scene, but it's hard to know either way.  The back of his head doesn't look like it had been repeatedly bashed into the pavement like it was reported though...no bandage either from the supposed EMTs at the scene.  of course team Zimmerman will find some other excuse to continue their orgy of hatred.

Seems ZImmerman's "friend" is full of shit too...

Christ you could make a 'Michael Mann's Insider' like movie out of this... with all the racism, police/political corruption, media circus, opportunistic characters trying to be on television...and I have a feeling its going to get even more insane once we get a grand jury hearing and autopsy/ballistics reports come out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malmordo 

I've always thought Spike Lee was an idiot. Now I think he should be jailed. For a long time.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/03/spike-lee-incorrectly-tweets-address-of-george-zimmerman/

I disagree with your opinion that Spike Lee has always been an idiot. That's pretty hyperbolic and, IMO, just plain wrong.

But in this particular instance, I agree. My blood is boiling. Spike needs to be reprimanded & charged with something for this. Even if he'd gotten the address right...hell, even if it had been the Dalai Lama himself who'd given out the address - it was wrong, stupid, illegal, & terribly dangerous.

A few more things that stand out in that video.  Zimmerman's attire does not appear to be scuffed, dirty or damaged from the alleged intense fight he had with Martin...and there is no blood on his shirt from the gunshot, meaning he was probably not underneath Martin when he shot him, putting a hole in his story about fearing for his life.  White skin also tends to bruise easily, and there is no bruising from the supposed broken nose he suffered at the hands of Martin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malmordo 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/03/spike-lee-incorrectly-tweets-address-of-george-zimmerman/

 

Holy shit!  How did I miss this?  Epic failure.  He's done some questionable things in the past but Jesus...at least have the smarts to twitter from an untraceable account.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malmordo 

I've always thought Spike Lee was an idiot. Now I think he should be jailed. For a long time.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/03/spike-lee-incorrectly-tweets-address-of-george-zimmerman/

 

Just saw this.  Way to make a situation even worse.  I hope nothing terrible comes of this for the poor couple.  The last thing they should have to worry about--that anyone should have to worry about--is some nutjob taking the law into his own hands because he thinks he's doing what the police can't.

Spike Lee needs to remove the address, apologize profusely, and then receive some kind of punishment for being such an idiot.

EDIT:  I see that several people are tweeting Spike Lee's personal address.  A dick move, to be sure.  Still, finding it hard to feel any sympathy when he brought it on himself.

Spike Lee gave the right exactly what they want. They can bitch about the wicked lefty media elite now.

Spike Lee must be one of the most naive motherfuckers walking this planet. Even tweeting the correct address would be a dumbass move.

Yeah Spike, you sure showed them!

Yeah, two wrongs totally make a right. How in FUCK can people lose their shit over Lee posting the address - a totally idiotic thing to do, by the way - then shrug when others do it to him? Come on.

Even if Zimmerman was cleaned up at the scene before that video, he looks absolutely spotless and unharmed. If he shot Trayvon whilst Trayvon was on top of him, wouldn't he have at least some blood on that shirt? Or from his broken nose? Or ANY CONTUSIONS ON HIS FACE WHATSOEVER?

I don't think anyone actually believes that bullshit story.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

Yeah, two wrongs totally make a right. How in FUCK can people lose their shit over Lee posting the address - a totally idiotic thing to do, by the way - then shrug when others do it to him? Come on.

 

Even if Zimmerman was cleaned up at the scene before that video, he looks absolutely spotless and unharmed. If he shot Trayvon whilst Trayvon was on top of him, wouldn't he have at least some blood on that shirt? Or from his broken nose? Or ANY CONTUSIONS ON HIS FACE WHATSOEVER?

I'm not saying it's right that people are doing it to him.  In fact, I even pointed out that it's a crappy thing to do.  No one deserves that.  But the fact remains, if he didn't want to open himself up to this madness, he should have kept his cool and not pulled such a childish stunt.
 

And if Trayvon Martin didn't want to get shot he shouldn't have been outside at 3am in a hoodie.

And motherfuck Fox News for their coverage of this story. Everything falling out of Joe Oliver's mouth gets a new headline, but a few sentences about the released surveillance tape are buried in a separate story about Zimmerman's father proclaiming his son's innocence.

The homicide detective on the scene sure didn't.  He wanted Zimm arrested and charged with manslaughter.  But Zimm having an ex judge for a father and all...  

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Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

And if Trayvon Martin didn't want to get shot he shouldn't have been outside at 3am in a hoodie.

I honestly don't even know how to react to that.  Are you really comparing the two?  That's insane.

A kid lost his life in the most senseless way possible, and Spike Lee used his death to advocate vigilantism.  In doing so he brought terror and pain down on two innocent people.  I'm not going to have sympathy for someone so thoughtless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kent 

I'm not saying it's right that people are doing it to him.  In fact, I even pointed out that it's a crappy thing to do.  No one deserves that.  But the fact remains, if he didn't want to open himself up to this madness, he should have kept his cool and not pulled such a childish stunt.

People seem to have this mental block on responsibility.  Causality is cancelled out by free will.  "If Spike hadn't started it..."  The people who tweeted Spike's address in revenge are the cause of it, not Spike.  What Spike did sucked, but they acted on their own.  

"If Trayvon hadn't been suspended/been out after dark/been wearing a hoodie...maybe he'd still be alive."  No, he'd still be alive if Zimm hadn't pulled the trigger.  America has to rank close to last in intelligence.  I'm not talking specifically about you, Kent.

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Originally Posted by Ambler 

People seem to have this mental block on responsibility.  Causality is cancelled out by free will.  "If Spike hadn't started it..."  The people who tweeted Spike's address in revenge are the cause of it, not Spike.  What Spike did sucked, but they acted on their own.  "If Trayvon hadn't been suspended/been out after dark/been wearing a hoodie...maybe he'd still be alive."  No, he'd still be alive if Zimm hadn't pulled the trigger.  America has to rank close to last in intelligence.  

 

They only did so because of what he did.  And as I said, it was a dick move.  Both sides are responsible.  Actions have consequences, and Spike getting his address blasted across Twitter is that consequence.  It doesn't make it right, or funny, or even justified, but that's what happened.  They wouldn't have tweeted his address if he had gotten Zimmerman's address right the first time.

And how are we comparing this to Trayvon?  That's cruel and disgusting.

Spike Lee isn't to blame for having his address plastered across the internet. Actions have consequences, but if those consequences are as bad or worse than the previous action then any kind of moral highground or justification vanishes.

And yes, they would have Tweeted his address  had he got Zimmerman's address right. Given the mental gymnastics and denials being made by those desperate to support Zimmerman, that you would suggest people wouldn't respond to Lee regardless kind of baffles me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

Spike Lee isn't to blame for having his address plastered across the internet. Actions have consequences, but if those consequences are as bad or worse than the previous action then any kind of moral highground or justification vanishes.

 

And yes, they would have Tweeted his address  had he got Zimmerman's address right. Given the mental gymnastics and denials being made by those desperate to support Zimmerman, that you would suggest people wouldn't respond to Lee regardless kind of baffles me.

This isn't about moral highground.  And as I said, what they did isn't justified.  But had Spike Lee stayed out of it we wouldn't be having this conversation.  It began with him.  It escalated with the several troglodytes who turned around and did the same thing to him, but it began with Spike Lee.

And I'm not sure they would have tweeted his address if he had gotten Zimmerman's right.  I don't think it would have gotten as much attention if he hadn't screwed up the lives of that couple.

The worst thing is that this is taking attention away from what happened to Trayvon.  Instead of rallying together, trying to see that justice gets done, many people are just taking potshots at one another over Lee's stupid attempt at revenge.  A kid was murdered by a stone cold racist, and here we are debating whether or not Lee's douchebagery is responsible for how things have taken a turn for the worse.  It's kind of sad.

Response to a Daily Mail article on Congressman Rush:

"If the Robert Byrd couldn't wear his hood then Rush can't wear his either."

And this had close to 200 thumbs up.

Wow.  That's....wow.

This is what's scaring me the most. The failure of the justic system is monstrous, but the sheer volume of ordinary people who think this kid had it coming - or worse, are just plain racist assholes - that this case is exposing...it's horribly, horribly depressing.

I think we as a nation have fooled ourselves for years into thinking that racism, injustice and inequality has been in a declining trajectory giving us a false sense of confidence that race relations are better than what they really are.  Now that's not to say that they haven't improved, becuase they have, but given that it has been almost 50 years since the civil rights movement and we are still brought down to the lowest level of name calling and spewing racial epithets towards others in response to a tragedy and a gross miscarraige of justice for a young man who lost his life lets me know that we have an extremely long way to go before we can truly call this "the land of the free".   

Zimmerman sure seems awfully calm for a guy who was supposedly in a life-or-death struggle earlier that evening.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

This is what's scaring me the most. The failure of the justic system is monstrous, but the sheer volume of ordinary people who think this kid had it coming - or worse, are just plain racist assholes - that this case is exposing...it's horribly, horribly depressing.

My uncle posted that fake picture comparison with the cleaned-up Zimmerman and the fake Trayvon Martin yesterday, talking about "media bias" all holier than thou. I pointed out it was fake, and today he had the nerve to say that he knew that it was fake, but that the "truth would be coming out soon" about "Zimmerman's broken nose" and all this nonsense. Yes, it's a giant media conspiracy to protect the innocence of one black teenager. Makes a lot of sense, given how few black criminals we've seen in the media over the years. And oh yeah, the pictures they used of Trayvon and Zimmerman really show a media bias, because god knows when a black man kills someone, the media always uses their High School Senior Photo while the picture of a victim is always one of them drunk and covered with rib sauce at Chili's. Give me a fucking break.

So naturally, I called him out on his bullshit, saying that it was beyond disingenuous to knowingly use a fake photograph to complain about media bias (especially when that fake picture first appeared on Michelle Malkin's loopy website...but god forbid you talk about conservative media bias). To continue to defend Zimmerman in the face of such monumental evidence against him (including that police video) is simply galling and underlines the problems with racism in this country. It's a bad enough tragedy that this kid was killed for seemingly no reason, but it's even WORSE that we can't come together as a country over this. That we use it yet again to divide us politically. It's just so ugly, and there's no reason to get political about it, other than out of blatant fear and racism! Are people really trying to deny that racism doesn't exist, or that it wasn't involved with this case? Guess what? That means you're a racist. And the harder you try to claim that this whole thing was legitimate, the worse you seem. This has gotten so ugly when it seems like it should be used as nothing but a tragedy we all come together behind. God forbid we learn from something awful like this. Just pick your sides, dig in and scream at those you hate that you're right. And I include that idiotic tweet from Spike Lee and the New Black Panthers in all this rant too. 

A lot of people seem physically incapable of taking a step back and saying "I might vote Republican, but on this we can all agree". Even if, EVEN IF, Zimmerman's story was true, you've got a man following and killing an unarmed teenager that he outweighs by close to 100lb because he feared for his life despite sustaining no visible injuries. Decent human beings, a decent society, would look at that and condemn it as reckless, cowardly behaviour.

Of course, the story isn't true and it's much uglier than even that scenario, which makes the divide amongst the nation even more horrifying. I can't fathom having family members acting like your uncle - I think I'd end up causing a serious rift with them.

My entire family is littered with people like that uncle. I don't speak to most of them and, on at least three occasions, told a family member that they need to fuck right off out of my sight for as long we're both still breathing. 

Some people are looking at that surveillance video (the ones who aren't trying to dismiss it as a fabrication) and trying to point to his injuries. "Look at the line at the back of his head! That could be a gash where his head was smashed into the pavement!" "Right there at the end, you can see his eye looks sort of bruised." "They probably took his clothes and put them into evidence before bringing him in." I'd wager none of these guys have seen or been in a street fight. And of course, it can't be Zimmerman's a crazy racist fuck. No, of course the guy had to have been defending himself from a violent delinquent who assaulted him unprovoked.

Let's say Trayvon was a thug.  Let's say he punched bus drivers, smoked pot, broken into lockers at school, ran with a gang, the whole nine yards.  That still wouldn't have given Zimmerman the right to be judge, jury and executioner.

We don't even kill the worst serial murderers on death row without a trial first.  Why should a kid who might have taken a swing at a guy not get the same consideration?

Oh sweet, so the police took him to his house to clean up, to a doctor to treat his injuries and then took him to the station to buy him some coffee and let him go?

To protect and to serve, indeed. Do the people coming up this bullshit actually buy what they're saying?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

A lot of people seem physically incapable of taking a step back and saying "I might vote Republican, but on this we can all agree". Even if, EVEN IF, Zimmerman's story was true, you've got a man following and killing an unarmed teenager that he outweighs by close to 100lb because he feared for his life despite sustaining no visible injuries. Decent human beings, a decent society, would look at that and condemn it as reckless, cowardly behaviour.

Exactly.  I honestly can't fathom why more wasn't done to put this guy behind bars.  It....frightens me.  That we could all be polarized on such an issue, that anyone would think of defending the actions of that drunken coward, is just so damn mind-boggling it makes me physically ill.  It's not about your politics or your world view, it's about a guy who looked out his window, saw an innocent kid walking down the street and thought that he should stop it because "his kind always gets away."

How is this not an open and shut case?  How can anyone stand in his corner after what he's done?

He shot a black kid. There's your answer.

I don't know how I missed this thread. I've been following the case from the get go, and anyone who is privy to my Facebook feed is probably sick of me posting links and photos about this case. I haven't been able to go through the whole thread to see what was posted, but this is a really good primer on the case. In particular, it talks about the history of Sanford Police bias against Black people, which lends credence to the theory that the police were covering for Zimmerman with a lack of arrest, by coaching witnesses to say that Zimmerman was the one calling for help, by not contacting Trayvon's parents for 3 days while his body laid in the police morgue even though they had his cell phone, etc. What really makes me angry about this case (aside from the death of an unarmed boy) is the travesty inflicted upon the entire Black community - and really the country at large - that justice has not been served. The sheer volume of blogs, newspaper articles, and media reports of Black men telling their own stories of "Walking While Black", of Black mothers reporting how they have to teach their kids that they can't do the same things as other kids because even innocent actions like standing on a street corner may be viewed as threatening or suspicious, etc. lays bare the very real trauma that racism has inflicted on our people. This is not an isolated incident. Zimmerman was not just some "crazy gun-toting vigilante" to be written off as an exception. Shit like this happens every day. And the fact that this man is still walking free over a month later is like a slap in the face that Black people don't matter. Even in 2012. I hope the U.S. Justice investigation finally puts Zimmerman behind bars. But my real hope is that the media hype around this case allows our nation to finally have a frank conversation about race and the ways in which racism plays out (hoodie = suspicious). ABC's "What Would You Do?" recently ran an episode highlighting the racial coding of certain acts by certain people and the results should not surprise you.

Also, I attended the Million Hoodie March in NYC last week. It was very inspiring to see the thousands of people who showed up in support for Trayvon, his parents, and justice at large. I was also amazed at how many people brought their children. Here are a few pics.

Panoramic of the crowd.

One love!

I having to work hard to remind myself that the most hateful, racist, rhetoric is coming from a loud minority, and is hopefully being encouraged by the faux-anonymity of the internet. 

Along the same vein, the bubble that people can create where they've cut themselves off from all different opinions, and that echo chamber, can heighten that rhetoric.

I guess what I'm trying to say is: I want to be encouraged that there aren't any pro-Zimmerman marches.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diva  But my real hope is that the media hype around this case allows our nation to finally have a frank conversation about race and the ways in which racism plays out (hoodie = suspicious). ABC's "What Would You Do?" recently ran an episode highlighting the racial coding of certain acts by certain people and the results should not surprise you.

Those are interesting, if not awesomely scientific.

I liked this one too

It's interesting not just for the prejudice, but the mode of address and people righteously gathering around.  As though there's a presumption in people of being able to confront and order around a (lone) black guy.