Heh. I will say that while it obviously won't *look* as nice as, say, Kenneth Branagh's version, I'm intrigued by how Whedon will adapt the play, and how his cast will tackle their respective roles.
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Heh. I will say that while it obviously won't *look* as nice as, say, Kenneth Branagh's version, I'm intrigued by how Whedon will adapt the play, and how his cast will tackle their respective roles.
All credit to RDJ's delivery, my wife and daughter cracked up, and they definitely do not know from LMD's. I had been as spoiler-free going in as possible, so that while I sort of suspected early on that the "Other" was Thanos, in the first post-credit scene, when the minion says that invading Earth would be "to court death," my delighted laughter was almost embarrassing.
Way late to the thread to contribute much: I was grinning ear to ear for the last 3/4 of the film, and I agree with (I think it was) Rain Dog that I'd rather a slow start/strong finish than the reverse.
The balancing act was really amazing, with so many quotable character moments and delightful visuals. Every time I think that one or another of the principals is the "real" star of the franchise, I think of something equally memorable from one of the others. I agree that Jackson felt like the weak point, but I'm never comfortable with pointing the finger of "phoning it in" (I don't pretend to have that much insight into someone else's mental processes); I do think he's playing the guy that Stark characterizes: the ultimate keeper of secrets, though I don't know I'd agree with all his acting choices in that. I did like his unapolagetic matter-of-factness when the WMD plan is revealed.
And I loved Black Widow: I don't know if this is something Whedon brought to the party (it feels like it would be), but the idea of her using her vulnerability as an espionage technique is much more interesting than just her (exemplary) ass-kicking; the loss of Emily Blunt is almost forgiven. I think too highly of Renner to want to see him spend the rest of his career juggling action movie franchises, but I'd definitely be up for a Black Widow-Hawkeye movie.
One of my brothers texted me after he saw it: "Cap + Iron Man = Woody + Buzz."
Such a nerdy question, I hate myself in advance, but here we go.
End of movie, Iron Man lies seemingly dead. Hulk roars at him, he pops up okeydokey. Did the Hulk's gamma radiation help re-power the ARC reactor? Was that part of why Stark was interested in Banner?
I started to pose that question to my wife, but since she hasn't seen the other movies and knows nothing about superheroes, it would have involved a long afternoon of charts, graphs, history books and the several issues of Marvel Age currently in my parents' attic.
I think it was just a joke: Hulk's roar is so powerful it can revive the almost-dead.
I think you're reading into it too much. Hulk's roar wakes him up - just a funny bit.

Again, Cap's character was fine. But he does just about as well as BW and Hawkeye against the Chitauri. More than that, I think I was hoping for some kind of big "hero moment" from Cap, like IM and Hulk got, seeing as he's ostensibly the leader. Him barking orders or taking out a couple of the foot soldiers didn't really qualify for that, in my eyes. Again, I still liked the movie a lot.
Rescuing all those people trapped in the bank didn't count?
I'm not sure, but it seemed that the group was just standing around and doing a whole lotta nothin', all prepared to mourn Tony's loss. Then Hulk does something goofy to wake him up (I thought he was going to give him a solid chest thump instead of the roar), and Stark gives his hilarious little victory speech.
I'll be seeing this again and will pay more attention to that scene.
As far as Stark's interest in Banner, it seemed it was more of a "this guy is REALLY smart and worthy of my respect" kinda thing. That and his ability to turn into a big green rage-monster.
Exhausted from trying to catch up on this thread!
I see this as the same kind of project as Jackson's LOTR; quibble wit the small stuff if you like but I can't see anybody doing any better right here, right now. It's the fully-conceptualized real deal. It's just too much fun.
What I liked best (and so did a lot of folks) was the Hulk. Whedon gets something that so many have failed to see - the Hulk isn't just Banner's anger, he's his complete Id. He's all of Banner's primal needs (including the noble ones) and he's also the man's swagger.
Echo. I said the same thing in the pre-release. Bring your big original stuff first.
I guess the'll bring Avengers II earlier than 2016.
Also, Morena Baccarin is a good choice no matter if she is a whedonite or not.
@Martianman I want chainmail and if they can improve the helmet bring it on.
As an unabashed Cap fan, I think the film did the character a great service wrt the rest of the team.
Coulson, the audience identification character, positively swoons over him (to use the dialogue).
He gets a one on one with Fury...the other characters don't.
He gets a GREAT reveal in Germany vs. Loki.
When Stark and Banner discuss and use technology to find out what SHIELD is up to, Steve has already sleuthed the old-fashioned way and has the answer.
He gets his licks in during the verbal altercation with Iron Man (I know guys with none of that worth ten of you).
He deals with the "Everything special about you came out of a bottle." Which is followed by:
Iron Man specifically calling him out as the leader after HULK appears.
He has the big hostage rescue scene, and he beats some ass quite well.
Yeah, he doesn't have the power of IM, Thor, or HULK, but he is still the heart of the team. They didn't say it overtly, but no doubt his argument with Cap fed his decision to sacrifice himself to nuke the Chitauri (I guess nuclear deterrents do work sometimes). I thought the film showed his role and ability very effectively. With regards to his own action, he has his own sequel to showcase that. How he relates to the team is what the Avengers showcased. And that was about his leadership and commitment.
Thanks for calling out that line. I was never able to hear it properly except for the "worth ten of you" part.
It's a good line, mcnooj. Considering the trailer only shows Stark's billionaire, genius, philanthropist line, I was happy there was a rejoinder.
To wit on my point...Cap's value in the team is about everything he was/is before "what came out of the bottle". Just as wimpy Steve Rogers in the alley getting decked in his own movie...he doesn't give up.
Why? Is there some rift he has with Fox TV?

And I loved Black Widow: I don't know if this is something Whedon brought to the party (it feels like it would be), but the idea of her using her vulnerability as an espionage technique is much more interesting than just her (exemplary) ass-kicking; the loss of Emily Blunt is almost forgiven. I think too highly of Renner to want to see him spend the rest of his career juggling action movie franchises, but I'd definitely be up for a Black Widow-Hawkeye movie.
One of my brothers texted me after he saw it: "Cap + Iron Man = Woody + Buzz."
THANK YOU. Just saw this yesterday. Every auditorium with The Avengers was FULL. That was four auditoriums, btw. Never have I seen this town's own big cineplex that busy. Astounding. Now, just wish these people would go out and buy some comics, dammit. But I'm digressing....
I thought Scarlet Johanssen nailed it. While everyone is cheering about the Hulk, I was roaring for BW. She surprised me! As a matter of fact, it was such a welcome sight to see not just her, but two other strong, sexay and smart female characters in this film; albeit all too briefly. I never thought I'd be so happy to see Gwyneth Paltrow, but when I saw Pepper, I smiled. Loved the casualness now between her and Stark. And "Phil". And although I referred to her as Agent Exposition, Ms. Smulders as Agent Hill had her fabulous moments to shine, too. That was the beauty of this movie: every single character had at least one moment...or two to really shine. Every single character had a reason to be there on screen.
And for geek-out-moments, there were aplenty. I've got my Avengers comic books bagged and boxed, but I'm taking them out as the boyfriend has never read an Avengers comic. I even have the Infinity Gauntlet mini series and he needs to read that now, evidently. But as for movie moments, they've probably been all mentioned already in this thread, eh? The moment I love is when Cap took over as defacto leader and they began behaving as a team. THAT right there, excited me the most.
There are two movies I'm seeing again this week: this one and Cabin in the Woods. Whedon, you magnificent man for exceeding expectations. What a fantastic movie experience that was. Haven't had a time like that since maybe, Raiders of the Lost Ark.
HAHA!
As did I, and for me she was the biggest/most pleasant surprise of the film (Ruffalo/Hulk coming in a close second). I don't think anyone expected much of her after the lackluster performance in IM2, but give Whedon credit for his ability to develop strong female characters, and Scarlett for proving that she can actually act when properly motivated.
Oh, I sort of forgot to mention: did it take the involvement of someone like Whedon to get people to realize that when you team up superheroes they MUST first throw down against each other?
What? Are you secretly aware of some movie experience they actually enjoyed more?
I'd give the Marvel Studios people enough credit to realize that. But I think Whedon had a uniquely keen sense of how best to do it. What the nature of their interpersonal frictions should be. Some of the pairings and fights are obvious, some of them less so. For example, pairing Stark and Banner FEELS obvious now. But it wasn't.

As did I, and for me she was the biggest/most pleasant surprise of the film (Ruffalo/Hulk coming in a close second). I don't think anyone expected much of her after the lackluster performance in IM2, but give Whedon credit for his ability to develop strong female characters, and Scarlett for proving that she can actually act when properly motivated.
Why I was so perplexed by IM2, I know the gal can act. I've seen it. But totally what you say, Whedon knows the strong female character through and through.

It's a good line, mcnooj. Considering the trailer only shows Stark's billionaire, genius, philanthropist line, I was happy there was a rejoinder.
To wit on my point...Cap's value in the team is about everything he was/is before "what came out of the bottle". Just as wimpy Steve Rogers in the alley getting decked in his own movie...he doesn't give up.
What's great about that moment is that if one had seen Captain America (the movie) before seeing The Avengers, you'd know that Stark's dig at Cap was total BS.
If one had skipped out on that movie, I'm sure it'd come through in the way that Evans plays the character... but still.
I thought the "heroes fighting each other" was pretty much a Marvel comic staple? Regardless, it worked liked gangbusters onscreen.
It IS an Avengers staple. I recall Wonder Man fights with Thor a few times in the comic. There's always some strife between Avengers - at least in the 70s era of books when the team grew to like 20-members. You're "Earth's Mightiest", so it's always a fight to find out who exactly is "mightiest" within.

What's great about that moment is that if one had seen Captain America (the movie) before seeing The Avengers, you'd know that Stark's dig at Cap was total BS.
If one had skipped out on that movie, I'm sure it'd come through in the way that Evans plays the character... but still.
I hadn't yet seen Cap's movie and I got it.
Neat seeing Stark, who's played as a child of the me-ist 80's, a super-powered Gordon Gekko, trying to take a stab at a living symbol of the Greatest Generation.
I like how all of the PUT ON THE SUIT tension goes away after the explosion.
*Cap helps Tony up*
Cap: Put on the suit!!!!
Tony: yeah!
Chris Spider, I would go with...Zooey Deschanel for Janet Van Dyne aka The Wasp! The Wasp is a very...goofy, and happy character, and I think Zooey would be a better fit. I do not think Marvel will wait til 2017 for Avengers 2. 2015 would be more likely! Unless they do not want an...Avengers Trilogy with Robert Downey Jr as Iron Man.
The one line I missed both times because of the laughter in the theater (and only knew about it because I heard other folks referring to it) was after Hulk used Loki much as a dog would use a chew toy, and then he walks off and says, "Puny god".
Other favorites that my friends said they missed hearing (both from Stark): "Make your move, Reindeer Games" to Loki and "Clinch up, Legolas" to Hawkeye.
I was the only one that cackled in the theater at "Point Break". That was a lonely moment.
I missed the "PUNY GOD" and Legolas lines. I was too busy giggling like a little girl at the former, and have no idea why I missed the latter.
Holy crap, I missed that one. When was that? I also missed the "clinch up, Legolas" line. And why a second viewing is mandatory.
Stark says it (Legolas line) as he's about to take Hawkeye up to the roof, so it sort of gets buried in with the mix of the repulsor sounds. (insert nerd alert graphic here)
Forgot about the "Point Break" comment (Stark says it to Thor back in the Helicarrier after their battle)--my wife and I laughed at that too. Also had to explain to her about Cap giving Fury the $10.
Jesus, how many tiny moments are we pulling out of this movie? I swear, I may go see it a 3rd time in IMAX.
On a second watch, I realized that Cap and Black Widow had their climactic moments swapped, and I wish they hadn't been. It should have been Cap on top of the Stark Tower shutting down the portal (note that he's still the guy who has to make the call to close it while Tony's inside) and Black Widow saving the hostages in the bank. In particular, the Widow probably would have used more stealth techniques to take out the Chitauri instead of going in with guns blazing, so it would have been more in line with her skill set, plus having to save a bunch of people would have gone a long way to striking the "red out of her ledger." Meanwhile, I thought Cap got shuffled off to the side a bit too much at the climax, and having him be the one with the staff would have made him feel a little more like he was in the thick of things. Plus, Cap's the ultra-agile one who could have flip-vaulted up onto the Chitauri hoverchariots; having Widow do it diminishes him a bit.
We are kindred spirits.
I think BW and Cap got it right. He is the shield. He protects. He protected BW as HULK punched the mecha-snake (that looked just like the Dragon Titan in Castlevania: Lords of Shadow) and it flipped over. BW shutting the portal is getting some red off of the ledger. Besides, as pointed out, Cap gives the order. Besides, his shield/getting blown onto the car was a great moment.
Can I just say that I never imagined the day when Legolas would be so ubiquitously known that his name would be a punchline in a major summer blockbuster?

I dunno. I think CHUD can harbor those kinds of opinions too. I think it's welcome when it happens once in a while. They can be fun.
Remember this moment now, makes me kinda misty-eyed:
Saw it yesterday afternoon, packed house, every moment played. SUCH a great, fun flick, an amazing A+ payoff to the run-up of B- to A- stand-alones. I'm one of those odd ducks who for some reason never got into superhero comics (although most of my friends did, and I hit them up for the arcane trivia and/or easter egg explanations), yet I'm a complete sucker for superhero movies. Maybe that's why I have zero superhero movie burnout? Cause if they can keep making them at this level of quality, or even just aspire to, I'll be in line every weekend.
Monster thread that's already dissected the best moments, payoffs, character beats, so I won't repeat them in another wave of earned gushing. One line I didn't see brought up, though, was for me the most haunting. Ruffalo's confession of a suicide attempt was simply breathtaking. "I couldn't see any end. I put a bullet in my mouth, and he spat it out." Pin drop, etc. That moment, and Ruffalo's delivery, said more about Banner's character and frustration than the past two Hulk movies managed (both of which I quite like), and was the true emotional set-up to the "I'm always angry" payoff.
Can't say enough about Johansson, and the favors Whedon did her. I think my favorite moment of hers was her first meeting with Banner, and when he fake-rages at her -- the abject, focused fear in her face as she stares down her gun barrel did as much to sell the threat of The Hulk as anything else before the actual hulk-out on the carrier. (As for the latter, Whedon was SO dead-on shooting Hulk like a horror movie monster, up until Thor tackles him. As great as the script was, Whedon makes so many great directorial decisions, you'd never guess this was his second feature, or that his first was a flop.)
Will definitely be seeing this again, to catch all the smaller things I missed, and I hate that it'll be a week before I can.

Can't say enough about Johansson, and the favors Whedon did her. I think my favorite moment of hers was her first meeting with Banner, and when he fake-rages at her -- the abject, focused fear in her face as she stares down her gun barrel did as much to sell the threat of The Hulk as anything else before the actual hulk-out on the carrier.
Truth.
Yeah, it is, but it wouldn't have been the first time that a studio misread the strengths of the material they had to work with, so kudos to Feige or Whedon or whoever.
As you say, gangbusters: after the Cap-Iron Man-Thor fight, I had nearly forgotten that we still had The Hulk to come, upping the ante further when he takes on Thor.
Another bit I appreciated for its absence: given how much of the film derives from The Ultimates (a series I seem to hate less than many fans), I was getting very nervous when Banner was standing near the edge of the helicarrier... the scene from the comic of him being pushed out of the helicopter to transform or die had to have been tempting someone at Marvel to find a way to work it into a movie where it didn't belong.
Indeed welcome and indeed fun. Interesting things can sometimes enter the larger discourse this way. Besides, there is really no actual point in talking about any of this shit to begin with, other than it is fun. And sometimes it is fun to completely pull something apart and look at all the pieces.
Plus with AVENGERS, I think it is safe to say now that the overwhelming majority consensus is that the film is GOOD. This isn't JOHN CARTER. The film can withstand some academic skewering.
Chewers weren't the only ones worried about SHIELD affinities http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/05/avengers-military/

As an unabashed Cap fan, I think the film did the character a great service wrt the rest of the team.
Coulson, the audience identification character, positively swoons over him (to use the dialogue).
He gets a one on one with Fury...the other characters don't.
He gets a GREAT reveal in Germany vs. Loki.
When Stark and Banner discuss and use technology to find out what SHIELD is up to, Steve has already sleuthed the old-fashioned way and has the answer.
He gets his licks in during the verbal altercation with Iron Man (I know guys with none of that worth ten of you).
He deals with the "Everything special about you came out of a bottle." Which is followed by:
Iron Man specifically calling him out as the leader after HULK appears.
He has the big hostage rescue scene, and he beats some ass quite well.
Yeah, he doesn't have the power of IM, Thor, or HULK, but he is still the heart of the team. They didn't say it overtly, but no doubt his argument with Cap fed his decision to sacrifice himself to nuke the Chitauri (I guess nuclear deterrents do work sometimes). I thought the film showed his role and ability very effectively. With regards to his own action, he has his own sequel to showcase that. How he relates to the team is what the Avengers showcased. And that was about his leadership and commitment.
I think you missed Thor pounding the shield and the forest going all Tunguska.
I saw it with my two boys and a friend and his son. He and I were the only two in a 60% filled theatre that laughed and we laughed pretty loud. Loud enough that the kids all asked us what was funny on the way to the car.