Obama Declares Support for Gay Marriage - Page 4

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reasor 


And that's not counting the most drastic change of all, the radical redefinition of marriage as a contract between equals. You can still see what marriage used to be in the symbolism of the traditional wedding ceremony, where the father of the bride escorts her into the ritual and the groom escorts her out. Just acknowledging the legal status of women as adults competent enough to sign a contract, vote in an election, and own property meant looking at what the Bible required of us on the one hand, looking at what common human decency required of us on the other, and collectively, as a society, telling the Bible to fuck straight off. Biblical marriage has been dead in America for generations, and thank God for that.

As they say, "Amen."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reasor 


And that's not counting the most drastic change of all, the radical redefinition of marriage as a contract between equals. You can still see what marriage used to be in the symbolism of the traditional wedding ceremony, where the father of the bride escorts her into the ritual and the groom escorts her out. Just acknowledging the legal status of women as adults competent enough to sign a contract, vote in an election, and own property meant looking at what the Bible required of us on the one hand, looking at what common human decency required of us on the other, and collectively, as a society, telling the Bible to fuck straight off. Biblical marriage has been dead in America for generations, and thank God for that.

But, but TEH GAY!!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draco Senior 

On the positive side, perhaps this will lower if not completely eliminate any instances of a right-wing moron saying "PRESIDENT OBAMA DOESN'T SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE EITHER!" when trying to make their position sound reasonable or mainstream.

 

 

 

 

When you dig deeper into the language, past the dishonest "evolution" talk that makes us sound like the "Joes and Janes" in a light campaign speech, one could argue that a lot of Obama's clarifications in that interview amount to pussyfooting (or political savvy, if you believe Obama has more spine).  Progressives are naturally going to be wary because the guy is not much of a progressive himself, and has disappointed on several fronts.  An awareness of not wanting to be pandered to or mildly supported is a good sense to have, and that's ultimately all we're expressing:  a sense that this might not lead into any more than a few calculated, inoffensive commitments and bones thrown.  None of us want to think that someone is on our side and take anything for granted, especially in just assuming that it will lead into action.

 

That's ultimately why I'm going to be the "Good for him, but we'll see where this goes" person.  It's nice to be acknowledged, but it's even worse to be acknowledged and then kind of ignored.

He is on your side!  You understand that many in this country are afraid of the gays right?  Enough that it matters even to someone running as a democrat, right?  After pushing the repeal of DADT, and telling the DOJ not to enforce DOMA, and now this, what more evidence do you need?! 

Honest question:  Do you think it's possible that Obama, morally, believes that gay marriage is wrong, and that he's announcing his support for purely cynical motives?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jacob Singer 

This thread has proven to me beyond a doubt why progressive Democrats aren't winning elections by landslides.

 

The book of American history is opening a new chapter right in front of us, and all we want to do is access the footnotes and the caveats.

Maybe that's because progressive Democrats aren't mindless drones who march in lockstep with whatever the people they elect get up to. Republican voters are always pleased because they vote based on whoever will be the most rotten bastard and they usually get what they want. But when someone runs on the slogan "Hope and Change" we kinda expect that person to live up to those words. What we don't want is some waffling asshole who tells us what we want to hear and then says sit down and STFU for most of his first term before throwing out some token progressive stance when it seems most politically convenient, specifically six months before another Presidential election, when he's looking to rally the base that he's shunned in order to appease Republicans who, in the best case scenario, want his ass voted out of office and most likely secretly want someone to put a bullet in his head.

The real problem isn't the voters but the people who say whatever they think will get them into office and then don't do what they campaigned on or drag their feet on those issues. We want progressive Democrats who fight just as viciously as Republicans who manage to ram through every piece of evil legislation they want. And we're not asking for our representatives to drag civil rights, women's rights, education and the entire country back into the dark ages like Republicans nor do we want to start endless wars, fuck over the sick, increase poverty, revoke child labor laws, starve the elderly, damage the environment and cripple scientific/medical research because of the uneducated and ignorant opinions of a bunch of bible thumping regressive inbred redneck fucksticks who are still fighting the civil war in their tiny little minds.

Progressive Democrats are on the right side of every one of these issues and there in NO downside to fighting against anything that Republicans support because they are soulless monsters.

Apart from alienating parts of the populace by being loudmouth pushy douchebags, thus helping those soulless monsters get back into power. That's a pretty big downside.

I just read the following statement from Obama re: Biden:

If anyone actually believes that, then maybe your heart and soul is a bit too pure for this game right here. Obama's statement is laughable.

Let's think about it: Biden comes out and supports gay marriage. The next day, Arne Duncan does the same, despite this supposedly being old Joe flying off the handle again. Obama comes out the following day in a pre-taped interview, the day after the debacle in NC no less, shutting down that conversation and winning the news cycle (and many more to come). The day after, he gets a hero's welcome in Los Angeles at Clooney's house and raises 15 million, a record. Babys are holding up signs and shit thanking him on behalf of his two moms. And what's happening at the same time? A story is leaked about Romney bullying a gay kid in high school and he spends the week on the defense, instead of trumpeting all those primary wins and Santorum's endorsement. 

And I don't mean to take away from the power of what Obama did. I'm not slighting him. It makes it all the sweeter. Spook's right, he is dismantling Romney. 

If there's one thing this thread taught me, and I'm speaking in general not to anyone here in particular, is that US progressives have been so browbeaten by the conservatives in the culture war they have become permanently hunched, not able to lift their eyes from their navel. Two steps ahead of you Obama laid down the Witch King's fucking big ass flail. This is the time to fucking fall in line, pick it up and start bludgeoning people with it.

You may have another subject nearer to your heart but it doesn't matter for now. Financial reform, the environment, education, women's rights. All are good and worthy but THIS is now the deciding battle in the war. If you crush them now you will break them for decades. Maybe for good.

I will, once again, give and expand upon my talk about activists for the benefit of the extremists here:

Activistists say they want this, and nothing else is acceptable ====>

.

.

Activists secretly would be happy with this ====>

.

.

Activists kind of expect this ====>

.

.

This is where we are ====>

.

.

This is what activists on the opposing side expect ====>

.

.

This is what they would be happy with ====>

.

.

This is what they say they absolutely want ====>

The reason they would be happy with less than complete fulfillment of their desires is because once you reestablish the status quo, you get to move the goal posts. You get that needle to move in your favor, you get to reset it and start again with an advantage.

The only exception to this model is when the opposition is advocating something infinitely evil (in a mathematical sense). In that case, any thing along the spectrum that is not the opposite of infinite evil is still evil. Think "slavery" here.

Republicans aren't soulless monsters. What they have done is tried to convince a large segment of their party that Democrats are soulless monsters and that everything they do must pro forma be opposed unconditionally. And some people actually believe them. The pros do not believe it. People that work on this and advocate a position for a living. They are happy just moving the needle.

The absolute last thing we need is for people on the Democratic side to believe the same about Republicans. Because it allows us to no longer appreciate the small step towards progress.

Wait.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTETP_mZx44&t=1m46s

Now read.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stelios 

If there's one thing this thread taught me, and I'm speaking in general not to anyone here in particular, is that US progressives have been so browbeaten by the conservatives in the culture war they have become permanently hunched, not able to lift their eyes from their navel. Two steps ahead of you Obama laid down the Witch King's fucking big ass flail. This is the time to fucking fall in line, pick it up and start bludgeoning people with it.

 

You may have another subject nearer to your heart but it doesn't matter for now. Financial reform, the environment, education, women's rights. All are good and worthy but THIS is now the deciding battle in the war. If you crush them now you will break them for decades. Maybe for good.

Regarding the Romney bully story, it's just indicative of larger problems with Mittens' public image. We hear something about Obama's past that paints him in a negative light, we then can turn to any of the dozens of introspective interviews/speeches he's given talking talking about his life and growth as a person, not to mention the memoirs that he's written which feature him examining his place in the world, the experiences which have informed his views, and his journey from callow teen to the man he is today.

When he hear that Romney assaulted a gay kid as a teenager, however, we get a wishy-washy apology and a claim that he doesn't even remember it. We have no self-portrait of the guy, of how he himself thinks and feels, of how he grew up, of how those years affected him and how they don't relate to his views now. Instead we've got an incident which, forty-plus years ago or not, feeds into the anti-gay position which he himself has been flirting with since he became the presumptive nominee. On its own the incident is really upsetting but decidedly historical in nature; without the candidate letting us see him warts and all, it becomes part of a larger tapestry, a picture of a man who would rather not talk about his uglier skeletons because they're likely still a part of his private self-image. Someone who had truly changed, who was truly sorry, would want to talk about it, would want to apologise fully and sincerely and wouldn't absurdly claim that he didn't even remember it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

Apart from alienating parts of the populace by being loudmouth pushy douchebags, thus helping those soulless monsters get back into power. That's a pretty big downside.

Care to pont out anything that I said about Republicans that wasn't true?

Did I say there was anything?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki Odinson 

 

Care to pont out anything that I said about Republicans that wasn't true?

That they are each of them inbred, bible-thumping regressive fucksticks who are still fighting the Civil War in their own tiny little minds, for starters.  You loudmouth, pushy douchebag.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeI 

I will, once again, give and expand upon my talk about activists for the benefit of the extremists here:

 

Activistists say they want this, and nothing else is acceptable ====>

.

.

Activists secretly would be happy with this ====>

.

.

Activists kind of expect this ====>

.

.

This is where we are ====>

.

.

This is what activists on the opposing side expect ====>

.

.

This is what they would be happy with ====>

.

.

This is what they say they absolutely want ====>

 

The reason they would be happy with less than complete fulfillment of their desires is because once you reestablish the status quo, you get to move the goal posts. You get that needle to move in your favor, you get to reset it and start again with an advantage.

 

The only exception to this model is when the opposition is advocating something infinitely evil (in a mathematical sense). In that case, any thing along the spectrum that is not the opposite of infinite evil is still evil. Think "slavery" here.

 

Republicans aren't soulless monsters. What they have done is tried to convince a large segment of their party that Democrats are soulless monsters and that everything they do must pro forma be opposed unconditionally. And some people actually believe them. The pros do not believe it. People that work on this and advocate a position for a living. They are happy just moving the needle.

 

The absolute last thing we need is for people on the Democratic side to believe the same about Republicans. Because it allows us to no longer appreciate the small step towards progress.

What fucking bullshit! Everything I said about Republicans is true. They will not be happy until we're back to an aristocratic feudal system and 99% of the population are living in Dickensian squalor. I'm not making this shit up. This is based on all the fucking outright evil shit these fuckers have done/are trying to do. What you said was the type of meek false equivalency simpering I always hear from Liberals who are too fucking spineless to call out these assholes. THEY ARE BULLIES and you don't beat bullies by being polite and fair. You do it by smashing their fucking teeth in.

What if Obama, on his first day, ordered an immediate withdrawal of all US troops from Iraq/Afghanistan, flushed out the Bushies in the DOJ and had Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice/Wolfowitz/Gonzales/Yoo etc... arrested for War Crimes/War Profiteering/Treason, appointed a special DOJ taskforce to investigate and try those on Wall Street who engineered the financial collapse, announced his support for gay marriage, reinstated the regulations that were removed which lead to the 08 crash, held everyone who fucked up with Katrina/New Orleans, pushed for a single payer healthcare, announced cuts in the military budget which were then going to be used for education, infrastructure and healthcare...etc....".

What exactly would be the downside? Republicans would say mean things about him? Wouldn't matter because you wouldn't be able to hear their greedy stupid whiney childish bullshit over the people who would be cheering in the fucking streets.

The USA wanted a champion in Obama. Someone who was going to push for progressive legislation that would repair and heal the country. What they got was a guy who plays good cop to the Republicans bad cop and says "oh, we can't do all of those things because we just don't have the votes" although that NEVER stopped Bushco and the Repukes from doing every despicable thing they had their cold black hearts set on.

I'm soo fucking tired of excuses. Talk is cheap and action speaks louder than words while everything I've suggested is based on good intentions and holding those who have committed injustices accountable.   

Total teeth-smasher.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwartz 

 

That they are each of them inbred, bible-thumping regressive fucksticks who are still fighting the Civil War in their own tiny little minds, for starters.  You loudmouth, pushy douchebag.

Oh, I'm soo sorry, you're absolutely right, not every Republican can be painted with that brush. I guess the ones who aren't "inbred, bible-thumping regressive fucksticks who are still fighting the Civil War in their own tiny little minds" are just greedy, stupid and mean spirited which is why they consistently vote against their own self-interests.

My bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stelios 

If there's one thing this thread taught me, and I'm speaking in general not to anyone here in particular, is that US progressives have been so browbeaten by the conservatives in the culture war they have become permanently hunched, not able to lift their eyes from their navel. Two steps ahead of you Obama laid down the Witch King's fucking big ass flail. This is the time to fucking fall in line, pick it up and start bludgeoning people with it.

This.

So very fucking this.

The whiny, lazy nonvoting block of the liberal party are what put America in this position in the first place.

Iraq war?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

Freedoms squelched?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

Economy in the toilet?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

Because those useless fucks couldn't get out there and spend 10 minutes putting checkmarks on a ballot, we are where we are today.

Obama needs to light all the fires under all the asses that he can.  Supporting gay marriage?  That's a big fucking fire under the asses of America.  Hopefully, the useless shitheel members of the liberally-minded voting population will decide that "oh hey, maybe I should do something this election".

Because like I said before: a high voter turnout hands Obama the election.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

 

Total teeth-smasher.
 

Yeah and holding hands, singing kumbaya and passing joints around really worked against the Bush Crime Syndicate. Didn't stop them from torturing/killing human beings or murdering them by the tens of thousands with wars of choice based on bullshit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

 

Total teeth-smasher.
 

Yeah and holding hands, singing kumbaya and passing joints around really worked against the Bush Crime Syndicate. Didn't stop them from torturing/killing human beings or murdering them by the tens of thousands with wars of choice based on bullshit.

Notorious pot smoker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

 

The worst thing about the apology is him saying he didn't know the kid was gay.  As if they bullying would have been just peachy had the guy been straight.

Of course it would have been. Don't you know of the general weakness in constitution and backbone of the gays? They get extra hurt when you're mean to them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

 

Every hysterical, hyperbolic fear about Obama would be made to seem true in one fell swoop?

And would he be morally wrong to do those things? Because that's the only real question here, not what a bunch of paranoid delusional assholes think or say because they say those things anyway.

You're either Creepy Thin Man, or you literally have no understanding whatsoever of human nature. Either way, put down the keyboard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

 

Counting down to this post being called "CHUD 101" in 3 ... 2 ...

I'm still waiting for the declaration that this is a 'liberal echo chamber'.  I know it's coming, but when...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki Odinson 

 

What if Obama, on his first day, ordered an immediate withdrawal of all US troops from Iraq/Afghanistan, flushed out the Bushies in the DOJ and had Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice/Wolfowitz/Gonzales/Yoo etc... arrested for War Crimes/War Profiteering/Treason, appointed a special DOJ taskforce to investigate and try those on Wall Street who engineered the financial collapse, announced his support for gay marriage, reinstated the regulations that were removed which lead to the 08 crash, held everyone who fucked up with Katrina/New Orleans, pushed for a single payer healthcare, announced cuts in the military budget which were then going to be used for education, infrastructure and healthcare...etc....".

 

I'm going to be polite here, because I want to believe the best of you, which would be that you're maybe on the fresher side of 19 and will calm down once you get a bit older and/or they iron out your meds dosage.  But in answer to your "what if?" question:

There have been tens of thousands more deaths in Iraq/Afghanistan due to the rush of factions looking to fill the power vacuum left by our sudden withdrawal.  Maybe a bit of Kurdish genocide in Iraq, probably a Taliban or Taliban-lite regime reestablishing itself in Afghanistan, making all of the effort and violence there over the last decade utterly pointless.

Bin Laden is still alive and plotting against the West, only with more resources and recruits at his disposal than ever.  Because he's a folk hero now, like Che Guevara, only bigger and more sucessful; the man who went toe-to-toe with both the biggest superpowers in living memory and turned them back.  

Single payer healthcare doesn't even reach the proposed bill stage, and his proposed budget cuts to the military budget are not even considered by a Congress stampeding to get away from the most unpopular president in American history.  He's the most unpopular president in American history because:

     a) All the centrists he courted in the 08 election by swearing over and over that he was a centrist who would make bipartisanship his guiding star hate him, not just because they disagree with his radical new policies, but because he made fools of them by openly lying to them to nab their votes

    b) The people who hated him anyway have seen all their worst fears about what would happen if we put a lying, conniving, radical (insert racial slur here) into the White House, and are even more incensed, leading to the worst racial violence we've seen in a lifetime

    c) There are 100,000+ military personnel returning home, bitter in defeat and angry at the president who wouldn't let them finish the job, and also they can't find jobs because

    d)  with no popular or political support, there was no auto bailout and no stimulus, and unemployment levels are beating those at the height of the Great Depression.

All of these angry, out of work people combine to make the Tea Party protests 5x larger and way more violent than what we actually experienced.  There are riots in most major American cities.

Meanwhile, Obama is being impeached for politicizing the DoJ and turning it into his own personal hit squad.  No one much cares if he actually broke the law because he has an 85% disapproval rating anyway.  None of the investigations against Bush Admin or banking industry figures ever make it to the indictment phase, but the nation's first black president is bounced out of office less than halfway through his first term, with no legislative accomplishments and carrying the distinction of ushering in a 2nd Great Depression.  

Also, Don't Ask Don't Tell is still on the books and gay marriage is more illegal than ever with all Obama has done to fire up the right-wing base and make the center suspicious of anything that vaguely wafts of progressivism.

Or, to put it in culturally relevant parlance, "Puny God".
 

That sure is some nice speculative fiction. Very nice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Shake 

This.

 

So very fucking this.

 

The whiny, lazy nonvoting block of the liberal party are what put America in this position in the first place.

 

Iraq war?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

Freedoms squelched?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

Economy in the toilet?  Blame the nonvoting liberal.

 

Because those useless fucks couldn't get out there and spend 10 minutes putting checkmarks on a ballot, we are where we are today.

 

Obama needs to light all the fires under all the asses that he can.  Supporting gay marriage?  That's a big fucking fire under the asses of America.  Hopefully, the useless shitheel members of the liberally-minded voting population will decide that "oh hey, maybe I should do something this election".

 

Because like I said before: a high voter turnout hands Obama the election.

Yes, because it's not the people who do the damage who are at fault. It's always the fault of those who feel complete apathy towards a political system because when they do support someone like Obama they're shunned the second he gets into office, as he plays pattycake with the people who destroyed the country and makes fucking bullshit excuses for not standing up to them.

Do you not understand why Liberal Progressives feel this apathy? It's because the two party system is a fucking joke with candidates acting as two sides of the same coin and people are expected to line up and eat a shit sandwich because if they don't vote for the lesser of two evils it's their fault when shit goes wrong as you claim. Nice fucking logic there. DERP!

In 2006, the Dems took the House and all we got was that cunt Pelosi telling us that "impeachment is off the table" when Bushco. had completely failed to prevent 9/11, which they could have based on the intel those motherfuckers had, and then used that to start a war based on fucking lies that resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of people before sanctioning the use of TORTURE on prisoners. That's not even mentioning the fact that Bushco. had put the judge of a fucking HORSE SHOW in charge of Fema and after Katrina went around spewing their talking point that "it could not have been prevented" when we know that's another fucking lie and they most likely didn't do shit because the hurricane was going to hit a predominately Democratic leaning area with a large population of African Americans. Or do you not remember the video that leaked of Bushco. being briefed about Katrina? Illegal wiretapping. The DOJ firings etc....

But NO time or expense can be spared when investigating where a President puts his cock according to the Republicans.

Then in 2008 EVERYONE got off their asses and voted, as you just bitched that they don't, giving the Dems all three branches of Government, including the first mix race President and they STILL gave us the same fucking excuses as to why they couldn't fix things or hold people responsible for their crimes. But that didn't stop the Republicans who had all three branches from 2000-2006 and were able to shut out the Dems and do every single thing they wanted.

In conclusion, the real problem with Liberals and Progressives isn't that they won't get off their asses, it's people like you who make excuses for the scum that are voted into office by people with good intuitions and then shown that their trust was misplaced by accidentally supporting a bunch of lying cocksuckers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

You're either Creepy Thin Man, or you literally have no understanding whatsoever of human nature. Either way, put down the keyboard.

And I think you're a morally ambivalent sociopath. Otherwise known as the average Republican/Conservative voter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki Odinson 

 

And I think you're a morally ambivalent sociopath. Otherwise known as the average Republican/Conservative voter.

So insightful and cool. Do me next!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Dickson 

 

You mean the same paranoid delusional assholes who broke the Democratic majority in 2010 on the mere suspicion Obama may have been planning to do those things?  Without a shred of evidence to support it?

 

I think Obama does more good as a two-term president than as a one-term martyr.

The 2010 election had NOTHING to do with what Republican voters thought Obama was going to do. It has everything to do with the fact that from 2008-2010, even with all three branches of Government, the Dems/Obama still made every excuse in the book as to why Iraq/Afghanistan needed to be dragged out, why there was little or no support for gay marriage, why they weren't holding anyone responsible for the economic crash, why Obama and the Dems didn't support single payer healthcare, why no one in Buscho. was held accountable for their crimes etc......2010 was the fault of Pelosi, that fucking worm Harry Reid and Obama ignoring what the base voted them into office for.

The moment I knew something was really wrong with Obama was literally the day of his inauguration and the fact that he picked that slimey fucking cocksucker Rick Warren to give the inauguration speech. I wonder what could have "evolved" Obama's opinion on gay marriage within three and a half years after picking a homophobic piece of shit snake oil salesman to give a speech at such a historic event? Perhaps the Presidential election six months from now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki Odinson 

 

And I think you're a morally ambivalent sociopath. Otherwise known as the average Republican/Conservative voter.

It's like you've reached into my chest and felt my very soul.

Can you imagine what would happen if Snaieke popped into this thread? Poor old Loki'd probably pull a Liz Sherman.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki Odinson 

 

And I think you're a morally ambivalent sociopath. Otherwise known as the average Republican/Conservative voter.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Take that, Merriweather.  And you've always taken such pride in being one of the stalwart, morally upright sociopaths!

More fun!

What?

Wait a minute Loki. So, the average guy in the Midwest, maybe he owns a hardware store, goes to church, maybe a bit racist because he's from a tiny white town, tends to vote Republican because he doesn't like paying taxes, this guy isn't just indicative of a slightly spoiled and dated society he's actually A COMPLETE MONSTER? Him and eveyone like him? And we must go to apocalyptic war with them? That'll be good for everyone.

Apologies for dragging out a pedantic old trope, but the root of "progressive" is "progress," not "perfect." And make no mistake, Obama's statement was a step OF progress, not TOWARD progress, and deserves to be celebrated as such no matter what its underlying political intent.

Yeah, all the hemming and hawing about what Obama is going to DO about it is missing the point, imo.  The president doesn't legislate things like marriage rights.  What he did was the most effective thing the executive can do on a social issue like this, adjust the Overton Window.  There is now precedent for a sitting president to openly support gay marriage.  Assuming this doesn't completely blow up in his face and cost him the election, it will no longer be the default position for any candidate seeking higher office to be for civil unions but not marriage.  He basically just drew the GOP candidate into saying he's okay with gay adoption!  That's HUGE.  

Homophobia is not a rational position, and it survives mostly because it goes unchallenged.  This assumption has now been challenged, and now politicians are going to have to take sides on it.  He might not have repealed NC's marriage amendment, but he did just blow up the safe middle ground most politicians (craven, impressionable beasts that they are) have been happy to hunker down in for the last 10-20 years.

At this point, I'm waiting for the inevitable "GIANT DOUCHE VS TURD SANDWICH LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL SOUTH PARK ROOLZ" comment from Loki.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwartz 

Yeah, all the hemming and hawing about what Obama is going to DO about it is missing the point, imo.  The president doesn't legislate things like marriage rights.  What he did, and what the most effective thing the executive can do on a social issue like this, is adjust the Overton Window.  There is now precedent for a sitting president to openly support gay marriage.  Assuming this doesn't completely blow up in his face and cost him the election, it will no longer be the default position for any candidate seeking higher office to be for civil unions but not marriage.  He basically just drew the GOP candidate into saying he's okay with gay adoption!  That's HUGE. 

It is a pretty kickass 'line in the sand' moment.  Let's hope that it forces other politicians to make similar stands.

Nothing better than using their own words against them...and to lighten the mood a bit.

Barack Obama's Gay Blasphemy

Lord of the Rings - The Right Side of History

Up front: I support gay marriage. Anyone should be able to marry whoever they want.

That said, i think this whole thing is being intentionally used to polarize the left and the right and distract the populace from the more pressing and important issues of the economy, education, the environment and foreign policy. Gay rights is a human rights issue and is progressive and important, but ultimately what it comes down to right now in practical terms is gays not being recognized by law as couples and not getting the prerequisite tax breaks in certain states. It sucks, but it's minor in the grand scheme of things we as a country need to deal with right now. But it's being blown up into a distracting, hot-button issue by the media. I find it troubling is all.

Anyway, my two cents. Good for Obama for coming out in support. Carry on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Shake 

At this point, I'm waiting for the inevitable "GIANT DOUCHE VS TURD SANDWICH LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL SOUTH PARK ROOLZ" comment from Loki.

Off topic, but thanks for reminding me of when I stopped caring even a little bit about what South Park had to say.

Funny how all the folks who argue that gay marriage isn't an important enough issue to politicize aren't, you know, gay. It's very easy to say "this isn't that big of a deal" when it doesn't apply to you at all.