THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN post release discussion - Page 19

What are the other key markets it's yet to open in?
 

Not sure.

Hint: there are none.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

Hint: there are none.
 

O'kay...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Merriweather 

 

No it hasn't. There's China, and it hasn't even got a release date scheduled yet and may never get one. That's it. Why are you *so* invested in this film?

LOL

 What is EXORCIST SYNCHRONIZED?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaz 

 What is EXORCIST SYNCHRONIZED?

Oh we have such sights to show you.

I finally got around to seeing this.  Shame on me.  As a massive Spiderman fan, there is no excuse.  I had left all expectations at the door, and I enjoyed the hell out of it.  To echo some others on here, it has some problems, but I enjoyed it in spite of them. 

A movie this high profile shouldn't have such glaring issues, but I also think they are being blown a bit out of proportion.  If this weren't such a "big" movie, they might be shrugged off to make way discussing what works.  And for me, that's the thing - the stuff that works.  The things that work well, work so absolutely fantastically, I didn't care about the rest that much.

It's been said, and I will say it myself: Andrew Garfield is downright inspired casting for me.  He's a got a great voice, great build and perfect demeanor.  Tobey Maguire never really bugged me.  Garfield retroactively lessens my impressions of Maguire now.  Bummer, but eh it is what it is.  Spiderman has never looked or moved better, and his attitude and quips were fairly spot on.  These three things alone earned a ton of goodwill from me.  This may be blasphemy but I was grinning more at these things that anything in the Avengers.

The rest never fell below mediocre to me, so ultimately this movie was above average to me.  Better than 1 and 3, but not quite 2.

Cameron Crowe interviews Emma Stone.

http://www.interviewmagazine.com/film/emma-stone#/page6

They really ruined that photoshoot with that ridiculous post-processing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fafhrd 

They really ruined that photoshoot with that ridiculous post-processing, XANADU-esque makeup, and laughable wardrobe.

Fixed.

Emma's a beauty. It's amazing how hard they worked to conceal that.

Wasn't sure where else to put this, but if the reboot team ever goes with Osborn and eventually the Green Goblin in the future...

Man, this would have been terrific.  The expressiveness with the eyes and mouth...just really, really great work.

This was uploaded back in early August, but I hadn't seen it until now.

What, the, fuck.  What possible reason could they have for not using that?  It works!  It looks great and it's done.  What was the excuse that made a plastic mask a better fit?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freeman 

What was the excuse that made a plastic mask a better fit?!

"Kids still like Power Rangers. Let's go with the other one."

Even more insane when you have a face like Willem DaFoe's in the role.

Seriously, that could have been INCREDIBLE! I mean it obviously wasn't complete, but I can't imagine what could have made them discard all of that work for a silly mask.

That was when the script had Norman physically changing into the goblin, as a kind of Jekyll and Hyde kind of villain. Once that angle was dropped something that elaborate wouldn't make sense, so we got the suit and helmet.

I dunno how you start with a guy who can look like this naturally...

...and then cover him up with a fucking helmet.

Spray him green and you're done.

He injects himself with an untested-on-humans formula.  We've already bought a radiated spider giving Peter spider powers, we'd go with an unstable formula transforming Osborn into some kind of monster.

If I can do this in five minutes in Photoshop.....

Then they could have done a whole lot better with professional SFX make up artists. (And they did, from that visual test.)

Using that helmet really is inexcusable.

Wow, that's such an unsettling effect. Dafoe would've sold the crap outta that. When you have something that good, opting out for something that has a more amusing effect is a sad choice. 

Deleted scenes are up.

Think they improve the film?

No.  The only thing those scenes add to the movie is that we know how the brown guy officially leaves the movie, and we know that they`re doubling down on the Ultimate Universe concept that Pete`s Dad was a scientist who did stuff to him.  Shades of the Lee Hulk in there.

So it turns out they didn't so much delete Spider-Man's 'new' origin as never have one to begin with. Fuck this movie. 

Well, you never know.  That might not be all of them.  If studios put everything out all at once, they couldn't justify trying to get us to buy version after version every few years in the form alternate cuts, director's cuts, expanded editions.  

That's actually my pet theory as to why the material was cut from the film in the first place.  As in: "Why tell a single self-contained story all at once, when you can drop specific details and drag them out over three films instead of just one?"  Films this year such as THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN and PROMETHEUS seem to have been intentionally cut to leave out information in order to leave questions hanging, specifically to be answered in sequels.  I'm seeing a lot of minimal-effort writing in blockbusters these days.  Plots that make no human approximation of common sense or even emotional reality, dialogue that doesn't ring true...  As much as I might have enjoyed some elements of TASM, it did suffer from this dramatically.

It used to be that film series told each self-contained story one at a time with beginnings, middles and ends.  Now, everything has to be a trilogy.  But why?  Are the stories that these movies are telling so dense and intricate that they have to be spread out?  Were there not entire sequences in each film that couldn't have been tightened up and made sharper?

Maybe I'm a conspiracy theorist when it comes to what's wrong with current cinema (mostly the writing), but two things keep coming to mind when I see modern film "studio product."  That is, the line attributed to Lenin about seeing a problem and asking yourself "who stands to gain?" and the Woody Allen quote  that "any story (film) that takes more than 90 minutes to tell, probably doesn't need to be told."  (paraphrased)

That, or I'm a grumpy old man.

The scenes aren't bad. The one in the sewer at least plasters up some holes and gives Rhys Ifans one good scene. 

Just watched the blu ray - my second time seeing the film. It got overshadowed this summer by Avengers and Batman, but I really like it.

It’s not flawless (what is) but I really think it might be my favorite Spider-Man film. I know I know - S-M 2 is great great great. I love the first two Raimi films (even 3 has scenes I like) and those are much closer in tone to the original Lee/Ditko comics.

But I really like the modern touches in this one. More than that, I love the cast - Garfield and Stone are so so good, and I love this version of Uncle Ben and Aunt May. The score is great, and I love all the Spidey / Lizard fights.

The costume is great - Garfield’s lanky body is perfectly suited to Spidey. I like the way he moves and poses himself. He comes off like a jerk in the carjacker scene, and the last line about promises is really out of character, but otherwise it’s a great portrait of Peter Parker.

Anyway I thought it was a great start. I know many are tired of origin stories, especially of heroes we already know, but I don’t know - I can appreciate another take on a story I like. I like origin stories - the discovery. I didn’t mind the speedy reboot - as someone who grew up reading superhero comics, I just looked at it as a new creative team taking over a title. I’m really looking forward to where they go next.

It didn't hold up as well on a second viewing but I still enjoy many aspects better than I Raimi's (see: less cheese; no Dunst; no Toby Weep Chin; no lines that come close to "Gobby"; isn't Cryder-Man"). I still like the Lizard's Goomba design but wish he didn't talk. Garfield sounds more natural using his witty banter and his body shape and physical movements capture what I want in Spider-Man. And Emma's legs in knee-highs are a hate crime to my groin.

Oh, my this post. Toby Weep Chin? Cryder-Man? Come on, dude.

Who needs superheroes with emotions, when we've got mechanical webshooters and "the best promises are the ones you can't keep" douchechills?

I think the organic vs mechanical webshooters debate is silly - makes little difference to me. I really like how Spidey used his webbing in this one. The sewer web as a way of finding Lizard was neat - it's what real spiders do. Web as wide as you can and wait for vibrations. I thought that was clever.

The breaking promises line at the end was a very un-Peter Parker like thing to say, but he's so good up to that point. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by grubstreeter 

I think the organic vs mechanical webshooters debate is silly - makes little difference to me. I really like how Spidey used his webbing in this one. The sewer web as a way of finding Lizard was neat - it's what real spiders do. Web as wide as you can and wait for vibrations. I thought that was clever.

 

The breaking promises line at the end was a very un-Peter Parker like thing to say, but he's so good up to that point. 

I like that instead of really making it, he bought it from Oscorp. They make thin string that is super strong and a teenager can just afford it. Honestly the organic shooters actually made more sense, that he would use something that was already there as his weapon. 

And yeah "the best promises are the ones you break" line seem incredibly shitty. Why not just cut Leary's promise out? Why try and follow, and then immediately throw out the same type of ending Raimi's Spider-man had?

I have no problem with the "promises you can't keep" section at the end of this movie. He's a teen and he's acting on hormones rather than using his head. Anyone who knows how Gwen and Peter's story ends, already knows that he'll come to regret this decision.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSaxon 

I have no problem with the "promises you can't keep" section at the end of this movie. He's a teen and he's acting on hormones rather than using his head. 

Then Uncle Ben died for nothing. The back bending to try and justify such a shitty quip is starting to make you guys look like pretzels.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSaxon 

I have no problem with the "promises you can't keep" section at the end of this movie. He's a teen and he's acting on hormones rather than using his head. Anyone who knows how Gwen and Peter's story ends, already knows that he'll come to regret this decision.

So then why is he Spiderman?

The entire point of his origin story is that he learns "with great power comes great responsibility." Doesn't matter how you go about the story---that's the lesson he has to learn.  It just shows that Uncle Ben's death hasn't taught him a goddamned thing and he's just as selfish as he was when he's starting out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSaxon 

I have no problem with the "promises you can't keep" section at the end of this movie. He's a teen and he's acting on hormones rather than using his head. Anyone who knows how Gwen and Peter's story ends, already knows that he'll come to regret this decision.

No for the record I have eyes and believe me im sure I would be guilty of breaking the promise too. However to have him so EASILY go back on it and then do it with a smarmy quip seems so........eww. Like he has zero respect for a guy who just died trying to help him and save the city. A better way would be to have them apart at the end and then through the course of the second film they are drawn back together because he feels like she does need him. That he feels like her need for him is greater than his promise OR at least have him struggle with it a bit, trying to justify it. That way if they do the comic book ending it will be even more bitter. Look it's a movie and obviously they are going to reconnect at some point because the audience demands that. However there is a way to do that and that shitty quip was NOT it.

Selfish? I don't know. Maybe he just genuinely loves Gwen and can't find it in his heart to give her up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by felix 

Selfish? I don't know. Maybe he just genuinely loves Gwen and can't find it in his heart to give her up.

The fucking show him struggle with that rather than "ha defying your father's wish!".

If he wasn't selfish and truly loved her then he'd honor the promise he gave a dying man (her FATHER) and honor the memory of his dead father figure.

Yeah, but he wants to do her. 

I mean, that's the whole point of the end of Raimi's Spider-Man. He loves MJ with all his heart, but knows he has a greater purpose, and loves her so much that he'd purposefully distance himself than risk her being hurt.

But who needs that? Tobey looks funny when he cries, Dunst has a snaggletooth and Spidey doesn't make enough jokes! Aesthetics are everything, emotions are dumb!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waaaaaaaalt 

The fucking show him struggle with that rather than "ha defying your father's wish!".

He does do a bit of soul searching during the funeral scene and his confession to Aunt May.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waaaaaaaalt 

No for the record I have eyes and believe me im sure I would be guilty of breaking the promise too. However to have him so EASILY go back on it and then do it with a smarmy quip seems so........eww. Like he has zero respect for a guy who just died trying to help him and save the city. A better way would be to have them apart at the end and then through the course of the second film they are drawn back together because he feels like she does need him. That he feels like her need for him is greater than his promise OR at least have him struggle with it a bit, trying to justify it. That way if they do the comic book ending it will be even more bitter. Look it's a movie and obviously they are going to reconnect at some point because the audience demands that. However there is a way to do that and that shitty quip was NOT it.

I can't actually argue with this. You're right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Elvis 

Oh, my this post. Toby Weep Chin? Cryder-Man? Come on, dude.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Clark 

Who needs superheroes with emotions, when we've got mechanical webshooters and "the best promises are the ones you can't keep" douchechills?

Last I checked this new one had plenty of emoting throughout, so there's no need to try and paint it as me not wanting feelings. Is this is the part where I throw out blind accusations about Raimi loyalty in order to equally disrespect your stance? I'd rather not. There's a way to do things and Toby/Dunst/Raimi never were able to in a convincing way, as far as I'm concerned (they had their moments, though).

I'm not sorry that I still had a better time with this, despite having some strong problems, than most of you do with Spider-Man 2. Get over it. It'll be okay.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSaxon 

 

I can't actually argue with this. You're right.

Holy shit that never happens on the internet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by felix 

 

He does do a bit of soul searching during the funeral scene and his confession to Aunt May.

Oh well as long as he did a bit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bradito 

I think what bothers me the most about "The Amazing Spider-Man" is the backlash it created around the Raimi films. It's as if some people can only like one movie at a time.

I think this is a problem with film viewers in general. I was watching Burton's Batman films one day and someone walked in and was perplexed that I was watching "the stupid old ones." I can't comprehend that thinking. For the love of all that is good, these characters are decades and decades old! We can't have multiple adaptations? I sure as hell love about thirty different variations of Shakespeare, I think I can handle a dude in a suit getting done more than once.

Speaking of Raimi, I hate the backlash around the Evil Dead "remake" already. But I don't want to get off topic. So yeah, your initial post gets at one of my biggest problems with the modern viewing public.

My biggest problem with the "promises you can't keep" line is that Gwen isn't part of this decision at all - she's like an inanimate object for the last part of the movie.  "My dad made you promise?  Oh, ok.  You want to ignore my father's dying wish?  Oh, ok.  Whatever's good with you.  I'll just let the men in my life make all the decisions for me."  I mean, at least have her give an opinion, for crying out loud.

This whole debate is stupid since there's obviously only one DEFINITIVE live-action Spider-Man:

albeit with a close runner-up: