THE DARK KNIGHT RISES Post-release thread..... - Page 25

I'm normally, the same but after the first flashback to the kid's escape, I turned to my friend and said the kid looked like Tate. It seemed really obvious to me, and I didn't get close to noticing eye colour. My conclusion was wrong though. I assumed the kid was Bane and Tate was his sister.

Speaking of the kid's escape, I realised on second viewing that Nolan told us expressly that it couldn't have been Bane before the conversation between Bruce and the doctor in the Pit. Bane says as much during the first fight - something like "I didn't see the daylight until I was an adult" or something. Also, the doctor talks about performing surgery on Bane after the prisoners beat the shit out of him, and yet when the kid climbs out there's not a mark on her face and no mask.

Lastly, the hulking bodyguard in the first few flashbacks are pretty obviously him in hindsight. If my memory is correct, it's amusing how Nolan lays it all out in plain sight.

ETA to cancel some of the unintended self-importance of my first remark.

 

Yeah, I don't know why I didn't see it. Nolan's good at that kind of stuff. I at first thought the hulking bodyguard was going to turn out to be the older prisoner who was lying in the cell next to Bruce.

 

I thought that on first viewing too, then on rewatch I noticed Batman does land a lot of punches to the face in the first fight as well. I don't know why it works better in the second fight though.

 

"Are you watching closely?"

 

Oh, there were a few nods to it, and a better action director might have made it more clear, but as it was, that wasn't conveyed in a satisfying way.  There was no sense of triumph to it.  The whole thing felt anti-climactic.  Especially with how they just sort of meandered through the crowd to each other.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, Rich.

 

Sebastian: He actually BREAKS the mask in the second fight. That's what helps, I think, and Bane is kicking his ass in the first fight anyway.

 

Is that from The Prestige?

Yep. Nolan does love his sleight-of-hand filmmaking. I thought the shots of Batman in the Bat as he flew out on the water were that too; no way he would've been able to survive if he was still in there that long.

 

As Chris confirmed, yes. Very first line of the film.

 

Yeah, we're pretty much at the "circling the wagons" point of the discussion anyway.  Those who like it like it, those who don't don't, and nobody's mind's being changed.

I wish we knew more about the mask. Was startled that Talia put it back together so easily.

 

How was Bruce's hand not swollen and pained as hell?

 

From what I recall, the mask itself wasn't broken. Batman was able, through aimed punches, to dislodge/disconnect a few of the hoses/tubes. Talia reconnected them.

 

Bruce is wearing protective gloves with reinforced knuckles. Stills of the Batsuit clearly show this. They're a hybrid, in looks at least, of motorcross gloves and tactical police/military gloves. The latter are often made using Kevlar, and have a lot of protection around the knuckles.

I don't care about arguing whether the movie is good or bad. I have been a huge fan of this trilogy and I am really pleased with how it has all been wrapped up. I haven't felt this way of a trilogy ever outside of LOTR (which I don't really count as it was one giant movie) . You can't take that from me, Dickson. (smiley wink emoticon).

 

Adendum: Sergio Leone's Man with No Name trilogy is also really good, but it's pretty loose as far as trilogies go.

Batman cheats.

I believe Batman dislodged the tubes on the mask with the scallops/fins on his gloves.

 

If there's a better, more immediate comparison in terms of relative quality and reception, it's probably The Mad Max Trilogy (certainly not a slam, I like MM:BT, just an observation).

Edited by JacknifeJohnny - 7/27/12 at 1:01pm

Hans Zimmer composes "Aurora" in response to those affected by the Colorado tragedy. 100% of proceeds to AVR fund:

 

https://watertowermusic.moontoast.com/estore/embed/1336

 

I too like MM:BT, though I think I like TDKR more comparatively. This comparison works on many levels, although MM's trilogy status is soon to be updended by Bane himself.

I thought about the fourth film, but the Hardy connection totally slipped my mind.

Johnny is correct, Batman clearly rakes his blade things against Bane's mask, which is the first time you see Bane react at all to any of Batmans offense.  I'm with Rich on this one.  The fights themselves needed more complex martial arts choreography.  Even the jumbled chaos of a Bourne fight would be a vast improvement in complexity and brutality.  Sadly I think Christians movements in the bulky suit are what limit the fights to throwing arms around. 

 

I've made this point before but the second fight needed a story to it.  It's FAR too simple and easy for Batman to cut Bane's mask with his bat blades, it needed more complexity than punch punch punch "why don't I try cutting it?  Oh WOW!  That worked great.  Wish I had started with that."

EDIT: As a side note I'm super touched by all the reaching out to Aurora by the Batman people.  Very moving stuff.

See, I disagree about the choreography thing. Not everything needs to be a Hong Kong fight to me. I loved how brutal both fights felt. Yeah, the Bat-suit is bulky, but it still moves a hell of a lot better than any of the other ones.

The TDKR suit is without a doubt my favorite of all the onscreen suits.

Isn't it the exact same as TDR suit.

Didn't look like it to me. Looked a lot more flexible, yet still armorlike. Am I making this up? Honest question.

 

MichaelM is our resident suit expert, but yes, I think you are making this up.

 

http://collider.com/lindy-hemming-dark-knight-rises-interview/178361/

Maybe it just looked different to me because of the daylight scenes. Still thought it looked super cool.

 

 

*Sighs sadly*

I thought it looked a lot more rubbery this time around, so maybe they used a stunt suit for more scenes or created something more flexible for him.

 

Yeah, I don't think there needed to be more choreography, just clearer and more interesting choreography.  I don't need Batman to be some Wuxia master or anything.  But just look at the string of posts with people wondering just what Batman did to Bane's mask.  That should be clearer and a lot more prominent, since it was a huge deal story-wise.

I wish the fights were more like how the Arkham Asylum/City games play out. There's batarangs being flicked at guys at a distance, stunning explosives, pulling guns out of people's hands with a grappling hook, breaking weapons. We saw a little bit of it in the first fight with Bane (smoke and light dampening), but it was all ineffective.

 

Fights in TDKR was better than anything in BB or TDK, but in comparison to the sort of inventiveness seen in the animated series (I watch a lot of 90s TAS and also Brave And The Bold with my kids) the fights were clunky.

OK, I think we're getting back into "circling the wagons" territory. I liked the fights; other people did too. Some didn't.

 

Kriegaffe: The thing about the Arkham fights is that they're video games. You can do that kind of shit there. I think that kind of combo stuff might end up looking goofy if someone tried to do it for real.

 

And yeah, I like the animated stuff overall more in terms of action. But I think it works very well here for what it's intended to do (live-action, relatively realistic Batman fighting).

Sorry guys i didn't read everything.

 

Has anyone mentioned the completely unaltered shots of the locations?

 

-Wall Street

-long aerial shot of Manhattan including a half-built Freedom Tower

-Heinz Field, incl. Heinz advertising.

-US Bank Tower in LA

 

This made the film feel really lazy.

...That was about the LAST thing on my mind while watching the film.

Can't say it bothered me, though it stuck out that the Wall Street chase/Batman's reemergence was definitely L.A.

Yea...and the very obvious Hines Ward cameo. You see him during the anthem but then he makes a turn toward the destruction behind him on the kick return, so we see his name too. Not sure why that bugged me- seemed like something from a lesser film.

Ok, now you guys are really starting to stretch to find things to complain about.

 

But it's Gotham, paul!

 

;)

I know fuck-all about Heinz Field and whoever this Hines Ward fellow is. That's what I get for not following sports.

 

At any rate, I've always seen Gotham as The City in these movies; I'm totally OK with it mixing and matching, since that's what they're doing anyway filming it.

Maybe he was traded to the Rogues.  But on a more serious note, when did Rapid City get a professional football team?  That pulled me right out of the movie.

 

 

 

 

"Up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right..."

You know what really bothered me? This actor they picked to play Batman. I've seen him in other things here and there like Newsies. It really pulled me out of the film and seemed lazy to show someone I obviously know isn't the real Batman.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually, this part is a little confusing to me now, looking back on it. 

 

At the point Batman and Bane first face off with each other, we've been led to believe that Bane was was the one born in the prison (which, I gather, is in keeping with the lore of the character in the comics). Turns out, though, that it was Talia who was born there and escaped.

 

So what's with Bane's monologuing about being raised in darkness and not seeing the light until he was a grown man? Was he raised in the prison too, or have some other, really similar Secret Origin we aren't ultimately told about? Or is this all just misdirection?

 

Not misdirection on Bane's part, mind-- he's planning to throw Batman into the prison and doesn't expect him to escape, so there's no reason to lie. (Bane could, as a matter of fact, say to Batman at this point, "By the way, Miranda Tate--? Totally on my side, sucker." Just to fuck with him.)

 

So this is misdirection on Nolan's part, just to protect the "twist" of Talia's identity? If so, that seems like a bit of a cheat. Or maybe I'm misreading it. What gives?

Bane was born in the prison, too.

 

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the fact that the leads learn about Bane because Gordon was dragged to him in the sewers and "came out ranting about a masked man called Bane" -- even though Bane is never actually named during their scene together.

 

 

I guess you missed Ben Roethlisberger and Bill Cowher?

Uh, I think he just calls him a "masked man".

Just saw it; really really enjoyed it, and while its not perfect, its a great film to close the trilogy.

The young nerd in me is hoping that we'll get a Batman Beyond movie out of this ending.

 

Okay, I'll buy it. Guess the local warlord had a habit of tossing pregnant women down there. Seems a little unlikely that two children could be brought to term and survive afterwards for any length of time, though. I think Bane's survival was what was supposed to make him the ultimate badass in the books... But this was just a nitpicky thing that occurred to me after I read jhp1608's post.

 

On that note-- good point about Gordon mentioning Bane after his trip to the sewer. I didn't catch that.

 

And on the real-life locations being instantly recognizable to any one who lives in or has visited those cities-- the football game was Heinz field and the Steelers all the way. I did catch all of that. I'm blanking, though, on the name of the fictional visiting team... Who played them, I wonder? 

 

ETA re: Chris Spider-- if Gordon only mentioned a "masked man", how did Bruce and Alfred tumble to his identity? I don't remember.

Edited by Slim - 7/27/12 at 9:34pm

They do a big chunk of their research on Bane after the stock exchange, when he has revealed himself.

Ah, thanks. Maybe I'll go in for a second viewing tomorrow.

 

They know a bunch about Bane before the stock exchange.  Blake tells Bruce that Gordon was ranting about a masked man called Bane.  In the very next scene, Alfred has dug up information on Bane and they make the connection to Daggett due to a job Bane pulled (in Africa, I think) that benefited him.  It's why Batman shows up at Daggett's in time to help Selina with Bane's men.