THE DARK KNIGHT RISES Post-release thread..... - Page 57

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurenOrtega 

It's something involving cat resurrection and other shit. The movie's origin really plays like somebody just saw Batman Returns and said "Oh that must be her origin" and then crafted a character totally based around that. Of course the character in that movie doesn't live in Gotham, isn't really even a thief, and isn't Selina Kyle, so it's less Catwoman and more some vague cat-powered superheroine.

I'd see that movie!

I've always been a fan of the character of Catwoman and not only because it's a sexy lady in a skin-tight suit (although, um, that certainly helps!) but because there really aren't enough interesting (or, at least, interesting to me) female superheroes in comics. Wonder Woman is kind of boring (does she still have her invisible plane?), Supergirl and Batgirl stand in the shadow of their better known male counterparts, and I've never read a Black Widow comic. Actually, I haven't read a comic in some time so it's possible that there are some good female characters out there but they just haven't gotten popular enough yet for me to know about them.

There aren't many good female superheroines. You're right that too many are just female versions of male heroes (She-Hulk, et al.) and the best known, Wonder Woman, has some famous gimmicks, but doesn't have a strong personality or origin the way the male A-listers do. 

Storm comes to mind. If I were Marvel I'd be making more of an effort to put her front and center. She's cool, and with her you can mark two items off the diversity checklist. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurenOrtega 

Anyhow to reach across the aisle again, Nolan's Catwoman is easily the best live-action version of the character.* Mostly because they actively let her be fun instead of some damaged weirdo(Batman Returns*) or some sort of weird barely coherent fever-dream of a character.(whatever the fuck Pitof directed) I might not like every single aspect of her story in the film, but I've got very little negative to say about the handling of her.

I have to agree with this, and expanding on it, I'd say that Nolan's Catwoman isn't just the best live-action version of Catwoman, she's the best element of TDKR precisely because he actively lets her be fun. Not that she doesn't have her emotional baggage-- she does! But that stuff melds with the amount of fun the character is allowed to and makes her robust, well-rounded, interesting, and engaging. I think I gave more of a shit about her than I did anyone else in the film, save for maybe Gordon; part of that is Nolan, part of that is Hathaway, who I think really sinks her teeth into the character and has a blast playing her.

So I wouldn't at all complain about a standalone Cathawoman movie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by grubstreeter 

 

Storm comes to mind. If I were Marvel I'd be making more of an effort to put her front and center. She's cool, and with her you can mark two items off the diversity checklist. 

Didn't Halley Berry basically campaign to have Storm made into a more prominent presence in X2 and X3? I think a lot of people kvetched about that at the time. Myself, I don't at all mind the idea of her being pushed into the forefront a bit, but I remember there being fan backlash along the lines of, "Pffft! What a bitch! Storm is just a secondary character!".

Yeah I guess I meant 'put Storm front and center' in terms of merchandise, cartoons, etc. You can walk around Target these days and see a collection of Marvel heroes on nearly anything, but it's usually Cap, Wolverine, Iron Man, etc. I'd put Storm in that mix. 

Wasn't trying to threadjack - Back to Bane breaking Batman's back. 

Have just informed my mother that I would like The Dark Knight Trilogy boxset for my Christmas present this year. Was going to just purchase The Dark Knight Rises but then I realised that I only currently own Batman Begins and that it will be awesome to watch all three on the day after Christmas, plus all of the special features and read the lovely book you get. Very excited!

I love how this movie just solves everything with "He's fucking Batman."

I liked it better than I did in theaters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurenOrtega 

 

 

It could still be funny in the right ways!

 

Say Richard Jenkins talking to a Joe Pesci voiced puppet.

OK, Sold!

Except, would a movie where the main villain (or even the secondary villain) is a comical character work? Justin Hammer in Iron Man 2 sure didn't work.

I think Justin Hammer worked just fine in Iron Man 2, I think Mickey Rourke's the weak link there.

And I'm not seriously suggesting a Batman movie that makes the Ventriloquist it's headline protagonist.

My very last word on this, just for the fuck of it. There's an article out there that claims that Selina in TDKR is a coded lesbian and that her "pitying" the bourgeois victims of the scourge, assisting Batman, and finally allowing Bruce to "conquer" her is living proof that the text as a whole is misogynist. The reading of Catwoman as a lesbian comes from, and only from, the way her friend / cohort, Jen, the "Holly" analogue, embraces her. There's another article that sided with this one and added that the movie intention makes Marion Cotillard dowdy and ugly, compared to Selina's sharp, sultriness. 

You'll have to look for the articles on your own if you're interested, I read them a while ago and can't remember who wrote them, but as much as I enjoy interpretive analysis...holy shit.

On Justin Hammer:

Rockwell is good in the role, but the character is shit. They hire Sam Rockwell to be a punching bag for Robert Downey Jr and in the end, I'm still not quite clear what he was arrested for, or more specifically, what evidence they had right then and there w/ which they could make an arrest.

Between Magic and episodes of Twilight Zone, I don't need convincing that the Ventriloquist and Scarface could make a good villain in a Batman movie. Ventriloquist dummies are just inherently creepy.

Go ask the WB for $150-250 million to make a blockbuster superhero movie where evil Howdy Doody is the villain. I'm thinking that will go one of two ways...or just one way.

It won't happen and I wasn't being serious.

I REPEAT NOT SERIOUS!

Though he's still better than Bane!

ZING!

More a response to JPL. And, it's okay, you can have the "zing", Lauren. As I mentioned, I'm done talking about the film. 

It's an awful film.

When does the blu-ray come out so that I may stomp on it???

Shit, that's what I should do with the Avengers and Prometheus Blu Rays I have.  Right now they are coasters and they suck just as much at collecting water then they do at being passable entertainment.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaurenOrtega 

I think Justin Hammer worked just fine in Iron Man 2, I think Mickey Rourke's the weak link there.

 

 

 

No

Quote:

Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny 

On Justin Hammer:

 

Rockwell is good in the role, but the character is shit. They hire Sam Rockwell to be a punching bag for Robert Downey Jr and in the end, I'm still not quite clear what he was arrested for, or more specifically, what evidence they had right then and there w/ which they could make an arrest.

Yeah I like Rockwell in most things, but Christ in IR2 he's so bad....you can put that down to the script, but I'd assume he read the script before signing on.....

I think both Rourke and Rockwell are great, for a movie that is ultimately about nothing more than what Tony Stark did on the weekend. They both feel like such insignificant, low-level threats that it fits with the really casual attitude of the movie. Not what most people are after, probably, but I think it's funny and watchable.

Bane, on the other hand, is awfully boring even though he has such amazing abilities as materializing in rooms suddenly, zapping across entire cities in the blink of an eye, and speechifying for long periods of time without anybody telling him that they simply don't understand what he's saying.

I'm in the opposite camp. I like Bane and his role in TDKR but if I wanted a "casual" take on Iron Man there are a lot of 30 page comics to take care of that wish. With a movie I want something more.

So conflicted right now. 
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMulder 

I think both Rourke and Rockwell are great, for a movie that is ultimately about nothing more than what Tony Stark did on the weekend. They both feel like such insignificant, low-level threats that it fits with the really casual attitude of the movie. Not what most people are after, probably, but I think it's funny and watchable.

 

Bane, on the other hand, is awfully boring even though he has such amazing abilities as materializing in rooms suddenly, zapping across entire cities in the blink of an eye, and speechifying for long periods of time without anybody telling him that they simply don't understand what he's saying.

Don't agree with this. One of the worst things you can do in any movie is make the villains unthreatening buffoons. Because of that the entire second half of IM2 had zero tension and I tuned out pretty quickly. I also thought besides being awful characters Rourke and Rockwell were both phoning it in. Rourke kind of got the shaft though. It's hard to make a character interesting/appealing when he has to spend 80% of his screen time in a bland fluorescent lit airplane hangar.

They're only the second worst thing in the movie though. The first being the shitty unfinished script and forced Marvel universe expanding stuff. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJokerAteMyID 

I honestly don't get what you all hate so much about Bane. He's basically The Hulk ; all thick neck and no personality - but nobody complains about that with The Hulk.
On the Iron Man 2 front, I didn't think Iron Man was so great to start with. I mean Matheus ( Matheus? I'm just going to call him Jeff Bridges) was cool with the whole "yo, dog, imma shock you with ma taser and steal yo heart" thing, but I really couldn't take his shitty suit of armour or bald head seriously. The bar wasn't really set that high, was it? And come on, all you blu-ray buyers, you obviously like these films if you're going to the cinema then buying these DVDs just so you can have it. Admit it. Shitty superhero movies are your guilty pleasure.

Who is Matheus? That doesn't sound anything remotely like Obediah Stone! And, wait a minute.... you couldn't take him seriously because he had a bald head? Why is hair so important to you when it comes to the threat of a villain? What's your opinion on Lex Luthor?

Actually I don't really want to know.

I'm worried by the fact that, aside from the score, Bane was the only thing I found remotely interesting in the entire film. I really don't want to be lumped together with people like TheJokerAteMyId.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike Marshall 

I'm worried by the fact that, aside from the score, Bane was the only thing I found remotely interesting in the entire film. I really don't want to be lumped together with people like TheJokerAteMyId.

There's no right or wrong opinions, man. There are plenty of films that lots of the people here find amazing that I just can't get in to. And probably vice versa.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Odo19 

 

Don't agree with this. One of the worst things you can do in any movie is make the villains unthreatening buffoons. Because of that the entire second half of IM2 had zero tension and I tuned out pretty quickly. I also thought besides being awful characters Rourke and Rockwell were both phoning it in. Rourke kind of got the shaft though. It's hard to make a character interesting/appealing when he has to spend 80% of his screen time in a bland fluorescent lit airplane hangar.

 

They're only the second worst thing in the movie though. The first being the shitty unfinished script and forced Marvel universe expanding stuff. 

I agree with your take on IM2's problems, although I think they could have integrated the "larger Marvel universe" stuff much better with just a few re-writes.

As for Bane, I like the fact that he is brutish and articulate at the same time. His deflation at the end is almost as bad has in Batman & Robin!

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSaxon 

Who is Matheus? That doesn't sound anything remotely like Obediah Stone! And, wait a minute.... you couldn't take him seriously because he had a bald head? Why is hair so important to you when it comes to the threat of a villain? What's your opinion on Lex Luthor?

 

Actually I don't really want to know.

But Bane is bald too!  And he's...like the Hulk?  I'm at a complete loss on that one.  

Obediah STANE!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwartz 

 

But Bane is bald too!  And he's...like the Hulk?  I'm at a complete loss on that one.  

Ha! I can't believe I didn't pick up on that!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcnooj82 

Obediah STANE!!

Well done! You've successfully spotted the deliberate mistake I made and win a framed copy of any one of my posts*! Enjoy!

* Please note that you are responsible for both the printing and the framing of the post of your choice.

Obediah BANE!!!

Is this the McNooj version of tourette's?

I'm going nutty from my blind hatred!  I'm crossing franchises!

Sweet Christ, what an inert piece of shit. It's way worse than I remember it! Well, I guess the smallness helps cover up the awful extras in this scene a bit. In IMAX they were unavoidable. 

Still love that Beserker flurry Bane does when Batman is against the pillar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike Marshall 

Still love that Beserker flurry Bane does when Batman is against the pillar.

Same here. That's a good little moment.

It's the only moment of the fight that actually works. Otherwise it's just a guy in an unwieldy batsuit slowly looking goofy as shit with his little elbow moves.

It's best to buy the blu-ray/DVD combo pack so you can have two coasters for the price of one. I hate how expensive Criterion coasters can be. But how else am I going to have a Hausu coaster?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spike Marshall 

Still love that Beserker flurry Bane does when Batman is against the pillar.

They really should have expanded that bit. It's great, but I would have loved it if it made him even a more dangerous foe. Kind of like MadDog from The Raid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Odo19 

 

Sweet Christ, what an inert piece of shit. It's way worse than I remember it! Well, I guess the smallness helps cover up the awful extras in this scene a bit. In IMAX they were unavoidable. 

I don't know if I can agree that it's terrible. There are things that are certainly problematic, and yes it does prove that Nolan is pretty weak in regards to shooting action, but in the moment I think it works fairly well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJokerAteMyID 

You know what, you're right. I apologise for my clunky, annoying opinion, loaded with errors. But I also think some of you need to calm down. You're all so intense about your comic book heroes. Maybe you need to step away from the computer. Watch some of the blu- rays you've been using as coasters. And, yes, Bane was bald. It was just the fakeness of Jeff bridges bald head. And the shine. Like a glittering disco ball.

I apologise for earlier. I probably should have responded to your post with more restraint than I showed. Besides, you're a fellow fan of TDKR and there aren't many of us around it seems (judging from this thread at least!)

For the record, I never had any issues with Jeff Bridges' baldness in Iron Man and I'm sorry it affected your enjoyment of that movie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcnooj82 

I'm going nutty from my blind hatred!  I'm crossing franchises!

Face it, Nooj.  Your hatred has made you Worst Everything of 2012.  That makes you Worst Chewer, Worst Hater, Worst Hurricane, Worst Political Convention.  And Worst Movie.

So, yep, that's right, bee-otch.  You are also Worst Dark Knight Rises of 2012.

When I cut, I cut deep.

You haven't given me all the titles. 

Not everything...

NOT YET.

If you strike nooj down, he will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine. So go ahead, call him the worst, for 2013...

The Nooj Rises.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Odo19 

 

God, it really just isn't good is it? Bale and Hardy just about carry it through sheer passion but it's just so shlocky. 

"No, I came here to stop you." Was that honestly the best "Triumphant Hero Line" they could come up with?

And the "Wait, if I attack the apparatus that is clearly helping him breathe it may give me the upper hand." just... urgh.

I don't even need to say anything anymore. 

My work here is done.

It is self-sustaining.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheJokerAteMyID 

It was just the fakeness of Jeff bridges bald head.

I think he did actually shave his head for that movie. Just sayin'.