What do you want to see in the next X-Men movies? - Page 2

That, and he, as the black guy, is the first "major" character to die. Really, Vaughn and Goldman? You really couldn't think of a better way to maybe, uh, not use that ancient cliche?

Well, at least the Hispanic girl lived. To immediately join the bad guys.

PROGRESSIVE.

That annoyed me as well. It's like they were completely unaware of the implications.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Spider 

Rule #1: NO. ALIENS. WHATSOEVER. The only time I've ever felt aliens worked in this universe was when Whedon and Cassaday did them, and that was because they tied those characters into a lot of the main themes and concepts of X-Men.

 

Screw the Shi'ar. Or the Kree. Or the Brood. This playing field doesn't need to be interstellar. Leave that to the Avengers. Or the Fantastic Four, although honestly I've always felt the Four dipped into that well a little too often myself.

 

And yet many of the best X-men (Comics) storylines involved aliens. The Dark Phoenix arc culminated in a battle royale in the Blue Area of the Moon, against the Imperial Guard. The Starjammers and the Shi'ar's first appearance led to the birth of the Phoenix. The Brood...yeah, fuck the Brood.

I get that the films are more "grounded" (also more dour, even First Class) than the comics, but I'd like to see Vaughn cut loose with some funky X-Men shit....like that one issue where the X-Men go to Ireland and meet Leprechauns! My God, it's a Franchise Crossover in the making! Add in Madea and we've got FRIED GOLD!

The thing I always liked about Singer's X-flicks was how he was making a sci-fi movie first, an ensemble piece second, and a comic book movie third. The films weren't embarressed of its pulpy origins--superpowers are fun!--but the thematic weight and drama were allowed to become heavy and dark in places. My big hang up with First Class-other than the final ten minutes' race to the finish line--was that the sci-fi implications of mutants appearing in the world aren't explored beyond the surface level. Really, the use of a "First Class" hamstrings the film--none of the characters are engaging, appealing, or particularly memorable. The relationship between Erik and Charles does the real heavy lifting (yuck yuck), but tonally the film is really weird--half bright pseudo-Roger Moore Bond flick, half period sci-fi flick that wants to be like Boys From Brazil. It gets it about 75% right (though I'll let BoatMan check my statistics), but that 25% really sticks out on rewatches.

I'd love films going forward to find a nice middle ground between the sci-fi first ideals of the first two flicks while working in the more fantastical (not TOO fantastical) elements of the comics; I'd be Ok with the Shi'Ar, but since Phoenix is already nice and fucked, I don't see that being an option till the whole franchise is clean slate rebooted. 

And please, leave Whedon out of this. I really hated his run of greatest hits storylines (Phoenix for the fifth time! Legacy Virus cause fuck you!) filtered through the let's make everyone a quippy smartass lens. Sure, it's a lonely island I walk upon, but walk it I must.

I think we can all agree that THIS would be an awesome live action X-Men film.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Clark 

And please, leave Whedon out of this. I really hated his run of greatest hits storylines (Phoenix for the fifth time! Legacy Virus cause fuck you!) filtered through the let's make everyone a quippy smartass lens. Sure, it's a lonely island I walk upon, but walk it I must.

Um, Whedon's run on Astonishing featured neither Phoenix nor the Legacy Virus.

Sidenote: It's also probably one of the 5 greatest X-Men runs of all-time (it ties at the top with Morrison's New X-Men and The Dark Phoenix Saga for me) and definitely made better use out of Kitty Pride than anyone else ever had.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Clark 

The thing I always liked about Singer's X-flicks was how he was making a sci-fi movie first, an ensemble piece second, and a comic book movie third. The films weren't embarressed of its pulpy origins--superpowers are fun!--but the thematic weight and drama were allowed to become heavy and dark in places. My big hang up with First Class-other than the final ten minutes' race to the finish line--was that the sci-fi implications of mutants appearing in the world aren't explored beyond the surface level. Really, the use of a "First Class" hamstrings the film--none of the characters are engaging, appealing, or particularly memorable. The relationship between Erik and Charles does the real heavy lifting (yuck yuck), but tonally the film is really weird--half bright pseudo-Roger Moore Bond flick, half period sci-fi flick that wants to be like Boys From Brazil. It gets it about 75% right (though I'll let BoatMan check my statistics), but that 25% really sticks out on rewatches.

 

I'd love films going forward to find a nice middle ground between the sci-fi first ideals of the first two flicks while working in the more fantastical (not TOO fantastical) elements of the comics; I'd be Ok with the Shi'Ar, but since Phoenix is already nice and fucked, I don't see that being an option till the whole franchise is clean slate rebooted.

I think the character problem is a general one with the X-Men. There's a metric shit-ton of characters and most of them are pretty dull. The boss men are good, Wolverine is as interesting as any superhero around, Nightcrawler and Jean have their moments but there are diminishing returns beyond that. It's why I used to read Wolverine regularly and X-Men almost never.

I don't know where the tone problem in First Class came from. Stardust and Kick Ass are really solid on that account so maybe this one was just a case of Vaughn stretching beyond his abilities. For me First Class's tonal issue wasn't so much Bond/Boys From Brazil as Basterds/Spy Kids. Erik's Nazi hunting segments are sharp but a lot of the rest of the film feels like it's written and played as a TV show for pre-teens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cylon Baby 

If it's set in the 70's they could go "Spy-Who-Loved-Me" mode and use Arcade as a villain.

Only if they could get that era's Malcolm McDowell to play him, since he was the inspiration behind the character in the first place.

I;ve no taste for most of the post Clairmont/Byrne era stuff, such as Pocky and Mr Sinister. To me they were just bland bad guys that could do anything. 

I'd be for the old school sentinels as well. But what I'd really like to see before I die is a dustup between the Avengers and the X men before they teamed up against Galactus. And the only reason they have a chance of winning is because the FF show up with Reed to convince the others to show mercy to the Devourer of Worlds, which earns the Big G's respect and an oath to never put Eatth on the menu again.

That's all. Is that too much to ask?!

Cylon: See, I never felt the Phoenix story NEEDED to be so cosmic. Really, for the most part when X-Men goes into stuff like time travel and alien warlords, I feel like it takes away from the more interesting core ideas and storylines you can do on Earth. That's why I thought Singer's first two films were so good: they jettisoned much of the stupid, needless chaff.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Vivisector 

 

Only if they could get that era's Malcolm McDowell to play him, since he was the inspiration behind the character in the first place.

 

I;ve no taste for most of the post Clairmont/Byrne era stuff, such as Pocky and Mr Sinister. To me they were just bland bad guys that could do anything. 

 

I'd be for the old school sentinels as well. But what I'd really like to see before I die is a dustup between the Avengers and the X men before they teamed up against Galactus. And the only reason they have a chance of winning is because the FF show up with Reed to convince the others to show mercy to the Devourer of Worlds, which earns the Big G's respect and an oath to never put Eatth on the menu again.

 

That's all. Is that too much to ask?!

Yeah yeah and Emma Frost was based on Diana Rigg, yet they managed to find someone to play the character twice (not that either actress did a stellar job).

Also, some of the Pocy and Sinister stories were written by Claremont sans Byrne.

But YES to your story idea. Hope Fox is reading this thread!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cylon Baby 

Yeah yeah and Emma Frost was based on Diana Rigg, yet they managed to find someone to play the character twice (not that either actress did a stellar job).

 

Also, some of the Pocy and Sinister stories were written by Claremont sans Byrne.

 

But YES to your story idea. Hope Fox is reading this thread!

The name for Emma Frost was taken from the Avengers character played by Dame Diana Rigg, but Byrne based her physical appearance upon Bonnie and Clyde era Faye Dunaway. Let's not talk about how the Emma character has been botched not once but twice in the movies. How do you mess that up?! As for casting someone else, next thing you'll be telling me is you want to cast Russel Brand as Arcade, and I will be forced to burn your Merry Marvel Marching Society card.

I am aware that Claremont was responsible for some of the Pocky and Sinister stuff, well after the stabilizing influence of Byrne (!) was gone. Chris's best work was behind him by the nineties, where he started to repeat himself to lesser effect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Vivisector 

 

The name for Emma Frost was taken from the Avengers character played by Dame Diana Rigg, but Byrne based her physical appearance upon Bonnie and Clyde era Faye Dunaway. Let's not talk about how the Emma character has been botched not once but twice in the movies. How do you mess that up?! As for casting someone else, next thing you'll be telling me is you want to cast Russel Brand as Arcade, and I will be forced to burn your Merry Marvel Marching Society card.

 

I am aware that Claremont was responsible for some of the Pocky and Sinister stuff, well after the stabilizing influence of Byrne (!) was gone. Chris's best work was behind him by the nineties, where he started to repeat himself to lesser effect.

Now hold the phone boss! Claremont actually wrote some good stuff post-Byrne. The Mutant Massacre and the X-Men circa late 80's was some good stuff.

And sorry, look at how Byrne Drew Emma Frost in his X-Men comics....she resembled Dian Rigg a HELLA lot more than Faye Dunaway.

And Fuck Russell Brand in anything. I say Malcom McDowell would still make a great Arcade, albeit an older version.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cylon Baby 

 

Now hold the phone boss! Claremont actually wrote some good stuff post-Byrne. The Mutant Massacre and the X-Men circa late 80's was some good stuff.

 

And sorry, look at how Byrne Drew Emma Frost in his X-Men comics....she resembled Dian Rigg a HELLA lot more than Faye Dunaway.

 

And Fuck Russell Brand in anything. I say Malcom McDowell would still make a great Arcade, albeit an older version.

The Massacre was ok, but it set up a lot of bad stories. I did like Ororo being able to express her badass side with Callisto. And I could love a motivated Malcolm in a good movie, not just an x men movie.

As for the Emma inspiration.....I went to the John Byrne official website, where the man himself confirms that he did not use Faye as the model for Emma, So there! 

Damn, what I wouldn't give to see Avengers era Diana Rigg wearing the Emma Frost Hellfire outfit in an Xmen Movie.

Could we be going about this the wrong way? Could we do the Xmen as they did the Avengers? Solo films for some of the characters?  We obviously have the Wolverine coming up. Storm could be an excellent stand alone story. Depending on how they show Cyclops, it could be an excellent stand alone film.

Cyclops is too defined by his relationship to the team, and it's awkward to have a summer action movie built around a lead when the audience can never see their eyes (a problem James Marsden actually did a pretty good job working around, all things considered).  I don't think any of the characters besides Wolverine have broken out enough to support a solo movie.  If Marvel owned the rights, I would say we need to see just how drunk they are on Avengers profits, but I don't see Fox breaking a profitable franchise to chase that.

We were thisclose to getting a Magneto solo prequel; it got cannibalized into the first half of First Class.

And I'm in the weird position of feeling that was the best thing for that material and that the rest of First Class wasn't very good at the same time. 

The film really does have a tangible "This is GREAT!" when it's being Erik Lenssher, Nazi Hunter that's absent from much of the rest of the film.

I was all for a Magneto prequel, but it was apparently in the hands of David Goyer, so...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Vivisector 

 

 

 

As for the Emma inspiration.....I went to the John Byrne official website, where the man himself confirms that he did not use Faye as the model for Emma, So there! 

Looks like you win, Dr Vivisector........this time.....

For starters, I would like to see Ellen Page brought back as Kitty Pryde and given a larger, perhaps leading, role as either a student or young mentor to the students.  Such a great choice for a character who deserved more to do than participation in a sort-of love triangle, even though I did like her brief action bits.  While we're at it, why not bring Kelsey Grammer back as Beast too, because he was yet another terrific choice for an undeserving film.

If there's still some time left before everyone calls it a day, phone Angela Bassett's agent and get her in the fucking Storm costume.

I am all for an X-Men 4 with Mr. Sinister resurrecting Cyclops* somehow, and the team led by Storm, with Kitty Pryde, Iceman, Colossus, Beast, and a couple of flashy new additions like Psylocke and/or Cannonball. Wolverine is... busy or something.

*Fan-fictioning because I love Marsden as Cyclops.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cylon Baby 

 

 

Looks like you win, Dr Vivisector........this time.....

Take heart, my respected adversary. There is no shame in victory.