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What if....?

post #1 of 29
Thread Starter 

I were to say that everyone goes to Heaven no matter how bad you are? And that Hell is only for Satan and his Demons.

 

What would you say to that?

post #2 of 29

I'd say that there's no way I'm spending my afterlife with Hitler and Bin Laden. I'll haunt the Earth, thank you very much.

post #3 of 29

I'd say lay off the weed.

post #4 of 29

I'd say: Where do the spiders go when they die? I don't want to be chased around by dead spiders so I'll go to the other place.

post #5 of 29

I'd say that I have a few people that I need to kill.

post #6 of 29

I'd say "What the fuck am I doing in Hell?"

post #7 of 29

post #8 of 29

post #9 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Workyticket View Post

 

I'd say 'Let's watch THE SOUND OF MUSIC twice an hour and JAWS 1, 2, and 3.'

post #10 of 29
I'd argue for some form of multiverse variation on eternal reccurence. We might find ourselves in some eschatological simulation towards the 'end of time', but that depends on the universe meeting certain conditions to make such an artifact possible.

I guess.
post #11 of 29
I'd say "what the hell was the point of Christ's sacrifice, if not atonement?" You'd think God would have better things to do than get killed for a non-issue.
post #12 of 29
Having suffered a concussion once and having read about the effects of degenerative nervous system disorders like Alzheimer's, I would be genuinely, but pleasantly, surprised if my memories and personality were to survive the death of my brain.
post #13 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonanthony View Post

I were to say that everyone goes to Heaven no matter how bad you are? And that Hell is only for Satan and his Demons.

 

What would you say to that?

 


I'd say why keep living and why not eat a bullet. The end result is the same.

post #14 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

I'd say "what the hell was the point of Christ's sacrifice, if not atonement?" You'd think God would have better things to do than get killed for a non-issue.

 

 

People seem to forget that its entirely possible that the Judeo-Christian conception of "God" may not be the only one. 

post #15 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavez View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

I'd say "what the hell was the point of Christ's sacrifice, if not atonement?" You'd think God would have better things to do than get killed for a non-issue.
People seem to forget that its entirely possible that the Judeo-Christian conception of "God" may not be the only one. 
Not at all - but Satan is specifically Judeo-Christian, and there was no indication the OP meant otherwise (indeed, the whole premise of the post, that the scenario posited would be unusual, only works by contrast to the standard Christian interpretation,) so it seemed like a reasonable assumption.
post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Not at all - but Satan is specifically Judeo-Christian, and there was no indication the OP meant otherwise (indeed, the whole premise of the post, that the scenario posited would be unusual, only works by contrast to the standard Christian interpretation,) so it seemed like a reasonable assumption.

 

 

IIRC (and I may not) Satan is more Christian/Muslim than Judeo. Not to mention the Norse and Greek mythologies had, if not a Heaven-Hell situation, at the very least a "good place/not-so-good place" division in the afterlife. 

 

Plus, I kinda figure that if God is all-loving etc, would he REALLY sentence someone who banged the woman he eventually married out of wedlock to the same ZIP Code as Hitler and/or Stalin? 

 

 

This is basically my roundabout way of saying that I don't know if there IS a God, but the Western conception of "him" strikes me as being utter bollocks. 

post #17 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavez View Post

IIRC (and I may not) Satan is more Christian/Muslim than Judeo. Not to mention the Norse and Greek mythologies had, if not a Heaven-Hell situation, at the very least a "good place/not-so-good place" division in the afterlife.
Well, I was referring to Satan/Lucifer as a specific individual, as named in the OP, not devil-figures in general. (As for not-Judeo, you're right that he does appear more in the New Testament than the Old, though there's a passage in Isaiah that gives an obvious nod to the traditional war-in-Heaven narrative.)
Quote:
Plus, I kinda figure that if God is all-loving etc, would he REALLY sentence someone who banged the woman he eventually married out of wedlock to the same ZIP Code as Hitler and/or Stalin? 

This is basically my roundabout way of saying that I don't know if there IS a God, but the Western conception of "him" strikes me as being utter bollocks.
But isn't that more of a positional statement on the OP's idea than anything to do with the validity of comparing the idea with the traditional framework against which we're supposed to contrast it? Whether you specifically are down with the traditional Judeo-Christian notion(s) of God has no bearing on Jasonanthony's question of what one would answer to his proposition within that context, except insofar as you agree or disagree with his idea.
post #18 of 29

I'd say the people who propose such a scenario are the ones who would benefit the most from it.  In other words, someone who did something really really bad, but doesn't want to suffer the consequences.

 

In which case, the question I then put to you is......

 

What did you do kid?  Huh?  Where is it?  What did you do with the body you sick little fuck?  What did you do with the body, Jasonanthony?  You think you have rights? You're wrong!  We can do this all night, we'll hold you til you break!  Tell us! TELL US!  We've got coffee, cigarettes, we can just keep asking.  TELL US WHERE THE BODY IS!  

What? You say you want you're lawyer?  Well, I thought you said you were going to the good place?  There ain't no lawyers where you're goin' kid!  None!

post #19 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSaxon View Post

I'd say that there's no way I'm spending my afterlife with Hitler and Bin Laden. I'll haunt the Earth, thank you very much.

 What if the Big Cheese made you forget That Hitler was a bad person.

post #20 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

I'd say "what the hell was the point of Christ's sacrifice, if not atonement?" You'd think God would have better things to do than get killed for a non-issue.


what if  He Never got Killed.

post #21 of 29
Persian Zoroastrianism had a satanic villain in the form of Ahriman. It's tempting to speculate about just how much Zoroastrian influence creeped its way into Judaism during the Babylonian Captivity. The Samaritans swore up and down for centuries that their cousins were practicing a corrupted form of their religion after Cyrus the Great let them go.

This is probably the kind of thing that the Discovery Channel should have shows about. There's enough mystery and wonder in real history to not have to waste time with bullshit about how only aliens were capable of masonry. But that's another thread, I suppose.
post #22 of 29

If my consciousness does anything other than cease to exist once my heart beats no more, I will be too surprised by the fact to even notice that everyone from Bruce Lee to John Wayne Gacy is walking around in the same place.

post #23 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

This is probably the kind of thing that the Discovery Channel should have shows about. There's enough mystery and wonder in real history to not have to waste time with bullshit about how only aliens were capable of masonry. But that's another thread, I suppose.
But why do that when they could do a show about how only aliens could possibly have been the inspiration for ancient religions? It's the best of both worlds!
post #24 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


But why do that when they could do a show about how only aliens could possibly have been the inspiration for ancient religions? It's the best of both worlds!

 

I find it funny that the concept of aliens visiting mankind thousands of years ago is probably less offensive to religious people than the alternative explanation: that human beings didn't understand certain things, and so decided to basically make shit up. Think about it, which makes religious people looks less foolish? Spaces Jesus, or several millenia of essentially not learning anything new?

post #25 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shuma Gorath View Post

Think about it, which makes religious people looks less foolish? Spaces Jesus, or several millenia of essentially not learning anything new?
If you think we spent several millennia not learning anything, you're basically right on board with the aliens-built-the-pyramids people. Just because people of the near-distant past didn't have flashy modern science doesn't mean they weren't busy laying a fuckton of the groundwork for it with mathematics, general observation/trial-and-error, and above all developing civilizations where people could have the time to seriously sit down and start figuring shit out.
post #26 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackson View Post

I'd say the people who propose such a scenario are the ones who would benefit the most from it.  In other words, someone who did something really really bad, but doesn't want to suffer the consequences.

 

In which case, the question I then put to you is......

 

What did you do kid?  Huh?  Where is it?  What did you do with the body you sick little fuck?  What did you do with the body, Jasonanthony?  You think you have rights? You're wrong!  We can do this all night, we'll hold you til you break!  Tell us! TELL US!  We've got coffee, cigarettes, we can just keep asking.  TELL US WHERE THE BODY IS!  

What? You say you want you're lawyer?  Well, I thought you said you were going to the good place?  There ain't no lawyers where you're goin' kid!  None!

Very Funny Stuff Jackson!


Edited by Jasonanthony - 1/23/13 at 10:50am
post #27 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


If you think we spent several millennia not learning anything, you're basically right on board with the aliens-built-the-pyramids people. Just because people of the near-distant past didn't have flashy modern science doesn't mean they weren't busy laying a fuckton of the groundwork for it with mathematics, general observation/trial-and-error, and above all developing civilizations where people could have the time to seriously sit down and start figuring shit out.

 

You misunderstood me. What I was saying is that if religion formed out of human ignorance about things like weather patterns, reproduction, and outer space, which I do believe to be the case, then anyone who continues to be religious despite all the wealth of knowledge humanity has gained over the years is being quite foolish. That's not something religious folks can laugh away as nonsense. Give them reason to contemplate the idea that they just may have wasted their lives, and they're going to get angry.

post #28 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shuma Gorath View Post

 

You misunderstood me. What I was saying is that if religion formed out of human ignorance about things like weather patterns, reproduction, and outer space, which I do believe to be the case, then anyone who continues to be religious despite all the wealth of knowledge humanity has gained over the years is being quite foolish. That's not something religious folks can laugh away as nonsense. Give them reason to contemplate the idea that they just may have wasted their lives, and they're going to get angry.

 

That might be the case if the only thing religions did was try to explain natural phenomena. It isn't, obviously.

post #29 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curiosity Cosby View Post

 

That might be the case if the only thing religions did was try to explain natural phenomena. It isn't, obviously.

 

No, they go a lot further than that. Which is even worse.

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