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Does Jenny McCarthy deserve this much hate?

post #1 of 50
Thread Starter 

http://social.entertainment.msn.com/blogs/post--jenny-mccarthys-view-hiring-blasted-as-public-health-threat#scpshrjmd

 

 

Wow, they are pretty hard on her.

 

 

I understand that emotions run hot on the vaccine debate. Let me say first that I'm on the vaccinate your kid side of it, and I often poke fun at the people who are against it, but this response strikes me as extreme.

 

 

1) Is it that wrong to question the establishment? Look at how many drugs get recalled EVERY year with serious side effects. I find it troubling that those who want more accountability and testing for the drugs we put into our children's bodies to be so severely demonized. I mean the article literally calls her a mass murderer, and stops just short of baby killer.

 

2) As a new parent I understand the anxiety, I can only imagine the turmoil if your child develops some sort of disorder. The medical establishment has no answers, especially when it comes to a lot of these mental diseases and disorders. So again, I can understand the motivation to just start looking for answers on your own.

 

3) She doesn't even preach "no vaccines" anymore. From her HuffPost column it seems she now talks about moderation, to spread out the vaccines and just wants further testing. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jenny-mccarthy/vaccine-autism-debate_b_806857.html

 

4) She's a model/actress/comedian.

 

 

Again, I'm almost always on the side of science but this backlash is wrong. This isn't climate change or pollution studies where the scientists present hard evidence, and then people deny it for political reasons. The medical community is still clueless about many things.

 

I've seen way too many relatives run the gambit of having to change out medications for SEVERE side effects. Again, I'm not saying that vaccines are bad and cause autism, I'm just saying that I sure as hell don't trust Big Pharma when they say anything is perfectly safe.

post #2 of 50

No, we're not too hard on her. She's done a great deal to spread confusion and mistrust about vaccines. She's forfeited her right to be taken seriously or treated without scorn. Even Jim Carrey has abandoned her.

post #3 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Harford View Post

No, we're not too hard on her. She's done a great deal to spread confusion and mistrust about vaccines. She's forfeited her right to be taken seriously or treated without scorn. Even Jim Carrey has abandoned her.

 

Being skeptical is a good thing but as the saying goes:

 

"Keep an open mind –but not so open that your brain falls out"

 

McCarthy's brain was bouncing across the floor...

 

I can't help but wonder if McCarthy's embracing of the anti-vaccine bullshit was a catalyst for that breakup.

 

On a related tangent...is anyone in the least bit surprised that Hasselbeck ended up at Fox. Talk about a match made in cliche heaven (or hell.)

post #4 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTRan View Post

 

I can't help but wonder if McCarthy's embracing of the anti-vaccine bullshit was a catalyst for that breakup.


Post hoc ergo propter hoc. I like to think so, anyway.

post #5 of 50
I can't believe anyone honestly gives a fuck about who's on "The View."
post #6 of 50
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Harford View Post

No, we're not too hard on her. She's done a great deal to spread confusion and mistrust about vaccines. She's forfeited her right to be taken seriously or treated without scorn. Even Jim Carrey has abandoned her.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by VTRan View Post

 

Being skeptical is a good thing but as the saying goes:

 

"Keep an open mind –but not so open that your brain falls out"

 

McCarthy's brain was bouncing across the floor...

 

I can't help but wonder if McCarthy's embracing of the anti-vaccine bullshit was a catalyst for that breakup.

 

On a related tangent...is anyone in the least bit surprised that Hasselbeck ended up at Fox. Talk about a match made in cliche heaven (or hell.)

 

 

Please explain to me how her love life should effect how she is treated in the public? Yes, she went far on the bandwagon, but mass murderer? She was just a scared parent trying to figure out what was wrong with her kid. Real classy Hartford.

 

And she left Carrey by the way, not that it should matter. But apparently it does.

 

Go back to 2005 or earlier, no one knew jack shit and everyone was scrambling for answers. It's really convenient in hindsight to say these people were nuts. But everyone needs to remember that we wouldn't know what we know now if parents weren't going crazy demanding further testing and studies.

post #7 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I can't believe anyone honestly gives a fuck about who's on "The View."
post #8 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I can't believe anyone honestly gives a fuck about who's on "The View."


post #9 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoatMan View Post

And she left Carrey by the way, not that it should matter. But apparently it does.

 

Perhaps she left because he called her out on her irrational beliefs....??

 

Quote:
Go back to 2005 or earlier, no one knew jack shit and everyone was scrambling for answers. It's really convenient in hindsight to say these people were nuts. But everyone needs to remember that we wouldn't know what we know now if parents weren't going crazy demanding further testing and studies. 

 

It wasn't that they didn't know jack shit, it was a question of willful ignorance based on bad journalism and incredibly shitty science.

 

 

From here: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Vaccine_denialism

Quote:
A small study by Andrew Wakefield, published in The Lancet in 1998, became famous around 2000-2002 when the UK media caught hold of it. It hypothesized an alleged link between the measles vaccine and autism despite a small sample size of only 12 children. This eventually lead to what Guardian columnist and science writer Ben Goldacre described as "the media's MMR hoax,"[35] due to the evidence for any link being so lacking that it may as well have been entirely manufactured. The paper was partially retracted several years later but continued to be the most often cited case study for the link, despite mounting evidence (including one large study into the rates of autism in adults who wouldn't have received MMR) to the contrary. It was finally considered "thrown out" by the media on February 2, 2010, after it was discovered that the author of the study, Andrew Wakefield, behaved unethically. Specifically, Wakefield was found guilty of not acting in the best medical interests of the children he did research on (one child was severely injured in a colonoscopy), as well as not disclosing his previous involvements with anti-vaccination groups prior to the study and it hitting the news.[36] Further examinations show that Wakefield outright fabricated information or selectively ignored facts in his study, such as preexisting conditions in 5 of the 12 children.[37]

 

This is a good read.

http://www.badscience.net/2008/08/the-medias-mmr-hoax/

post #10 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I can't believe anyone honestly gives a fuck about who's on "The View."

Because her hiring on a very mainstream shoe like "The View" could perhaps be construed as an endorsement of her nutjob anti-vaccination views, which are extremely irresponsible.

post #11 of 50




The answer is "yes. Jenny McCarthy deserves greater than or equal to this much hate." Skepticism is the exact opposite of supporting fraud, and the fraud that McCarthy supported is one that kills children.
post #12 of 50

Yeah sorry, celebrities who use their celebrity as a pulpit to espouse their beliefs don't get granted immunity from any potential backlash.

 

If Jenny McCarthy doesn't like the scorn being heaped upon her, she always has the option of shutting the fuck up.

post #13 of 50

duplicate

post #14 of 50

Just brings in more ratings for The View. For some reason, people who hate other people can't wait to hear what they have to say next.

post #15 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben W View Post

Because her hiring on a very mainstream shoe like "The View" could perhaps be construed as an endorsement of her nutjob anti-vaccination views, which are extremely irresponsible.

As opposed to the even-keeled rantings of Elisabeth Hasselbeck.

post #16 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mangy View Post

As opposed to the even-keeled rantings of Elisabeth Hasselbeck.

Hasselbeck's views are merely idiotic; McCarthy's views are outright dangerous.

post #17 of 50

Next time on "The View":

One piece of ass blonde who shouldn't open her mouth is replacing another piece of ass blonde who shouldn't open her mouth.

post #18 of 50

yes.  She espoused something she hadn't done the basic research on, and used her celebrity status to get a whole bunch of fucking sheep to follow her.

 

Fuck her


Go Amanda Peet!

 

http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2008/10/06/why-now-jenny/

post #19 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben W View Post

Hasselbeck's views are merely idiotic; McCarthy's views are outright dangerous.

Hasselbeck was able to spread her idiocy across several issues. She was WAY more influential than McCarthy, at least until Jenny replaced her on the bully pulpit.

post #20 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoatMan View Post

Again, I'm almost always on the side of science but this backlash is wrong. This isn't climate change or pollution studies where the scientists present hard evidence, and then people deny it for political reasons. The medical community is still clueless about many things.

 

I've seen way too many relatives run the gambit of having to change out medications for SEVERE side effects. Again, I'm not saying that vaccines are bad and cause autism, I'm just saying that I sure as hell don't trust Big Pharma when they say anything is perfectly safe.

 

If vaccines were only backed by Big Pharma, I might see that but vaccines have been tested and the anti-vaccine crowd's fundamental belief is based on a "correlation isn't causation" fallacy. They're convinced something is wrong with vaccines because their kids took them and, at some later point, they developed autism and that's about it. There's no causal mechanism that isn't based on bunk.

 

WIth McCarthy in particular, she's backed off from her more rabid assertions recently but still maintains a position as keynote speaker for Autism One, a yearly anti-vax festival. She's in a good position to raise the profile for this sort of thing. At the moment, she's not the quack Dr. Oz is but if she's as expressive of her views as Hasselbeck was, she could give him a run for his money.

post #21 of 50

Others have summed it up pretty nicely.  Why this looks a little harsh at this point is there has been a bit of a lull in the conflict for a year or two and the scientific medicine crowd have been making sure they won't be behind the curve this time. 

J Mac was the biggest figurehead for the anti-vaccine movement in the US, given a pulpit to preach from by Oprah and was going to have her own show for a while there.  I guess personal reasons meant she stepped out of the limelight for a while.  The "war" didn't end though, it just moved elsewhere: to Europe, UK, Australia, Japan etc.  So when she rears her head again the whole story is ready and waiting this time.  So it looks a little meaner than it would had the conflict been continuous.

What you're seeing isn't a backlash as such, but the truth of the matter just starting to finally get equal time.

 

So, re: this bit

Quote:
This isn't climate change or pollution studies where the scientists present hard evidence, and then people deny it for political reasons.

 

It most assuredly is, unfortunately.  The anti vaccine movement are akin to the flat earth society.  They believe utterly fantastical 19th century and New Age nonsense in general.  They slip under the kook radar by appearing to be 'just caring about kids and health and vaccine damage' and with arguments like "the medical establishment doesn't know everything".  They're not the slightest bit interested in what the medical establishment does actually know, however.  Rather rejecting reality and substituting their own, more often than not.

That this sort of thing has managed to creep largely unchallenged into currency in "womens' programming" under the heading of "alternative medicine" is bad news and well overdue for countering.

post #22 of 50

If only Jenny McCarthy had a gun, she could stop all those autisms.

post #23 of 50

This is a must listen...

 

Bob Garfield from 'On The Media' (syndicated on NPR) rips McCarthy a new one.

 

http://www.onthemedia.org/2013/jul/19/dangerous-view/

Quote:
This week, ABC announced that model, comedian, and anti-vaccine activist Jenny McCarthy would be joining the hit daytime talk show The View. Bob looks at the controversy surrounding her hiring and at the media's description of McCarthy's "controversial" views.

 

edit to add- These vids were linked in the comments section of the On the Media page.

 

If you know anyone that believes this anti-vaccine bullshit, have them watch these videos (specifically vid #2)

 

Vaccines and the Autism Myth

Part 1- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6gpw_Deth8

Part 2- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGb9m1dbNdM


Edited by VTRan - 7/21/13 at 12:19pm
post #24 of 50

No one could be hard enough on Jenny McCarthy if even one child got sick or died due to her empty-headed, anti-scientific campaign against preventing entirely preventable childhood illnesses. The only thing more tragic than her inability to accept bad luck as the cause of her child's condition is the fact that she doesn't understand that correlation doesn't equal causation, and she used her minimal amount of celebrity to convince credulous morons to endanger their children.

 

As the host of a talk show for a demonstrably low-information audience, she's demonstrated that she's actively dangerous.

post #25 of 50
You know, I'm not a fan of "alternative medicine," and I don't buy what she's selling in the slightest, but holy Christ does the quantity and nature of the venom spewed at her make me uncomfortable. (As if the medical establishment has never been wrong before...)

Some day you people are going to make scientism the new religion of this country, and with attitudes like this society will have slipped right back into heretic-burnings without even noticing.
Edited by commodorejohn - 7/21/13 at 7:34pm
post #26 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

Some day you people are going to make scientism the new religion of this country, and with attitudes like this society will have slipped right back into heretic-burnings without even noticing.


post #27 of 50
In my defense, I only repped McWang because it was a hilarious first post.
post #28 of 50
I'd be a lot less hard on her if she dyed her hair black again. But I'd be hard for her, amirite guise?
post #29 of 50

Speak of the devil...

 

 

Quote:

Fifteen Years After Autism Panic, a Plague of Measles Erupts

Legions spurned a long-proven vaccine, putting a generation at risk

 

PORT TALBOT, Wales—When the telltale rash appeared behind Aleshia Jenkins's ears, her grandmother knew exactly what caused it: a decision she'd made 15 years earlier.

 

Ms. Jenkins was an infant in 1998, when this region of southwest Wales was a hotbed of resistance to a vaccine for measles, mumps and rubella. Many here refused the vaccine for their children after a British doctor, Andrew Wakefield, suggested it might cause autism and a local newspaper heavily covered the fears. Resistance continued even after the autism link was disproved.

 

The bill has now come due.

 

A measles outbreak infected 1,219 people in southwest Wales between November 2012 and early July, compared with 105 cases in all of Wales in 2011.

 

One of the infected was Ms. Jenkins, whose grandmother, her guardian, hadn't vaccinated her as a young child. "I was afraid of the autism," says the grandmother, Margaret Mugford, 63 years old. "It was in all the papers and on TV."

<cont.>

also covered here- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22277186

post #30 of 50
After reading this thread I'm am totally shocked by something. People care and watch The View! Oh my god who are these people!
post #31 of 50

I had to dredge up this thread for the sole reason to point this bit of brilliance out....

 

It's from the always entertaining Phil Plait


 

Quote:

Jenny McCarthy: “I’m Not ‘Anti-Vaccine’”

 

Jenny McCarthy is claiming she is not anti-vaccine.

 

Here’s the problem with that claim: Yes, she is. That’s patently obvious due to essentially everything she’s been saying about vaccines for years. Yet in an op-ed in the Chicago Sun-Times on April 12, 2014, she tries to ignore all that, and wipe the record clean.

 

In case you think I may be misquoting her, here is the first line of that op-ed: “I am not ‘anti-vaccine.’”

 

So, there you go.

 

She says she’s never told anyone not to get vaccinated. Assuming that's true, great! But that’s hardly the entry-level position for being anti-vax. For example, you can say things that are grossly incorrect about them that would scare parents into not vaccinating their children. That would fit the moniker “anti-vax,” I’d think.

 

So, for example, saying vaccines have toxins in them—as she has said for years, and as she reiterates in her op-ed—is a clear sign of being anti-vax. After all, if someone tells you you’re putting toxins in your body, that sounds awful, doesn’t it? Doesn’t that make you want to stop doing whatever it is that’s putting them inside you?

 

Yet as doctors say, dosage makes the poison. The amount of, say, formaldehyde in a typical vaccination is much less than you’d get eating an apple. The same can be shown for the other ingredients claimed to be toxins in vaccines as well. The truth is vaccines contain far too small a dose of any of these things to cause any of the problems McCarthy and other anti-vaxxers claim exist.

 

 

this is the part that I find so damn amusing...:

Also, botulinum is the single most lethal toxin known to humans. Yet McCarthy has enthusiastically praised injecting this toxin into her face. How can anyone possibly say that and also say vaccines have dangerous levels of toxins in them with a straight face?

 

heh!

vaccines = bad  botox = good  : )

post #32 of 50

I agree that telling people to not use vaccines is awful but who the hell is going to Jenny McCarthy for medical advice? Sadly im sure the answer is much more than I would like to think but wow.

post #33 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waaaaaaaalt View Post
 

I agree that telling people to not use vaccines is awful but who the hell is going to Jenny McCarthy for medical advice? Sadly im sure the answer is much more than I would like to think but wow.


It's not so much "going to her for advice" as it is confirmation bias. There are tons of people who want there to be an easy cause-and-effect for something like autism, who want to believe "natural is better", and who want to distrust doctors, medicine and science. Someone like McCarthy speaking vehemently gives them fuel for the stupid ideas that were already kicking around in their head.

 

When I went to school, Logic and Critical Thinking was an elective course IN COLLEGE. I desperately wish it were a required course for every high school graduate.

post #34 of 50

So, this happened.....

:
California Vaccination Bill SB 277 Signed By Governor, Becomes Law

A California bill that removes all exemptions to vaccine requirements for school entry except those medically indicated has just become law. After the California Assembly passed SB 277 on Thursday and the state senate passed the same version Monday, Governor Jerry Brown signed the bill into law this morning.

“The science is clear that vaccines dramatically protect children against a number of infectious and dangerous diseases,” Brown wrote in his signing message. “While it’s true that no medical intervention is without risk, the evidence shows that immunization powerfully benefits and protects the community.”

Brown acknowledged the significant and acrimonious opposition – including comparisons to Nazi Germany – and controversy that has surrounded the bill since its inception, inspired by the outbreak of measles that began at Disneyland last winter. But he points out that any child with a medical contraindication to receiving a vaccine can still receive an exemption to attend daycare or school.

“While requiring that school children be vaccinated,” he wrote, SB 277 “explicitly provides an exception when a physician believes that circumstances – in the judgment and sound discretion of the physician – so warrant.”

The law applies to students attending any public or private school in the state, so parents who choose not to vaccinate children for non-medical reasons would need to homeschool their children. The only other states with similar immunization policies that do not allow any non-medical exemptions are Mississippi and West Virginia.

<cont.>


....and then this.

 

Jim Carrey calls Gov. Brown a 'fascist' for signing new vaccination law

 

 

I have to admit, I always thought Carrey was the sane one in the relationship he had with McCarthy....

post #35 of 50
I'm sure Jim Carrey is more of an expert on vaccines than medical doctors who administer vaccines. Because he has links to sites on the Internet.
post #36 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I'm sure Jim Carrey is more of an expert on vaccines than medical doctors who administer vaccines. Because he has links to sites on the Internet.

 

...which is a good segue into this link.  Carreyed Away

 

Phil Plait (Bad Astronomy) goes through Carrey's tweets one by one and points out his errors.

post #37 of 50

I wish I could un-know this.  I honestly wasn't aware Jim Carrey advocated for this shit.  Thanks for nothing you dicks.

post #38 of 50
Now "Dumb & Dumber To" isn't the lamest thing he's done recently.
post #39 of 50

I'm one of that movie's half-hearted defenders, but what I realize now is that Jim Carrey wasn't necessarily giving a performance.

 

post #40 of 50

Forget McCarthy and Carrey and the View etc for a second. I'm MORE angry at the NIH/CDC and other government health organizations for taking Wakefield's research at face value years ago and claiming there may be an issue with vaccinations. The vetting should have been done before supporting his claims. One person's shaky "science" (and 12 test subjects) shouldn't be enough to sway opinion and change policy. Years ago when I researched autism (my nephew's on the spectrum), I looked into NIH warnings and Wakefield's research. Since then (over a decade after his paper was written), it's been discredited. Why did it take so long? So much damage has already been done.

post #41 of 50
post #42 of 50

Once great actor making utter shit like DIRTY GRANDPA.

 

Fuck off and retire, De Niro.

post #43 of 50
post #44 of 50
So much for the anti-vaxxer shared universe.
post #45 of 50

To his credit, it sounds like it was an informed decision - the opposite of the initial decision to show the films.

 

 

Quote:

Dr. William Schaffner, a professor of preventive medicine at the Vanderbilt University School of Medicine, said on Saturday that he believed “the entire board as well as Mr. De Niro have learned a lot in the last several days.”

 

“My hat is off to them for listening, thinking about it, discussing it and responding,” he said.

post #46 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

So much for the anti-vaxxer shared universe.

 

I wish, but unfortunately they're still in their own universe if my Facebook feed is anything to go by (it probably isn't.)

post #47 of 50

This should have been the first 'red flag' with regards to the credibility of the 'filmmaker'.

 

 

from the link above...

Quote:
The film, “Vaxxed: From Cover-Up to Catastrophe,” was directed and co-written by Andrew Wakefield, the author of a study that was published in the British medical journal The Lancet and then retracted in 2010. Mr. Wakefield’s medical license was also revoked over his failure to disclose financial conflicts of interest and ethics violations.
post #48 of 50

Yep, he's an infamous figure over here. The study, the controversy it provoked, the debunking and his personal vilification was huge news. It always astounds me when disgraced figures can simply hop the Atlantic and seemingly start over like it's the 1890s.

post #49 of 50

I was reading a bit about Wakefield whistleblower story a bit before the doco came out and all this Tribeca business.  It's all thoroughly at that level in a debate where loads of the over arching conflict hinges upon minutiae of some sliver of data, or who knew what when and what that means.  Where people not deeply invested tune out in other words, it's agonising.  (I certainly did)

 

You can read a bit about how this supposed cover up works and its chain of evidence in an interview with Wakefield that was done on a cruise ship convention of conspiracy theorists.  Which is awesome.

 

(when you zoom out a bit from the whole business about a missing page or two, the argument for what is being covered up doesn't seem quite so sexy.[or make a whole lot of sense. "Oh it's African American boys now."  Was it always them?  Is it still everyone?  Buhhdunno]  But, add some corruption and intrigue and Bob is your uncle, as ever)

post #50 of 50
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