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post #251 of 280

Then he needs to stfu.  It's like my hero Alan Grayson citing a story in the f****ing Daily Caller during the Syria scare.  Not everyone is infallible. 


ps. we're all private citizens.  What we say doesn't mean a rat's ass out there in the world.  But people like Hersh and Grayson are actually listened to, and without actual facts, it's no better than Fox News.

post #252 of 280

Well, Hersh pulled that before with a piece he wrote in the New Yorker linking the CIA to some Libya militants or something. Turns out he heard it from a guy, etc., and it ended up in the story without getting cross-checked. Journalism is tough, and its easy to get hoodwinked.

post #253 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by yt View Post
 

I'd love to read anything Hersh has uncovered, but just calling it a lie without any evidence or alternate narrative just kind of leaves you hanging.  I think he's an amazing reporter, clearly, but, yeah, like Bernstein, no one's infallible.  Which isn't to say his OBL comments are a big fail; I'd just like to know why he says that.  Does he mean in the details?  The whole operation?  What's he talking about?

Righto, YT. I'd like to hear more specifics. Is he just talking about the fact that the initial word on what went down seems to have been smoke screen? Or the large op itself was somehow a lie? Or what?

post #254 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post
 

Well, Hersh pulled that before with a piece he wrote in the New Yorker linking the CIA to some Libya militants or something. Turns out he heard it from a guy, etc., and it ended up in the story without getting cross-checked. Journalism is tough, and its easy to get hoodwinked.

 

It's true.  The one thing the terrible Newsroom did well was revealing how everyone can look at a set of facts and draw the same conclusion, but once the cracks begin to show, it becomes painfully obvious how flawed all of it was all along.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Harford View Post
 

Righto, YT. I'd like to hear more specifics. Is he just talking about the fact that the initial word on what went down seems to have been smoke screen? Or the large op itself was somehow a lie? Or what?

 

Exactly. 

post #255 of 280

This could be an example of how fucking easy conspiracy theories can begin and spread in this day and age of the twittertubes.

 

Oh my god, is it a crazy conspiracy theory or someone who is just shitty at math?
 

Quote:

 

 

Former White House spokesman Ari Fleischer backed off on his suggestion earlier this week that Twitter allows President Barack Obama to use more than 140 characters in his tweets, but some Republican primary voters evidently still have doubts.

 

Democratic-leaning Public Policy Polling tested Fleischer's debunked and ultimately retracted conspiracy theory in a survey released Friday, finding support and uncertainty among Republicans nationwide. The poll showed that 13 percent of GOP primary voters think Twitter does permit Obama to exceed the 140 character limit while a majority — 52 percent — said they weren't sure.

 

Thirty-six percent said they don't think Obama enjoys a larger character limit than the rest of Twitter users.

 

The former press secretary under George W. Bush was widely ridiculed after he said that a tweet from the @BarackObama Twitter account — which is run by Organizing for Action — had gone over the 140-character limit and wondered if the president gets to "play by different rules."

 

But there were actually only 136 characters in the tweet that Fleischer questioned and, moments later, he was forced to walk back his suggestion.


Edited by VTRan - 9/27/13 at 9:00pm
post #256 of 280
I love that this story has its genesis in Fleischer not arguing with the message of whatever Obama said, but railing against the perceived unfairness of him being allowed to say it.
post #257 of 280

Here's a doozy: Star Trek is actually an expose of the Illuminati and their alliance with the Reptilian and Hybrid Aliens!

 

post #258 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhukov View Post
 

Well, Hersh pulled that before with a piece he wrote in the New Yorker linking the CIA to some Libya militants or something. Turns out he heard it from a guy, etc., and it ended up in the story without getting cross-checked. Journalism is tough, and its easy to get hoodwinked.

 

  This is why a reporter MUST have two credible sources. That is Journalism 101.

post #259 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

I love that this story has its genesis in Fleischer not arguing with the message of whatever Obama said, but railing against the perceived unfairness of him being allowed to say it.

I'm still kind of amazed that that's even an angle they'd try "OMG the President is treated like he's special!  With all his security guards and 150 char twiiter account!  Revolt!"

Yeah, no, there's nothing special about that office in the nation state you so revere, nothing at all...

 

...oh, this isn't the Right Wing pundits are idiots thread...

post #260 of 280

I just watched one that was hilariously all encompassing and animated.  The narration sounds accelerated like a south park character.  But I cant guarantee its worth an hour of your time.  Unless you believe in Martians, Thoth, Atlantis, etc.

 

post #261 of 280

It's the weirdest thing.  The relentless high speed balderdash is bad enough, but what really fascinates me is how it's such a detailed lift of Extra Credits' style.  Not a casual bit of plagiarism.  Quite a lot of effort has clearly gone into aping their presentation, even expanding on it.  It's bizarre.

 

Anyway, this one is interesting also

 

 

A three hour epic dissection of everything wrong with the Ancient Aliens nonsense.

It's startlingly thorough (although draws from a lot of stuff you can find in the skepticosphere fairly readily).  The real kicker however is the guy doing it is himself a Christian and self confessed conspiracy theorist.  His broad goal is to debunk the whole New Age movement and its attendant woo, but not just because its wrong.  Because he suspects that 70s Spiritualism is actually the work of demons deceiving us for their own nefarious ends, by injecting false histories, pretending to be ghosts to mediums, giving people strange revelations when on peyote et al.

Yes really.

post #262 of 280

This gave me a larf:

 

post #263 of 280
post #264 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

What are your thoughts on the Mel Gibson movie, "Conspiracy Theory?"

This is what I came to see.  I actually really like the film.  Patrick Stewart makes a pretty creepy villain.

post #265 of 280

Resurrecting this cause this Assange conspiracy theory that's gaining traction is hilarious.

 

Quote:
 Jullian Assange was apprehended and or murdered by the CIA and us government because he has information far more damaging than damage against the Clinton campaign. They murdered his colleague probably after torturing both of them to release the keys and locations of the dead mans switch. Sooner after they took over reddit subs and the Wikileaks site itself and defused and or deleted the dead mans switch with the massive DDOS attack in the us.Now they are making it seam like actual leaks are coming covering up the really damaging ones against the US government. They don't care who is president, because the power isn't in the presidency it is in the country. We think we are ahead but we are still two steps behind. Us hating against Hillary is all part of their plan. Only after whatever happens will be realize how we all got duped. After Assange a body shows up somewhere with a bullshit cover story.

 

All because his internet was cut off and he's been obviously radio silent as a result. That sub's a fucking goldmine. 

post #266 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codename View Post
 

Resurrecting this cause this Assange conspiracy theory that's gaining traction is hilarious.

 

 

All because his internet was cut off and he's been obviously radio silent as a result. That sub's a fucking goldmine. 

I think its pretty clear Embassy Cat is a Putin agent who is making sure Assange stays in line now that he is no longer needed.

post #267 of 280
So I take it that these new flat-earthers are just trolls looking for attention, right?
post #268 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post

So I take it that these new flat-earthers are just trolls looking for attention, right?

Our tax dollars are about to fund an EPA conspiracy team with the objective of refuting peer reviewed research on climate change, one of the President's few trusted friends believes the moon landing was filmed in Arizona, and one of the President's favorite pundits believes Obama is a genetically engineered Lizard-Human hybrid in the service of Lucifer.

So I take nothing for granted at this point.
post #269 of 280
Man, conspiracy theories aren't any fun when they become conspiracy fact. Thanks, Olmos.
post #270 of 280
Sam Kriss, writing for The Atlantic, has a take on Flat Earthers that's the best thing I've read this week. It's a heartbreakingly empathetic depiction of theorists as people struggling to make sense out of the modern world.


Flat-Earthers Have a Wild New Theory About Forests: What it means to believe that “real” trees no longer exist
post #271 of 280
I will look to utter 'hylothanatism' in conversation as soon as possible no matter how awkwardly I have to work it in.
post #272 of 280
That's, ah, the second time this week I've ended a phrase that way . . .
post #273 of 280
Any world with a past where trees were so fucking humongous that Devil's Tower is just a petrified stump is a universe I wouldn't mind living in, frankly. That's pretty goddamn metal.
post #274 of 280
I'm really not on board with anything that romanticizes these kooks. Struggling to understand the modern world? Open a goddamn science book.
post #275 of 280

What's the drive behind Flat Earthers?  Stuff like Illuminati/Lizard People is born out of a sense of loss of control and personal agency, which is something I can understand.  What benefit is to be gained on a personal or social level by disputing the physical nature of our world?

post #276 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post

I'm really not on board with anything that romanticizes these kooks. Struggling to understand the modern world? Open a goddamn science book.
The modern world is a boring place where the awesomest creatures all died out aeons ago and everybody is constantly told that the rest are due to go any year now, the good countries are run by ineffectual, uncaring, and often shady bureacrats and sometimes outright crooks, the rest are run by much, much worse, and the general outline for most people's lives is "work at a shitty job for all the best years of your life so you can eat something nicer than cat food for the rest, then die." I fully understand the urge to imagine a different one; some people just take it a step beyond imagining.
post #277 of 280

Then play D&D or write a fantasy novel or something.  Don't try to push your escapism as a replacement for science.

post #278 of 280
I mean, I'm not going to defend that. But if you're looking for reasonable, rational action in this arena, you're SOL. The reason a lot of these people are devoted to irrational ideas is because plain materialist rationalism doesn't hold any answers that are actually satisfactory. I'm not gonna say that's healthy, but damned if I don't kinda understand.
post #279 of 280
I'd say it goes farther than that. I think the flat earthers are born out of the same mind set as the anti-vaxxers, the evolution deniers and the 'GMO's are evil!' crowds. This idea that science is some sinister agenda to lie to us for whatever reason. As the world becomes more secular and rational. Some pushback was bound to happen.
And a lot of conspiracy theorists are attracted to the idea of opposing some nebulous system and only they can see the truth. So we get these fuckos.

It's also important to keep in mind...these guys were always there. The internet just makes them more visible. That always soothes my mind when the thought that these people actually exist threatens to throw me over the edge.
post #280 of 280
That's also not wrong. I'd say it's a bit of both, in varying mixtures.
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