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Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017) Pre-Release Discussion - Page 42

post #2051 of 6852

Now THAT'S a creepy CG double. 

post #2052 of 6852

According to The Hollywood Reporter's Lucasfilm source: "Rogue One is the road map." If they do go that route, how many of you would be bothered enough to skip EPISODE IX?

post #2053 of 6852

post #2054 of 6852

Chris Hardwick seems like such a nice person that I don't want to tell him to go away.

 

So I'll tell Barry in his place!

post #2055 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelM View Post
 

 

No. They cancel Episode 9. They make the solo Solo movie because eh, whatever.

 

But it's back to the drawing board for the main saga. Either go backwards far enough that there's genuine narrative tension in both big and small outcomes, or go forward 50-100 years when all the principals of the OT would naturally be dead anyway.

Michael gets it.

post #2056 of 6852

What about bringing Leia back in voice only, like Obi-Wan after his death in the original STAR WARS? Forget about CGI Leia or Stevie Nicks Leia, hire a great voice actress to channel Carrie Fisher and let the character still play an active, if disembodied, role in EPISODE IX.


Edited by Barry Woodward - 1/6/17 at 3:33am
post #2057 of 6852

She can banter back and forth with Luke, Force hug Chewie (we don't see her, but we see the effect of the hug on Chewie's fur), confront Ben/Kylo Ren with Luke, and maybe, at the very end, appear in ghost form (it needn't be CGI, they could just make use of unused footage from VIII) with Han Solo at her side. I think it's the best option.

post #2058 of 6852
And you guys thought I was a weirdo for suggesting a straight up recast, and only if plot-critical.
post #2059 of 6852

This idea is even better. She still gets to be an important part of the story without her physical appearance even being an issue. I think fans would more readily accept this than a straight up recast.

post #2060 of 6852
giphy.gif
post #2061 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightning Slim View Post

And you guys thought I was a weirdo for suggesting a straight up recast, and only if plot-critical.

Nah, I just think it's best to let go of Leia. The intention always has been that the episodes focus on the next generation as the old guard bows out in supporting roles. Han has already bowed out and Leia will have to in a manner the filmmakers didn't plan (had Carrie lived on, I assume Leia would have just settled down and retire from the Resistence for some peace). It would just seem odd after five films with Carrie that she's replaced by an actress for what may be only around for one film, as nothing beyond IX is really planned and won't be for awhile.

It's just best to move on and adapt. All filmmakers have to and this is just an extreme circumstance.
post #2062 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post

Nah, I just think it's best to let go of Leia. The intention always has been that the episodes focus on the next generation as the old guard bows out in supporting roles. Han has already bowed out and Leia will have to in a manner the filmmakers didn't plan (had Carrie lived on, I assume Leia would have just settled down and retire from the Resistence for some peace). It would just seem odd after five films with Carrie that she's replaced by an actress for what may be only around for one film, as nothing beyond IX is really planned and won't be for awhile.

It's just best to move on and adapt. All filmmakers have to and this is just an extreme circumstance.

If they recast Leia there's no reason Leia can't continue well into future films supporting new characters along with Luke. Give a new actress 2 or 3 films and she'll be the norm.

If they can recast a younger Han Solo with a guy at least half a foot shorter than Harrison Ford and 125% not Harrison Ford then they can certainly recast Leia.

It's sad that Carrie bowed out the way she did, but the show must go on. That's showbiz.
post #2063 of 6852

no more star war

post #2064 of 6852
That's assuming they even have X planned out, which also assumes they'll break away from the trilogy format and just keep making these until the money runs dry.
post #2065 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post

That's assuming they even have X planned out, which also assumes they'll break away from the trilogy format and just keep making these until the money runs dry.

 

I assume the last part, but that they'd keep making trilogies and side films. Because they didn't buy SW to keep it behind a glass case to be admired.

post #2066 of 6852
I'd think there'll be a slight break between trilogies that is mostly filled with spinoffs. That gives them time to do the groundwork for a three-film gauntlet.

But, boy, this much Star Wars sounds TERRIBLE.
post #2067 of 6852

Me reading this thread:

 

post #2068 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agentsands77 View Post

I'd think there'll be a slight break between trilogies that is mostly filled with spinoffs. That gives them time to do the groundwork for a three-film gauntlet.

But, boy, this much Star Wars sounds TERRIBLE.

That's the thing, STAR WARS was like nothing else because it had a definitive beginning and end. Lucas didn't indulge in spin-offs when he easily could have, he left that to EU stuff and cartoons.
post #2069 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post


That's the thing, STAR WARS was like nothing else because it had a definitive beginning and end. Lucas didn't indulge in spin-offs when he easily could have, he left that to EU stuff and cartoons.

 

Lucas was smart in that he treated his non trilogy material as fan fiction.  Now the fan fic has become the serious movie stuff.  It's annoying.

post #2070 of 6852
Man. I wish R1 just bombed... but it's Star Wars. So big not even the prequels could collapse.
post #2071 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 

 

Lucas was smart in that he treated his non trilogy material as fan fiction.  Now the fan fic has become the serious movie stuff.  It's annoying.

Ironically, the fan fiction EU stuff was the best part of his prequel era.  

post #2072 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post

Man. I wish R1 just bombed... but it's Star Wars. So big not even the prequels could collapse.

Why would you wish a pretty good movie to fail?  Such nonsense in this little fantasy world you're living in where this movie was BvS or something.  So silly.  

post #2073 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post

 

Lucas was smart in that he treated his non trilogy material as fan fiction.  Now the fan fic has become the serious movie stuff.  It's annoying.

 

The problem with expanding Star Wars is that part of what made the originals so strong is that everything was drawn in these very broad, clean strokes, and the further you try to extend that you either fall into repetition or dilute the core elements so much they start losing what made them unique in the first place. Only two movies into Disney's EU era, we're already starting to see that.

 

Like how the main movies had these simple elemental planets - the ice planet, the desert planet, etc. TFA tried to keep that up but fell back on repetition. Rogue One didn't really bother and just used generic sci-fi worlds with wacky names. That original boldness and gets replaced by genericism.


Likewise, references to the force in movies where the force isn't actually important at all rather sucks the mystique from the concept, it just becomes stand in magic.

 

I'm not sure there's actually a way around this.

post #2074 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman View Post

Why would you wish a pretty good movie to fail?  Such nonsense in this little fantasy world you're living in where this movie was BvS or something.  So silly.  

Simple, so we have fewer Star Wars films, thus again feel like events that only come about every now and then rather than every fucking year. Back when you had to wait three whole years with nothing between.

Now it's like Marvel, just going through the motions. If all we get out of these are mediocre fanservice bore like R1 then it's not worth it. You're just running it to the ground in the name of the almighty dollar.
post #2075 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman View Post

Why would you wish a pretty good movie to fail?
Probably because it would disrupt the DisneyWars machine and force them to rethink their strategy.

(And it wasn't a pretty good movie.)
post #2076 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

The problem with expanding Star Wars is that part of what made the originals so strong is that everything was drawn in these very broad, clean strokes, and the further you try to extend that you either fall into repetition or dilute the core elements so much they start losing what made them unique in the first place.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

Likewise, references to the force in movies where the force isn't actually important at all rather sucks the mystique from the concept, it just becomes stand in magic.
Eh, I really liked how the Force was treated in ROGUE ONE. All that Force-talk felt more mysterious and significant in ROGUE than it did in FORWAKENS. Or the prequels for that matter.
post #2077 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post


Simple, so we have fewer Star Wars films, thus again feel like events that only come about every now and then rather than every fucking year. Back when you had to wait three whole years with nothing between.

Now it's like Marvel, just going through the motions. If all we get out of these are mediocre fanservice bore like R1 then it's not worth it. You're just running it to the ground in the name of the almighty dollar.

Marvel released Civil War and Doctor Strange most recently right?  Seems like the factory approach is getting better and better movies out of Disney.  

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agentsands77 View Post

(And it wasn't a pretty good movie.)

Most people appear to disagree with you in general.  

post #2078 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman View Post

Most people appear to disagree with you in general.  
Fuck 'em
post #2079 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman View Post

Marvel released Civil War and Doctor Strange most recently right?  Seems like the factory approach is getting better and better movies out of Disney.

DOCTOR STRANGE was boring. I was totally apathetic watching that. CIVIL WAR was okay in that they address a few things at the beginning like accountability, but it quickly becomes fan service bullshit (seriously there was no reason for Spider-Man being in it other than to have MCU brag how they have him and make mindless fanboys happy).

These films are not special.
post #2080 of 6852
I liked DOC STRANGE. It's moderately better than FORWAKENS and ROGUE ONE, not that there's leagues of difference in quality between any of these movies.

But Marvel was also never some magical, unique auteur franchise. STAR WARS, for all its highs and lows, was the product of one man's vision, and, for better and worse, it felt totally unlike anything else because of that.

Now STAR WARS feels like it's becoming conventional blockbuster material.
post #2081 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post


DOCTOR STRANGE was boring. I was totally apathetic watching that. CIVIL WAR was okay in that they address a few things at the beginning like accountability, but it quickly becomes fan service bullshit (seriously there was no reason for Spider-Man being in it other than to have MCU brag how they have him and make mindless fanboys happy).

These films are not special.

 

Said the exact same thing here and got shouted down!

post #2082 of 6852
All this talk makes me realize how happy I am that EON has refused to jump on certain trends with James Bond by starting spin-offs or some cinematic universe. They could easily do that if they wanted. They could have even hopped on the 3D train and make more money off that. Instead they're just sticking to one Bond film at a time. They may not all be perfect, but at least I get focus on the one film that comes out without thinking of other spin-offs and how they'll tie in.
post #2083 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post


Likewise, references to the force in movies where the force isn't actually important at all rather sucks the mystique from the concept, it just becomes another generic science fiction series.

 

Fixed that for you.

 

But yeah, I agree with everything you said.  The success of Star Wars was also its downfall.  Like I said, Lucas understood what he owned, and realized he could create an empire with it by using spin off material in books, comics and toys, etc... he was careful to be sure it never became serious like the trilogy.  BUT, what he was aiming for with his empire was not money, but to transform filmmaking techniques (with Skywalker Sound, ILM, Edit Droid, etc) so that it would be easier for filmmakers to be creative.  THAT is his legacy and why I always tolerated the spin offs existing... they were fueling real, important and artistic change in filmmaking.  Lucas was contributing something.  The prequels don't taint that legacy.

 

And it is why I was cynical when Disney bought Lucasfilm, and remain so today, probably even more so... because Disney does not give a flying pig fuck about advancing anything but their financial portfolio and pleasing shareholders, at the behest of a very important and vital franchise.  That means something.  This would ALMOST be okay if the movies were good.  I liked TFA but not R1... a different argument but reinforces that the spin offs are a bad idea and the sequel trilogy, which Lucas always planned on finishing, get a pass from me.

post #2084 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post


DOCTOR STRANGE was boring. 

Says the TNG fan.  

 

Whatever, Picard!  I'm not a fan of this deep cynicism setting in because you guys feel like you have to.  Marvel's doing just fine but "Nope, I didn't like a movie so it must mean the decline of summer movie entertainment as we know it!"

 

Have fun with it but I'm out.  

post #2085 of 6852
If Marvel could turn out something special like Donner's Superman, I'd go along with the hype.

They haven't. And no, the precious desaturated shakycam yawner THE WINTER SOLDIER wasn't really that great.
post #2086 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post

If Marvel could turn out something special like Donner's Superman, I'd go along with the hype.

They haven't. And no, the precious desaturated shakycam yawner THE WINTER SOLDIER wasn't really that great.

 

The Marvel films are cotton candy fluff.  I have fun with them for an afternoon and forget them immediately after.  They're not very good films on an objective level (except maybe the first Iron Man, but Favs was more in control, now it's a machine).

post #2087 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 

 

The Marvel films are cotton candy fluff.  I have fun with them for an afternoon and forget them immediately after.  They're not very good films on an objective level (except maybe the first Iron Man, but Favs was more in control, now it's a machine).

 

To me, they're McDonald's. Churning out perfectly acceptable fast-food that hit the spot but, by no means, the greatest burgers ever made. It doesn't stick to you.

post #2088 of 6852
FOOD METAPHORS?

QUICK, SOMEONE GET NOOJ!
post #2089 of 6852
The other day I watched CHAPLIN and enjoyed it primarily because it was refreshing to revisit Downey Jr at a time when he wasn't Tony Stark, that he was actually doing more interesting projects in the early part of his career. I miss that RDJ. It's depressing to see him just going through the motions in that SPIDER-MAN trailer, where he's likely only in it so to assure this Spidy film is bumped up by the hype "SPIDY IN THE MCU!!!"
post #2090 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmNerdJamie View Post

 

To me, they're McDonald's. Churning out perfectly acceptable fast-food that hit the spot but, by no means, the greatest burgers ever made. It doesn't stick to you.

 

My problem is the SW movies are basically becoming the same thing.  That was fine when they were just stupid YA novels, comics and toys.  I will probably start ignoring the spin offs and not supporting them because I really do believe Disney should leave them alone and just finish the trilogy like Lucas had always planned.  But obviously that's not gonna happen.

post #2091 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 

 

My problem is the SW movies are basically becoming the same thing.  That was fine when they were just stupid YA novels, comics and toys.  I will probably start ignoring the spin offs and not supporting them because I really do believe Disney should leave them alone and just finish the trilogy like Lucas had always planned.  But obviously that's not gonna happen.

 

And that's why I was always against treating Star Wars like Marvel. What works for one thing doesn't automatically work for another.

post #2092 of 6852
Quote:

Originally Posted by FilmNerdJamie View Post

 

To me, they're McDonald's. Churning out perfectly acceptable fast-food that hit the spot but, by no means, the greatest burgers ever made. It doesn't stick to you.

 

If we're going to use food metaphors, then the MCU is more like Smashburger or Penn Station for me. Not four-star restaurant quality by any means, but a definite step above McDs, Burger King, etc.

post #2093 of 6852

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post #2095 of 6852
I had more fun watching X-MEN: APOCALYPSE than MCU.

Yeah. I went there.
post #2096 of 6852

post #2097 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stockslivevan View Post

I had more fun watching X-MEN: APOCALYPSE than MCU.

Yeah. I went there.

FUCK! Aw fuck you oh fuck this fuck everything.

That movie was garbage!!!!
post #2098 of 6852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman View Post

FUCK! Aw fuck you oh fuck this fuck everything.

That movie was garbage!!!!

YOU'RE GONNA NEED A BIGGER HOUSE!
post #2099 of 6852

Freeman melting down across multiple threads:

 

post #2100 of 6852
I should feel for Freeman. I know what it's like to see a movie that moved me immensely be shit on by a bunch of snarky cynical fuddy duddys (LA LA LAND)...

But his meltdowns are too pure to resist.

Also, I'm turning in my Team Woof card. I can't defend movies like AGE OF ULTRON anymore, not when I've seen pure delights like LA LA LAND and X-MEN APOCALYPSE (my own personal GODS OF EGYPT).
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