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Trumpocalypse Now - Page 338

post #16851 of 41349

Mike Pence is "a little rattled" after this week:

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/12/politics/trump-comey-white-house-morale-fallout/index.html

 

Quote:
In conversations with multiple advisers, conducted on condition of anonymity to discuss internal deliberations, officials described to CNN a sense of dejection within the West Wing ranks, where most aides were caught off guard by Trump's decision and had little ability to develop a cogent response. Even Vice President Mike Pence, who found his public statements again undercut by Trump himself, was "a little rattled" at the events of the week, according to an administration adviser.
 
Through it all, Trump has remained largely out of sight, not leaving the White House once since he returned late Sunday night. He grew increasingly isolated and agitated, associates tell CNN, going a full week without hearing the applause and adulation that often brightens his mood.

 

And morale, in general, is low:

 

Quote:
Still, inside the West Wing the mood appeared to lift somewhat by the end of the week, as one exhausted aide declared, "It's Friday."
 
Trump, in both individual meetings and larger sessions, personally worked to bolster his staff's plummeting morale after rampant criticism of their inability to cast his firing of Comey in a positive light.
 
But the scars were still apparent, with one White House official asking: "Do you think we're liars?"
 
And just as some aides began to feel on firmer footing after Comey's dismissal, Trump revived his longtime obsession with surveillance, suggesting that he was recording conversations inside the Oval Office. Neither Trump nor his spokesman tamped down on the implication, a telling development for a White House not shy about publicly rebutting what it claims is false reporting.

 

More on Pence:

 

Quote:
After Trump told NBC that he'd long planned to fire Comey -- and was not, as Pence declared seven times on Capitol Hill Wednesday, acting on the advice of his Justice Department -- the Vice President found himself again in a position of being contradicted by his boss.
 
"He's not rattled very often and he was a little rattled" about how the events transpired, a senior administration adviser said.
 
According to this adviser, Trump made the decision to fire Comey -- and Pence knew the decision was coming before the announcement on Tuesday -- but he wasn't fully briefed on the President's reasoning for firing Comey before he went in front of cameras on Wednesday.
 
"He went out there without all the information," the adviser said. "It was not an attempt to lie."
post #16852 of 41349
You do have to wonder how many times Pence is going to have the rug pulled out from under him in a highly public and embarassing fashion before he finally gets fed up with it.
post #16853 of 41349
If you definitively state A, which you don't have all the information on, and the answer to turns out to be B, how is that not a lie?
post #16854 of 41349

Conservative Charles Sykes is back with another interesting op-ed:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/opinion/sunday/if-liberals-hate-him-then-trump-must-be-doing-something-right.html?smid=tw-share

 

Quote:

If there was one principle that used to unite conservatives, it was respect for the rule of law. Not long ago, conservatives would have been horrified at wholesale violations of the norms and traditions of our political system, and would have been appalled by a president who showed overt contempt for the separation of powers.

 

But this week, as if on cue, most of the conservative media fell into line, celebrating President Trump’s abrupt dismissal of the F.B.I. director, James Comey, and dismissing the fact that Mr. Comey was leading an investigation into the Trump campaign and its ties to Russia. “Dems in Meltdown Over Comey Firing,” declared a headline on Fox News, as Tucker Carlson gleefully replayed clips of Democrats denouncing the move. “It’s just insane actually,” he said, referring to their reactions. On Fox and talk radio, the message was the same, with only a few conservatives willing to sound a discordant or even cautious note.

 

The talk-show host Rush Limbaugh was positively giddy, opening his monologue on Wednesday by praising Mr. Trump for what he called his “epic trolling” of liberals. “This is great,” Mr. Limbaugh declared. “Can we agree that Donald Trump is probably enjoying this more than anybody wants to admit or that anybody knows? So he fires Comey yesterday. Who’s he meet with today? He’s meeting with the Soviet, the Russian foreign minister, Sergey Lavrov! I mean, what an epic troll this is.”

 

Given the enthusiasm of the president’s apologists, it is likely that much of Mr. Trump’s base will similarly rally to him as it has in the past.

 

And here's the crux of the piece:

 

Quote:
But perhaps most important, we saw once again how conservatism, with its belief in ordered liberty, is being eclipsed by something different: Loathing those who loathe the president. Rabid anti-anti-Trumpism.
In a lamentably overlooked monologue this month, Mr. Limbaugh embraced the new reality in which conservative ideas and principles had been displaced by anti-liberalism. For years, Mr. Limbaugh ran what he called the “Institute for Advanced Conservative Studies.” But in the Trump era, he told his audience, he has changed that to the “Institute for Advanced Anti-Leftist Studies.”
With Mr. Trump in the White House, conservative principles were no longer the point. “How many times during the campaign did I warn everybody Trump is not a conservative? Multiple times a day,” Mr. Limbaugh said. “How many times have I told you: ‘Do not expect Trump to be a conservative? He isn’t one.’ ”
He went on to emphasize that the campaign was not about conservatism, because that’s not what Mr. Trump is about.

That was a remarkable admission, but it is also a key to understanding what is happening on the right. While there are those like Sean Hannity who are reliable cheerleaders for all things President Trump, much of the conservative news media is now less pro-Trump than it is anti-anti-Trump. The distinction is important, because anti-anti-Trumpism has become the new safe space for the right.

 

Here is how it works: Rather than defend President Trump’s specific actions, his conservative champions change the subject to (1) the biased “fake news” media, (2) over-the-top liberals, (3) hypocrites on the left, (4) anyone else victimizing Mr. Trump or his supporters and (5) whataboutism, as in “What about Obama?” “What about Clinton?”

 

For the anti-anti-Trump pundit, whatever the allegation against Mr. Trump, whatever his blunders or foibles, the other side is always worse.

 

But the real heart of anti-anti-Trumpism is the delight in the frustration and anger of his opponents. Mr. Trump’s base is unlikely to hold him either to promises or tangible achievements, because conservative politics is now less about ideas or accomplishments than it is about making the right enemies cry out in anguish.

 

This form of conservatism has been what took up a good chunk of our morning here.  "Are liberals pissed?  Good."  That's what we're dealing with.  That's what conservative media figures are selling.  That's what Trump supporters want.

post #16855 of 41349
Politics as team sport, forever and ever.
post #16856 of 41349

Apparently Comey does want to testify, but in public.

 

https://twitter.com/jakesNYT/status/863220717172797440

 

Quote:
 Mr. Comey made no comment, but later in the day he declined a request to testify before the Senate Intelligence Committee on Tuesday. According to a close associate of Mr. Comey, he is willing to testify, but wants it to be in public.
post #16857 of 41349

In other Mike Pence News, Mike Pence made an idiot out of himself with this particular tweet, in which he sounds like he's either romantically interested in horses, or really likes eating horse skin:

 

https://twitter.com/VP/status/863182608552906755

 

Probably my favorite response, just for all the details on the various side columns:

 

https://twitter.com/Lowenaffchen/status/863227105001316352

post #16858 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by bendrix View Post

If you definitively state A, which you don't have all the information on, and the answer to turns out to be B, how is that not a lie?

 

Exactly. The lie was him pretending to know what the fuck is going on... which is about the most embarrassing kind of lie I can think of.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

Politics as team sport, forever and ever.

 

Or until their team finally loses. In the Roman sense.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mondguy View Post
 

Apparently Comey does want to testify, but in public.

 

https://twitter.com/jakesNYT/status/863220717172797440

 

 

I try to avoid watching anything political unless I have insomnia, but I might set my alarm for that one.

post #16859 of 41349

This part of the Sykes piece from above jumped out....

 

Quote:

As the right doubles down on anti-anti-Trumpism, it will find itself goaded into defending and rationalizing ever more outrageous conduct just as long as it annoys CNN and the left.

In many ways anti-anti-Trumpism mirrors Donald Trump himself, because at its core there are no fixed values, no respect for constitutional government or ideas of personal character, only a free-floating nihilism cloaked in insult, mockery and bombast.

 

Just what level of absurdity/illegality will it take for the GOP to say 'enough'? Is there a level?

post #16860 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by mondguy View Post

Apparently Comey does want to testify, but in public.
ohpleaseohpleaseohplease
post #16861 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTRan View Post
 

This part of the Sykes piece from above jumped out....

 

 

Just what level of absurdity/illegality will it take for the GOP to say 'enough'? Is there a level?

 

I suppose Trump ordering bombing runs on American cities might do it, if those cities have Republican voters in any numbers in them .

post #16862 of 41349
post #16863 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farsight View Post
 

 

We're not doomed.

 

This course is correctable. If this country goes down in flames, it won't be the 2016 election that caused it. It'll be people not doing enough in reaction to the 2016 election.

 

I know cynicism is the lifeblood of the Internet, but cynicism is a coward's justification for apathy. 

I may be a cynic, but I'm not apathetic. Yesterday I call both my rep and senator to let them know I think there should be a special prosecutor to investigate Trump's ties to Russia, and I can't wait to vote in the midterms. 

post #16864 of 41349

"...but cynicism is a coward's justification for apathy. "

 

It's not apathy to see a battle that has been lost. 

 

This battle was lost long ago.

post #16865 of 41349

This might be a repost, but I can't resist.....this shit just writes itself.

 

-Trump lawyers say no income from Russia, with exceptions
 

Who are Trump's lawyers?

 

-Trump's lawyers: Morgan, Lewis & Bockius

wait for it......


Chambers & Partners Names Morgan Lewis as Russia Law Firm of the Year
May 02, 2016

 

:D

post #16866 of 41349

post #16867 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post

It's not apathy to see a battle that has been lost.

This battle was lost long ago.
Okay, let's suppose you're right and there's no hope.

Then what?

Do we just go "fuck it" and lie down and wait for WWIII to melt our flesh from our bones?

Come the fuck on.
post #16868 of 41349

Looks like Pence's role in this shit stain was bigger than we were initially led to believe:

 

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/us/politics/trump-sean-spicer-sarah-huckabee-sanders.html?emc=edit_tnt_20170512&nlid=1811197&tntemail0=y&referer=

 

Quote:

He asked Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein to draft a letter documenting Mr. Comey’s shortcomings to leave the impression that it was Mr. Rosenstein’s judgment and not his own that led to the dismissal — an idea that was reinforced by Vice President Mike Pence, who was part of the small group of advisers who planned Mr. Comey’s ouster in near secrecy.

 

On Thursday, Mr. Trump himself vaporized every version of the Comey story his defenders, including Mr. Pence, had labored so earnestly to put forward. “I was going to fire Comey — my decision. There is no good time to do it, by the way,” Trump told the “NBC Nightly News” anchor Lester Holt. “I was going to fire regardless of the recommendation” made by Mr. Rosenstein, he said.

post #16869 of 41349

Yep, good ol' Mikey is up to his eyeballs in all this shit.


Edited by Dent6084 - 5/13/17 at 1:21am
post #16870 of 41349
I have wondered about exactly how deep he is in this, but as a general rule I figure "don't trust anybody in this administration farther than you could kick them" is probably about right.

Particularly since I'm not very good at kicking.
post #16871 of 41349

Grrrrr.....

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-epa-alaska-pebble-mine-permits-20170512-story.html

 

Quote:

In a sharp reversal, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency has cleared a way for a company to seek permits to develop a massive copper and gold deposit near the headwaters of a world-class salmon fishery in southwest Alaska.

 

As part of a court settlement with the Pebble Limited Partnership, the EPA agreed to begin the process of withdrawing proposed restrictions on development in the Bristol Bay region, an area that produces about half of the world's sockeye salmon.

 

The agreement, signed Thursday but released on Friday, comes four months into the Trump administration, which supporters of the proposed Pebble Mine hoped would give it a fairer shake than they believed they received under President Barack Obama.

 

The mining industry has seen promising signs from the administration, including a willingness to take a different look at projects and to review regulations seen as overly burdensome, said Luke Popovich, a spokesman for the National Mining Association.

post #16872 of 41349
I'd be madder about that if I liked salmon. But let's be honest, tuna is where it's at.
post #16873 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
 

I may be a cynic, but I'm not apathetic. Yesterday I call both my rep and senator to let them know I think there should be a special prosecutor to investigate Trump's ties to Russia, and I can't wait to vote in the midterms. 

 

That doesn't sound like you're a true cynic, either.

 

My sense of humor is pretty dark and cynical, but I find pure cynicism to be as blind as pure optimism, and much more harmful.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
 

"...but cynicism is a coward's justification for apathy. "

 

It's not apathy to see a battle that has been lost. 

 

This battle was lost long ago.

 

I'd bet there are people who've been saying something similar to that since 1777.

 

The reality is that we're probably not that special. This country has survived a Civil War, The Great Depression, two World Wars, the brink of nuclear war, Presidents being assassinated, a President resigning, and countless other crises. 

 

The only battle that may be lost is your own internal one, and even that one is still up to you.

post #16874 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Okay, let's suppose you're right and there's no hope.

Then what?

Do we just go "fuck it" and lie down and wait for WWIII to melt our flesh from our bones?
 

 

No, we have the warm and emberous glow of the internet to huddle around until then.

 

I don't completely agree with Jacob, the 'American Experiment' isn't over . . . but it's hard to not see some value in the idea that we may in fact be in some sort of peak oil in terms of how the experiment is able to appropriately and correctly respond to new pressures in a world that has experienced as much growth and change as rapidly as it has over the last few generations and will continue to face without, sooner than later, changes to how we carry it out that will be difficult to carry out. Lemon difficult. My worry is that those will only take place at a point in time when they become necessary forced moves, made too late for other better options to be viable. I know that's vague and half-baked, but, I'm  . . . kind of half-baked right now, and it's . . . it's just a vague feeling, and . . . um . . . yeah.

 

Sorry, continue. 

post #16875 of 41349

The genie that is the empowerment of the racists and Nazis and anti-science and anti-freedom types is not going back into the bottle.  Wars end, depressions end, diplomatic crises end.  Dead or quit presidents can be replaced.  But Trump supporters - and the culture that lets them flourish - will still be with you after Trump is gone.  59 million Americans are not going to suddenly change their ways.  Your country will survive, but it will be full of the sort of people who vote for someone like Trump, and they will be under the impression that their racism or sexism or bigotry or anti-intellectualism is now acceptable.

 

If your parents or siblings or FWB's voted for Trump and you're on the outs with them now, will that change when Trump is gone?  Will they?

post #16876 of 41349

Nah, a quick generation or two and they'll learn to shut the fuck up and sit the fuck back down like they have at least twice before in our past. Just gotta be quick with the newspaper on the nose. 

 

Shit . . . it just occurs to me that no one reads newspapers anymore.

post #16877 of 41349

If you feel the need to smack someone in the face with your laptop, I won't stop you.  Unless that someone is me.

post #16878 of 41349

I'll have you know that salmon is my John Wick dog. Don't shoot it.

post #16879 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

Come the fuck on.

 

You tell me. When was the last time you had a sane conversation with a Trump supporter?

 

We. Are. Done.

 

People can pretend that we've weathered worse, that this is just some sort of hiccup, it's just a bump in the statistics, we'll come to our senses sooner or later.

 

There's no going back from this.

 

Our democracy is literally out of our control.

post #16880 of 41349

Remember how the American public was warned about how there were Russian intelligence efforts crowding up chatrooms and seeding apathy about the US democratic process?

Thank goodness none of us behave like that in here, right? That would look bad.

post #16881 of 41349

It was duke fleed wasn't it? I knew it!

post #16882 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turingmachine75 View Post
 

Nah, a quick generation or two and they'll learn to shut the fuck up and sit the fuck back down like they have at least twice before in our past. Just gotta be quick with the newspaper on the nose. 

 

 

It's stunning to me that anyone could think that THIS is the worst behavior a sizable chunk of the American population has exhibited, EVER.

 

Really? REALLY?!?

 

We live in a country where black people were once property. Where in recent history, women were essentially property. Where a fragment of our population was able to violently abuse anyone different with impunity. Because not nearly enough people gave a damn.

 

Yeah, it sucks that progress isn't an exponential curve of increasing positivity, It's more of a two steps forward, one step back kind of system. And with even a cursory examination of history, you can see that's how it always has been.

 

Anyone with the view that this is the end, that things are so bad today that recovery is impossible, needs to GROW THE FUCK UP.

 

Life's tough. Suck it up. Get a bowl of ice cream, hug a kitten and then do something about it.

post #16883 of 41349

WARNING: 100% BOONE POST AHEAD

 

It just seems to me that apathy and claims of the American experiment being over is a ridicuously privileged thing to say. We, a bunch of (mostly, I assume, with few exceptions) straight white dudes on the internet, have that luxury. We can sit back and decry how we don't recognize this country, or how hard it is to have conversations with Trump supporters, or how this country has become poisoned, and there's no coming back from this. Meanwhile, the people whose rights are actually under attack now - LGBT, POC, and women - are doing what they've always done. Rolling their sleeves up and getting to work. They don't have time for apathy. 

 

Since we've been having this discussion over the past couple of days, I've been thinking about this interview/podcast with Dan Savage in the immediate aftermath of the election last year. In that podcast, he broke down crying as he discussed all the things LGBT people faced - in our lifetimes! - and how he refused to go back to that, even though he knew what was at stake. And I've thought a lot about that.

 

I've also thought about what writers like Jamelle Bouie have said, and the reading I've done about the end of Reconstruction, the development of Jim Crow, and Jim Crow at the turn of the century in this country. We can talk about brother shooting brother all we want, and the horrors of slavery (and we should), but it still sickens me to think that we would have lynching parties in this country. Entire towns would show up to watch someone be executed. And yes, that's part of our human nature, and yes, we should talk about that. And Bouie has written a lot about how we may be facing the dawn of the end of a second Reconstruction, a pushback against 60 years of progress. And to think about that scares me. It pushes me towards pessimism.

 

But pessimism is what they want. Pessimism is how they win. 

 

And yes - I do think we need to have tough conversations with Trump supporters. By we, I don't mean the media. By we, I don't mean the nation as a whole. I mean us - white people. We should be out there standing in solidarity and fighting and showing up and putting our bodies on the line. But we also need to take up the slack of having these difficult conversations with our white relatives and people we know on an individual level, because that's the only way we change minds. And yes, it is possible. I've done it. I've seen it happen. Have I turned every Trump supporter I've talked to into a raging Obama voter? No. But I've been able to at least get them to see the other side, if only for a moment. And moments like those add up. Moments like those are everything.

 

This was a tough week. Real tough. But we gotta keep moving forward, inch by inch. It's what we've always done. We may stumble. We may fall. 

 

But before I quote Man of Steel, I'll quote Hamilton instead: "I may not live to see the glory, but I will gladly join the fight."

 

told u this was a boone post. 

post #16884 of 41349

Right on, Boone. Right on.

post #16885 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post

You tell me. When was the last time you had a sane conversation with a Trump supporter?
Like, about politics specifically? A few weeks ago. And you know what happens when the topic turns to this administration? They start rationalizing and hemming and hawing and trying to change the topic. Because they're already uncomfortable, deep down, because unlike everyone except for a handful of true deplorables, they actually have a conscience, even if political circumstances and toxic influences from talk radio, etc. have led them to tune it out in order to make themselves less uncomfortable over voting for this fuck.

Yes, this doesn't end neat and tidy when President Baby is led off in handcuffs. But it's not going to go on indefinitely either. The whole thing is fundamentally untenable over the long term, culturally speaking (one relative is already worried about what would happen if the people at her workplace ever found out who she voted for.) And if it's publically confirmed that in addition to bad, stupid, immoral policy decisions, these people were actively colluding with hostile foreign interests? You are going to see a lot of people shame-facedly walking-back and trying to forget they ever voted for him.

Or, yeah, what Boone said. Because in times like these, with attitudes like this, we need a Humorless Scold.
post #16886 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Like, about politics specifically? A few weeks ago. And you know what happens when the topic turns to this administration? They start rationalizing and hemming and hawing and trying to change the topic. Because they're already uncomfortable, deep down, because unlike everyone except for a handful of true deplorables, they actually have a conscience, even if political circumstances and toxic influences from talk radio, etc. have led them to tune it out in order to make themselves less uncomfortable over voting for this fuck.

Yes, this doesn't end neat and tidy when President Baby is led off in handcuffs. But it's not going to go on indefinitely either. The whole thing is fundamentally untenable over the long term, culturally speaking (one relative is already worried about what would happen if the people at her workplace ever found out who she voted for.) And if it's publically confirmed that in addition to bad, stupid, immoral policy decisions, these people were actively colluding with hostile foreign interests? You are going to see a lot of people shame-facedly walking-back and trying to forget they ever voted for him.

Or, yeah, what Boone said. Because in times like these, with attitudes like this, we need a Humorless Scold.


My thing (cause for pessimism) is this:  Despite all that shame, despite all that discomfort, and despite people already changing their stories as far as who they voted for (Who knew Johnston or McMullin totally won the Presidency in 2016?), once they're in that voting booth, 99.75% of them are still going to punch the button for whoever has the "R" next to their name.  No. Matter. What.

 

Even in 2020.  DEFINITELY in 2018.

 

Because no matter how evil or incompetent or flat-out insane Trump's administration gets, it's still better than another Democratic President in their minds.  I'm not saying they're absent conscience...I'm saying they believe many liberal ideas are genuinely evil (though more accurately they believe what right wing media has told them liberal ideals are is genuinely evil) and would destroy the country, their communities, and their families if they were implemented.

post #16887 of 41349
That's probable, yes. But if this goes down the way it's increasingly looking like it will, Trump's implosion is likely to have a major impact on the GOP - anybody who isn't dragged down with him in the fallout (and, show of hands here, who really thinks that Priebus wasn't involved with this? What about Ryan?) will be scrambling to disassociate themselves from this fiasco. Add to that the slaughter they're going to face in 2018 when the fallout from Trumpcare hits the polls, and there's going to have to be a significant shift in the GOP if it's going to survive this. Simply put, if the fascist coup that's being attempted here fails (and with Trump at the head, I'm all but certain it will,) and with a few years for the dust to settle, we're never going to see anything like this again.

The good that's going to come out of this isn't the destruction of the GOP. (Which would be disastrous in its own way, creating a one-party effective monopoly on the system.) The good that's going to come out of this is the excision of this particular cancer from it - and (in an ideal world) the imposition of further checks on presidential authority in case any such person should manage to gain the office again.
Edited by commodorejohn - 5/13/17 at 8:17am
post #16888 of 41349
Quote:
Another threatened attack on press freedom, from a president who detests the free press? Sure. But also: Would this be bad? Or is this one of those occasional moments when Trump stumbles maliciously into a completely defensible position?

The White House press briefing does not serve the public or the White House. It is a pointless farce, and we owe Donald Trump—and especially Sean Spicer, his incompetent and comical press secretary—our gratitude for making clear the extent of its pointlessness. Press briefings under Spicer have become must-watch programming purely because of their sheer ridiculousness. A room full of people who know the man answering their questions cannot possibly truthfully answer their questions makes for great TV, but it does not make for meaningful coverage of this White House.

This is not particular to the Trump era. The pointlessness is baked into the entire enterprise.

Alex Pareene, writing for Fusion: Actually, Why Not Cancel the White House Press Briefing?
post #16889 of 41349
post #16890 of 41349
Given the pace of Trump's implosion, and the fact Bannon has been laying low this past month, I'd start expecting our own Reichstag Fire within the year. No later than September 2018.
post #16891 of 41349
I certainly wouldn't put it past them - but I don't think it'd work. This thing is too big and too public for distractions anymore. It's already eclipsed what in a normal world would be big separate scandals in their own right. Even Trump's attempts at beating the war-drum with North Korea and Syria couldn't make it go away.
post #16892 of 41349

Republicans just had a three-day gathering where Trump and 2018 were the hut-button topics:

 

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/13/trump-2018-midterms-gop-alarm-238342

 

Quote:

With the Comey firing and Russia investigation dominating the headlines, there were also moments of discomfort. During a welcome reception Wednesday, a national committeeman took the stage and, perhaps jokingly, referred to those assembled as “comrades," drawing grimaces.

 

At times, the RNC appeared to take pains to obscure any dissent about Trump. On Thursday, RNC members gathered for a closed-door breakfast meeting to discuss issues confronting the committee. Chairwoman Ronna Romney McDaniel, fearing leaks, implored attendees to turn off their phones and not record the proceedings. She also asked RNC and hotel staffers to leave the room.

 

McDaniel warned the group that reporters were covering the event and trying to eavesdrop in the hopes of writing negative stories.

 

McDaniel's aides insisted the move was typical. Yet some members felt she was going too far to project a united front.

post #16893 of 41349

Here's the thing (with Alec Baldwin): Trump is stupid. He's smart, but he's stupid. He's too stupid to have come up with this Russia thing - whatever it is - on his own. Remember, he once described his pre-teen son at "good at the cyber." Someone probably explained hacking to him once, but who knows if it sunk in?

 

And we've already seen multiple people with connections to Russia. Flynn. Sessions. Manfort. etc. 

 

Preibus and Ryan were party leaders. There's no way they didn't know something was going on. 

post #16894 of 41349

That word "loyal" is being thrown around again:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/us/politics/fbi-interim-director.html

 

Quote:

Mr. Trump and his advisers have asked some people whether they believe Mr. Kelly, the former New York police commissioner, would be “loyal,” language similar to what he used in questioning Mr. Comey’s effectiveness, according to people briefed on the discussions. In Mr. Kelly’s case, they said, the White House appeared to be trying to assess whether he would seek to advance his own image, as Mr. Trump accused Mr. Comey of doing.

 

Mr. Kelly declined to comment on whether he had spoken with the president about the job. He is said to be seen as outside the top tier of candidates because the job is a 10-year appointment and at 75, he is older than many of the other prospects.

 

As police commissioner, he also had a combative relationship with the F.B.I., with the two agencies frequently engaged in turf wars. He was widely disliked among agents who felt he constantly worked to undermine the F.B.I., creating a legacy of mistrust.

post #16895 of 41349

post #16896 of 41349

He deleted that tweet.  He's not supposed to.

post #16897 of 41349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Maiden View Post



...are Venom?
post #16898 of 41349

Some anecdotes to Wisconsin's voter fraud:

 

https://apnews.com/dafac088c90242ef8b282fbebddf5b56?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=AP

 

Quote:

MILWAUKEE (AP) — State Sen. Mary Lazich was adamant: The bill Republicans were about to push through the Wisconsin state Senate, requiring that voters present identification at the polls, would do no harm.

 

“Not a single voter in this state will be disenfranchised by the ID law,” Lazich promised.

 

Five years later, in the first presidential election held under the new law, Gladys Harris proved her wrong.

 

By one estimate, 300,000 eligible voters in the state lacked valid photo IDs heading into the election; it is unknown how many people did not vote because they didn’t have proper identification. But it is not hard to find the Navy veteran whose out-of-state driver’s license did not suffice, or the dying woman whose license had expired, or the recent graduate whose student ID was deficient — or Harris, who at 66 made her way to her polling place despite chronic lung disease and a torn ligament in her knee.

 

She had lost her driver’s license just before Election Day. Aware of the new law, she brought her Social Security and Medicare cards as well as a county-issued bus pass that displayed her photo.

 

Not good enough. She had to cast a provisional ballot that ended up not being counted.

 

In the end, Wisconsin’s 10 Electoral College votes went to Republican Donald Trump, who defeated Democrat Hillary Clinton by roughly 22,000 votes. But the battle over voter ID laws continues.

 

Under the Wisconsin law, voters must present a driver’s license, state ID, passport, military ID, naturalization papers or tribal ID to vote. A student ID is acceptable only if it has a signature and a two-year expiration date. Those who do not have their ID can cast a provisional ballot that will be counted only if they return with the proper ID within a few days of the election.

post #16899 of 41349
...iner?
post #16900 of 41349

Welp?

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